Can we please stop arguing about piloting it correctly, the Warlock Control decks are super easy to pilot if you've got à bit if experience with the game and the meta.. As said, I could predict each play before he did it, I just pushed my luck because I knew it would be the only way I'd win this game. I knew hellfire was coming, I didn't play my totem in order not to get the 1/1 one and get defiled, never overextended because of the incoming Twisting Nethers... You must be a Warlock player in order to say that your deck implies more skill than another, this isn't even the point... There are bad match ups which I can win, and then there is (was) Warlock pre-nerf and maybe post-nerf.
I mean, we can stop arguing about piloting decks correctly, but just a fun fact, that is what should be the most important aspect of the game, the way the decks are piloted...
Sure is, but when you have limited resources vs the same amount of resources from your opponent.
When you draw cards for a 2/1 1 mana minion, obliterate a full enemy board for fucking 2 manas, get 18 manas value with 6 manas play, recover endless taunts and get a broken hero power with the DK. kill a big minion and restore 7 life for 4 manas is not "piloting anything", is just use cheat codes to win the game, it is exactly what warlock cards are now, cheat, because they are insanely efficient for the cost, the only card can be compare in Standard is CtA, all other classes have garbage cards in comparison.
Can we please stop arguing about piloting it correctly, the Warlock Control decks are super easy to pilot if you've got à bit if experience with the game and the meta.. As said, I could predict each play before he did it, I just pushed my luck because I knew it would be the only way I'd win this game. I knew hellfire was coming, I didn't play my totem in order not to get the 1/1 one and get defiled, never overextended because of the incoming Twisting Nethers... You must be a Warlock player in order to say that your deck implies more skill than another, this isn't even the point... There are bad match ups which I can win, and then there is (was) Warlock pre-nerf and maybe post-nerf.
I mean, we can stop arguing about piloting decks correctly, but just a fun fact, that is what should be the most important aspect of the game, the way the decks are piloted. Hearthstone, or any card game, when stripped down to it's basic concepts, should award wins to players depending on solely two aspects, Strategy and Technical play.
Strategy being the deck and game plan you have, which is one you decide is good to face other players, something that you control, and Technical play being the player executing the game plan correctly and according to the matchup you are facing.
In Hearthstone, those two aspects to play a part, and specially over large sample sizes of games, that is extremely important. When it comes to an isolated instance, a single game, then Luck is 75% of the deciding factor for that single game. The clash between strategies will determine a lot of the matchup, the luck of the draw and random elements will determine almost the rest, with the Technical play of the players in that particular game deciding the rest.
I'm not saying Control Warlock decks are hard to pilot, they simply require more Technical play than a deck like the Shaman you are playing. Again, if you don't believe me, you are welcome to try the 200 game experiment, you will understand what I mean when you finish that experiment.
I'm not a Warlock player per say. I'm a player, I play every single class, although I barely tough the Priest class. In fact, thematically speaking, Warlock is my least favourite class, with Priest being the class I simply don't like. I enjoy the other 7 classes far more when it comes to thematics, and when it comes to play styles, Warlock is my 5th class.
The thing is, I have played this game far too much, I don't hold particular bias towards classes, I am more concerned with Balance and with aspects that are far more important to me, like diversity of strategies and existence of tools to deal with those, rather than what a particularly bad matchup plays like, specially in a single isolated game, rather than a long sample size of games, which is what you provided us.
Wow, just browsing through threads, and I decide to read this one. I don't know who you are, (or rather who you THINK you are)...but all I can say is you're arrogant AF.
I'd go more in-depth about some of your logical fallacies you cleverly avoided admitting, but honestly you seem like the type of person who A) takes Hearthstone WAY too seriously for your skill-level (my hypothesis there: moderate at best) and B) someone who deflects topics (read: the first sentence of your quote here) when arguments are turned against them.
Wow, just browsing through threads, and I decide to read this one. I don't know who you are, (or rather who you THINK you are)...but all I can say is you're arrogant AF.
I'd go more in-depth about some of your logical fallacies you cleverly avoided admitting, but honestly you seem like the type of person who A) takes Hearthstone WAY too seriously for your skill-level (my hypothesis there: moderate at best) and B) someone who deflects topics (read: the first sentence of your quote here) when arguments are turned against them.
The correct adjective is not arrogant. You should learn the difference between confident and arrogant, they are similar, but have a very important difference between them. That's as much as I'll say regarding that, as you are feel free to think whatever the hell you want of me.
The fact you made that statement actually negates your (biased) viewpoint of yourself. A confident person wouldn't make such a statement...only arrogant people have to make such claims because of the level of insecurity they inherently have.
Also, even if you are truly confident, well there's always the Dunning-Kruger effect. Which means either A) you're an expert, or B) you're an idiot, as both are statistically found to have higher than normal levels of confidence. Since TRUE experts are few and far between, I haven't heard of you, seen you stream, and you don't seem to have an affiliation (that I know of) with any Hearthstone stat sites (i.e. VS, HSreplays.net, metastorm, etc)....then I have to assume your confidence probably stems from the low end of the dunning-kruger scale.
You can retort with your next arrogant reply whenever you like. :) I'm sure it'll be entertaining, if nothing else.
@DiamondDM13, you're way to much self confident then, I'm not a noob at this game even if I did some pretty rough mistakes (being mad from previous games didn't help), and we are multiple people trying to tell you something without you willing to listen. I agree with you at a certain level, but I wont argue with you more about this thread, it is unproductive.
Thank you to everyone that made a constructive comment about this Thread, my gameplay, and the "Control Warlock Problem".
My primary mistake during my game was minions positionning I get it, but I think this hasn't had much of an impact on this particular game, correct me if I'm wrong (even if I'll be more careful during the upcoming games, thanks to your advice). Al'Akir could have been dropped earlier but with little hope it could win me the game.
There is no need to argue about the fact that Warlock was broken since Blizzard decided to nerf it, we just have to wait and see if this will be enough or not...
@DiamondDM13, you're way to much self confident then, I'm not a noob at this game even if I did some pretty rough mistakes (being mad from previous games didn't help), and we are multiple people trying to tell you something without you willing to listen. I agree with you at a certain level, but I wont argue with you more about this thread, it is unproductive.
Thank you to everyone that made a constructive comment about this Thread, my gameplay, and the "Control Warlock Problem".
My primary mistake during my game was minions positionning I get it, but I think this hasn't had much of an impact on this particular game, correct me if I'm wrong (even if I'll be more careful during the upcoming games, thanks to your advice). Al'Akir could have been dropped earlier but with little hope it could win me the game.
There is no need to argue about the fact that Warlock was broken since Blizzard decided to nerf it, we just have to wait and see if this will be enough or not...
I agree that with proper positioning you would still not have won this game. However if the mistakes that were done in this particular game happen in other games, you are sometimes losing games you would not have lost and you never realized it. With proper plays you might steal a win here and there and most importantly NOT throw a won game. Maybe after this you wouldnt view certain decks to be as oppressive as you make them out to be. But now, let's all rejoice in the warlock nerfs :D
Turn 12 was a mistake. You should have gone with Al'akir since you first play the "can be stopped by taunt" damage. You played the sword too late imo. Side note: if nerf were active you would have won
Also, even if you are truly confident, well there's always the Dunning-Kruger effect. Which means either A) you're an expert, or B) you're an idiot, as both are statistically found to have higher than normal levels of confidence.
C) heard of the Dunning-Kruger effect, realized they were not confident, drew the conclusion they are above average.
Warlock OP? please tell me why. Ive been playing control warlock since release of WW . I have huge problem with healing, and this is before the nerf of dark pact. Now its almost unplayable, cus you lack so much healing. And i have alot of healing in my deck.
Yesterday i played vs hunter , i had healead for 19 when we hit turn 9. I still lost , cus he only went face. No trading whatsover, skils.
Then i met burst mage, same thing. Not one single trade , everything face. Killed me when i hit turn 7. And people complaining about good removelas? What the hell would you do with warlock if they didnt have it? Its a reason why 99,9% of warlock is cubelock. Cus the rest are bad.
If you are talking about cubelock , then i can understand some complaining.
First, it has been said, you played horribly with your positioning. No proficient mid shaman player, no matter how tilted, would make these mistakes, so if you correct them, you'll get a lot better. Positioning is the number one skill to work on when picking up mid-shaman, always has been.
Second, your turn 3. You play against a deck that runs a lot of boardclears, heals, and a one man taunt-army. As you are bigly unfavored, you have to ask yourself: what is your wincon here? It is not developping a board and chipping damage, as it'll get wiped. Your best path to win is to get a winfurry'ed corpse taker to deal a lot of damage, and you happen to have corpse in your hand along with flametongue & earthen might: the one dream combo that allows you to win these unfavored games. But rather than saving your flametongue, you decided to play it going into the hellfire turn to protect such a low value minion (in this match-up) as the juggler, thus allowing the bad guy to go 2 for 1 with his hellfire and losing your flametongue while you got 0 value out of it.
Your turn 3 should not have been flametongue, you should just have totem'ed up and either trade your juggler or go face and let him kill it with his ooze. Would have meant his t4 would not have been hellfire, and his spellstone would not have been upgraded, thus less heal for him, and more damages for you. Wolf could also have been played for better trade without taking the risk of losing the all-important flametongue for nothing.
Then, there is your al'akir use: the guy got an army of taunts, so when you can hit his face with the windlord, your do, especially considering your hand size and the lack of draws in your deck (you might want to kick zap out for sandbinders, as you play kalimos, they are absolutely great at refilling your hand with steady damage that can go face). Your elementals can hit behind a taund, al'akir cannot.
Anyway, the bottom line is, ctrl warlock is heavily unfavored for you, so you have to take risks and follow the highest winrate line of play, which is getting basically every single point of damage possible to the face in one turn (corpsetaker is the one minion that can reliably do that) and hope it'll be enough. You did not, you came close, but you lost, better luck (and plays) next time :)
edit: someone on first page made a much more thorough analysis already, so my post is useless. Bottom line is, you don't seem to understand how to pilot your deck (positioning) and your wincon in an unfavored match up, so you lost. Improving would be a better step than blame the warlock arsenal, as frustrating as said arsenal can be.
Oh god, that went out of hand quickly...
@DiamondDM13, you're way to much self confident then, I'm not a noob at this game even if I did some pretty rough mistakes (being mad from previous games didn't help), and we are multiple people trying to tell you something without you willing to listen. I agree with you at a certain level, but I wont argue with you more about this thread, it is unproductive.
Thank you to everyone that made a constructive comment about this Thread, my gameplay, and the "Control Warlock Problem".
My primary mistake during my game was minions positionning I get it, but I think this hasn't had much of an impact on this particular game, correct me if I'm wrong (even if I'll be more careful during the upcoming games, thanks to your advice). Al'Akir could have been dropped earlier but with little hope it could win me the game.
There is no need to argue about the fact that Warlock was broken since Blizzard decided to nerf it, we just have to wait and see if this will be enough or not...
If you find yourself facing a lot of control lock, run some tech cards against it. Silences, mc tech, even black knight can come in handy.
Turn 12 was a mistake. You should have gone with Al'akir since you first play the "can be stopped by taunt" damage. You played the sword too late imo. Side note: if nerf were active you would have won
Warlock OP? please tell me why. Ive been playing control warlock since release of WW . I have huge problem with healing, and this is before the nerf of dark pact. Now its almost unplayable, cus you lack so much healing. And i have alot of healing in my deck.
Yesterday i played vs hunter , i had healead for 19 when we hit turn 9. I still lost , cus he only went face. No trading whatsover, skils.
Then i met burst mage, same thing. Not one single trade , everything face. Killed me when i hit turn 7. And people complaining about good removelas? What the hell would you do with warlock if they didnt have it? Its a reason why 99,9% of warlock is cubelock. Cus the rest are bad.
If you are talking about cubelock , then i can understand some complaining.
Control warlock was a tier 3 deck according to both VS and HSreplay even before nerfs. And now it's unplayable, so OP can finally rejoice.
A few pointers.
First, it has been said, you played horribly with your positioning. No proficient mid shaman player, no matter how tilted, would make these mistakes, so if you correct them, you'll get a lot better. Positioning is the number one skill to work on when picking up mid-shaman, always has been.
Second, your turn 3. You play against a deck that runs a lot of boardclears, heals, and a one man taunt-army. As you are bigly unfavored, you have to ask yourself: what is your wincon here? It is not developping a board and chipping damage, as it'll get wiped. Your best path to win is to get a winfurry'ed corpse taker to deal a lot of damage, and you happen to have corpse in your hand along with flametongue & earthen might: the one dream combo that allows you to win these unfavored games. But rather than saving your flametongue, you decided to play it going into the hellfire turn to protect such a low value minion (in this match-up) as the juggler, thus allowing the bad guy to go 2 for 1 with his hellfire and losing your flametongue while you got 0 value out of it.
Your turn 3 should not have been flametongue, you should just have totem'ed up and either trade your juggler or go face and let him kill it with his ooze. Would have meant his t4 would not have been hellfire, and his spellstone would not have been upgraded, thus less heal for him, and more damages for you. Wolf could also have been played for better trade without taking the risk of losing the all-important flametongue for nothing.
Then, there is your al'akir use: the guy got an army of taunts, so when you can hit his face with the windlord, your do, especially considering your hand size and the lack of draws in your deck (you might want to kick zap out for sandbinders, as you play kalimos, they are absolutely great at refilling your hand with steady damage that can go face). Your elementals can hit behind a taund, al'akir cannot.
Anyway, the bottom line is, ctrl warlock is heavily unfavored for you, so you have to take risks and follow the highest winrate line of play, which is getting basically every single point of damage possible to the face in one turn (corpsetaker is the one minion that can reliably do that) and hope it'll be enough. You did not, you came close, but you lost, better luck (and plays) next time :)
edit: someone on first page made a much more thorough analysis already, so my post is useless. Bottom line is, you don't seem to understand how to pilot your deck (positioning) and your wincon in an unfavored match up, so you lost. Improving would be a better step than blame the warlock arsenal, as frustrating as said arsenal can be.