I remake the thread because I didn't give argumentation and was closed so I will try it better.
WTF were Team5 thinking when designed Lightning Bloom for druid? This just makes an already disgusting deck even worse to play against.
It is a bullsh*it because it makes a unfun deck to play against even more highroll and can blast any other deck by turn 4 with just a little bit of luck. Any thoughts?
i mean innverate was way better back then and in the game for years
ofc the cards in general got better so it has even more impact, probably would be best to just replace it with something completely different
unfortunately that seems unlikely, the last time they completely got rid off one and put in another was in beta, so yeah... gotta live with it i assume
My only problem with druid is mount seller or whatever its called they get a full board on turn 7 and their hand is always full of spells for the rest of the game. They cheat so much mana with that card.
i mean innverate was way better back then and in the game for years
ofc the cards in general got better so it has even more impact, probably would be best to just replace it with something completely different
unfortunately that seems unlikely, the last time they completely got rid off one and put in another was in beta, so yeah... gotta live with it i assume
They nerfed it because it clearly conditioned the design space for other cards. Then, when nerfed they print the cards they couldn't do before because the innervate, they reprint innervate. No sense.
Edit: And what is worse, they can play the old and the new innervate in the same deck.
i would bet quite a lot that blizzard is sick of the card and will put the mountseller on the nerflist as well, it's reign has been far too long
the winrate isn't even that high surprisingly, still it brute forces an archetype almost completely on its own, which is just very bad. it's very similar to good old patron warrior: it wasn't that successful as a whole but in the hands of good players it's deadly beyond belief
arguably the spell druid nonsense is very easy to play, so it's actually way much more of an offender imo
sidenote: because of that, malygos should've been hall of famed years ago
Lightning Bloom doesn't seem to be the offender here honestly. I played ~40 games today and above 1/3 of them were against Guardian Animals/Survival of the Fittest druid. The biggest problem of this deck seems to be Overgrowth and Nature Studies. They have like 8-9 mana on turn 4-5, and then boom! - Kael'thas, two cheap spells (Innervate, Bloom, Crystal Power, Bogbeam, Ironbark whatever), Survival of the Fittest. Then it can get even worse - spell, spell, Guardian Animals. Nice, face three minions of approximately 8/8 in stats into your turn 6. This seems to happen more often than not and feels like pre-nerf Galakrond Shaman. Just all about super swingy mana cheating.
Hey, it's like anyone who can cheat out massive boards of minions on low amounts of mana is busted. And folks kept trying to tell me there was something especially heinous about Resurrect effects in Priest. I know it's a massive non-sequitor, but there's nothing inherently wrong with resurrect per se, just the potential power level of effects for their mana cost. That'll hold true whether resurrected, recruited, or just summoned out of nothing.
I didn’t want to make a fuss about it, but having kaelthas on turn 4 with only two overload means survival of the fittest turn 5 and that’s just not cool. This deck wouldn’t be nearly as bad without kaelthas. Overgrowth is bad, bloom is bad, but it’s kaelthas that breaks it. I think blizz said something about free cards recently...
I wouldn't mind it if it weren't for all the day one druid netdecks I'm running into. Literally the only classes I've played against tonight have been druid and hunter.
I must be the only one who hasn’t encounter a single druid today. Thank god lol
I played mostly Druid tonight and I played against an astonishing amount of Rogues and Paladins and very few other classes. Just one of those things where it seems weird and evens out when you play more days.
As to Lightning Bloom being busted, I don't think it is. The overload hurts your next turn badly. I think Druid just has a package of cards that are all a little bit busted and it's the combination of them that hurts. Druid has basically no early game except to ramp as quckly as they can into their actual game plan. No Ramp = ded. You basically need all that mana ramping or the deck doesn't work at all. But, when you DO get that ramping done, it's a hard deck to stop.
It's just kind of binary. When it works, it works a little too well probably. When it doesn't work, it falls very flat. Putting the druid under pressure while he's trying to ramp, making a board he needs to deal with is probably key to getting a win.
My losses all happened when I was not ramping up in the early game and my opponent pressured. The only exception was when I ramped and used most of my cards into getting 2 fat minions on board and my Rogue opponent discovered Devolving missiles from Wand Thief, and turned my fat minions in to easily clearable trash. I didn;t have the time or card draw to get more stuff nor deal with his board so I just died 2 turns later.
I think Beast/Ramp Druid will probably end up similar to Embiggen Druid. It's pretty straightforward to pilot and has some obvious big threats, but once you know their gameplan they are not all that hard to deal with.
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Had to stop on diamond 3.. 6 druids in a roll with the same exact deck is too much, Guardian Animals gives druid a HUUUUGE tempo swing this class should not be able to pull off easily. Kael'thas would not be so busted if GA didnt help them get back on board so hard like this, 7 mana summon 2 5 mana beasts then draw 4 doesnt seem balanced to me!
Yeah, played ladder all day and I've got to say IMO Druid is on another level compared to the power of most of the other decks I've seen.
It's not just Kaelthas that's for sure. Almost all of their ramp cards are bs now. Basically, as soon as they ramp to 7 mana the game is over. Once they play Guardian Animals and pull out the 2 beasts that rush and draw 4 cards, or the taunt beast w/ deathrattle, or EVEN the new cleaving beast...it's basically GG. There wasn't a single game I played today where if the Druid played Guardian Animals they didn't win.
Plus, on turn one now they can play Nature Studies and possibly find the ramp cards they need or just play Overgrowth on turn 2-3 thanks to their next spell being discounted.
Anyone who bitched about Secret Passage or Glide needs to slow their roll. Druid needs nerfs ASAP.
And thats exactly why you dont spend real money, the Meta once again resolves around some Cheap Ass cheesy Mana Cheat decks, preferably aggro. All Common or Rare cards, maybe a few epics needed, thats it.
New Face Hunter with the 1 mana weapon is incredibly disgusting as well, like the Lepragnomes and Sandtroopers basically get rush and trade into you for free Rush AND Face Charge Dmg xD
Rather, as always spending my 5 $ on HSReplay Premium for the first month of new Expansion coz Knowledge is Poooowah.
I remake the thread because I didn't give argumentation and was closed so I will try it better.
WTF were Team5 thinking when designed Lightning Bloom for druid? This just makes an already disgusting deck even worse to play against.
It is a bullsh*it because it makes a unfun deck to play against even more highroll and can blast any other deck by turn 4 with just a little bit of luck. Any thoughts?
i mean innverate was way better back then and in the game for years
ofc the cards in general got better so it has even more impact, probably would be best to just replace it with something completely different
unfortunately that seems unlikely, the last time they completely got rid off one and put in another was in beta, so yeah... gotta live with it i assume
My only problem with druid is mount seller or whatever its called they get a full board on turn 7 and their hand is always full of spells for the rest of the game. They cheat so much mana with that card.
Keymaster Alabaster come faster
They nerfed it because it clearly conditioned the design space for other cards. Then, when nerfed they print the cards they couldn't do before because the innervate, they reprint innervate. No sense.
Edit: And what is worse, they can play the old and the new innervate in the same deck.
i would bet quite a lot that blizzard is sick of the card and will put the mountseller on the nerflist as well, it's reign has been far too long
the winrate isn't even that high surprisingly, still it brute forces an archetype almost completely on its own, which is just very bad. it's very similar to good old patron warrior: it wasn't that successful as a whole but in the hands of good players it's deadly beyond belief
arguably the spell druid nonsense is very easy to play, so it's actually way much more of an offender imo
sidenote: because of that, malygos should've been hall of famed years ago
Lightning Bloom doesn't seem to be the offender here honestly. I played ~40 games today and above 1/3 of them were against Guardian Animals/Survival of the Fittest druid. The biggest problem of this deck seems to be Overgrowth and Nature Studies. They have like 8-9 mana on turn 4-5, and then boom! - Kael'thas, two cheap spells (Innervate, Bloom, Crystal Power, Bogbeam, Ironbark whatever), Survival of the Fittest. Then it can get even worse - spell, spell, Guardian Animals. Nice, face three minions of approximately 8/8 in stats into your turn 6. This seems to happen more often than not and feels like pre-nerf Galakrond Shaman. Just all about super swingy mana cheating.
Hey, it's like anyone who can cheat out massive boards of minions on low amounts of mana is busted. And folks kept trying to tell me there was something especially heinous about Resurrect effects in Priest. I know it's a massive non-sequitor, but there's nothing inherently wrong with resurrect per se, just the potential power level of effects for their mana cost. That'll hold true whether resurrected, recruited, or just summoned out of nothing.
The mana cheat in res priest was Barnes. Turn 4 yshaarj and friends was not fair.
I didn’t want to make a fuss about it, but having kaelthas on turn 4 with only two overload means survival of the fittest turn 5 and that’s just not cool. This deck wouldn’t be nearly as bad without kaelthas. Overgrowth is bad, bloom is bad, but it’s kaelthas that breaks it. I think blizz said something about free cards recently...
I wouldn't mind it if it weren't for all the day one druid netdecks I'm running into. Literally the only classes I've played against tonight have been druid and hunter.
kaelthas is the problem
I must be the only one who hasn’t encounter a single druid today. Thank god lol
N
Good for you, bro. Follow the rules! :)
I played mostly Druid tonight and I played against an astonishing amount of Rogues and Paladins and very few other classes. Just one of those things where it seems weird and evens out when you play more days.
As to Lightning Bloom being busted, I don't think it is. The overload hurts your next turn badly. I think Druid just has a package of cards that are all a little bit busted and it's the combination of them that hurts. Druid has basically no early game except to ramp as quckly as they can into their actual game plan. No Ramp = ded. You basically need all that mana ramping or the deck doesn't work at all. But, when you DO get that ramping done, it's a hard deck to stop.
It's just kind of binary. When it works, it works a little too well probably. When it doesn't work, it falls very flat. Putting the druid under pressure while he's trying to ramp, making a board he needs to deal with is probably key to getting a win.
My losses all happened when I was not ramping up in the early game and my opponent pressured. The only exception was when I ramped and used most of my cards into getting 2 fat minions on board and my Rogue opponent discovered Devolving missiles from Wand Thief, and turned my fat minions in to easily clearable trash. I didn;t have the time or card draw to get more stuff nor deal with his board so I just died 2 turns later.
I think Beast/Ramp Druid will probably end up similar to Embiggen Druid. It's pretty straightforward to pilot and has some obvious big threats, but once you know their gameplan they are not all that hard to deal with.
If you see a bad post on the forum use the report function under it, so I or someone else of the moderation team can take care of it!
Had to stop on diamond 3.. 6 druids in a roll with the same exact deck is too much, Guardian Animals gives druid a HUUUUGE tempo swing this class should not be able to pull off easily. Kael'thas would not be so busted if GA didnt help them get back on board so hard like this, 7 mana summon 2 5 mana beasts then draw 4 doesnt seem balanced to me!
seems unfair...
To live is to suffer, to survive is to find meaning in the suffer!
That is just ridiculous. 7/7 taunt on turn 1...
but to give you an impression on how good of a hearthstone player i am... I almost lost that game :(
To live is to suffer, to survive is to find meaning in the suffer!
Yeah, played ladder all day and I've got to say IMO Druid is on another level compared to the power of most of the other decks I've seen.
It's not just Kaelthas that's for sure. Almost all of their ramp cards are bs now. Basically, as soon as they ramp to 7 mana the game is over. Once they play Guardian Animals and pull out the 2 beasts that rush and draw 4 cards, or the taunt beast w/ deathrattle, or EVEN the new cleaving beast...it's basically GG. There wasn't a single game I played today where if the Druid played Guardian Animals they didn't win.
Plus, on turn one now they can play Nature Studies and possibly find the ramp cards they need or just play Overgrowth on turn 2-3 thanks to their next spell being discounted.
Anyone who bitched about Secret Passage or Glide needs to slow their roll. Druid needs nerfs ASAP.
And thats exactly why you dont spend real money, the Meta once again resolves around some Cheap Ass cheesy Mana Cheat decks, preferably aggro. All Common or Rare cards, maybe a few epics needed, thats it.
New Face Hunter with the 1 mana weapon is incredibly disgusting as well, like the Lepragnomes and Sandtroopers basically get rush and trade into you for free Rush AND Face Charge Dmg xD
Rather, as always spending my 5 $ on HSReplay Premium for the first month of new Expansion coz Knowledge is Poooowah.