Everyone who plays wild knows that Big Priest is one of the biggest problems of wild. Since it counters midrange and control decks so hard the ladder is full of aggro decks and some other mana cheating decks like big priest. If it weren't for big priest there would be more control decks that will balance the ratio of different type of decks in wild.
Most people wants ressurection cards to get nerfed, but I think those cards are totally fine as long as they cannot cheat mana and play big minions very early.
Here is my suggestion, nerf Barnes and Shadow Essence so that they cannot summon their big minions early and snowball. I will suggest a Blizzard way of nerf for these cards. Just increase their cost by 2 and it should be fine. Obviously there could be more elegant ways to nerf those cards but you all know that Blizzard don't do such nerfs.
While mentioning Big Priest I would also like to mention another deck that devestates control: Jade Druid. For this deck just nerf Jade Idol to shuffle a different version of Jade Idol which only have the option of summoning jades. With the addition of Keeper Stalladris that deck should be just fine.
You might think that I want nerfs for control decks but that is not my intention. When an archtype is missing in the gameplay you just cannot have a decent meta hence no diversity.
What is your opinion, would this make wild ladder better?
Yes yes yes. Lets nerf Mechwarper while we at it, Kazakus now requires 3 copies of a card in your deck to activate, Reno heals only 15 now and Baku/Genn decks just force you to press concede if you play them. While we at it lets nerf all Giants and add +10 cost to all of them. Kingsbane now gives your opponent 2 copes of Ooze. Give all murlocs the Battlecry: deal 5 damage to yourself because me no likey playing against strong cards.
I would maybe see the Big Priest nerf because highroll archetype is annoying af, but haven't Jade Druid suffered enough honestly? Those poor fellas are conceding against Skulking Geist 100% of the time and yet you want to nerf them again.
Can't we just play cards in an Eternal format called Wild and rather explore all the combo and deck and build possibilities rather than whining and "fixing" it?
While I understand your concern I must say that if a deck is hated by a huge amount of people and is considered unfun to play against I would say that it requires to be tuned down. As for Jade Druid, I'm not that against it like Big Priest. Maybe fixing Big Priest will suffice.
As an addition I don't understand why people like to argue in such manner. I have already stated in my post that I would like to hear others opinion yet people like you like to heat up the conversation immediately.
Indeed, Jade Druid needs no nerf. It's just a solid deck now, and the Keeper Stalladris build is not even the strongest one btw.
I'm sure we'll see a decent nerf to Big Priest and Darkest Hour Warlock sometime soon enough, and Wild will be ok for a very long while (untile they release new broken cards).
OP, do you realise there are thousands of threads about nerfing Big Priest and your "easy" and "perfect" way to fix it has been suggested plenty of times?
1) Big priest has so many tools now that competitive lists actually cut Barnes
2) In the crappy lists that still run Barnes, many games are still won without seeing a Barnes
3) the real problem is that there's no tech against the deck because
3.a) transform effects are limited to certain classes, limiting other classes to cards that summon stuff in your opponent's side of the board to mess with the res pool
3.b) Cards that summon minions on your opponent side of the board and transformed minions get ignored because Eternal Servitude allows big priest to dodge tech
4) the only other "tech" you can run against big priest is returning their stuff to their hands, which only 1 class can do,
Sooooo after you “fix” Big Priest, will the next thread be about how to “fix” the Wild Control Decks? Because that’s every other thread about Standard currently.
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Grammar is the difference between knowing your crap, and knowing you’re crap.
I just thought of one new and memey to do it. Print a card that destroys any duplicate card in opponent deck and shuffle 1 reno jackson to the deck to compensate. This would half big priest potential.
also jade druid is good because keep decks like odd warrior in check im sure if they nerf jade druid u people all gonna complain about odd warrior and 1h long games like standard players
Dunno, but majority of votes is : NO! So, i guess u have ur answer about it. NOT HUGE PEOPLE HATE THE DECK! Move on...
oh no, all of us actualy hate the deck and think it deserves a nerf, the thing is that Op's proposed nerfs do nothing, the real card to nerf is eternal servitude, to not revive only friendly minions but any minions that died during the game
So STFU and dont say anything if you dont have anything to contribute
I don't like Big Priest, and a nerf would probably be justified after 2 years. But I don't think nerfing the deck will really fix the problem.
Nerfing Barnes might discourage some players to play Big Priest (which would help already), but there's no shortage of options in building a Priest deck that is just as unfair by similar means, starting with that some don't even use Barnes anymore. Once they get their right cards, there are only a handful of cards, almost all of them class cards, that can do anything about it, and they are nowhere near as decisive as Skulking Geist.
That's all the cards that potentially counter Big Priest's (and similar decks) playstyle. Ironically, many of them are Priest cards. On the other hand, even if something should get nerfed, chances are that Big/Resurrect Priest will get better over time regardless.
Sooner or later, because Priests need those in Standard every year, they might get better early board clear besides Spirit Lash and Shadow Word: Horror to beat aggressive decks. And they will definitely get another full board clear that might even outperform Lightbomb, Mass Hysteria or Psychic Scream.
Sooner or later, there are new resurrection targets, like Archmage Vargoth and Catrina Muerte. Especially the former ensures that Resurrect never missfires.
There's also the possibility that Priest gets new means to cheat out big minions aside from Shadow Essence or more resurrection tools, like it just happened, simply because big minions and resurrection are established themes in the class that will get reintroduced to Standard every once in a while.
Real answers across all classes are the better way to balance things in the long run. Besides, unless they destroy Rogue because "Standard should feel fresh", there are decks that counter Big Priest pretty reliably. It's not that Big Priest is unbeatable or way too strong, it's just no fun to play against because much of its power comes from good draws and highrolls, and for a vast number of decks makes an unwinnable matchup.
Dunno, but majority of votes is : NO! So, i guess u have ur answer about it. NOT HUGE PEOPLE HATE THE DECK! Move on...
OMEGALUL. We all hate it . I voted no cause its a bad pole and it says to nerf jades to. I hate big priest and if u think most wild players dont hate big priest then u are oblivious to ur surroundings. Sorry bud but ur auto deck pilot is hated beyond measure. I face odd pally pirate rogue and pirate warrior and lose sometimes but i enjoy them i play them thinking i can win. Big Priest when i face them i always think im gonna lose. 47% of my opponents are big priests in wild and i have 50% winrate vs them. U see the problem? Its not a terrible deck to face for me according ro stats but my mind state during those matches makes me wanna stop playing. Its unfun beyond any measure.
Besides the known ways to nerf Big Priest (raise mana, change graveyard effects etc.), how about this?
Shadow Essence: Put a minion from your deck into the battlefield. Make it 4/4. (This way, no chance to play from hand and vulnerable to transform effects more)
I'm not sure if this idea was stated previously, but this is what I came up with, as a new solution. (Maybe?)
Dunno, but majority of votes is : NO! So, i guess u have ur answer about it. NOT HUGE PEOPLE HATE THE DECK! Move on...
OMEGALUL. We all hate it . I voted no cause its a bad pole and it says to nerf jades to. I hate big priest and if u think most wild players dont hate big priest then u are oblivious to ur surroundings. Sorry bud but ur auto deck pilot is hated beyond measure. I face odd pally pirate rogue and pirate warrior and lose sometimes but i enjoy them i play them thinking i can win. Big Priest when i face them i always think im gonna lose. 47% of my opponents are big priests in wild and i have 50% winrate vs them. U see the problem? Its not a terrible deck to face for me according ro stats but my mind state during those matches makes me wanna stop playing. Its unfun beyond any measure.
Fix wild nerf big priest HS fixed
well, lets see how big preist works, loses to aggro, hmm. the biggest nerf to preist i can think off is to nerf some spells.
If you nerf big priest, more “annoying” decks will pop up, at least against big priest you just hope they low roll on some res cards or only draw their minions. Nerfing barnes wont help alot, nerfing eternal servitude would be better.
I've been having a lot of fun playing Weasel Tunneler; an absolute killer for Big Priest, Reno Decks, or any otk combo decks.
Not a great deck to climb with but you know; for ze memes
Awaken the Makers Potion of Madness x 2 Spirit of the Dead x 2 Weasel Tunneler x 2 Dead Ringer x 2 Loot Hoarder x 2 Seance x 2 Shadow Visions x 2 Augmented Elekk Mirage Caller x 2 Twilight's Call x 2 Zola the Gorgon Carnivorous Cube x 2 Excavated Evil Mass Hysteria Lightbomb Psychic Scream Kel'Thuzad Shadowreaper Anduin N'Zoth, the Corruptor
If you nerf big priest, more “annoying” decks will pop up, at least against big priest you just hope they low roll on some res cards or only draw their minions. Nerfing barnes wont help alot, nerfing eternal servitude would be better.
Like what? What deck(s) are currently being kept in check by big priest?
The fact that you mention "hope" on how to beat the deck is its entire problem. The deck is far too hit and miss and draw-dependant that it's super unfun to play against for everyone.
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Everyone who plays wild knows that Big Priest is one of the biggest problems of wild. Since it counters midrange and control decks so hard the ladder is full of aggro decks and some other mana cheating decks like big priest. If it weren't for big priest there would be more control decks that will balance the ratio of different type of decks in wild.
Most people wants ressurection cards to get nerfed, but I think those cards are totally fine as long as they cannot cheat mana and play big minions very early.
Here is my suggestion, nerf Barnes and Shadow Essence so that they cannot summon their big minions early and snowball. I will suggest a Blizzard way of nerf for these cards. Just increase their cost by 2 and it should be fine. Obviously there could be more elegant ways to nerf those cards but you all know that Blizzard don't do such nerfs.
While mentioning Big Priest I would also like to mention another deck that devestates control: Jade Druid. For this deck just nerf Jade Idol to shuffle a different version of Jade Idol which only have the option of summoning jades. With the addition of Keeper Stalladris that deck should be just fine.
You might think that I want nerfs for control decks but that is not my intention. When an archtype is missing in the gameplay you just cannot have a decent meta hence no diversity.
What is your opinion, would this make wild ladder better?
I'm also adding a poll.
Yes yes yes. Lets nerf Mechwarper while we at it, Kazakus now requires 3 copies of a card in your deck to activate, Reno heals only 15 now and Baku/Genn decks just force you to press concede if you play them. While we at it lets nerf all Giants and add +10 cost to all of them. Kingsbane now gives your opponent 2 copes of Ooze. Give all murlocs the Battlecry: deal 5 damage to yourself because me no likey playing against strong cards.
I would maybe see the Big Priest nerf because highroll archetype is annoying af, but haven't Jade Druid suffered enough honestly? Those poor fellas are conceding against Skulking Geist 100% of the time and yet you want to nerf them again.
Can't we just play cards in an Eternal format called Wild and rather explore all the combo and deck and build possibilities rather than whining and "fixing" it?
Moving into https://outof.cards/members/firepaladinhs/decks
While I understand your concern I must say that if a deck is hated by a huge amount of people and is considered unfun to play against I would say that it requires to be tuned down. As for Jade Druid, I'm not that against it like Big Priest. Maybe fixing Big Priest will suffice.
As an addition I don't understand why people like to argue in such manner. I have already stated in my post that I would like to hear others opinion yet people like you like to heat up the conversation immediately.
Indeed, Jade Druid needs no nerf. It's just a solid deck now, and the Keeper Stalladris build is not even the strongest one btw.
I'm sure we'll see a decent nerf to Big Priest and Darkest Hour Warlock sometime soon enough, and Wild will be ok for a very long while (untile they release new broken cards).
We shouldn't worry now. Hopefully...
OP, do you realise there are thousands of threads about nerfing Big Priest and your "easy" and "perfect" way to fix it has been suggested plenty of times?
it's not easy and perfect, tho, because
1) Big priest has so many tools now that competitive lists actually cut Barnes
2) In the crappy lists that still run Barnes, many games are still won without seeing a Barnes
3) the real problem is that there's no tech against the deck because
3.a) transform effects are limited to certain classes, limiting other classes to cards that summon stuff in your opponent's side of the board to mess with the res pool
3.b) Cards that summon minions on your opponent side of the board and transformed minions get ignored because Eternal Servitude allows big priest to dodge tech
4) the only other "tech" you can run against big priest is returning their stuff to their hands, which only 1 class can do,
Sooooo after you “fix” Big Priest, will the next thread be about how to “fix” the Wild Control Decks? Because that’s every other thread about Standard currently.
Grammar is the difference between knowing your crap, and knowing you’re crap.
A .gif is worth a thousand words.
I just thought of one new and memey to do it. Print a card that destroys any duplicate card in opponent deck and shuffle 1 reno jackson to the deck to compensate. This would half big priest potential.
big priest is a plauge of wild not because of winrate but because of unfun experince the deck create
big priest is so straight forward to play and no matter how well u play/draw sometimes they just win because they draw the right card
im not seeng any problem with jade druid i hate Jade Idol too but playing Skulking Geist will 99% win u the game vs jade druid because they cut Jade Spirit for Archmage Vargoth package and higher winrate even cut Aya Blackpaw and Jade Behemoth
also jade druid is good because keep decks like odd warrior in check im sure if they nerf jade druid u people all gonna complain about odd warrior and 1h long games like standard players
Never seen that before
oh no, all of us actualy hate the deck and think it deserves a nerf, the thing is that Op's proposed nerfs do nothing, the real card to nerf is eternal servitude, to not revive only friendly minions but any minions that died during the game
So STFU and dont say anything if you dont have anything to contribute
Another day, another nerf thread...
I don't like Big Priest, and a nerf would probably be justified after 2 years. But I don't think nerfing the deck will really fix the problem.
Nerfing Barnes might discourage some players to play Big Priest (which would help already), but there's no shortage of options in building a Priest deck that is just as unfair by similar means, starting with that some don't even use Barnes anymore. Once they get their right cards, there are only a handful of cards, almost all of them class cards, that can do anything about it, and they are nowhere near as decisive as Skulking Geist.
Transform effects are very rarely added, and exclusively to Shaman and Mage. The only neutral option is the brutally nerfed Tinkmaster Overspark. I won't count the even less reliable Gelbin Mekkatorque and Kazakus. The only other effects that deny resurrection are mind controlling effects, reshuffle effects or return to hand effects. And the entirety of cards we have with these effects are Mind Control, Cabal Shadow Priest, Mind Control Tech, Embrace Darkness, Sylvanas Windrunner, Sap, Vanish, Kidnapper, Recycle, Entomb and of course Psychic Scream.
That's all the cards that potentially counter Big Priest's (and similar decks) playstyle. Ironically, many of them are Priest cards. On the other hand, even if something should get nerfed, chances are that Big/Resurrect Priest will get better over time regardless.
Sooner or later, because Priests need those in Standard every year, they might get better early board clear besides Spirit Lash and Shadow Word: Horror to beat aggressive decks. And they will definitely get another full board clear that might even outperform Lightbomb, Mass Hysteria or Psychic Scream.
Sooner or later, there are new resurrection targets, like Archmage Vargoth and Catrina Muerte. Especially the former ensures that Resurrect never missfires.
There's also the possibility that Priest gets new means to cheat out big minions aside from Shadow Essence or more resurrection tools, like it just happened, simply because big minions and resurrection are established themes in the class that will get reintroduced to Standard every once in a while.
Real answers across all classes are the better way to balance things in the long run. Besides, unless they destroy Rogue because "Standard should feel fresh", there are decks that counter Big Priest pretty reliably. It's not that Big Priest is unbeatable or way too strong, it's just no fun to play against because much of its power comes from good draws and highrolls, and for a vast number of decks makes an unwinnable matchup.
Please dont label your rudimentary proposal as a 'perfect' solution.
OMEGALUL. We all hate it . I voted no cause its a bad pole and it says to nerf jades to. I hate big priest and if u think most wild players dont hate big priest then u are oblivious to ur surroundings. Sorry bud but ur auto deck pilot is hated beyond measure. I face odd pally pirate rogue and pirate warrior and lose sometimes but i enjoy them i play them thinking i can win. Big Priest when i face them i always think im gonna lose. 47% of my opponents are big priests in wild and i have 50% winrate vs them. U see the problem? Its not a terrible deck to face for me according ro stats but my mind state during those matches makes me wanna stop playing. Its unfun beyond any measure.
Fix wild nerf big priest HS fixed
Besides the known ways to nerf Big Priest (raise mana, change graveyard effects etc.), how about this?
Shadow Essence: Put a minion from your deck into the battlefield. Make it 4/4. (This way, no chance to play from hand and vulnerable to transform effects more)
I'm not sure if this idea was stated previously, but this is what I came up with, as a new solution. (Maybe?)
no
well, lets see how big preist works, loses to aggro, hmm. the biggest nerf to preist i can think off is to nerf some spells.
If you nerf big priest, more “annoying” decks will pop up, at least against big priest you just hope they low roll on some res cards or only draw their minions. Nerfing barnes wont help alot, nerfing eternal servitude would be better.
I've been having a lot of fun playing Weasel Tunneler; an absolute killer for Big Priest, Reno Decks, or any otk combo decks.
Not a great deck to climb with but you know; for ze memes
Awaken the Makers
Potion of Madness x 2
Spirit of the Dead x 2
Weasel Tunneler x 2
Dead Ringer x 2
Loot Hoarder x 2
Seance x 2
Shadow Visions x 2
Augmented Elekk
Mirage Caller x 2
Twilight's Call x 2
Zola the Gorgon
Carnivorous Cube x 2
Excavated Evil
Mass Hysteria
Lightbomb
Psychic Scream
Kel'Thuzad
Shadowreaper Anduin
N'Zoth, the Corruptor
Like what? What deck(s) are currently being kept in check by big priest?
The fact that you mention "hope" on how to beat the deck is its entire problem. The deck is far too hit and miss and draw-dependant that it's super unfun to play against for everyone.