Considering the fact that im going to play only a 100% controll heavy (not even taken 4 mana 12/12 value cards) kingsbane rogue this expansion im really hoping to see this deck completely break the game.
why you may ask? i decided to go kingsbane when i saw the lab recruiter even before pogo and other then pogo kingsbane has heal and can sustain aggro matchups (i got 2 fans 2 vanishes and 2 blade flurris in there as i said with 100% controll heavy) and when i saw floop come out i decided to add 1 card against otk combos: eavasion (a 1 of tech card wich would get 2 slots if there gets to be a like higher then 50% chance to meat maly or this deck).
so gl with your 5 128 attack boars at the end of the combo or so.. you can only hit me in the face with one hahahahaha (yes im still dead tho), but
So, even if you can manage to get all seven combo cards in your hand in a reasonable amount of time (which will be difficult on its own), I think there are two problems.
1. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think this combo will junk up your hand with too many copies of Vivid Nightmare and Topsy Turvy. You need at least 5 copies of Divine Spirit to make the boar work. Each additional Test Subject will have the same number of Vivid Nightmares and Topsy Turveys (because they will stack from the one you had to kill off each previous iteration.) So, every time you kill off a new Test Subject you are going to get a lot of copies of both Vivid Nightmare and Topsy Turvy (that you don't want) along with the copies of Divine Spirit that you do want. But if you can't get 5 Divine Spirits, then the whole thing falls apart.
EDIT - The topsy turveys won't stack on each additional test subject, but the vivid nightmares will.
2. You are going to have to make a lot of extremely complicated clicks very quickly. And I mean a lot. I count 28 different cards (at the bare minimum) that need to be played. As long as the animations for Topsy Turvey and Test Subject don't take too long, that is doable in the 75 second time limit. But it will be hard. And require a lot of precision. If you accidentally do a Vivid Nightmare before a Divine Spirit on one of the first Test Subjects, the entire thing could get ruined.
TL;DR - This is probably too complicated to be that wide spread.
The thing about this deck is literally everything is going toward the OTK. There is very little that is going to control what your opponent is playing. Probably going to be a must win on turn 7. But yeah, I don't see a counter except to kill them before they kill you, which to be honest, doesn't seem like that will be to crazy hard to do.
So never in the history of the game we had a combo deck that can kill you on turn 7 with limetless Damage and through taunt with no card as counterplay whatsoever. Also Priest has tons of fetch cards: Dead RingerShadow VisionsSandbinderWitchwood Piper so its basically like Priest can play bazillion copys of the cards he needs, which are
This just looks like it has potential to just break the game, limitless damage through taunts for 7 mana in a deck full of fetch in a class that has access to stall and heal?!
What are your thoughts about this?
Out of all the Druids and Warlocks that are going to run rampant tomorrow, you are worried about topsy priest, lol.
Inner fire priest is a very slow deck, most of the minions in that deck are high health low power minions that doesn't do much proactively. All you need to do to win against inner fire priest is either play aggro or stall them by constantly clearing their board.
That 7 card combo is very weak and almost unnecessary, from my experience I have rarely lost a game because I was missing one Divine spirit or inner fire. Almost all the games I have lost with that deck is either because of aggro or I am unable to stick a high health minion on the board.
Conclusion : Don't be so paranoid, topsy priest will not even make tier 2.
Big combos with a handful of cards like this work SO poorly. It's just TOO hard to stay alive long enough to get all the pieces you need to pull it off. These kinda decks usually always end up with a 40% winrate or worse.
Any particular reason you are using awkward draw 1 neutrals over the classic pyro circle shell as the draw engine? It's better against aggro and draws faster and more consistently (assuming you run pipers). I assume it's overdraw concerns since your combo takes up so much hand space? Even so, you should definitely run twilight's call if you want to stick with the deathrattle shell. The 2nd copies of your combo pieces are probably doing more harm than good. When 7 cards are required you'll likely be drawing your entire deck. I don't know about the combo but the rest of the deck could use a lot of optimization
As for the combo itself I worry about it running into APM/animation issues. How many cards+attacks is the entire combo? It has to be something like 30 or more
Can somebody please explain to me, why taunts matter? You have like infinite 64/1 boars to clear them with the combo? No need for mass dispel. That's a big plus vs. The old inner fire combo. No board necessary, taun proof. Even giggling inventor will not help
While this is a cool combo, I don't see it being prominent in the new meta (or any meta) for one big reason.
The Mage non-quest fireballs OTK
Mage can already do "infinite" fireballs combo, and that combo takes fewer cards (6), is less card order / time sensitive than this combo, has fewer weaknesses / obstacles to get through than this combo does (more secrets that pose issues **coughexplosivetrapcough**, dealing with many taunts), mage has more stalls, mage usually runs 9 cards max in deck to make this happen whereas this requires up to 12 just for the combo pieces, and mage doesn't require all the combo pieces wait in hand until you want to use the combo.
Granted, this priest combo requires less total mana for truly large amounts of damage (8 by my count... so turn 7... if on coin; 10 mana for mage) and all happens in 1 turn (mage does need the setup turn at least, if all cards are in hand), but I don't see those being good enough reason to run the priest combo over mage combo in any meta that would be conducive to either.
...and this mage combo is not exactly big in the current meta... but taunt druid and hunters are.
Given infinite time, taunts aren't a problem. But you don't have much time for the number of spell casts and animations you would need to get through to get through even a few taunts, let alone something like a taunt druid board. The problem isn't inherently the taunts, its the clock, and the taunts will eat away at the clock.
Now your three spells are back in hand, AND you have a second Test Subject with those three buffs. You repeat the process on the second test subject (casting your second Vivid Nightmare onto a Radiant Elemental, to make all spells 0), which will now double the spells in hand since the second test subject will now have double. Now you can repeat infinitely. Then you can cast infinite Divine Spirit onto a minion or Stonetusk Boar and hit for infinite damage (so long as you aren't roped).
I'm curious to try, and possibly put it into a Deathrattle quest priest too as the win condition after stalling the board and Amara.
So I think you can only cast the 3rd Nightmare on an Elemental, since killing the second Test Subject should net you 2 spells each (I guess). That makes it a 9 mana combo however, unless I'm missing something (which is quite possible as it took me a lot of time to even understand this combo).
After killing the second test subject, you get two nightmares in hand, one for the elemental and one for the test subject to keep the ball rolling.
I don't know how good this will be only because druid can do the same but better.
I do not think that it will get nerfed. Since, there is a counter available for each player. They do not need to reconsider cards in this particular deck.
I don't get the fuzz to be honest. It's a 7!!! card combo. That's extremely hard to pull off. Building a deck which depends on a 7 card combo, it's a meme deck and not competitive. You'll have to hold cards for a long time, so you will fall behind very fast in the game. Most of the times you've lost already by the time you get this far and if you haven't yet, the opponent will bust you will all his taunts.
Combos like this wouldn't be an issue in Standard if there were more classes able to stop it other than Mage with a lucky Explosive Runes and Warlock with a lucky Demonic Project.
can I see your kingsbane idea, please?
So, even if you can manage to get all seven combo cards in your hand in a reasonable amount of time (which will be difficult on its own), I think there are two problems.
1. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think this combo will junk up your hand with too many copies of Vivid Nightmare and Topsy Turvy. You need at least 5 copies of Divine Spirit to make the boar work. Each additional Test Subject will have the same number of Vivid Nightmares and Topsy Turveys (because they will stack from the one you had to kill off each previous iteration.) So, every time you kill off a new Test Subject you are going to get a lot of copies of both Vivid Nightmare and Topsy Turvy (that you don't want) along with the copies of Divine Spirit that you do want. But if you can't get 5 Divine Spirits, then the whole thing falls apart.
EDIT - The topsy turveys won't stack on each additional test subject, but the vivid nightmares will.
2. You are going to have to make a lot of extremely complicated clicks very quickly. And I mean a lot. I count 28 different cards (at the bare minimum) that need to be played. As long as the animations for Topsy Turvey and Test Subject don't take too long, that is doable in the 75 second time limit. But it will be hard. And require a lot of precision. If you accidentally do a Vivid Nightmare before a Divine Spirit on one of the first Test Subjects, the entire thing could get ruined.
TL;DR - This is probably too complicated to be that wide spread.
can s1 explain the combo plz?
The thing about this deck is literally everything is going toward the OTK. There is very little that is going to control what your opponent is playing. Probably going to be a must win on turn 7. But yeah, I don't see a counter except to kill them before they kill you, which to be honest, doesn't seem like that will be to crazy hard to do.
Out of all the Druids and Warlocks that are going to run rampant tomorrow, you are worried about topsy priest, lol.
Inner fire priest is a very slow deck, most of the minions in that deck are high health low power minions that doesn't do much proactively. All you need to do to win against inner fire priest is either play aggro or stall them by constantly clearing their board.
That 7 card combo is very weak and almost unnecessary, from my experience I have rarely lost a game because I was missing one Divine spirit or inner fire. Almost all the games I have lost with that deck is either because of aggro or I am unable to stick a high health minion on the board.
Conclusion : Don't be so paranoid, topsy priest will not even make tier 2.
Big combos with a handful of cards like this work SO poorly. It's just TOO hard to stay alive long enough to get all the pieces you need to pull it off. These kinda decks usually always end up with a 40% winrate or worse.
Any particular reason you are using awkward draw 1 neutrals over the classic pyro circle shell as the draw engine? It's better against aggro and draws faster and more consistently (assuming you run pipers). I assume it's overdraw concerns since your combo takes up so much hand space? Even so, you should definitely run twilight's call if you want to stick with the deathrattle shell. The 2nd copies of your combo pieces are probably doing more harm than good. When 7 cards are required you'll likely be drawing your entire deck. I don't know about the combo but the rest of the deck could use a lot of optimization
As for the combo itself I worry about it running into APM/animation issues. How many cards+attacks is the entire combo? It has to be something like 30 or more
Legend with : S65 Freeze Mage, S57 Maly Gonk Druid, S57 "Okay" Shaman, S53 Boom-zooka Hunter, S53 Maly Tog Druid, S52 Wild Tog Druid ft.Blingtron, S50 Quest Rogue, S49 Dead Man's Warrior, S41 Wild Clown Fiesta Druid, S41 Hadronox Jade Druid, S40 Wild OTK Dragon Druid, S35 SMOrc Shaman, S33 Jade Druid, S22 Control Priest, S19 Control Priest
Can somebody please explain to me, why taunts matter? You have like infinite 64/1 boars to clear them with the combo? No need for mass dispel. That's a big plus vs. The old inner fire combo. No board necessary, taun proof. Even giggling inventor will not help
Occasionally gives helpful advice.
While this is a cool combo, I don't see it being prominent in the new meta (or any meta) for one big reason.
The Mage non-quest fireballs OTK
Mage can already do "infinite" fireballs combo, and that combo takes fewer cards (6), is less card order / time sensitive than this combo, has fewer weaknesses / obstacles to get through than this combo does (more secrets that pose issues **coughexplosivetrapcough**, dealing with many taunts), mage has more stalls, mage usually runs 9 cards max in deck to make this happen whereas this requires up to 12 just for the combo pieces, and mage doesn't require all the combo pieces wait in hand until you want to use the combo.
Granted, this priest combo requires less total mana for truly large amounts of damage (8 by my count... so turn 7... if on coin; 10 mana for mage) and all happens in 1 turn (mage does need the setup turn at least, if all cards are in hand), but I don't see those being good enough reason to run the priest combo over mage combo in any meta that would be conducive to either.
...and this mage combo is not exactly big in the current meta... but taunt druid and hunters are.
Yep only you, there are comboes with less cards/mana that see no play.. why would this see play?
Given infinite time, taunts aren't a problem. But you don't have much time for the number of spell casts and animations you would need to get through to get through even a few taunts, let alone something like a taunt druid board. The problem isn't inherently the taunts, its the clock, and the taunts will eat away at the clock.
After killing the second test subject, you get two nightmares in hand, one for the elemental and one for the test subject to keep the ball rolling.
I don't know how good this will be only because druid can do the same but better.
I do not think that it will get nerfed. Since, there is a counter available for each player. They do not need to reconsider cards in this particular deck.
I also like how this is resilient against Skulking Geist. :D
Looking at that list it feels like questless mage can survive longer and more reliable than that combo lol
If this gets out of control they could reduce the cost of nozdormu to 7 as a counter.
I don't get the fuzz to be honest.
It's a 7!!! card combo. That's extremely hard to pull off.
Building a deck which depends on a 7 card combo, it's a meme deck and not competitive.
You'll have to hold cards for a long time, so you will fall behind very fast in the game.
Most of the times you've lost already by the time you get this far and if you haven't yet, the opponent will bust you will all his taunts.
Combos like this wouldn't be an issue in Standard if there were more classes able to stop it other than Mage with a lucky Explosive Runes and Warlock with a lucky Demonic Project.
I am now scared of topsy turvy priest.
Scared to play it.
This alone brings the combo from "top tier" to "meme tier".
It will be reaaaally hard to pull off and is very easy to disrupt.
Bad players whine.
Good players adapt.