I honestly just find the devastator really powerfull, two copies is definitely fine but I have played several control shaman/priest versus control warrior and in the entire game they sometimes just play 6 or more copies of it from all the discover a mech abilities. Which gives warrior just a bit too many powerful removals.
Can you promise me people will stop complaining after the nerfs, when a new "meta shaping" deck arises and each class will struggle again finding a single deck to counter it?
My point is, and I can't believe nobody see it after so many years - when people call for certain nerfs, Blizzard nerfs something else, unrelated, counterproductive. Their reasons are different. People just lose dust and we go again.
People will complain again and again, because they hate losing. Losing a single game in HS feels disastrous, that's a fact, and masses cannot control their passions. Here we have complaining about a mediocre deck like Control Warrior, which is miles weaker than prenerf Cubelock, Quest Rouge, Jade.... I bet, after the nerfs people would start complaining about whatever is now average or bellow average (Resurrect, Silent Priest...) and would believe a single action would solve all the problems forever.
Nah, I wouldn't promise that at all. People always complain but sometimes complaints are justifiable. I do think Warrior is overtuned right now. Not by ton and you definitely don't want to nerf only warrior as that could make the meta worse. It might also be a bit short sighted in the long term because once other classes get some hero cards it might not be as much of an issue.
Is control warrior miles weaker than those decks? If you compare them head to head then yea but against their field not so much. I looked up the vS meta reports on cubelock and jade druid before their nerfs and it's winrate is basically the same, and like warrior they aren't the highest winrates at the time either. Decks don't always get nerfed on raw power but often for warping the meta strongly. You can only play mech paladin right now because warriors. You can only play conjurer mage right now because warriors. You can't really play any control deck right now because you can't out value warriors and only warriors can control Rogue. Etc, etc.
Balancing the game probably isn't easy, rogue/warrior/token are shaping the meta and if you touch one then everything changes. I personally think you slap rogue, warrior, and token with a decent nerf, but not deck killing, and just see what happens. Kind of like at the beginning of WW meta when all the top decks got nerfed and they were all still good but the meta was a lot more open to other classes/strategies.
I've been trying a lot of decks these days. Lackey, Conjurer, Control Warrior, Mech Hunter & Paladin... Still haven't: Shaman, Zoo and Bomb Warrior... Of all those, Control is the most troublesome to play (although, challenge makes it fun to play). Unlike Odd Warrior, this one doesn't guarantee a win against anything, even against favorable matchup. Even stupid goblin bombs can wreck Warrior. My last two games vs. Zoo, which I won, were exceptionally dramatic: was on 5-10 hp and praying to not get Leeroyed. A lot of decisions you must get right. Always missing a proper removal. I'll not even talk about Paladin, Hunter or Mage matchups.
Then I go play vs. Warrior: Results: 10 wins in tavern brawl, 6 Warriors farmed; lost 2 (two!) games vs. Bomb Warrior so far playing with whatever deck; have a positive winrate with Lackey Rouge (counter deck)...
And then I come to this forum where everybody is crying how Warrior is busted, the worst deck, broken... I start rubbing my eyes, can I read anymore, because I can't believe what I read. Ok, nerfs talk, but is Warrior really that broken?! On which merits people are basing their assumptions? Are those people who wouldn't coin Thug on 2? Those who don't run Sap? Go all in? Play shitty decks? Such and many other questions start dropping on my mind. Maybe the biggest sin of Control Warrior is that it's a "good, strong" deck (among others)? A lot of people find strong decks as much offensive as broken decks. I don't know...
What kind of merit a person who critiques something must have, before we can start suspecting he or she is just a salty person or know nothing about the case? I think the first condition needs to be that he or she played that freaking deck first! That would be a good start! I firmly believe a lot of people attacking Ctrl. Warrior didn't play the deck. I want to hear (gladly) nerf propositions from people who played the deck, then from people who left the name in the community, etc... Let THEM say what is Ctrl. Warrior's place in the meta and is he a problem in a manner of Quest Rouge and such... Not random people with highest decibels in their voices.
Random ravings lead only to disastrous nerfs and never ending circle with economical consequences, as we've experienced.
I exactly know what you're talking, you're not that concerned with certain decks, but you would like to open more space for other stuff. Fine. My post is all about the need to recognize and react every time when unfounded piffle starts spreading like plague.
This. Cw is a good control deck which keeps some of the aggrodecks, mainly rogues, in check. Something that couldnt exist last year because of rexxar, jaina and all the otks. There are barely any other control decks right now because besides hagathas scheme there werent any board clears printed this expansion, therefore the other control classes (priest & warlock) struggle to find a decent control build.
Does that make cw unfair? No, it beats a lot of aggro decks as it is supposed to, it loses a lot to greedier builds and otk-decks,as it is supposed to. Everything is in balance. Stop crying and try to play a different deck if yours keeps losing to warrior. Or live with it and move on.
Archivist needs a nerf ASAP she is wrapping up the control metagame too much creating scenarions cof "infinite value" again and negating fatigue, espionage is ok cause it's rogue only and rogue can't abuse it well, but espionage like cards in other classes is broken.
She creates boring matchups she should shuffle way less cards... around 4 would still be a lot but at least will cut the time control mirrors go for.. we never had such long games... even with jade druid it would not go over 4th draw of original fatigue normally, games going over 50 turns limit regularly is dumb.
Its not the Bomb Package that makes Bomb Warrior a great deck. People need to realize its the control warroir in it which is doing its worth
Bomb warrior isn't even a good deck. Above rank 5 no one plays it. It's a fun deck, but it's like how druid used to be when maly, token , and togwaggle were good with a great control shell and different final 6-8 cards
I don't agree that Bomb Warrior is not a good deck...it's tier 2 at best, and I've had a 60% win rate with it albeit in ranks 7-10.
I do agree that it's the control shell that gives opponents fits, not the bomb package. I mainly use the bombs in fatigue matchups, waiting until my opponent has cycled through most of his deck then shuffling loads of bombs to potentially finish them off. It's extremely fun seeing 3-4 bombs go off in sequence :P
The Control shell alone makes it seem like a good deck but its Dr. Boom and co. carrying the deck, not the bombs. Above rank 5 no one plays it, as control warrior is just simply better. Bombs are RNG which makes them at the mercy of the game. You also actually have to draw them, my experience playing the deck (I was on the hype train as everyone was days 1-3) is that you need 4+ bombs in the opponent deck to make them really do much and opponents playing control can usually heal and armor away their affect.
I said it once, Elysiana should get the following treatment: mana cost increased from 8 to 10 mana (no, you should not be allowed to play any other card in the same turn. hi@Omega Assembly) and she cannot be discovered at all. These should be enough to prevent her from ruining serious competition such as tournaments.
Elysiana 10 mana,Omega devastator not discoverable,Cut rush from Hero card and this Crappy game finally will be healthy.
I can't believe people keep saying to cut rush. In all honesty, without it warrior would be done for as this is what gives it a fighting chance against its bad matchups (hunter, mage, paladin). If you are aggro, you probably already lose if warrior plays dr boom and in control vs. control its important but not as game breaking since board isn't a huge issue.
I do agree elysiana needs to be 10 mana and discover 5. The fact that control warrior vs control warrior will always be a 50 card misery-fest is just laughable. And random crap like who gets more armor hero power from dr. boom, randomly discovers zilliax from dr. boom/assesmbly can swing the game. And, of course, people who discover broken cards. Just played my first 50 card game and won because I had better cards then my opponent. No thanks jeff.
Dr. Boom is the problem, in my opinion, as with all "infinite value" cards in HS.
Interestingly enough, infinite value cards actually prevent 'do nothing' stall fatigue control decks from dominating other control mirror matches, which Odd/Control Warrior was/is also one of those stall and mindlessly play nothing but removal, hero power, emote, and pass.
Infinite value prevents 100% reactive slogfests from taking over the meta more than what they otherwise could do right now.
Warrior should be nerfed like they did druid over the years, hit em hard in the classics, make brawl 7 mana, shield slam use up all armor or maybe halved and make shield block give just 3 armor. Then hit rogue classics next.. Haha..
Dr. Boom should be increased to 9 mana (so you can't immediately hero power as well), and the armor option should drop to only 4, like tank up. The rest of the card is mostly OK-ish. 9 mana would put it in the same ballpark as Jaina and Gul'dan used to be, which would be appropriate since he is now as powerful in the current meta as Jaina or Gul'dan ever were.
I don`t understand why people say that warrior is not T1. It is a free win against the most played class 9 out of 10 games. 50% of the streamers play it. Why is that? because it's a bad deck? It's the 2nd most played class? Why would everyone play it if it is not T1? Everybody just copies the most popular decks that do well? You have a problem with druids? Adapt, like some people do. Most people don`t, but just copy a popular deck. I don`t think warriors need nerfing, I think other classed need similar card like Dr. Boom mad genius.
I also don`t understand the crying for nerf rogues. I used to to think so as well when I was playing Murloc shammy and every rogue destroyed me. Now I tried some rogue myself and just get farmed by Warriors and everyone else who just runs 2 or more weapon removals to disturb rogue plays. As HS has always been rock, paper, scissors.
I can't understand one of all things mentioned here. How are people defending Archivist Elysianna? For me it's a cool card that SHOULD have been either 9 or 10 mana from the beginning to cancel the bounce back effects and also leave the opponent the chance to remove her in the following turn. So long it's used on Control Warrior mainly and a little on Control Shaman.
But I can see it being played in some Control Resurrect Priest with Spirit of the Dead and Seance. Goodbye world then.
Apart from this "nerf" I don't think that anything else is needed in Warrior. I place my bet that the "magic carpet" will be nerfed, and I intend to craft it as golden, as well as cards from Token Druid(Acornbearer? ) and Tempo Rogue?
Also I am betting off topic, that Mount giant(busted with Conjurer's Calling) and Malygos will be moved to HOF next year