It is there you called it obviously Brocken? I don’t see it because BP is not, I can only see people doing wrong disicions against BP or playing decks with low winrate against BP, and then blaming their countless loses on how this deck is op, it is but not as op as everyone said it is, this deck needs a nerf, yes, but there are other problems in wild that needs solution more than big priest, and fixing Barnes/res mechanic must be a part of a big nerf not the only one
Whatever man. I won't argue further with you because you are playing deaf.
Personally, my problem with Barnes is making big priest a not fun deck to play against in general. I would be fine if they only have things like shadow essence. Also, I know, big priest doesn't have the biggest winrate of all time, so it would be pretty unfair to whine about them because they win all the time. But when shit like Barnes -> Obsidian -> double resurrect happens, it really rustles my jimmies to the extreme.
I don't even play ranked a lot, I play hearthstone for fun, and even I think Barnes is a problem.
I would compare big priest with turn 4 Barnes to mill rogue. Only the player that plays the deck have fun, the opposing player only gets frustrated.
I agree that Barnes is a bit much. It was cool for a time but should be reconsidered I feel. Thing is, there are plenty of wild cards that I feel could do with an adjustment.
For Barnes, I think he could totally be a 5 mana 4/5 with the same effect, just to control how early he comes out on the board.
yeah i hate that too but for me voidcaller is even a bigger problem. abdeck that cycles lie a jet and heals and board clears into otk.. yeah not really a fan of it.
Why most of wild players are so salty of Barnes? I’m not a big priest player, but I think if blizzard will decide to fix Barnes they also need to fix voidcaller and molten giants both allows the same swing turns. But no one is complaining about cubelock turn 3 demon sense into turn 4 caller pact or pally turn 3 Thekal. And in game mode there such turns is not even considered a problem it’s fine to have card like Barnes
P.S. you can easily tech your deck agains priest ressumoning mechanic, so just please if you are writing about nerfs in wild alongside Barnes remind blizzard about thing from bellow, Kingsbane, voidcaller,Kabal crystal runner, potion of madness and lots of other cards that allows unfair swing turns
Barnes has nothing to do with "Swing turns", there's a reason he is only complained about in Priest. His ability enables a consistent, nearly endless supply of the same huge, high value minion starting as early as turn 4.
The only reliable way to tech against it is Potion of Madness/Shadow Madness or drawing Polymorph/Hex early. The "swing cards" you listed have literally nothing on dropping an Obsidian Statue 3-4 times before turn 9. Nerfed Kingsbane? 0 mana 5/5 on turn 5? Gimme a break dude.
Voidcaller is the only one you mentioned that comes close to Barnes, the one difference being that Voidcaller has many more counters and Warlock can't just resummon Mal'Ganis again until turn 10.
The original problem is indeed how the copy/graveyard system is handled.
Since i doubt they plan to correct the whole mechanic (but they should), the problem shifts to cards and their synergies.
The removal/stall arsenal of Priest is already insane, and grows stronger every year.
The old Resurrection cards are extremely efficient.
The summoning cards (Barnes but also Shadow Essence) come incredibly early (also considering the removal arsenal).
Crucially, without summons, Resurrection is useless, however efficient.
So nerfing the summoners package, possibly hard, will fix the deck forever, and let REAL Priests emerge in the Wild meta (and they do have a couple of solid meta decks already).
Given the arsenal again, nerfing only Barnes could be insufficient on the long run.
But i repeat, the original problem is the silly graveyard system of HS.
Voidcaller is also problematic, eg it shatters the rules of the Mana Curve as much as Big Priest, but it is DR, and requires further synergy with Hand. Surely Warlock can consistently fix that...
_____
But indeed, breaking the limitations of the Mana Curve (before t10) is the largest part of why Wild feels broken, instead of just very powerful.
This is the correct answer. The way the deck is built it just isn't especially vulnerable to early aggression. It has amazing clears, amazing spot removal, amazing healing.
A tip - freeze mage/ Aluneth mage absolutely wrecks big priest and control warlocks. The recent nerfs to tempo and aggro have also helped the deck a lot.
Play lots of freeze aluneth mage and BM the hell out of big priest players.
Why most of wild players are so salty of Barnes? I’m not a big priest player, but I think if blizzard will decide to fix Barnes they also need to fix voidcaller and molten giants both allows the same swing turns. But no one is complaining about cubelock turn 3 demon sense into turn 4 caller pact or pally turn 3 Thekal. And in game mode there such turns is not even considered a problem it’s fine to have card like Barnes
P.S. you can easily tech your deck agains priest ressumoning mechanic, so just please if you are writing about nerfs in wild alongside Barnes remind blizzard about thing from bellow, Kingsbane, voidcaller,Kabal crystal runner, potion of madness and lots of other cards that allows unfair swing turns
As someone who plays Wild, I just want to point out that if you know what you're doing and you're playing a reasonably built deck, you should be able to beat Big Priest. This may require you to play some tech cards. While Barnes can be infuriating, sometimes they don't have it. The issue isn't Barnes (IMO), but rather the Resurrection mechanic as a whole. Blizzard needs to simply release could counter cards to deal with the deck. For example, cards like Gravelsnout Knight and Saronite Taskmaster can muddy up your opponent's res-pool. There are also class cards that work well against the deck, such as Sap and Vanish, Polymorph and Kazakus, and Hex (with Zentimo. Are these good enough answers to conclude the conversation about Barnes? Of course not! If anything, up the mana cost to 6, which puts it on par with Shadow Essence, giving players enough time to prepare/draw their counters. With Barnes at 6, it may even get dropped from the list. I'd be interested in seeing how many people would continue to complain about Big Priest even without Barnes...
How about Team 5 actually does something about the deck, so we stop complaining?
I seriously cannot believe how globally hated decks like BP (Raza Priest back in the day, or Jade Druid) can find so much support in this website. With highly intelligent arguments, like 'Stop crying', or 'Its fine' w/o giving a single reason why it might be fine, and why 95% of people in this thread and more than half of the community who has ever touched wild mode are completely wrong.
I just assume the reason why its fine is you just play the deck, get Barnes on Turn 4, who draw a Y'Shaarj, which draws into another one. Then their opponent kills the 1/1, then the next turn, 2 Resurrect brings 2 Y'Shaarjs back, so now there are 3, which in turn summons Rag, Statue and KT. Its Turn 5, there are 3 Y'Shaarjs, Rag, KT and Statue, and Barnes, which is in total 59 mana. How much you spent? 8. Your opponent is looking for a large hammer to crush their computer. And you, who just won a really hard, nail-biting game, by making some amazing plays, come to Hearthpwn to defend the deck.
I created one of the topics you mentioned. You want me to do it again?
Barnes is not the main problem but the resurrection mechanic is. A lot of "Big" decks use Barnes to cheat big minions but the difference is that if you kill the 1/1 it gets killed and stops doing his effect (8 damage for Ragnaros, mind control for Sylvanas etc...) but with priest if that happens it will get resurrected a lot of times.
Big priest in wild is very frustrating and it is what like now is ruining wild and the reasons are these:
1) Big priest has the strongest turns 6/7/8/9 in the game (and 4 and 5 if he had Barnes)
2) Due to this people are forced to play aggro in order to kill big priest before these turns
3) Wild in composed then mainly but heavy aggros, due to this a lot of decks are not practically permitted
4) Big priest is very very hard to manage even for big controls
5) Big priest is very frustrating to play against because when you receive always board clears and then a 4/8 taunt and life steal is not fun at all
6) It is a lot that this deck is played and there are many of them so time and frequency are others two frustrating factors
7) Big priest is probably what shaped more the meta in wild forcing a lot of people in aggro and closing the opportunity to any midrange deck. No midrange deck has any possibility against the value generated by big priest
8) Big priest is even more frustrating when you receive a turn 4 Barnes
9) Turn 4 Barnes may win a game in only one turn
These are the reasons why Team 5 should, in my opinion, insta nerf Big Priest, and not only in Barnes but also in other cards. This deck is wrong, it is shaping the meta and ruining wild.
To be fair there are several decks in wild that can crush big priest handily.
Off the top of my head: Kingsbane Pirate Rogue, Control Rogue, Tempo Mage, Even Shaman, Reno Priest and Renolock/Evenlock all have great chances of smashing big priests.
I dont think BP is nearly oppressive as people make it out to be, especially in Wild. I farm Big Priests and Warlocks with my Control Rogue, i welcome seeing them.
How about Team 5 actually does something about the deck, so we stop complaining?
Do you seriously belive people will stop complaining? They wont. People will start complaining about whatever deck fills the void. It goes on, and on. As stated in this thread there are many decks that steam roll BP. I suggest you make one.
To be fair there are several decks in wild that can crush big priest handily.
Off the top of my head: Kingsbane Pirate Rogue, Control Rogue, Tempo Mage, Even Shaman, Reno Priest and Renolock/Evenlock all have great chances of smashing big priests.
I dont think BP is nearly oppressive as people make it out to be, especially in Wild. I farm Big Priests and Warlocks with my Control Rogue, i welcome seeing them.
What even is control rogue... are you referring to mill rogue?
Even shaman is unfavored, reno priest is 50/50, evenlock is unfavored and renolock might as well instantly concede against big priest. So much for those matchups you mentioned...
Anyway, it's not about the deck being oppressive. The deck is in a reasonable spot in tier 1. It's about the fact that pulling barnes on turn 3/4 increases the deck's winrate by an unhealthy amount. This allows the deck to win certain games it should have no business winning whatsoever, all because they drew a single card within the first few turns of the game. This is unhealthy and about as unfun as it gets for both sides, eventually. I don't understand why so many people fail to see this. They keep thinking people complain because big priest is overpowered, it's not. Barnes is.
Kek talking about reflecting your feelings on someone else xD
"Boohoo I got rekt by 1 card sometimes it must be OP pls blizzard nerf it so I can stop crying because I have nothing else going on in my life"
" I am here because my life suck and I have a lot fun using big priest.
Every night I am praying Jesus hoping in a non Nerf for my favorite deck. I am poor and noob and I don't have the dusts to craft another deck. Sometimes when it is late I like masturbate me when I think Ragnaros the Firelord. He is hot and I don't have a girlfriend. I love Blizzard and I agree with everything. Even when they push it in my ass. Because I like it."
I actually dont play big priest nor do I plan to and I have more than enough dust to play whatever I want so no problem there. Thanks for your concern though. Enjoy the report.
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Whatever man. I won't argue further with you because you are playing deaf.
Have a good day.
Personally, my problem with Barnes is making big priest a not fun deck to play against in general. I would be fine if they only have things like shadow essence. Also, I know, big priest doesn't have the biggest winrate of all time, so it would be pretty unfair to whine about them because they win all the time. But when shit like Barnes -> Obsidian -> double resurrect happens, it really rustles my jimmies to the extreme.
I don't even play ranked a lot, I play hearthstone for fun, and even I think Barnes is a problem.
I would compare big priest with turn 4 Barnes to mill rogue. Only the player that plays the deck have fun, the opposing player only gets frustrated.
I agree that Barnes is a bit much. It was cool for a time but should be reconsidered I feel. Thing is, there are plenty of wild cards that I feel could do with an adjustment.
For Barnes, I think he could totally be a 5 mana 4/5 with the same effect, just to control how early he comes out on the board.
Yo waddup fam
Kek talking about reflecting your feelings on someone else xD
"Boohoo I got rekt by 1 card sometimes it must be OP pls blizzard nerf it so I can stop crying because I have nothing else going on in my life"
yeah i hate that too but for me voidcaller is even a bigger problem. abdeck that cycles lie a jet and heals and board clears into otk.. yeah not really a fan of it.
Barnes has nothing to do with "Swing turns", there's a reason he is only complained about in Priest. His ability enables a consistent, nearly endless supply of the same huge, high value minion starting as early as turn 4.
The only reliable way to tech against it is Potion of Madness/Shadow Madness or drawing Polymorph/Hex early. The "swing cards" you listed have literally nothing on dropping an Obsidian Statue 3-4 times before turn 9. Nerfed Kingsbane? 0 mana 5/5 on turn 5? Gimme a break dude.
Voidcaller is the only one you mentioned that comes close to Barnes, the one difference being that Voidcaller has many more counters and Warlock can't just resummon Mal'Ganis again until turn 10.
PERFECT!
The problem is not Barnes... it's the multiple ressurections...
And guess what? They just presented us with Catrina Muerte and Mass Ressurection...
Go figure...
This is the correct answer. The way the deck is built it just isn't especially vulnerable to early aggression. It has amazing clears, amazing spot removal, amazing healing.
A tip - freeze mage/ Aluneth mage absolutely wrecks big priest and control warlocks. The recent nerfs to tempo and aggro have also helped the deck a lot.
Play lots of freeze aluneth mage and BM the hell out of big priest players.
As someone who plays Wild, I just want to point out that if you know what you're doing and you're playing a reasonably built deck, you should be able to beat Big Priest. This may require you to play some tech cards. While Barnes can be infuriating, sometimes they don't have it. The issue isn't Barnes (IMO), but rather the Resurrection mechanic as a whole. Blizzard needs to simply release could counter cards to deal with the deck. For example, cards like Gravelsnout Knight and Saronite Taskmaster can muddy up your opponent's res-pool. There are also class cards that work well against the deck, such as Sap and Vanish, Polymorph and Kazakus, and Hex (with Zentimo. Are these good enough answers to conclude the conversation about Barnes? Of course not! If anything, up the mana cost to 6, which puts it on par with Shadow Essence, giving players enough time to prepare/draw their counters. With Barnes at 6, it may even get dropped from the list. I'd be interested in seeing how many people would continue to complain about Big Priest even without Barnes...
Barnes is fine. Stop being salty and move on. No more threads about Big Priest, plz..
As you wish your excellence.
How about Team 5 actually does something about the deck, so we stop complaining?
I seriously cannot believe how globally hated decks like BP (Raza Priest back in the day, or Jade Druid) can find so much support in this website. With highly intelligent arguments, like 'Stop crying', or 'Its fine' w/o giving a single reason why it might be fine, and why 95% of people in this thread and more than half of the community who has ever touched wild mode are completely wrong.
I just assume the reason why its fine is you just play the deck, get Barnes on Turn 4, who draw a Y'Shaarj, which draws into another one. Then their opponent kills the 1/1, then the next turn, 2 Resurrect brings 2 Y'Shaarjs back, so now there are 3, which in turn summons Rag, Statue and KT. Its Turn 5, there are 3 Y'Shaarjs, Rag, KT and Statue, and Barnes, which is in total 59 mana. How much you spent? 8. Your opponent is looking for a large hammer to crush their computer. And you, who just won a really hard, nail-biting game, by making some amazing plays, come to Hearthpwn to defend the deck.
I created one of the topics you mentioned. You want me to do it again?
Barnes is not the main problem but the resurrection mechanic is. A lot of "Big" decks use Barnes to cheat big minions but the difference is that if you kill the 1/1 it gets killed and stops doing his effect (8 damage for Ragnaros, mind control for Sylvanas etc...) but with priest if that happens it will get resurrected a lot of times.
the problem is you can ress it more then once
t5 double ress is too op
What this Guy Said.
Just do us a favor, Blizzard, and increase the mana cost of these cards by two:
Resurrect/Barnes/Eternal Servitude
And, increase the cost of this card by one:
Lesser Diamond Spellstone
So? "Big Priest" problem will be gone for good.
Thanks in advance.
To be fair there are several decks in wild that can crush big priest handily.
Off the top of my head: Kingsbane Pirate Rogue, Control Rogue, Tempo Mage, Even Shaman, Reno Priest and Renolock/Evenlock all have great chances of smashing big priests.
I dont think BP is nearly oppressive as people make it out to be, especially in Wild. I farm Big Priests and Warlocks with my Control Rogue, i welcome seeing them.
Do you seriously belive people will stop complaining? They wont. People will start complaining about whatever deck fills the void. It goes on, and on. As stated in this thread there are many decks that steam roll BP. I suggest you make one.
What even is control rogue... are you referring to mill rogue?
Even shaman is unfavored, reno priest is 50/50, evenlock is unfavored and renolock might as well instantly concede against big priest. So much for those matchups you mentioned...
Anyway, it's not about the deck being oppressive. The deck is in a reasonable spot in tier 1. It's about the fact that pulling barnes on turn 3/4 increases the deck's winrate by an unhealthy amount. This allows the deck to win certain games it should have no business winning whatsoever, all because they drew a single card within the first few turns of the game. This is unhealthy and about as unfun as it gets for both sides, eventually. I don't understand why so many people fail to see this. They keep thinking people complain because big priest is overpowered, it's not. Barnes is.
I actually dont play big priest nor do I plan to and I have more than enough dust to play whatever I want so no problem there. Thanks for your concern though. Enjoy the report.