Raza should have just remained nerfed. If you’re wanna try to fix mecha’thun lock, Team 5 should make Cataclysm discard half the hand instead. Quest Mage should have an increase in mana for the reward, they nerfed the reward from the Rogue Quest for love of god. Secret mage can be fixed with Mediv’s Valet and Cloud Prince dealing damage equal to their attacks.
I feel like these are reasonable solutions to but Team 5 won’t do anything. 🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️
While I do think Wild Mages, mainly Open the Waygate, are oppressive in wild, you have to come to the wrong place to post this.
Anyone who posts anything about wild’s lack of balance or oppressive decks on here, Outofcards, or any hearthstone subreddit usually just gets told that wild is wild and balance is not a priority. As you can see by one of the earlier posts, someone has already come down on wild players as being crybabies
There is no point in trying to discuss wild’s balance problems here no matter how obvious they are. You will get most of the community coming and saying wild isn’t a “true competitive mode” and balance in it does not matter. You’ll also get responses that say you aren’t playing correctly, not playing the correct deck / cards, and you will be directed to the salt thread. You’ll also get people that completely deny or ignore any of the potential problems that you bring up.
When a player can take 3 straight turns without a response from the opponent, that’s broken.
Quest needs to worded in such a way that it reads, "take one extra turn after this turn". That way it cannot be duplicated. Eeeeeeeeveryone knows this and it will happen when they get off they butts.
They should nerf some cards. Open the waygate to 7 spells required.
Explosive runes dealing 5 damage. Cloud prince deal 5 damage. Arcane flakemage having cost 3 mana or to be a 2/2.
Medivh valet to be a 2/2 instead of 2/3.
In this way mage will still be tier 1 becouse this nerfs won t kill the class but also will make it weaker. Or even just not letting explosive runes going face can really change it all.
I am sure hearthstone devs are conscius about how annoyng is to play against a class that is way too favourited. And against quest magw there is no really a counter or a tech card. You can only put pressure and hope they dont complete too fast.
Open the Waygate is fine, the problematic interaction is Archmage Vargoth getting you three turns instead of just two. Coincidentaly, Archmage Vargoth is also one of the main reasons ressurect priest is oppressive as well. My way of nerfing him would be to change him so that he only recasts spells with cost 4 or less. That would shut down both Time Warp as well as Lesser Diamond Spellstone or Mass Resurrection.
As for secret mage, i think the main reason its so dominant right now is that Arcane Flakmage gives him anti-aggro tool. Before Flakmage, some decks like Pirate Warrior or Genn Shaman could outpace secret mage by building early board, but Flakmage just gives you autowin against any aggressive strategy. A two mana 3/2 with such a powerful synergistic ability is way too good. I think if his text was instead "After you play a secret, deal 3 damage to a random enemy." that would be appropriate change, it would allow it to push for more face damage but remove the ability to obliterate enemy boards... It would be more in line with cards that have similar effect like Ship's Cannon.
Raza should have just remained nerfed. If you’re wanna try to fix mecha’thun lock, Team 5 should make Cataclysm discard half the hand instead. Quest Mage should have an increase in mana for the reward, they nerfed the reward from the Rogue Quest for love of god. Secret mage can be fixed with Mediv’s Valet and Cloud Prince dealing damage equal to their attacks.
I feel like these are reasonable solutions to but Team 5 won’t do anything. 🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️
Yeah lol no, "nerf" shouldn't mean "completely obliterate the deck", unless you work for Blizzard (in which case, you shouldn't whine about anything). Making cataclysm discard half the hand would entirely wipe mech'alock off the map and mecha'thun lock is a low tier 2 if not tier 3 deck, it loses regularly to a boatload of decks (such as secret mage, quest mage and pretty much any aggro deck if they roll well enough). Decks like secret and quest mage are cancer because there's close to no answer to either of them. It'd be easy to nerf them: just make vargoth cost 7 mana (which would also prevent all the disgusting nonsense resurrect priest does with it) and plenty of quest mage decks would be weaker. If you really want to make it fair, have them need to cast more spells rather than the current amount.
For secret mage, even easier: have medivh's vallet and cloudprince be able to target only minions. Then secret mages would have to actually bother with what you're doing on the board instead of going face more than a sodding pirate warrior.
Damm, this is why I wish we would get a new format with different sets rotating in and out once in a while. This would also allow for new fun decks which would never be possible in standart due to the sets being out at different times. and stop the burning mess (which I quite enjoy) that is wild, by turning down the power levels.
They should nerf some cards. Open the waygate to 7 spells required.
Explosive runes dealing 5 damage. Cloud prince deal 5 damage. Arcane flakemage having cost 3 mana or to be a 2/2.
Medivh valet to be a 2/2 instead of 2/3.
In this way mage will still be tier 1 becouse this nerfs won t kill the class but also will make it weaker. Or even just not letting explosive runes going face can really change it all.
I am sure hearthstone devs are conscius about how annoyng is to play against a class that is way too favourited. And against quest magw there is no really a counter or a tech card. You can only put pressure and hope they dont complete too fast.
Open the Waygate is fine, the problematic interaction is Archmage Vargoth getting you three turns instead of just two. Coincidentaly, Archmage Vargoth is also one of the main reasons ressurect priest is oppressive as well. My way of nerfing him would be to change him so that he only recasts spells with cost 4 or less. That would shut down both Time Warp as well as Lesser Diamond Spellstone or Mass Resurrection.
As for secret mage, i think the main reason its so dominant right now is that Arcane Flakmage gives him anti-aggro tool. Before Flakmage, some decks like Pirate Warrior or Genn Shaman could outpace secret mage by building early board, but Flakmage just gives you autowin against any aggressive strategy. A two mana 3/2 with such a powerful synergistic ability is way too good. I think if his text was instead "After you play a secret, deal 3 damage to a random enemy." that would be appropriate change, it would allow it to push for more face damage but remove the ability to obliterate enemy boards... It would be more in line with cards that have similar effect like Ship's Cannon.
Don't forget Flame Ward, wich is a very important AOE tool for mage as well. Flakmage is also so strong because of Ancient Mysteries and Kabal Lackey, if you had to pay 3 mana for the secret, it would have been fine.
It's hard to nerf these Mage decks because there is no truly op card in it's own, the enormous amount of synergy is what makes these decks truly impressive.
Printing Flame Ward and Flakmage was the biggest mistake in the past year. They erased Secret Mage's and Quest Mage's only weakness: Swarm. They did the same with Aluneth to card draw a while ago.
Hearthstone needs a new format, Team 5 gives little importance to wild. How many years have mage (secrets and quest), warlock (any archetype "control") and priest (big) been played? Those archetypes are a design problem for wild.
I wouldn't want them to remove cards but I think it would be a stronger solution that really affects those decks, because sometimes Blizzard doesn't know how to do nerfs in the wild. My proposal is that they permanently delete cards and replace them with others. This has happened since the Hearthstone beta, remember?
Hearthstone needs a new format, Team 5 gives little importance to wild. How many years have mage (secrets and quest), warlock (any archetype "control") and priest (big) been played? Those archetypes are a design problem for wild.
I wouldn't want them to remove cards but I think it would be a stronger solution that really affects those decks, because sometimes Blizzard doesn't know how to do nerfs in the wild. My proposal is that they permanently delete cards and replace them with others. This has happened since the Hearthstone beta, remember?
Putting cards in wild is Blizzard's way of deleting them KEKW
I've always disliked aggro and super-fast tempo, but it's really easy to counter pirate warrior, even shaman and similar decks, even with decks that allow for a bit of fun (in Hearthstone???).
Countering Mech Paladin, another really stupid deck, is harder, but still feasible.
Quest mage is uncounterable. You can die to flamewaker/giants mage on turn 8 or 9 without really having a game. Simply nerfing quest increasing the spell count requirement these days would mean at the very least 10 spells, I'd do more, 'cause too many cheap spells that give you extra cheap spells are available to date, plus cyclone is just retarded. Power-level-wise, Flamewaker needs a nerf, and it is time we bid goodbye to Sorcerer's Apprentice the way we know her.
No one wants to play 2 Secret Eaters in their deck, though I guess that possibility exists. Let's face it though: too many high tempo secret-related cards were printed throughout the expansion. Moreover, it's not feasible to play around so many different secrets.
Nerf this, and we can switch to the next tier of complaints about combo decks: Warlock clears too easy and draws way too fast, and Druid-Kael'Thas looks like a Tavern Brawl in Wild.
The only mage decks I really don't like to go against is the Quest Mage. Vargoth just makes this deck stupid, when the opponent gets +3 turns to play before you do anything.
The only mage decks I really don't like to go against is the Quest Mage. Vargoth just makes this deck stupid, when the opponent gets +3 turns to play before you do anything.
Not one class dominating the format, that is not healthy. Remember they have nerfed Wild cards in the past in similar situations:
Tbh, the only deck which could rival the current mage decks were the SA-druid. The others were much weaker but frustrating to play against.
They nerfed cards because all the wild players kept crying about it. In reality it is just a for fun mode that Blizzard barely wants to cater to until the wild community starts spamming their twitter and reddit crying about it.
What I think they should so is add a third format. Stop the nerfs and start banning in both Standard and Wild to balance the formats. This is the way it works in MTG and I think banning is superior to nerfing because this way people can play The banned cards in the third format. I would have loved to get to play old Patron or Worgen Warrior again :/
I'm so glad that they "nerfed" Open the Waygate. Last game my Mage opponent played Sorcerer's Apprentice, Luna and 13 more cards on turn 5, freezing my stuff, dealing damage and so on. I was dead to quest + double giant on turn 6.
Compared to that, losing to a disconnection would have felt alright.
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Holla atcha boy when you see him come through sitting on 27 inch blades that keep spinning every time they stop
Raza should have just remained nerfed.
If you’re wanna try to fix mecha’thun lock, Team 5 should make Cataclysm discard half the hand instead.
Quest Mage should have an increase in mana for the reward, they nerfed the reward from the Rogue Quest for love of god. Secret mage can be fixed with Mediv’s Valet and Cloud Prince dealing damage equal to their attacks.
I feel like these are reasonable solutions to but Team 5 won’t do anything. 🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️
While I do think Wild Mages, mainly Open the Waygate, are oppressive in wild, you have to come to the wrong place to post this.
Anyone who posts anything about wild’s lack of balance or oppressive decks on here, Outofcards, or any hearthstone subreddit usually just gets told that wild is wild and balance is not a priority. As you can see by one of the earlier posts, someone has already come down on wild players as being crybabies
There is no point in trying to discuss wild’s balance problems here no matter how obvious they are. You will get most of the community coming and saying wild isn’t a “true competitive mode” and balance in it does not matter. You’ll also get responses that say you aren’t playing correctly, not playing the correct deck / cards, and you will be directed to the salt thread. You’ll also get people that completely deny or ignore any of the potential problems that you bring up.
When a player can take 3 straight turns without a response from the opponent, that’s broken.
Here heree
Quest needs to worded in such a way that it reads, "take one extra turn after this turn". That way it cannot be duplicated. Eeeeeeeeveryone knows this and it will happen when they get off they butts.
Mage Secret is super buffed up. I hope they nerfed it
Open the Waygate is fine, the problematic interaction is Archmage Vargoth getting you three turns instead of just two. Coincidentaly, Archmage Vargoth is also one of the main reasons ressurect priest is oppressive as well. My way of nerfing him would be to change him so that he only recasts spells with cost 4 or less. That would shut down both Time Warp as well as Lesser Diamond Spellstone or Mass Resurrection.
As for secret mage, i think the main reason its so dominant right now is that Arcane Flakmage gives him anti-aggro tool. Before Flakmage, some decks like Pirate Warrior or Genn Shaman could outpace secret mage by building early board, but Flakmage just gives you autowin against any aggressive strategy. A two mana 3/2 with such a powerful synergistic ability is way too good. I think if his text was instead "After you play a secret, deal 3 damage to a random enemy." that would be appropriate change, it would allow it to push for more face damage but remove the ability to obliterate enemy boards... It would be more in line with cards that have similar effect like Ship's Cannon.
Yeah lol no, "nerf" shouldn't mean "completely obliterate the deck", unless you work for Blizzard (in which case, you shouldn't whine about anything). Making cataclysm discard half the hand would entirely wipe mech'alock off the map and mecha'thun lock is a low tier 2 if not tier 3 deck, it loses regularly to a boatload of decks (such as secret mage, quest mage and pretty much any aggro deck if they roll well enough). Decks like secret and quest mage are cancer because there's close to no answer to either of them. It'd be easy to nerf them: just make vargoth cost 7 mana (which would also prevent all the disgusting nonsense resurrect priest does with it) and plenty of quest mage decks would be weaker. If you really want to make it fair, have them need to cast more spells rather than the current amount.
For secret mage, even easier: have medivh's vallet and cloudprince be able to target only minions. Then secret mages would have to actually bother with what you're doing on the board instead of going face more than a sodding pirate warrior.
Damm, this is why I wish we would get a new format with different sets rotating in and out once in a while. This would also allow for new fun decks which would never be possible in standart due to the sets being out at different times. and stop the burning mess (which I quite enjoy) that is wild, by turning down the power levels.
Don't forget Flame Ward, wich is a very important AOE tool for mage as well. Flakmage is also so strong because of Ancient Mysteries and Kabal Lackey, if you had to pay 3 mana for the secret, it would have been fine.
Can you believe they went from Magic Dart Frog to this?
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It's hard to nerf these Mage decks because there is no truly op card in it's own, the enormous amount of synergy is what makes these decks truly impressive.
Printing Flame Ward and Flakmage was the biggest mistake in the past year. They erased Secret Mage's and Quest Mage's only weakness: Swarm. They did the same with Aluneth to card draw a while ago.
Obey C'Thun, Praise The Darkness, Pet Hakkar, the Soulflayer, Love Yogg-Saron, Hope's End
Hearthstone needs a new format, Team 5 gives little importance to wild. How many years have mage (secrets and quest), warlock (any archetype "control") and priest (big) been played? Those archetypes are a design problem for wild.
I wouldn't want them to remove cards but I think it would be a stronger solution that really affects those decks, because sometimes Blizzard doesn't know how to do nerfs in the wild. My proposal is that they permanently delete cards and replace them with others. This has happened since the Hearthstone beta, remember?
Putting cards in wild is Blizzard's way of deleting them KEKW
I've always disliked aggro and super-fast tempo, but it's really easy to counter pirate warrior, even shaman and similar decks, even with decks that allow for a bit of fun (in Hearthstone???).
Countering Mech Paladin, another really stupid deck, is harder, but still feasible.
Quest mage is uncounterable. You can die to flamewaker/giants mage on turn 8 or 9 without really having a game. Simply nerfing quest increasing the spell count requirement these days would mean at the very least 10 spells, I'd do more, 'cause too many cheap spells that give you extra cheap spells are available to date, plus cyclone is just retarded. Power-level-wise, Flamewaker needs a nerf, and it is time we bid goodbye to Sorcerer's Apprentice the way we know her.
No one wants to play 2 Secret Eaters in their deck, though I guess that possibility exists. Let's face it though: too many high tempo secret-related cards were printed throughout the expansion. Moreover, it's not feasible to play around so many different secrets.
Nerf this, and we can switch to the next tier of complaints about combo decks: Warlock clears too easy and draws way too fast, and Druid-Kael'Thas looks like a Tavern Brawl in Wild.
The only mage decks I really don't like to go against is the Quest Mage. Vargoth just makes this deck stupid, when the opponent gets +3 turns to play before you do anything.
It's pretty easy for mages to make otk decks as well... (like this one using Sorcerer's Apprentice, Archmage Antonidas and Molten Reflection due to the enormous amount of tempo the freezing cards give them.
aside from this, for me it's fine lol
Vargoth is stupid across the board in Wild, I really wish they'd just remove him.
Amazing. Everything you just said is wrong
Is the Worst shitty meta of all-the-time. This game must be die, seriously.
What I think they should so is add a third format. Stop the nerfs and start banning in both Standard and Wild to balance the formats. This is the way it works in MTG and I think banning is superior to nerfing because this way people can play The banned cards in the third format. I would have loved to get to play old Patron or Worgen Warrior again :/
I'm so glad that they "nerfed" Open the Waygate. Last game my Mage opponent played Sorcerer's Apprentice, Luna and 13 more cards on turn 5, freezing my stuff, dealing damage and so on. I was dead to quest + double giant on turn 6.
Compared to that, losing to a disconnection would have felt alright.