I have taken into account some of this stuff in a previous reply, so I'll keep to I didn't think through before.
I like Eater of Secrets as a one of but you have a point since Mad Scientist will be gone. Kezan Mystic is gone too. I'll have to review this one later so I'll just mark it for now.
I'm pretty sure Cabalist's Tome will see play in Reno mage where tempo isn't hard to compensate for in late game. It might be a bit overestimated since I'm not sure how to value the creation of 3 random cards out of one. Hard one for me, but I'll demote it one tier since its value is questionable.
I think that ''Thing from below'' and ''Master of Evolution'' might be tier 0, seems like Blizzard really want to give shaman a boost.
Reason's Are:
''Thing from below'' already becomes really damn good after just summoning 2 totems, then it'd be a 4 mana 5/5 taunt. In late game this card has the potential of costing all the way down to 0 mana. Also this have pretty damn good synergy with ''Master of Evulution'' as it will give you a 7 mana card. (usualy a around a 7/7)
''Master of Evolution'' might be the strongest card released so far in my opinion, it's a 4 mana card that has the value of a 5 mana minion. Guess what other card is also a 4 mana minion that have the value of 5 mana? That's right Piloted Shredder. :P Just imagine playing ''tuskar totemic'' and then follow it up with ''master of evulution'', seems pretty damn broken. XD
Also i think that you're right about ''Aincent Shieldbearer'' being really good, i'd run C'thun in warrior just to be able to play this. ;) It's basicly a Shieldmaiden on crack.
I might consider moving ''DOOM!!'' down to bottom tier, it's basicly an ''Twisting Nether'' with a pretty huge downside. (You die to fatigue or overdraw)
I think that ''Thing from below'' and ''Master of Evolution'' might be tier 0, seems like Blizzard really want to give shaman a boost.
Reason's Are:
''Thing from below'' already becomes really damn good after just summoning 2 totems, then it'd be a 4 mana 5/5 taunt. In late game this card has the potential of costing all the way down to 0 mana. Also this have pretty damn good synergy with ''Master of Evulution'' as it will give you a 7 mana card. (usualy a around a 7/7)
''Master of Evolution'' might be the strongest card released so far in my opinion, it's a 4 mana card that has the value of a 5 mana minion. Guess what other card is also a 4 mana minion that have the value of 5 mana? That's right Piloted Shredder. :P Just imagine playing ''tuskar totemic'' and then follow it up with ''master of evulution'', seems pretty damn broken. XD
Also i think that you're right about ''Aincent Shieldbearer'' being really good, i'd run C'thun in warrior just to be able to play this. ;) It's basicly a Shieldmaiden on crack.
I might consider moving ''DOOM!!'' down to bottom tier, it's basicly an ''Twisting Nether'' with a pretty huge downside. (You die to fatigue or overdraw)
Anyways nice list, keep up the great work!! :D
Hey thanks for the reply and support!
As for the Shaman cards I initially thought of making both of them tier 0 but after more careful consideration I prudently moved them both to tier 1.
Thing from Below is just a really good card that can be played on turn 4 for good tempo as you say and later for great tempo, but I have tested midrange Shaman in the past and my concern is with the archetype rather than the card itself. It just lacks draw (as pointed out by Purpenflurb earlier), and because of this I decided to not make it tier 1 because I don't know Shaman that well to say this is game breaking and I don't want to make claims I can't back up.
Master of Evolution was a tough call. 4/5 is fine and I think the right way to look at it is that you can always use it on a totem. You will not be always getting value from it, the value is situational unlike Shredder, and against Shaman the right way to play is to always try to remove their board which is easier after Naxx is out of the picture. So midrange decks like actual Zoo (which will be out of the picture) and tempo Mage will almost always succeed in denying you that extra value but against control Warrior for example it gives you the tempo you want to put pressure on them and I believe its better than Piloted Shredder in this match up. For these reasons its looking more like a tier 1 card to me. All hail the "recombobuyeti", as someone called it.
Yeah I'm not sure about DOOM! so I'll just do as you said.
I agree with the guy that said Steward of Darkshire is one of the most amazing cards in the set. The trick is keeping him on the board for a turn or two, which isn't guaranteed even if you have board presence and he's a 3/3 for 3 mana.
Stand Against Darkness? Those guys come out with divine shield. Half of the cards with the murloc tag? Sure. Your hero power, whether murloc or Justicar'd or whatever? Uh huh. Twilight Drake? Faceless Shambler? Does it combo with Sword of Justice? No idea, but I want to find out.
But I could really see this guy being influential enough that it actually drags Power Word: Horror up from tier 4 to tier 2 or 3 all by itself.
I agree with the guy that said Steward of Darkshire is one of the most amazing cards in the set. The trick is keeping him on the board for a turn or two, which isn't guaranteed even if you have board presence and he's a 3/3 for 3 mana.
Stand Against Darkness? Those guys come out with divine shield. Half of the cards with the murloc tag? Sure. Your hero power, whether murloc or Justicar'd or whatever? Uh huh. Twilight Drake? Faceless Shambler? Does it combo with Sword of Justice? No idea, but I want to find out.
But I could really see this guy being influential enough that it actually drags Power Word: Horror up from tier 4 to tier 2 or 3 all by itself.
The deck getting the most out of this will be some kind of aggro Paladin and it probably wants to get immediate value. The thing is by the turn you are able to get immediate value out of this have you not already played most of your 1-health minions? The archetype is still a question mark to me so I can't make it tier 1.
Ancient sheildbearer is a joke at tier 0. Sure if c'thun warriors is a thing this card may shut face decks out of the game, it dosen't do much against a deck with a board position, it could give you 20 armor and the battlecry would still have little relevance in a control match up.
That's not comparable to a card that every non-combo deck with plans to get to turn 7, often single handedly reserve the tide of a game if unanswered and is so prevalent that it warped the meta with people teching in a card just to counter it, and even when countered the player who played it still has a good chance of coming out ahead.
The tier 4 list is full of cards that are playable - great Given the right meta/synergy.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Saying RNG isn't detracting from skill in hearthstone, won't convince anyone it's a good idea. It just shows your too stupid to understand the basics principles of good game design.
I believe I was hyped about Hallazeal the Ascended. It seems too slow and hard to abuse. I've demoted it to tier 2 until something comes up that justifies this being tier 1. I don't want to be unfair about it just because I like it a lot.
I don't believe I'm being unfair about Ancient Shieldbearer. I'm just assuming C'thun Warrior will be a thing like I said. Its not Dr. Boom, I don't mean it like that.
Added Ravaging Ghoul as a tier 2 card because of whirlwind value + ~2 mana worth of stats but its hard to find a place for it right now.
Klaxxi Amber-Weaver should probably be tier 3 ... stats alone don't make for a good creature if they don't come with taunt. No reason to play this right now. Blademaster can be really good in Priest but he can heal it. Some input?
Hammer of Twilight is just predictable, has no interesting synergies and costs more mana than similar cards from other classes. Cards like this usually dont see any competitive play.
Forbidden Flame doesn't hit face though. How often do you Pyroblast a minion?
I think it could be at least tier 3 though, since it's a cheap (0 mana) activator for Flamewaker or Antonidas. If you have spell damage, it still does 3 damage for 2 mana as well.
Hammer of Twilight is definetly a good card. 4/2 weapon for 5 isn't bad and on top of that you're getting a 4/2 body as a deathrattle. Better than Doomhammer for Midrange and Control decks that aren't looking for the burst and on top of that no overload.
Hammer of Twilight is only edged out by Truesilver Champion and Death's Bite, which are OP. It's a perfectly good weapon for a class whose only options up until now were Doomhammer and a couple of shitty small ones. It's better than Powermace, and Powermace saw some play; it's better than Stormforged Axe, and Storm Axe sees play (albeit in aggro decks, while this is more of a midrange or control card).
Hammer of Twilight is only edged out by Truesilver Champion and Death's Bite, which are OP. It's a perfectly good weapon for a class whose only options up until now were Doomhammer and a couple of shitty small ones. It's better than Powermace, and Powermace saw some play; it's better than Stormforged Axe, and Storm Axe sees play (albeit in aggro decks, while this is more of a midrange or control card).
Why is Powermace inferior to this card? You can control its effect or even use it right away and it only costs 3 mana which is sweet since you can remove early stuff with it. For 5 mana and 4 damage to remove 3-4 health minions this seems to be both overpriced and in the wrong place it needs to be, which is 4 mana.
I think that ''Thing from below'' and ''Master of Evolution'' might be tier 0, seems like Blizzard really want to give shaman a boost.
Reason's Are:
''Thing from below'' already becomes really damn good after just summoning 2 totems, then it'd be a 4 mana 5/5 taunt. In late game this card has the potential of costing all the way down to 0 mana.
Also this have pretty damn good synergy with ''Master of Evulution'' as it will give you a 7 mana card. (usualy a around a 7/7)
''Master of Evolution'' might be the strongest card released so far in my opinion, it's a 4 mana card that has the value of a 5 mana minion. Guess what other card is also a 4 mana minion that have the value of 5 mana? That's right Piloted Shredder. :P
Just imagine playing ''tuskar totemic'' and then follow it up with ''master of evulution'', seems pretty damn broken. XD
Also i think that you're right about ''Aincent Shieldbearer'' being really good, i'd run C'thun in warrior just to be able to play this. ;)
It's basicly a Shieldmaiden on crack.
I might consider moving ''DOOM!!'' down to bottom tier, it's basicly an ''Twisting Nether'' with a pretty huge downside. (You die to fatigue or overdraw)
Anyways nice list, keep up the great work!! :D
Renounce Darkness and Infest tier 4???
are you crazzy?
Infest with unleash the hounds is amazing card drawn and Renounce Darkness is playable in some kind of valuelock
Moved Polluted Hoarder one tier down due to poor stat distribution.
Need more input on Klaxxi Amber-Weaver, Forbidden Healing and Vilefin Inquisitor.
Thinking of demoting Xaril, Poisoned Mind due to toxins being unreliable.
Updated text format to make it easier on the eye.
Vilefin Inquisitor is not that bad because of murloc synergy cards like Murloc Warleader
Tier 4: Op's tier list.
Ancient sheildbearer is a joke at tier 0. Sure if c'thun warriors is a thing this card may shut face decks out of the game, it dosen't do much against a deck with a board position, it could give you 20 armor and the battlecry would still have little relevance in a control match up.
That's not comparable to a card that every non-combo deck with plans to get to turn 7, often single handedly reserve the tide of a game if unanswered and is so prevalent that it warped the meta with people teching in a card just to counter it, and even when countered the player who played it still has a good chance of coming out ahead.
The tier 4 list is full of cards that are playable - great Given the right meta/synergy.
Saying RNG isn't detracting from skill in hearthstone, won't convince anyone it's a good idea. It just shows your too stupid to understand the basics principles of good game design.
I believe I was hyped about Hallazeal the Ascended. It seems too slow and hard to abuse. I've demoted it to tier 2 until something comes up that justifies this being tier 1. I don't want to be unfair about it just because I like it a lot.
I don't believe I'm being unfair about Ancient Shieldbearer. I'm just assuming C'thun Warrior will be a thing like I said. Its not Dr. Boom, I don't mean it like that.
Hallazeal is very good ,if your opponent kills it on the turn after u play him, he is like a druid of the claw in taunt form
Added Ravaging Ghoul as a tier 2 card because of whirlwind value + ~2 mana worth of stats but its hard to find a place for it right now.
Klaxxi Amber-Weaver should probably be tier 3 ... stats alone don't make for a good creature if they don't come with taunt. No reason to play this right now. Blademaster can be really good in Priest but he can heal it. Some input?
Added Hammer of Twilight and Mire Keeper.
Hammer of Twilight is just predictable, has no interesting synergies and costs more mana than similar cards from other classes. Cards like this usually dont see any competitive play.
Forbidden Flame will see play if pyroblast sees play, pyroblast has seen play since beta in freeze mage. Forbidden Flame should be tier 1
Edit: I can not read
Forbidden Flame doesn't hit face though. How often do you Pyroblast a minion?
I think it could be at least tier 3 though, since it's a cheap (0 mana) activator for Flamewaker or Antonidas. If you have spell damage, it still does 3 damage for 2 mana as well.
Its fangs are in your flesh before its hiss leaves your ears.
Golden Heroes: Druid -> Rogue -> Shaman -> Hunter -> Warlock
Hammer of Twilight is definetly a good card. 4/2 weapon for 5 isn't bad and on top of that you're getting a 4/2 body as a deathrattle. Better than Doomhammer for Midrange and Control decks that aren't looking for the burst and on top of that no overload.
Cult Apothecary isn't Antique Healbot, but it's the only neutral heal we GET, now. That isn't tier 4-worthy.
Hammer of Twilight is only edged out by Truesilver Champion and Death's Bite, which are OP. It's a perfectly good weapon for a class whose only options up until now were Doomhammer and a couple of shitty small ones. It's better than Powermace, and Powermace saw some play; it's better than Stormforged Axe, and Storm Axe sees play (albeit in aggro decks, while this is more of a midrange or control card).
I don't really care what anyone says I really believe renounce darkness is a hidden gem