4 mana 3/4 taunt deathrattle summon a 2/2 is average? Sounds like shredder stats to me. Or 4 mana 5/3 deathrattle draw a card is average?
It like saying that Doomsayer + Frost Nova is a bad combo because the cards are not doing much if played seperately.
The difference is that with Frost NovaDoomsayer is that 1, they actually ARE useful seperately and 2 the benefit you get for comboing the two is HUGE. You're getting a complete board clear AND stopping your opponents next turn for 5 mana. With Forlorn Stalker you're playing a really below average 3 drop just to get a moderately above average 4 drop. Then of course seperately both are complete garbage.
Well the main idea is to play the stalker in a deck full of deathrattles (I mean about 15/30), so you can get the buff on 2-3 minions on average. This way you played a below average 3-drop, an above average 4-drop, and you still have some advantage from your turn 3. And the main thing is that it actually allows you to play on curve Huhuran with the benefit of her battlecry while maintaining fair tempo in the previous turns.
So you have a deck with 5-6 actual good Deathrattles and 9-10 bad deathrattles just so you can have 3 'pretty good' cards in your deck.
Princess Huhuran is good, with the potential to be great if some better deathrattles show up for turns 1-3. Much like N'Zoth, really; they need some good Standard deathrattles to be worthwhile.
Highmane into Huhuran is the dream, sure, but that still means you're sitting on your 6/5 until turn 7. And that's if they don't kill Highmane because they know Huhuran exists.
Using Huhuran to get another random beast is okay, but using Huhuran's battlecry to deal 1 point of random damage is weaksauce. Not that Huge Toad is a bad card if you're playing on the aggro side of midrange, I guess.
So I would probably change the Polluted Hoarder for a better deathrattle, if we will have one, otherwise the quality of deathrattle minions is fine. I think people have too high expectations of deathrattle minions after shredder/belcher/etc. but in standard, cards like Harvest Golem or Cairne Bloodhoof will see a lot of play.
Your 6 drop slot is really slow and heavy. I think the stalker is best left to wild where you curve into shredder and more importantly belcher. The effect makes cards like mad scientist significantly better in the mid to late game. In standard though, you have to use suboptimal cards to make it work correctly.
Princess Huhuran is good, with the potential to be great if some better deathrattles show up for turns 1-3. Much like N'Zoth, really; they need some good Standard deathrattles to be worthwhile.
Highmane into Huhuran is the dream, sure, but that still means you're sitting on your 6/5 until turn 7. And that's if they don't kill Highmane because they know Huhuran exists.
Using Huhuran to get another random beast is okay, but using Huhuran's battlecry to deal 1 point of random damage is weaksauce. Not that Huge Toad is a bad card if you're playing on the aggro side of midrange, I guess.
I dont know about you, but I'd probably play a 6/5 that dealt 1 damage upon entering the battlefield.
So I would probably change the Polluted Hoarder for a better deathrattle, if we will have one, otherwise the quality of deathrattle minions is fine. I think people have too high expectations of deathrattle minions after shredder/belcher/etc. but in standard, cards like Harvest Golem or Cairne Bloodhoof will see a lot of play.
Your 6 drop slot is really slow and heavy. I think the stalker is best left to wild where you curve into shredder and more importantly belcher. The effect makes cards like mad scientist significantly better in the mid to late game. In standard though, you have to use suboptimal cards to make it work correctly.
I have 4 6-drops because I dont have any 7-drops, and also because I want to get super value from N'Zoth. I expect a slower meta in standard so I dont think its very greedy. And half of the set is still unknown, but Im pretty sure that there are some useful deathrattles among them.
In all likelyhood Standard is going to be a lot closer to a heavy Midrange meta rather than one of almost exclusively control decks. All the Shaman cards look insane, Mage with things like Faceless Summoner (potentially Servant of Yogg-Saron and Demented Frostcaller), Hunters with Call of the Wild, etc.
All the midrange decks are really strong and most of them support the kind of Quartermaster Paladin style of midrange rather than the more aggressive Mid Hunters.
If you play an awfully slow deck like that against OpieOP Midrange Shaman or Hunter you're going to get crushed.
C'thun Druid is going to be amazing, so they're still going to maintain their current 'drop big monsters to punch people in the face with while you charge up your doom laser' style. Mind you, I'll take a turn 8-9 C'thun over a turn 6-7 Force-Roar combo any day.
C'thun Druid is going to be amazing, so they're still going to maintain their current 'drop big monsters to punch people in the face with while you charge up your doom laser' style. Mind you, I'll take a turn 8-9 C'thun over a turn 6-7 Force-Roar combo any day.
err no, I wouldn't. a 16/16 C'Thun isnt as good, as powerful or as easy to set up as a force roar combo
C'Thun - C'Thun decks will be pretty prominent and successful. A couple classes' C'Thun decks will be tournament material, but even several that aren't tournament-worthy will still be a common sight on ladder.
C'Thun's Chosen - I'm not sure whether all C'Thun synergy cards are worthwhile, but I'm sure of this one. It might even be more annoying in those decks than C'Thun himself.
Steward of Darkshire - Mark my words, this card will keep Aggro Paly alive and cancerous. You'll get really, really sick of facing this card.
Thing from Below - Midrange Shaman will become viable, and this card will be a staple in it.
Flamewreathed Faceless - Compare with Boulderfist Ogre. Even with one less attack, it would be a significant improvement due to being played earlier. With BGH nerfed, could be truly monstrous.
Darkshire Councilman - Amazing boost to Zoolock. Summoning lots of little minions is easy (see: how many knives their Jugglers can throw). And this only needs to proc once before it's ok value.
Widely Played
Ragnaros, Lightlord - A very good card, one of the reasons Control Paladin will be strong.
Ancient Shieldbearer - I'm guessing Warrior will be one of the stronger C'Thun classes, because this card is pretty nuts.
Hallazeal the Ascended - Not as good as the new Ragnaros or anything, but this will make it into Midrange Shaman decks, which will be pretty good based on their other new cards.
Blood Warriors - Will keep Patron Warrior alive in spite of losing Death's Bite, and might even make it into some other Warrior decktypes. Better than most of the community seems to think it is.
Ravaging Ghoul - It's not that great, but will be a necessary card in Patron and other whirlwind-friendly decks in Standard.
Possessed Villager - Zoo already runs Argent Squire. This will be slightly better for Zoo than Argent Squire. 'Nuff said.
Mark of Y'Shaarj - Druids can run enough Beasts to make this great.
Beckoner of Evil - Has a solid niche as the main 2-drop in C'Thun decks.
Blade of C'Thun - This is incredible value in C'Thun Rogue. Especially against other C'Thun decks. I'm going to go out on a limb and predict that this will make C'Thun Rogue strong in spite of Rogue's other weaknesses after that darn Blade Flurry nerf.
Dark Arakkoa - Will make C'Thun Druid strong. Unlike what some other people think, won't see play outside C'Thun decks.
Princess Huhuran - Actually pretty good even if its ability whiffs. A much less risky Feign Death.
Hooded Acolyte - Even without the C'Thun buff, this has the coveted Water Elemental stat line. With 6 health and lots of heals in Priest, should live long enough to buff C'Thun quite a bit.
Infested Wolf - Sticky like Haunted Creeper. Slower, but still great for Midrange Hunter.
Rallying Blade - A strong piece of that Steward of Darkshire deck.
Disciple of C'Thun - Basically an Argent Horserider (a fine card) plus a C'Thun buff.
Eternal Sentinel - Will just take over the place of Lava Shock, since it's also fine to play on-curve.
Selfless Hero - A strong piece of that Steward of Darkshire deck.
Forbidden Ritual - Flexibly generating tons of 1/1's is great in Zoo, especially with combos like Knife Juggler or Darkshire Councilman.
Moderately Played
N'Zoth the Corruptor - If nothing else, he'll be a strong optional finisher to add to Control Paladin, which will become a fairly strong deck archetype.
Yogg-Saron, Hope's End - At first I was definitely going to file this card under the "just for fun" category lower down. But after looking at the statistics of how many non-targeted beneficial spells there are, i think this card will actually see competitive play here and there, as a panic button in games that you're otherwise losing.
Hogger, Doom of Elwynn - Better than most people think it is. A good addition to Patron Warrior, a good C'Thun counter, and might even occasionally get just thrown into random decks with no particular synergy.
Mire Keeper - Not as great as a lot of people seem to think, but will sometimes get included anyway as an additional Wild Growth.
Infest - Better than many people seem to think. But not a must-include.
Undercity Huckster - Not as good as a lot of people seem to think. Half a Burgle is a pretty tame deathrattle. Except in Unearthed Raptor decks, I'm not sure this will get played any more than Undercity Valiant has seen play.
N'Zoth's First Mate - The value on this card is incredible, but that won't be enough to get it into Control or Patron Warrior lists. So the question is whether it will help make Aggro Warrior or Pirate Warrior viable. I'm guessing yes, but not to the point where they become top-tier.
Vilefin Inquisitor - Definitely a staple in non-OTK Murloc Paladin. Again, I'm guessing such a deck will be moderately successful, but not huge.
Forbidden Healing - It's not that strong a card, but will sometimes get used anyway as a stall tactic in Control Paladin, which will be pretty prominent.
Forbidden Shaping - Some Priests will find room for this flexibility. Others won't.
Doomcaller - Underwhelming when played on curve. Bringing C'Thun back for a second run is amazing -- if the meta is slow enough that the game isn't already decided after playing C'Thun the first time.
Twin Emperor Vek'lor - I don't think it's amazing, but it's a decent-value way for C'Thun decks to survive until the late game.
Faceless Summoner - Great value on average, and therefore will get included in some decks even though it's not really synergizing with how Mage decks work.
Psych-o-Tron - The new Sludge Belcher. But the crazy number of Taunts competing with it in this expansion keeps it from being one tier higher.
Shadowcaster - Insane potential, but very combo-dependent. I think people will stubbornly keep trying it out whether or not it really "works."
Usher of Souls - Even without its ability it's a Pit Fighter. I think C'Thun Warlock will be a mid-quality deck. Unless this deck is pretty zoo-ish, it'll be hard to get this ability to trigger may times.
Bloodhoof Brave - Pretty strong, but for a deck archetype that's always struggled. Fantastic to Bolster.
Cyclopian Horror - Usually at least at least as good as Sen'jin, fantastic against Zoo style decks. Again, so much competition from other Taunts this expansion.
Demented Frostcaller - A lot better than the community seems to think. Will be a major headache to deal with. Takes skill to get value out of it though.
Shadow Strike - Very meta-dependent. If all your opponents are playing Thaurissan or other high-value, expensive minions with 5 health, it will earn a place.
Bloodsail Cultist - Best pirate in a long time. Especially in combination with First Mate (turn 4!), will go a long way toward making Pirate Warrior playable.
Shatter - Some deck will figure out how to freeze enough to make this fantastic removal. Maybe the deck that also uses Demented Frostcaller.
Cult Sorcerer - Can a spell-heavy C'Thun deck be a thing? Even if it's not, this card might get played just for the solid stats and cheap spell damage.
Blood to Ichor - Fair substitute for Cruel Taskmaster. Fantastic for popping all those divine shields.
Journey Below - If Museum Curator is worth playing, this is too, especially in a deck with Unearthed Raptors.
Bladed Cultist - Bad on Turn 1 without The Coin. Bad in the late game. But SO strong in other early turns. Will tempo-focused Rogue decks be worthwhile?
Fiery Bat - Much like Huge Toad, which is decent. Might be a needed 1-drop for Aggro Hunter after nerfs.
Zealous Initiate - Great for tempo/aggro vs. tempo/aggro matchups. Poor vs. Control.
I Make No Prediction - These Cards Could Go Either Way
Giant Sand Worm - Better than most people think it is, this card could be a devastating board clear. It's a question of whether the right Hunter deck for it to exist will be a thing.
Ancient Harbinger - Better than most people think, it will at least be excellent removal bait.
Herald Volazj - Optimistically, might be a sleeper hit just for duplicating cheap staple cards.
Skeram Cultist - 7/6 stats are a lot better than people seem to think, especially with BGH nerfed. But C'Thun decks might be pretty crowded, so this may or may not make the cut.
Cult Apothecary - Excellent Healbot replacement if the meta is "swarmy" enough. But might be a Freeze Mage-only thing.
Forbidden Flame - We'll see if the flexibility is worth the lack of value.
Deathwing, Dragonlord - Will the meta be slow enough for really, really slow Dragon Control decks?
Bog Creeper - At first glance it looks like a typical noob trap, but it's close enough to Ancient of War to make me wonder if non-Druids might start using it in a similar manner.
Crazed Worshipper - Strictly better than Fen Creeper, but that's not saying much. Probably good in C'Thun Warrior? But might be popular in C'Thun decks in general ... I'm just not sure.
Forbidden Ancient - Usually better than Forbidden Shaping, yet Druid doesn't need the on-curve flexibility as much as Priest ...
Niche Use
Y'Shaarj, Rage Unbound - Only worthwhile in decks that can "cheat" it out early (Astral Druid, Ancestor's Call Shaman, Naga Sea Witch). Which won't be that prominent.
Wisps of the Old Gods - People are right that this card is pretty terrible overall. However, I think it could be a great 1-of in Zalae's Summoner Druid deck. Also somewhat redeemed by synergy with Fandral Staghelm.
Cho'Gall - He isn't good with enough spells to make it into most Warlock decks! Just comboing him with Siphon Soul and Shadowflame is too inconsistent. However, I see some promise in putting him into combo-Lock decks together with Rafaam.
Scaled Nightmare - Not good if you don't build a deck around it. But potentially devastating in a deck where you buff it (maybe with Djinni too, maybe with Conceal).
Cabalist's Tome - IMO, the loss in tempo is only worth it in Reno Fatigue Mage builds.
Validated Doomsayer - Might see a little use in aggressive decks, similar to Fel Reaver.
Eater of Secrets - A tech card, rarely seen in Standard but pretty good in Wild.
Faceless Shambler - I think a few decks will manage to find some uses for it. Mostly Handlock, or in combination with Steward of Darkshire?
Spreading Madness - Better than people think. Can be used as AoE in control-ish Warlock decks, if they're worried about facing Demonlocks (so Demonwrath is bad) or if they use cards that benefit from self-harm (Gurubashi, Imp Gang Boss, Acolyte, Patron, Floating Watcher in Wild).
Anomalus - Great value against decks like Handlock or Dragon Control, terrible in most other matchups. I'm guessing some deck will find it worthwhile, but I have no idea which one or how.
Malkorok - Good value on average, but quite risky. Most Warriors have enough weapons already (and would rather use Gorehowl) that they just won't find a a spot in their deck for this, with 7 armor. But some deck somewhere will find a way to build around this value.
Corrupted Seer - Do murloc decks need board clears at all? This seems really expensive, but I can't shake the feeling that it will find a niche somewhere.
Power Word: Tentacles - Optimistically, might be used for synergy with Lightspawn and Inner Fire.
Darkspeaker - This is really cool, but getting good value out of it (consistently) will take some real cleverness. Maybe making buffs like Power Overwhelming become permanent?
Evolved Kobold - Something can take advantage of the spell damage, I hope, in spite of the terrible stats.
Southsea Squidface - I really, really want to rate this card higher. But the timing of when you get the Deadly Poison effect just seems too unreliable. In the end, I'm not sure this ends up being any better than Dark Iron Dwarf.
Feral Rage - Might go into Druid decks that focus on the hero attacking a lot. Pretty awesome with Fandral Staghelm.
Addled Grizzly - Good for Token decks. Unlike Spawn of N'Zoth, can be activated multiple times on the same turn that you play it (without using removal on your own minion).
Forlorn Stalker - I think even Deathrattle Hunter decks will struggle to make good use of this consistently.
Silithid Swarmer - The disadvantage is pretty minimal in Rogue or in a weapon-heavy Warrior. (Pirate Warrior?) Are 3/5 stats for 3 enough ahead of curve to find a spot in a deck? I think so, in just the right deck.
Embrace the Shadow - Most Priest decks will prefer just 2 Auchenai's, with bodies built in. But maybe OTK Priest will be a thing.
Darkshire Librarian - If this is played on curve and there are no surprises, it's essentially just a vanilla 3/2 ... meh. But will Zoo topdeck it late-game, with an empty hand, often enough to make it great?
Nat, the Darkfisher - Probably useful in Mill decks. Otherwise interesting but not quite worthwhile.
Twilight Geomancer - Poor stats, but might be worth it in the slowest C'Thun decks.
Evolve - I don't think it deserves the hype it's getting. SO MUCH RNG (lots of chances to get a Doomsayer), and depends on being able to build up a board in the first place. Terrible anti-synergy with overload. Still might be great in token or battlecry Shaman decks.
Will Be Played Just For Fun, but Not Competitively
Servant of Yogg-Saron - The saving grace of Yogg is the Law of Large Numbers. If he casts 15 random spells, you're almost certain to benefit overall. One spell is much more "swingy." Outside of Casino Mage shenanigans, Mage will just have better 5-mana options.
Shifter Zerus - Usually not as good as just putting a consistently good card in your deck in the first place.
Won't See Play
DOOM! - Warlock decks just don't need the card draw.
Stand Against Darkness - Even with buffs, this just isn't good enough by the time you can cast it.
Spawn of N'Zoth - Shattered Sun Cleric doesn't really get played anymore, and the situations where this is any better than that are too rare.
Eldritch Horror - Like Captured Jormungar, but even slower and without beast synergy. Mediocre (at best) in Arena, useless in Constructed.
Nerubian Prophet - If Knight of the Wild wasn't good enough to make Beast Druid a thing, then this won't be any more successful.
Midnight Drake - The decks with lots of cards in hand aren't the decks that want really agressive stat distributions.
Squirming tentacle - Obviously significantly worse than Fierce Monkey, which is a good card but not a fantastic one.
Stormcrack - At first glance I was excited, but really, this is very similar to Shadow Bolt (meh). Being able to play it one turn earlier will seldom matter (e.g. a Totem Golem or something Innervated).
Duskboar - I'd rather play the new Worgen, and I'm not sure it's any good. This is just so fragile, even with Beast synergy.
Divine Strength - too defensive for aggro, too low-impact for control.
On the Hunt - Basically Elven Archer with Beast synergy. I don't think that's enough to make it see play when Elven Archer doesn't.
Primal Fusion - Tempting potential value, but kind of win-more. I just foresee it being hard to make room for it in a 30-card deck.
Freeze mage will be top tier, making eater of secrets a popular tech choice.
Without Mad Scientist and Antique Healbot I think Freeze Mage has taken more of a hit than people expect. Also, the loss of Mad Scientist just makes secrets WAY worse overall, I really don't expect Eater of Secrets to see much play at all in Standard.
Freeze mage will be top tier, making eater of secrets a popular tech choice.
Paladin, priest, and warrior have too much burst heal now for freeze mage to handle and C'thun is a thing of nightmares for freeze mage as it deals insane burst on top of being a tough body to handle. Freeze mage just cant compete in this meta consistently I dont think. However, if aggro pally becomes a thing (and I think it will), it will still be a solid deck that may see some usage as a tier 3 counterpick kind of deck.
Freeze mage will be top tier, making eater of secrets a popular tech choice.
Paladin, priest, and warrior have too much burst heal now for freeze mage to handle and C'thun is a thing of nightmares for freeze mage as it deals insane burst on top of being a tough body to handle. Freeze mage just cant compete in this meta consistently I dont think. However, if aggro pally becomes a thing (and I think it will), it will still be a solid deck that may see some usage as a tier 3 counterpick kind of deck.
You have a point, points I like and I feel much more at ease. Though C'thun decks will still fall prey to freeze mage I think. C'thun requires lots of minions which will be froze out and killed. meanwhile burst doens't mean anything against Iceblock, although due to the few creatures Freeze Mage has and how C'thun does it's damage I can see pinging the the ice block and leaving the mage at 1 health being relatively easy. Also because of Mad Scientists rotation it'll be harder for mage to make sure they take advantage of both ice blocks. In other words it won't be nearly as easy for freeze mage but I still feel like they have a leg up.
I predict:
Massive Druid Nerf
Slight Rogue Nerf (???)
Moderate Aggro Nerf
Unfun mechanisms Nerf (BGH, silence and maybe sap)
Retired Hearthstone Columnist
C'thun Druid is going to be amazing, so they're still going to maintain their current 'drop big monsters to punch people in the face with while you charge up your doom laser' style. Mind you, I'll take a turn 8-9 C'thun over a turn 6-7 Force-Roar combo any day.
Retired Hearthstone Columnist
... By which I mean, 'I'll take having to face a C'thun over a Force-Roar combo any day.'
Shifter Zerus probably isn't a very good card but I'm putting him in every deck I can anyway. He's too cool not to!
I updated my tier predictions with all the new cards. Whew.
Meta-Defining
Widely Played
Moderately Played
I Make No Prediction - These Cards Could Go Either Way
Niche Use
Will Be Played Just For Fun, but Not Competitively
Won't See Play
Wow, This Is Really Terrible
Freeze mage will be top tier, making eater of secrets a popular tech choice.
Finally got around to updating the list with all the cards from the stream day.
Stating a lot of bold opinions that a lot of people may disagree with.
This is my final list.