I've been playing the deck for a week or so. At first it seemed insanely strong. I leveled up from 17 to 6 with hardly a bump. The last 2 or 3 days I've been stuck at rank 7. Seems like almost everythign beats it. Right now I think Miracle Rogue is probably my only comfortably matchup. I'm starting to think about changing what I'm playing. It's just not that good at this rank.
Just got killed from 30 Health with it. Not only that, I cleared the board three times prior to that (2 Dragonfire Potions and a Deathwing). Not only that but my Deathwing was frozen by a 1 mana 5/5 twice in a row. Not only that but I managed to play minions turns 1 to 4 while my opponent played none getting to the quest.
The people defending this quest are ridiculous.
If i defend this card it's because the quest IS balanced, you'd have to be really dumb or really salty, or both to not notice what the real problem with the quest is which has nothing to do with the quest AT ALL, it has everything to do with what has historically been the most problematic mechanic in the game which is charge, let's be honest here, the rogue quest is indeed strong but it also helps proof how blizzard nerfed Charge the wrong way, what they should've done is apply the nerf they applied to that card to the mechanic in general and allow the Charge card to be the only way in the game a Minion or a Weapon could attack face the turn it was played/equiped and that's it, they kill like 5 birds with one stone.
I agree with the charge element being one of the issues. One change, that could be cool is:
Quest = Play "X" minion 4 times to get crystal cavern
Crystal Cavern = All minions become a 5/5 copy of "X"
I don't know if it would fix the quest, but it could add some more depth to what is being drawn/redrawn. The positive is that the minion is a non-battlecry or charge minion so there is a chance to get one to two more turns before the board gets stormed with 5/5's. The negative would be if they are playing a charge (Southsea Deckhand) or draw-card battlecry (with Novice ENG).
It would make the quest interesting for the Rogue, to try and maximize which minion you are returning to hand, and the opponent can see the strategy within two to three turns and try to stop or counter.
The card is not being nerfed. Get over your salt, you fucking thieving Priests. As a matter of fact, Rogue was due for something viable and now that you have nothing worth stealing, you're bitching. Im not sorry.
How many of you wanting a nerf also had no issues spamming your little Imps or freezing the fucking board 6 turns in a row? I'm not sorry.
Let me guess, some of you love playing with your little divine shield deck but OH NO...now they all get put back in your hand and WHALA, here comes a bunch 5/5's. Oops.
Fuck that. I'm golden Rogue and I get to play Quest Rogue until I'm blue in the face because I've spent money, time and have dealt with the class being shit for too long with Miracle being the only archetype.
Infirc is right. It's the charge mechanic that's the real issue. So stop bitching about a card being OP when it isn't.
The card is not being nerfed. Get over your salt, you fucking thieving Priests. As a matter of fact, Rogue was due for something viable and now that you have nothing worth stealing, you're bitching.
I'm playing Priest most of the time and don't have a big problem against Quest Rogue. Well, at least in Wild. Sure, it is annoying to lose against a Gang-Uped Patches but that does not happen all the time and so really fun games do in fact happen. Heck, I even lost one game with my 40 life due to 7 5/5ers mostly with Charge and an Eviscerate after sapping my Amara. Am I salty? No. It was well played and a bit unexpected.
And yeah, definetely Charge is the issue. In a game where only three classes have access to "counterspells" in form of Secrets, something with Charge is not healthy. You can't react immediately to it? Well, you are dead most of the time.
On the other hand, if Charge is being nerfed, the Quest Rogue deck will be unplayable because then every deck could handle it somehow, I guess...
Again.. this deck isn't tier 1, or even tier 2. I can't see blizzard nerfing a 48% win deck.
Maybe check your facts before posting. If we're going by the most popular rating of it, Tempo Storm claims it's T1. I don't know what world you're living in where it's not T1.
The card is not being nerfed. Get over your salt, you fucking thieving Priests. As a matter of fact, Rogue was due for something viable and now that you have nothing worth stealing, you're bitching. Im not sorry.
How many of you wanting a nerf also had no issues spamming your little Imps or freezing the fucking board 6 turns in a row? I'm not sorry.
Let me guess, some of you love playing with your little divine shield deck but OH NO...now they all get put back in your hand and WHALA, here comes a bunch 5/5's. Oops.
Fuck that. I'm golden Rogue and I get to play Quest Rogue until I'm blue in the face because I've spent money, time and have dealt with the class being shit for too long with Miracle being the only archetype.
Infirc is right. It's the charge mechanic that's the real issue. So stop bitching about a card being OP when it isn't.
Incredible.
The card is far too strong. It doesn't matter that rogue was miserable for so long as that doesn't justify giving it some broken card that ruins everyone else's experience. I have golden rogue too, never played quest rogue, and rarely played the pure miracle decks (instead opting for Gadgetzan as a draw engine in N'Zoth and Thief rogue or playing straight up pirate rogue). There were plenty of ways to play rogue before this card and there are plenty of ways to play it now (Thief, miracle, water, pirate aggro for example). This quest is a blight upon the rogue class, making what used to be a class known for its complex and difficult plays into one of the most braindead overpowered decks around. It even resulted in yet another rise of pirate warrior as it's the best counter to the deck.
Jaraxxus gave an interesting mechanic in that if you didn't beat the warlock by the first turn or two after they played Lord J, you were going to lose by sheer shitstorm of 6/6's. Rogue quest took that idea, fastforwarded it 5-6 turns and threw charge minions in to piss everyone off. It's extremely unhealthy for the meta to have a deck that you HAVE to beat by T6 or T7 or else face absurd amounts of pressure the rest of the game.
Again.. this deck isn't tier 1, or even tier 2. I can't see blizzard nerfing a 48% win deck.
Maybe check your facts before posting. If we're going by the most popular rating of it, Tempo Storm claims it's T1. I don't know what world you're living in where it's not T1.
While his definition of T1 might be different from Tempo Storm, that link doesn't appear to disprove his other point that Quest Rogue had at some point or now has an overall 48% win rate. I do appreciate the link you shared though, many people are posting hyperbole in this thread without any facts and that link was an interesting read. The bar chart with the match ups in Quest Rogue section was kinda hard to read though to determine what the overall winrate might be, but it appears plausible to me that it could be 48%.
Although this seems to be a recurring theme with the recent metagames, the current state can best be described, once again, as a cyclical rock-paper-scissors type. As of right now, the control decks beat the aggressive decks, the aggressive decks beat the Rogue decks, and the Rogue decks beat the control decks.
I've played a bit of Aggro (Pirate Warrior, Beast Hunter) and Control (Renolock with a little bit of budget Control Priest), but I like Midrange the best, decks that aim to win on turns 7 to 10 by first generating value. Quest Rogue feels like Midrange to me as the Crystal Core gives value to minions with weaker stats, and if I'm going to win with Quest Rogue it is generally in the Midrange time frame around turns 8 and 9. That is plenty of time for your opponent to pile up as much face damage as possible and I've won and lost some fairly epic close games because Quest Rogue is playing catch up after losing tempo bouncing minions back into their hand. Even if they are cheap minions and have good battlecry effects, that is still a tempo loss that other decks aren't experiencing.
The worst part is, this deck is even more toxic than old-fashioned Miracle Rogue back in 2014, for that there is absolutely zero interaction on board – it's either you kill Quest Rogue in time, or they complete the quest and kill you.
I found this part of their write up disingenuous. Hearthstone as a game has only two outcomes: You win or you lose. Three outcomes if you include draws. To simply say "its either you kill Quest Rogue in time, or they complete the quest and kill you" is something you could say about just any deck. Either you kill your opponent before they succeed in accomplishing the design of their deck or they kill you. Any deck that aims to create a lot of value creates pressure if you leave them alone long enough to do it. I would have to agree with Whateverwithu and Infirc that if there is a balance problem here, it is with how Charge works in Hearthstone. Cheap 5/5's is a lot of tempo, particularly if they have charge, but if you aren't applying any pressure yourself while they are losing tempo bouncing minions back into their hand, that is a lost opportunity.
Nerfing charge will nerf aggro decks. Less to no aggro decks, control will rise. Serious question, do we really want a long fatigue games?
While I do feel that charge can be a problem I also agree with the idea that if this game becomes a ball numbing control fest that it will become unplayable. Maybe some people enjoy 45 minutes games where zero minions survive past one turn and it becomes a fatigue battle. That's boring as shit. As usual, there is a happy medium here somewhere and that's where we need to get.
I actually find this rogue quest more of a hassle due to silence not working and the overly cheap cost of the bounce cards. Shadwostep needs to cost at least one mana if not two. If the minion gets hexed or sheeped then it stays with its stats, not 5/5. Or, have it affect only what's on the board at the time to force them to maintain a board. Or something. I dunno.... the quest is simply too easy to achieve.
...This quest is a blight upon the rogue class, making what used to be a class known for its complex and difficult plays into one of the most braindead overpowered decks around...
This is a curious statement to me. The deck says absolutely nothing about how other decks using the rogue class play, so as soon as you have not used turn 1 to play the quest there is no reason for you opponent to think "Oh great, another mindless rogue". Whether it has a positive or negative impact on the game as a whole is its own matter, but no single deck ever blights an entire class.
If anyone's opinion of miracle, thief, N'Zoth, water, C'Thun, jade... rogue decks is in any way affected by the existence of quest rogue, then they don't think clearly.
Nerfing charge will nerf aggro decks. Less to no aggro decks, control will rise. Serious question, do we really want a long fatigue games?
While I do feel that charge can be a problem I also agree with the idea that if this game becomes a ball numbing control fest that it will become unplayable. Maybe some people enjoy 45 minutes games where zero minions survive past one turn and it becomes a fatigue battle. That's boring as shit. As usual, there is a happy medium here somewhere and that's where we need to get.
it necessarily isn't, do you remember that secret Paladin could reliably kill you by turn 7?, it was by virtue of being able to achieve massive value boards and go face during the mid-game ebcause of the huge thhreatening board they made, and that deck didn't use any charge minion at all, nerfing charge wouldn't extend the duration of the game by a whole lot but it'd fix a lot of problems, you've got to admit that before the weird "preparing for standard nerfs" 99% of all the cards nerfed had something to do with charge, Unleash the Hounds, Warsong Commander, Leeroy Jenkins, Argent Commander to name a few, land even in the "weird preparing for standard nerfs" the charge mechanic made presence in Force of Nature, if 90-99% of the cards nerfed in the history of the game have something to do with charge then there's a common factor that should be fixed instead of repeating a vicious cycle that's honestly a lot of work of releasing a card let it run amok and then killing it because it had something to do with charge, solution: Fix charge, save a lot of time and work and cards.
Nerfing charge will nerf aggro decks. Less to no aggro decks, control will rise. Serious question, do we really want a long fatigue games?
While I do feel that charge can be a problem I also agree with the idea that if this game becomes a ball numbing control fest that it will become unplayable. Maybe some people enjoy 45 minutes games where zero minions survive past one turn and it becomes a fatigue battle. That's boring as shit. As usual, there is a happy medium here somewhere and that's where we need to get.
it necessarily isn't, do you remember that secret Paladin could reliably kill you by turn 7?, it was by virtue of being able to achieve massive value boards and go face during the mid-game ebcause of the huge thhreatening board they made, and that deck didn't use any charge minion at all, nerfing charge wouldn't extend the duration of the game by a whole lot but it'd fix a lot of problems, you've got to admit that before the weird "preparing for standard nerfs" 99% of all the cards nerfed had something to do with charge, Unleash the Hounds, Warsong Commander, Leeroy Jenkins, Argent Commander to name a few, land even in the "weird preparing for standard nerfs" the charge mechanic made presence in Force of Nature.
Why do we need to nerf charge, though? When has charge ever been an extended problem that the whole category of charge needed to be nerfed? If one spell is overpowered, do we need to nerf all spells? Yes, charge is overpowered in Rogue, as the Rogue has the ability to buff charge minions, but that's the issue of the spell; same with EVERY single other deck that involved charge minions as win condition. It was all with the assistance of spells. Charge minions at it's core are already weaker versions of minions. In my honest opinion, not a single charge minion currently in the Hearthstone collection needs a nerf.
The fundamental issue with Rogue quest is there's not much counter play involved. You can't silence, you can't board clear, you can't use heavy removal to counter the opponent. It's up to how the Rogue draws and whether they can activate their quest or not. You can't do much in order to reduce the chances of Rogue's activating their quest. I'm not sure why people believe charge is the issue here.
it necessarily isn't, do you remember that secret Paladin could reliably kill you by turn 7?, it was by virtue of being able to achieve massive value boards and go face during the mid-game ebcause of the huge thhreatening board they made, and that deck didn't use any charge minion at all, nerfing charge wouldn't extend the duration of the game by a whole lot but it'd fix a lot of problems, you've got to admit that before the weird "preparing for standard nerfs" 99% of all the cards nerfed had something to do with charge, Unleash the Hounds, Warsong Commander, Leeroy Jenkins, Argent Commander to name a few, land even in the "weird preparing for standard nerfs" the charge mechanic made presence in Force of Nature.
Why do we need to nerf charge, though? When has charge ever been an extended problem that the whole category of charge needed to be nerfed? If one spell is overpowered, do we need to nerf all spells? Yes, charge is overpowered in Rogue, as the Rogue has the ability to buff charge minions, but that's the issue of the spell; same with EVERY single other deck that involved charge minions as win condition. It was all with the assistance of spells. Charge minions at it's core are already weaker versions of minions. In my honest opinion, not a single charge minion currently in the Hearthstone collection needs a nerf.
The fundamental issue with Rogue quest is there's not much counter play involved. You can't silence, you can't board clear, you can't use heavy removal to counter the opponent. It's up to how the Rogue draws and whether they can activate their quest or not. You can't do much in order to reduce the chances of Rogue's activating their quest. I'm not sure why people believe charge is the issue here.
Charge has been the mechanic that's got all those cards i mentioned killed, charge is the mechanic that makes pirate warrior so broken, spells just help boost it into an even more broken mechanic, you are jsut using my words and turning them the other way around, if charge dcouldn't go face then the quest would be completely fair because it'd allow the opponent the time to dig for answers, nerf charge and the 1 mana recyclable Fireball becomes a 1 mana semi-recyclable Shadow Strike without the undamaged restriction, we keep a viable and interesting quest and get rid of any future problem the mechanic can cause instead of killing yet another card just because it boosted charge.
That quest needs to be either play the same minion 4 times in a single turn or it has to be more than 4 times, because it's insane that they reliably have the quest done on turn 4...
Again.. this deck isn't tier 1, or even tier 2. I can't see blizzard nerfing a 48% win deck.
Maybe check your facts before posting. If we're going by the most popular rating of it, Tempo Storm claims it's T1. I don't know what world you're living in where it's not T1.
The card is not being nerfed. Get over your salt, you fucking thieving Priests. As a matter of fact, Rogue was due for something viable and now that you have nothing worth stealing, you're bitching. Im not sorry.
How many of you wanting a nerf also had no issues spamming your little Imps or freezing the fucking board 6 turns in a row? I'm not sorry.
Let me guess, some of you love playing with your little divine shield deck but OH NO...now they all get put back in your hand and WHALA, here comes a bunch 5/5's. Oops.
Fuck that. I'm golden Rogue and I get to play Quest Rogue until I'm blue in the face because I've spent money, time and have dealt with the class being shit for too long with Miracle being the only archetype.
Infirc is right. It's the charge mechanic that's the real issue. So stop bitching about a card being OP when it isn't.
Incredible.
The card is far too strong. It doesn't matter that rogue was miserable for so long as that doesn't justify giving it some broken card that ruins everyone else's experience. I have golden rogue too, never played quest rogue, and rarely played the pure miracle decks (instead opting for Gadgetzan as a draw engine in N'Zoth and Thief rogue or playing straight up pirate rogue). There were plenty of ways to play rogue before this card and there are plenty of ways to play it now (Thief, miracle, water, pirate aggro for example). This quest is a blight upon the rogue class, making what used to be a class known for its complex and difficult plays into one of the most braindead overpowered decks around. It even resulted in yet another rise of pirate warrior as it's the best counter to the deck.
Jaraxxus gave an interesting mechanic in that if you didn't beat the warlock by the first turn or two after they played Lord J, you were going to lose by sheer shitstorm of 6/6's. Rogue quest took that idea, fastforwarded it 5-6 turns and threw charge minions in to piss everyone off. It's extremely unhealthy for the meta to have a deck that you HAVE to beat by T6 or T7 or else face absurd amounts of pressure the rest of the game.
Under top archetype matchups, crystal rogue currently sits at 47% (it declined).
Also tempostorm is run by noobs and have 0 credibility. Their aggro shaman list last month included lightning storm, and some other terrible cards. I played aggro shaman for 3 seasons and have a top 100 and top 200 finish with that deck, so I can tell if a list is bad or not.
Again.. this deck isn't tier 1, or even tier 2. I can't see blizzard nerfing a 48% win deck.
Maybe check your facts before posting. If we're going by the most popular rating of it, Tempo Storm claims it's T1. I don't know what world you're living in where it's not T1.
The card is not being nerfed. Get over your salt, you fucking thieving Priests. As a matter of fact, Rogue was due for something viable and now that you have nothing worth stealing, you're bitching. Im not sorry.
How many of you wanting a nerf also had no issues spamming your little Imps or freezing the fucking board 6 turns in a row? I'm not sorry.
Let me guess, some of you love playing with your little divine shield deck but OH NO...now they all get put back in your hand and WHALA, here comes a bunch 5/5's. Oops.
Fuck that. I'm golden Rogue and I get to play Quest Rogue until I'm blue in the face because I've spent money, time and have dealt with the class being shit for too long with Miracle being the only archetype.
Infirc is right. It's the charge mechanic that's the real issue. So stop bitching about a card being OP when it isn't.
Incredible.
The card is far too strong. It doesn't matter that rogue was miserable for so long as that doesn't justify giving it some broken card that ruins everyone else's experience. I have golden rogue too, never played quest rogue, and rarely played the pure miracle decks (instead opting for Gadgetzan as a draw engine in N'Zoth and Thief rogue or playing straight up pirate rogue). There were plenty of ways to play rogue before this card and there are plenty of ways to play it now (Thief, miracle, water, pirate aggro for example). This quest is a blight upon the rogue class, making what used to be a class known for its complex and difficult plays into one of the most braindead overpowered decks around. It even resulted in yet another rise of pirate warrior as it's the best counter to the deck.
Jaraxxus gave an interesting mechanic in that if you didn't beat the warlock by the first turn or two after they played Lord J, you were going to lose by sheer shitstorm of 6/6's. Rogue quest took that idea, fastforwarded it 5-6 turns and threw charge minions in to piss everyone off. It's extremely unhealthy for the meta to have a deck that you HAVE to beat by T6 or T7 or else face absurd amounts of pressure the rest of the game.
Under top archetype matchups, crystal rogue currently sits at 47% (it declined).
Also tempostorm is run by noobs and have 0 credibility. Their aggro shaman list last month included lightning storm, and some other terrible cards. I played aggro shaman for 3 seasons and have a top 100 and top 200 finish with that deck, so I can tell if a list is bad or not.
It gets worse - Metastats is currently tracking the deck as 16th-best from Rank 5 through Legend. It's the bottom of Tier 3, marginally better than the "just for fun" Tier 4 decks. Against the ten most popular decks on ladder, the deck has six match-ups between 29%-43%. However, I doubt that any of this will make much of an impression against "Quest Rogue Fundamentalists." The deck is clearly broken beyond repair, the devs are lazy, stupid and greedy, etc.
I've been playing the deck for a week or so. At first it seemed insanely strong. I leveled up from 17 to 6 with hardly a bump. The last 2 or 3 days I've been stuck at rank 7. Seems like almost everythign beats it. Right now I think Miracle Rogue is probably my only comfortably matchup. I'm starting to think about changing what I'm playing. It's just not that good at this rank.
I don't think it needs a nerf in the least.
Galavant Animation
I agree with the charge element being one of the issues. One change, that could be cool is:
Quest = Play "X" minion 4 times to get crystal cavern
Crystal Cavern = All minions become a 5/5 copy of "X"
I don't know if it would fix the quest, but it could add some more depth to what is being drawn/redrawn. The positive is that the minion is a non-battlecry or charge minion so there is a chance to get one to two more turns before the board gets stormed with 5/5's. The negative would be if they are playing a charge (Southsea Deckhand) or draw-card battlecry (with Novice ENG).
It would make the quest interesting for the Rogue, to try and maximize which minion you are returning to hand, and the opponent can see the strategy within two to three turns and try to stop or counter.
Again.. this deck isn't tier 1, or even tier 2. I can't see blizzard nerfing a 48% win deck.
S39 Legend - Quest Rogue, S38 Legend - Murloc Paladin, S37 Legend - Miracle Rogue, S36 Top 200 Legend - Aggro Shaman, S35 - Finished Rank 51 Legend - Aggro Shaman, S34 Legend - Aggro Shaman
The card is not being nerfed. Get over your salt, you fucking thieving Priests. As a matter of fact, Rogue was due for something viable and now that you have nothing worth stealing, you're bitching. Im not sorry.
How many of you wanting a nerf also had no issues spamming your little Imps or freezing the fucking board 6 turns in a row? I'm not sorry.
Let me guess, some of you love playing with your little divine shield deck but OH NO...now they all get put back in your hand and WHALA, here comes a bunch 5/5's. Oops.
Fuck that. I'm golden Rogue and I get to play Quest Rogue until I'm blue in the face because I've spent money, time and have dealt with the class being shit for too long with Miracle being the only archetype.
Infirc is right. It's the charge mechanic that's the real issue. So stop bitching about a card being OP when it isn't.
Incredible.
Nerfing charge will nerf aggro decks. Less to no aggro decks, control will rise. Serious question, do we really want a long fatigue games?
Death to all who oppose the Horde!
I win due to skill and lose due to bad RNG. :D
Check out my Frozen Throne Evolve Shaman deck:
http://www.hearthpwn.com/decks/903345-new-evolve-shaman
That quest needs to be either play the same minion 4 times in a single turn or it has to be more than 4 times, because it's insane that they reliably have the quest done on turn 4...
All I can say is: Dirty Rat FTW!
S39 Legend - Quest Rogue, S38 Legend - Murloc Paladin, S37 Legend - Miracle Rogue, S36 Top 200 Legend - Aggro Shaman, S35 - Finished Rank 51 Legend - Aggro Shaman, S34 Legend - Aggro Shaman
quest rouge is just like jade druid except it gets rolling by turn 4 or 5. So thank you quest rouge for forcing the meta into aggro or nothing.
Me, you have forced me to play silence priest, so don't complain when you get hit with a 48 attack razor leaf on turn 4.
That's the problem ,everybody think the only counter is to kill a Qrouge before She complete the quest.