Imo they should have gone with refreshing 2 mana crystals, still the same card in terms of combos but prevents being abused to ramp out anything too major (like a 6 mana UI)
I think that's a good nerf . It won't make the card unplayable . It just won't be good in aggro decks anymore .
Still good for jades because they sometimes need to remove cards from hand to not overdraw with UI and you can still shuffle idol innervate UI or UI innervate jade so that's nice .
I think overall the changes will not have the desired effect : the decks affected most seem aggro decks while jade druid is still OP OP vs anything that can't kill them fast .
I'm sorry but nerfing innervate is just horrible. Why would you nerf a core classcard because of new cards being over powered?? Nerf the new cards not the cards that have been around forever. This is just horrible decision making.
Why give back dust to players when they can just nerf basic cards ?
It is literally just a counterfeit coin for druids..... well I guess it could be worse, they could have made it cost 1 mana as well and made the card literally useless.
No matter how i look at it, I really hate this change. Refresh mana would have solved literally all the problems while leaving the card up for combo decks in the future. LIke, when do they think Malygos is every going to be a viable archetype in any class ever?
At the end of the day I really hope they're making the best out of this and actually design cards that wouldn't be possible with the old Innervate still around
Innervate did deserve a nerf for variety sake, but this is taking it too far. Comparing it to a Rogue card is extremely unfair when Rogue can make much, much better use of it. Still, Counterfeit Coin only sees play in Miracle Rogue, so one can assume that Innervate will now only see play in a Miracle Druid deck that is all about cycling super quickly.
The Refresh 2 option (or something similar) would have been much more appropriate. It stops the card from being used as much in aggro while retaining its usefulness in ramp decks. It's also a very understandable mechanic for new players.
But as we know, Blizzard overnerfs 90% of the time, so it was expected.
(A) Firstly, this will do very little to slow down the main offender ie: Jade Druid;
(B) Meanwhile, it weakens other options for Malfurion (especially Ramp) - making Druid even more of a single-archetype class; and...
(C) Perhaps worst of all, this nerf erodes Druid's core identity as a mana-creating class.
The announcement explicitly referenced Counterfeit Coin, and why a 0-cost 1 mana gain is clearly better in Rogue because of the Combo mechanic and "Miracle" effects such as Edwin VanCleef.
They left the door open for the "right support" (?) in future expansions, such as utilizing Innervate "in decks that revolve around playing inexpensive spells"... but blurring the line between Rogue and Druid feels like an unfortunate and unnecessary solution to me.
As others have said, I would have preferred the change to be "Refresh two mana crystals". This would have achieved the stated goal of "slow(ing) down the explosive start potential", while preserving an essential piece of Druid's class identity.
Several powerful variations of Druid are currently seeing play, and all of them utilize Innervate. Innervate creates explosive starts to the game that can be difficult for the opposing player to recover from. This change leaves Innervate as a simple Basic card and slows down the explosive start potential, while ensuring that it will be utilized in decks that revolve around playing inexpensive spells.
What other changes did we consider?
We considered a few other options for Innervate:
Refresh 2 Mana Crystals.
Gain 2 Mana Crystals this turn only and increase the mana cost to 1.
Gain 6 Mana Crystals this turn only and increase the mana cost to 4.
Since Innervate is a basic card, we need it to be clear and simple. Along with Wild Growth, these cards inform newer players that Druids create mana as a part of their class identity.
We kept in mind that cards like Counterfeit Coin were strong in combination with other support cards, such as Gadgetzan Auctioneer, Edwin VanCleef, and Combo cards. With the right support cards for Innervate, it may end up still seeing play, but won’t be in every deck—which is ultimately what we’re aiming for with this change.
It's interesting that the design of cards are changed for the sake of variety, and not just for the sake of balance.
The card compares with Counterfeit Coin, which does see play, but only in decks centered around cheap spells.
Though Ultimate Infestation did not get nerfed directly, this nerf does mean that Druids will take a bit longer to play it, so aggressive decks should have more time to beat Jade Druids down.
We had Ramp. Then we had Jade, which is a package that fits Ramp.
Now, this nerf is fair, but it obviously hits Ramp (and Aggro!) more than Jade - which has plenty of other ramp and taunt options anyway.
I am afraid Jade Druid is not going anywhere from where it is in the Tier list. Actually, together with other nerfs, Jade Druid could even get relatively better!
Right, Innervate can actually be a dead card sometimes, so replacing it with another good card is often pretty good!
Would this make Jade Druid unplayable from now on?
I am pretty sure both changes combined aren't good enough to make a big difference to Jade Druid. Especially since with some nerfs they hit counters to Jade Druid Fiery War Axe (Pirate Warrior) and Murloc Warleader (Murloc Paladin). Innervate is more important to Aggro Druid and Ramp Druid.
The overall changes seem to make priest a lot stronger. Weird changes overall but I can't wait to see how this goes, hopefully we'll see a big enough shift to spice things up.
I think it also increases Tempo decks power, which are already pretty good. Tempo Rogue, and Mage are already really good.
I would have preferred some other options for the nerf, such as:
1) Refresh 2 mana crystals,
2) The next minion you play this turn costs (2) less, or
3) Gain 2 mana crystals next turn only
1) lets it still be a powerful card but prevents things like turn 1 Vicious Fledgling, 2) makes the card more in line with Preparation, and 3) makes the card much more skill intensive since it telegraphs to your opponent that your opponent has a big turn next turn and allows them a chance to prepare for it. All that being said though, I am very very happy that the card got changed.
Worst nerf ever, rip class identity and jades are still strong.
still broken. needs to cost 1 mana
this nerf does nothing to help the ultimate infestiation problem.
matter of fact should have just moved this to wild if your gonna change it to 1 mana increase
Imo they should have gone with refreshing 2 mana crystals, still the same card in terms of combos but prevents being abused to ramp out anything too major (like a 6 mana UI)
it was too flexible both in ramp decks, and aggro decks, and is / was an auto-include in both archetypes. totally approve of this nerf
I think that's a good nerf . It won't make the card unplayable . It just won't be good in aggro decks anymore .
Still good for jades because they sometimes need to remove cards from hand to not overdraw with UI and you can still shuffle idol innervate UI or UI innervate jade so that's nice .
I think overall the changes will not have the desired effect : the decks affected most seem aggro decks while jade druid is still OP OP vs anything that can't kill them fast .
I tried having fun once. It was awful.
No matter how i look at it, I really hate this change. Refresh mana would have solved literally all the problems while leaving the card up for combo decks in the future. LIke, when do they think Malygos is every going to be a viable archetype in any class ever?
At the end of the day I really hope they're making the best out of this and actually design cards that wouldn't be possible with the old Innervate still around
I tried having fun once. It was awful.
Bad nerf. An 1 mana ramp for 1 turn is useless outside rogue. They had more elegant paths to choose but they killed the card.
another dead card added to the nerf collection. good job blizz.
Innervate did deserve a nerf for variety sake, but this is taking it too far. Comparing it to a Rogue card is extremely unfair when Rogue can make much, much better use of it. Still, Counterfeit Coin only sees play in Miracle Rogue, so one can assume that Innervate will now only see play in a Miracle Druid deck that is all about cycling super quickly.
The Refresh 2 option (or something similar) would have been much more appropriate. It stops the card from being used as much in aggro while retaining its usefulness in ramp decks. It's also a very understandable mechanic for new players.
But as we know, Blizzard overnerfs 90% of the time, so it was expected.
Disappointing...because:
(A) Firstly, this will do very little to slow down the main offender ie: Jade Druid;
(B) Meanwhile, it weakens other options for Malfurion (especially Ramp) - making Druid even more of a single-archetype class; and...
(C) Perhaps worst of all, this nerf erodes Druid's core identity as a mana-creating class.
The announcement explicitly referenced Counterfeit Coin, and why a 0-cost 1 mana gain is clearly better in Rogue because of the Combo mechanic and "Miracle" effects such as Edwin VanCleef.
They left the door open for the "right support" (?) in future expansions, such as utilizing Innervate "in decks that revolve around playing inexpensive spells"... but blurring the line between Rogue and Druid feels like an unfortunate and unnecessary solution to me.
As others have said, I would have preferred the change to be "Refresh two mana crystals". This would have achieved the stated goal of "slow(ing) down the explosive start potential", while preserving an essential piece of Druid's class identity.
instead of admitting the big mistake that jade idol is ... they go screwing up cards that identify the class . i don't like what they are doing .
ROCK (salt) & ROLL (the bodies over)
It's interesting that the design of cards are changed for the sake of variety, and not just for the sake of balance.
The card compares with Counterfeit Coin, which does see play, but only in decks centered around cheap spells.
Though Ultimate Infestation did not get nerfed directly, this nerf does mean that Druids will take a bit longer to play it, so aggressive decks should have more time to beat Jade Druids down.
Will never see play again
I would have preferred some other options for the nerf, such as:
1) Refresh 2 mana crystals,
2) The next minion you play this turn costs (2) less, or
3) Gain 2 mana crystals next turn only
1) lets it still be a powerful card but prevents things like turn 1 Vicious Fledgling, 2) makes the card more in line with Preparation, and 3) makes the card much more skill intensive since it telegraphs to your opponent that your opponent has a big turn next turn and allows them a chance to prepare for it. All that being said though, I am very very happy that the card got changed.