Except for Crabrider, none of these nerfs is actually relevant imo. The nerf to Hysteria is a freaking joke.
1st Day of School is not even a real nerf actually. Paladin will still win everything in standard and it's boring, shaman still sucks, Frenzy still sucks. And Refreshing Spring Water is still way too good in spell mage. Hunter has received no changes at all?
The buffs are mostly irrelevant. BG might become a little less one-sided, but that's it.
On a sidenote: WIld and Duels are close to unplayable right now in higher ranks, but who at Blizzard cares anyway.
N'zoth going down to 9 mana is.... weird. Like super weird. I don't question that he needed the buff, and it's one less shit card for the "summon a 10 drop" effects, so it's all good, but... Isn't it weird ? Was anyone even asking to buff this card ?
Shieldmaiden is still too slow and worse than the 5 mana mech.
Whirling Combatant gets better, but Saurfang gets worse, because you don't want to summon Whirling combatants with Saurfang. Don't like this buff at all, the card didn't need it.
Why is that ? I like this nerf, Hysteria is in every priest/warlock deck and clears any early game board without thinking. And it's extremely hard to play around at the early stage of the game without butchering your own game plan. It's a better board clear than many 4 and 5 mana board clears.
1st Day of School is not even a real nerf actually.
That, I actually agree with. They didn't nerf the card, they just nerfed the turn 1 with this card. Card is getting even more oppressive, they will revert the nerf or make another nerf.
Except for Crabrider, none of these nerfs is actually relevant imo. The nerf to Hysteria is a freaking joke.
1st Day of School is not even a real nerf actually. Paladin will still win everything in standard and it's boring, shaman still sucks, Frenzy still sucks. And Refreshing Spring Water is still way too good in spell mage. Hunter has received no changes at all?
The buffs are mostly irrelevant. BG might become a little less one-sided, but that's it.
On a sidenote: WIld and Duels are close to unplayable right now in higher ranks, but who at Blizzard cares anyway.
Just my two cents.
This paragraph gets written EVERY single time there is a balance change and it almost never ages well. Single mana nerfs are a big deal and they continuously affect the meta whenever they are introduced. Hysteria - for example - is a card which has become more and more problematic as it has proven to be WAY too efficient of a board clear for a relatively cheap cost and when you combine that with the high potential for discovery in Priest decks then you are left with an extremely frustrating situation where one player is continuously punished for attempting to establish any board control. Allowing a player a single extra turn to establish board presence and do potential damage while robbing a Priest of 2-4 mana per game (depending on discovery amount) is absolutely a big deal.
Tidal Surge is a Shadow Bolt with an ok upside against aggro decks. I don't think this is good enough.
Unbound Elemental is decent now, sure, but you don't have that many Overload cards in elemental decks, so you would either focus more on Overload or only rarely buff it. The very nature of elemental shaman is curvestone and overloading feels pretty bad for that.
Lilypad Lurker was already kinda the midrange backbone of elementals. If they buff any elementals, it really shouldn't have been this one.
Fiendish Circrle is quite nice until you realise that there is enough small damage board clears with low mana cost already.
Deck of Chaos could be fun if there was a combo for it. No room in control warlock, though, imo. Building a deck around this is probably a lot worse than just playing classic control warlock (which has been hit pretty hard with Hysteria).
Nzoth is cool, I like the card but weird. Unsure if this helps, though, because 9 is still a lot.
The other two are meh.
If you think about it, Hysteria nerf is a hugh problem for efficient control lists. It's not understandable how they nerf a key card for priest and warlock, but paladin can still do whatever it wants. And hunter?
Sorry, by "freaking joke", I didn't mean to say irrelevant. I cannot understand why they did that because, well, see above.
Except for Crabrider, none of these nerfs is actually relevant imo. The nerf to Hysteria is a freaking joke.
1st Day of School is not even a real nerf actually. Paladin will still win everything in standard and it's boring, shaman still sucks, Frenzy still sucks. And Refreshing Spring Water is still way too good in spell mage. Hunter has received no changes at all?
The buffs are mostly irrelevant. BG might become a little less one-sided, but that's it.
On a sidenote: WIld and Duels are close to unplayable right now in higher ranks, but who at Blizzard cares anyway.
Just my two cents.
This paragraph gets written EVERY single time there is a balance change and it almost never ages well. Single mana nerfs are a big deal and they continuously affect the meta whenever they are introduced. Hysteria - for example - is a card which has become more and more problematic as it has proven to be WAY too efficient of a board clear for a relatively cheap cost and when you combine that with the high potential for discovery in Priest decks then you are left with an extremely frustrating situation where one player is continuously punished for attempting to establish any board control. Allowing a player a single extra turn to establish board presence and do potential damage while robbing a Priest of 2-4 mana per game (depending on discovery amount) is absolutely a big deal.
I was gonna rage on the Hysteria nerf, but then I saw the Crabrider nerf so I don't care any more. I can no longer lose to a single 2-cost minion and that's all I ever wanted. Waiting one more turn to play my absurd semi-hard removal is just fine.
First Day of School nerf is beautiful as well. No more perfectly consistent early game and smoothed out curve for Paladin. They'll have to run more crappy 1-cost minions to compensate (and I don't have to worry about losing to a randomly generated Blackjack Stunner any more).
Shaman buffs are majorly underwhelming. Elementals still aren't sticky enough to get in minion damage against anybody with removal and they have no practical way to leverage their minions on board with buffs. The only things that bordered on viable prior to the patch were doomhammer/spell damage related and those decks got nothing. Lilypad Lurker was a great card before the buff and even better now, but only in a vacuum. It still doesn't fit into a working archetype.
little bit disappointed, i hoped for changes that would shake up the meta more.
for example i think that rogue, palas and mages may now change in power level but will not change any card in their decks (with the exception of crab rider), which is kinda sad.
Has anyone seen Kazakus in priest or warlock lately? I am curious cause I haven't. Xyrella and Cascading DIsaster too good?
I don't consider 64% Face Hunters healthy, but I am probably biased because I am not the biggest fan of aggro. Maybe some heal midrange shaman will keep it in check, but how is that deck supposed to win against most of the non-aggro competition?
Also, I am not in the "nerf Tickatus" group, but it's surprising they didn't do it, given the amount of community rage the card created.
I expect a legendary shaman elemental card in the mini-set to make up for the last two months. Maybe then we can talk about high-tier shaman again.
I'm actually pleasantly surprised at the restraint shown in severity of buff/nerf.
When 15 changes are being rolled out at once, it's pretty important to not go overboard on any one card. Very easy to go WAY too far with this number of changes.
I don't see any huge red flags though. Just looks like they had some cards they hoped would get played at the start of the expansion/core set, and when they didn't see play, Bliz decided to amp them up or tune down others.
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Except for Crabrider, none of these nerfs is actually relevant imo. The nerf to Hysteria is a freaking joke.
1st Day of School is not even a real nerf actually. Paladin will still win everything in standard and it's boring, shaman still sucks, Frenzy still sucks. And Refreshing Spring Water is still way too good in spell mage. Hunter has received no changes at all?
The buffs are mostly irrelevant. BG might become a little less one-sided, but that's it.
On a sidenote: WIld and Duels are close to unplayable right now in higher ranks, but who at Blizzard cares anyway.
Just my two cents.
This paragraph gets written EVERY single time there is a balance change and it almost never ages well. Single mana nerfs are a big deal and they continuously affect the meta whenever they are introduced. Hysteria - for example - is a card which has become more and more problematic as it has proven to be WAY too efficient of a board clear for a relatively cheap cost and when you combine that with the high potential for discovery in Priest decks then you are left with an extremely frustrating situation where one player is continuously punished for attempting to establish any board control. Allowing a player a single extra turn to establish board presence and do potential damage while robbing a Priest of 2-4 mana per game (depending on discovery amount) is absolutely a big deal.
Can't play it with Kazakus too.
That's big. The most successful Priest lists I've seen run Kazakus; it gives them a major boost in the unfavorable Warlock matchup. I've seen some Warlocks run it as well, but I think it's less important.
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Hi there
For any other anxious folk, here are the patch notes that Alec commented yesterday
https://playhearthstone.com/en-us/news/23671132/20-2-2-patch-notes
Just when I posted this they posted in the home page haha.
thanks
It's a little easier to post just the text link than it is to create a news post. :p
Thanks for posting though, it always helps to have information out there. :)
If you see a bad post on the forum use the report function under it, so I or someone else of the moderation team can take care of it!
I don't know about you guys, but I will probably take a break from the game for a year or so.
What the heck is this?
Pretty good nerfs, the Mankrik one is a bit out of place.
Buffs are okay, although some of them are completely useless.
Care to elaborate what's on your mind ? What's wrong ?
Except for Crabrider, none of these nerfs is actually relevant imo. The nerf to Hysteria is a freaking joke.
1st Day of School is not even a real nerf actually. Paladin will still win everything in standard and it's boring, shaman still sucks, Frenzy still sucks. And Refreshing Spring Water is still way too good in spell mage. Hunter has received no changes at all?
The buffs are mostly irrelevant. BG might become a little less one-sided, but that's it.
On a sidenote: WIld and Duels are close to unplayable right now in higher ranks, but who at Blizzard cares anyway.
Just my two cents.
Tidal Surge -1 mana is a pretty insane buff I love it.
Unbound Elemental+1 atk isn't punishing you for playing it on curve anymore, love it.
Lilypad Lurker +1/+1 is kinda whatever, but it's a significant buff to elemental decks.
Fiendish Circle -1 mana is also a scary buff imo, but I guess Zoolock needed that.
Deck of Chaos still a meme card. Or is it ?
N'zoth going down to 9 mana is.... weird. Like super weird. I don't question that he needed the buff, and it's one less shit card for the "summon a 10 drop" effects, so it's all good, but... Isn't it weird ? Was anyone even asking to buff this card ?
Shieldmaiden is still too slow and worse than the 5 mana mech.
Whirling Combatant gets better, but Saurfang gets worse, because you don't want to summon Whirling combatants with Saurfang. Don't like this buff at all, the card didn't need it.
It would be an insane buff ;)
Why is that ? I like this nerf, Hysteria is in every priest/warlock deck and clears any early game board without thinking. And it's extremely hard to play around at the early stage of the game without butchering your own game plan. It's a better board clear than many 4 and 5 mana board clears.
That, I actually agree with. They didn't nerf the card, they just nerfed the turn 1 with this card. Card is getting even more oppressive, they will revert the nerf or make another nerf.
At least they can beat aggro now. 3 mana Tidal Surge + Tidal Wave is auto win.
This paragraph gets written EVERY single time there is a balance change and it almost never ages well. Single mana nerfs are a big deal and they continuously affect the meta whenever they are introduced. Hysteria - for example - is a card which has become more and more problematic as it has proven to be WAY too efficient of a board clear for a relatively cheap cost and when you combine that with the high potential for discovery in Priest decks then you are left with an extremely frustrating situation where one player is continuously punished for attempting to establish any board control. Allowing a player a single extra turn to establish board presence and do potential damage while robbing a Priest of 2-4 mana per game (depending on discovery amount) is absolutely a big deal.
Tidal Surge is a Shadow Bolt with an ok upside against aggro decks. I don't think this is good enough.
Unbound Elemental is decent now, sure, but you don't have that many Overload cards in elemental decks, so you would either focus more on Overload or only rarely buff it. The very nature of elemental shaman is curvestone and overloading feels pretty bad for that.
Lilypad Lurker was already kinda the midrange backbone of elementals. If they buff any elementals, it really shouldn't have been this one.
Fiendish Circrle is quite nice until you realise that there is enough small damage board clears with low mana cost already.
Deck of Chaos could be fun if there was a combo for it. No room in control warlock, though, imo. Building a deck around this is probably a lot worse than just playing classic control warlock (which has been hit pretty hard with Hysteria).
Nzoth is cool, I like the card but weird. Unsure if this helps, though, because 9 is still a lot.
The other two are meh.
If you think about it, Hysteria nerf is a hugh problem for efficient control lists. It's not understandable how they nerf a key card for priest and warlock, but paladin can still do whatever it wants. And hunter?
Sorry, by "freaking joke", I didn't mean to say irrelevant. I cannot understand why they did that because, well, see above.
Yeah but shaman has access to spell damage tools, it's more than just a shadowbolt, it will often deal+heal 5 or 7 damage. (Novice Zapper, Bru'kan)
Nothing wrong with Hunter they are probably in the best place they have ever been. Not OP, not garbage.
Can't play it with Kazakus too.
I was gonna rage on the Hysteria nerf, but then I saw the Crabrider nerf so I don't care any more. I can no longer lose to a single 2-cost minion and that's all I ever wanted. Waiting one more turn to play my absurd semi-hard removal is just fine.
First Day of School nerf is beautiful as well. No more perfectly consistent early game and smoothed out curve for Paladin. They'll have to run more crappy 1-cost minions to compensate (and I don't have to worry about losing to a randomly generated Blackjack Stunner any more).
Shaman buffs are majorly underwhelming. Elementals still aren't sticky enough to get in minion damage against anybody with removal and they have no practical way to leverage their minions on board with buffs. The only things that bordered on viable prior to the patch were doomhammer/spell damage related and those decks got nothing. Lilypad Lurker was a great card before the buff and even better now, but only in a vacuum. It still doesn't fit into a working archetype.
little bit disappointed, i hoped for changes that would shake up the meta more.
for example i think that rogue, palas and mages may now change in power level but will not change any card in their decks (with the exception of crab rider), which is kinda sad.
Has anyone seen Kazakus in priest or warlock lately? I am curious cause I haven't. Xyrella and Cascading DIsaster too good?
I don't consider 64% Face Hunters healthy, but I am probably biased because I am not the biggest fan of aggro. Maybe some heal midrange shaman will keep it in check, but how is that deck supposed to win against most of the non-aggro competition?
Also, I am not in the "nerf Tickatus" group, but it's surprising they didn't do it, given the amount of community rage the card created.
I expect a legendary shaman elemental card in the mini-set to make up for the last two months. Maybe then we can talk about high-tier shaman again.
I'm actually pleasantly surprised at the restraint shown in severity of buff/nerf.
When 15 changes are being rolled out at once, it's pretty important to not go overboard on any one card. Very easy to go WAY too far with this number of changes.
I don't see any huge red flags though. Just looks like they had some cards they hoped would get played at the start of the expansion/core set, and when they didn't see play, Bliz decided to amp them up or tune down others.
Helpful Clarification on Forbidden Topics for Hearthstone Forums:
Enjoying Americans winning in the Olympics is forbidden because it is political. A 14 plus page discussion of state-sponsored lawsuits against a multi-national corporation based on harassment, discrimination, and wrongful death allegations is apparently not political enough to raise an issue.
That's big. The most successful Priest lists I've seen run Kazakus; it gives them a major boost in the unfavorable Warlock matchup. I've seen some Warlocks run it as well, but I think it's less important.