I had said that I am out till next expansion due to Kingsbane and been back since it's gone, so when I had written that this is the least effective expansion ever, I was almost stoned to death by those who kept writing the same thing over and over again. 'This is the first week, wait 2 or 3 weeks you will see new decks emerging'. Let alone new decks there is nothing but hunters, who would guess that I might even miss Shudderwock Shaman.
So when someone claims something that might appear premature in the first sight, wait to reply to unprove what is stated instead of proposing counter arguments and try to get upvotes by your reply. So where are you now?
Here the main question to ask why this expansion is bad is very simple: What makes an expansion good? I tell you what. For instance, when MSoG released, new archetypes emerged. People tried to play decks that can only use one copy of each cards, the discover mechanic is so far the most successful mechanic since the release and it is good for both reasons: first, it is different in each game, which makes it fun to play, and second it is not 100% RNG since it allows you to choose a card that you can either benefit or get punished by it. People created Jade decks - though jade idol was broken till Geist - it was something novel. Introducing even & odd decks are also successful since we saw some of the cards that we thought would never included in any decks normally. Rush is another good mechanic that is introduced since the immediate effect of a card is usually what we want which is the current problem with overkill unless it is a rush minion, and also doesn't have an additive effect for 'just going face decks'. When it comes to Rasthakan, I was hopeful at first glance, spirit cards, Loas which sound like exciting but turned out to be disappointing. I am F2P and usually I do have only 1 deck type that I can play after I manage to earn through arena rewards. Since I wanted to try pirate rogue, which is no way close to being an brainless aggro deck like in turn 5 pirate warrior era, there are some synergistic cards that worth to give a shot, but the results are absolutely terrible, not only because you can usually have a few pirates on the board - thanks to every class having AoEs - that makes Cannon Barage awful, but also you have almost no way to comeback once you lost the board and can't pressure your opponent fast enough which makes odd rogue inevitably superior. I can write an example of each class like that but I am certain that is sufficient to make the point. Apart from standard, Arena is super boring for nowadays, because it is just playing minions over and over again that you just trade and hit face with the remaining ones, I had never complained about RNG in Arena before as it was on of the most important parameter that made Arena somehow exciting and frustrating, which makes the moves unpredictable and punishable, you could go with many spells in your deck and get rewarded by it or punished, it was your choice.
Lastly, someone will surely claim that the RR will be valuable with the introduction of new cards & mechanics, but what is the point of playing the new expansion then? We can just wait 6 months and they can release 2 expansions at once. I am sure Team 5 is at least capable of doing that. Unless we give the right negative feedback, the game will never develop as we want, because the HS players are the ones who declare whether the meta is balanced or extremely boring, not Blizzard.
Here the main question to ask why this expansion is bad is very simple: What makes an expansion good? I tell you what. For instance, when MSoG released, new archetypes emerged. People tried to play decks that can only use one copy of each cards, the discover mechanic is so far the most successful mechanic since the release and it is good for both reasons: first, it is different in each game, which makes it fun to play, and second it is not 100% RNG since it allows you to choose a card that you can either benefit or get punished by it. People created Jade decks - though jade idol was broken till Geist - it was something novel. Introducing even & odd decks are also successful since we saw some of the cards that we thought would never included in any decks normally. Rush is another good mechanic that is introduced since the immediate effect of a card is usually what we want which is the current problem with overkill unless it is a rush minion, and also doesn't have an additive effect for 'just going face decks'. When it comes to Rasthakan, I was hopeful at first glance, spirit cards, Loas which sound like exciting but turned out to be disappointing. I am F2P and usually I do have only 1 deck type that I can play after I manage to earn through arena rewards. Since I wanted to try pirate rogue, which is no way close to being an brainless aggro deck like in turn 5 pirate warrior era, there are some synergistic cards that worth to give a shot, but the results are absolutely terrible, not only because you can usually have a few pirates on the board - thanks to every class having AoEs - that makes Cannon Barage awful, but also you have almost no way to comeback once you lost the board and can't pressure your opponent fast enough which makes odd rogue inevitably superior. I can write an example of each class like that but I am certain that is sufficient to make the point. Apart from standard, Arena is super boring for nowadays, because it is just playing minions over and over again that you just trade and hit face with the remaining ones, I had never complained about RNG in Arena before as it was on of the most important parameter that made Arena somehow exciting and frustrating, which makes the moves unpredictable and punishable, you could go with many spells in your deck and get rewarded by it or punished, it was your choice.
Look at that text wall, that thing is beautiful! Donald Trump would be proud!
Seriously though, anything reasonably balanced wouldn't change a thing after the insanely op cards we got last year. So yeah every RR card seems like dogshit. They took a design choice to tone things down. A choice which i agree with. Now as long as they won't go back to their word AGAIN, and keep this powerlevel in the future expansions as well, then a new life will be added to the game. Till then patience my padawan.
In any given expansion, a few cards will become meta staples. A bunch of cards will be fun to play around with but not actually competitively viable except in a few cases. And most cards will never see play because they're garbage. This is true for every card game, not just Hearthstone. The closer an expansion is released after a rotation, the more impact it will have. I suspect this is why you rate MSOG so highly - if I recall correctly, wasn't it the second expansion of the set year?
So just to counter your claim that RR was unsuccessful, here are cards that are seeing regular competitive play because they're good cards:
I haven't played ladder in since the beginning of the month, so I'm not entirely sure what's being played in Shaman or Warrior. This is largely based on my experience earlier and in watching recent streams of top players. Based on the numbers, it seems RR was just about as impactful as any other expansion.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Life before death. Strength before weakness. Journey before destination.
Here the main question to ask why this expansion is bad is very simple: What makes an expansion good? I tell you what. For instance, when MSoG released, new archetypes emerged. People tried to play decks that can only use one copy of each cards, the discover mechanic is so far the most successful mechanic since the release and it is good for both reasons: first, it is different in each game, which makes it fun to play, and second it is not 100% RNG since it allows you to choose a card that you can either benefit or get punished by it. People created Jade decks - though jade idol was broken till Geist - it was something novel. Introducing even & odd decks are also successful since we saw some of the cards that we thought would never included in any decks normally. Rush is another good mechanic that is introduced since the immediate effect of a card is usually what we want which is the current problem with overkill unless it is a rush minion, and also doesn't have an additive effect for 'just going face decks'. When it comes to Rasthakan, I was hopeful at first glance, spirit cards, Loas which sound like exciting but turned out to be disappointing. I am F2P and usually I do have only 1 deck type that I can play after I manage to earn through arena rewards. Since I wanted to try pirate rogue, which is no way close to being an brainless aggro deck like in turn 5 pirate warrior era, there are some synergistic cards that worth to give a shot, but the results are absolutely terrible, not only because you can usually have a few pirates on the board - thanks to every class having AoEs - that makes Cannon Barage awful, but also you have almost no way to comeback once you lost the board and can't pressure your opponent fast enough which makes odd rogue inevitably superior. I can write an example of each class like that but I am certain that is sufficient to make the point. Apart from standard, Arena is super boring for nowadays, because it is just playing minions over and over again that you just trade and hit face with the remaining ones, I had never complained about RNG in Arena before as it was on of the most important parameter that made Arena somehow exciting and frustrating, which makes the moves unpredictable and punishable, you could go with many spells in your deck and get rewarded by it or punished, it was your choice.
Look at that text wall, that thing is beautiful! Donald Trump would be proud!
Reason why me and a lot people i know never read nor give a sh** about those posts
I think the team is just struggling with the baggage from old expansions (even odd garbage, deathknights, highrolls) and fending off constant pressure from bean counters who have no clue what makes a good game but have an idea what sells. It mirrors what is going on in the film and music industry.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Free to try and find a game, dealing cards for sorrow, cards for pain.
This entire year has been almost not impactful cause of the insane power level of Frozen Throne and Kobolds.
The only cards that have been really impactful for the last 3 sets are Genn and Baku cause they allow you to cheat the mana curve somehow or you can just plain out make a hyper aggro archetype viable and then there is Zilliax cause he's like a tool-type minion where he's not terribly OP but he does work but offensively and defensively (Usually defensively) and is capable of activating multiple synergies on his own. Other than those no other card is actually impactful enough to make the cut right? Like yes some other cards from this year see play and are core to very succesful decks but none of them are nearly as impactful as Genn, Baku, Zilliax and the entire year of the Mammoth.
Hall of Flame exists for a reason, if RR cards are extremely poor due to the strength level of old cards, we don't have to suffer for 3 more months to see them quit the game, the algorithm for that is both cheap and easy to make it happen.
Who is that crybaby, salty boy again? Dear god, these salty posts for the UP 2018 expansions are more than the bricks that D. Trump needs to build his wall. I want to propose the hearthpwn admins a single-simple algorithm that queries for salty words the new topics and cuts them down before they come into existence.
The set itself is good. The problem are the older sets which are currently in the format.
Blizzard has been releasing weaker sets for the whole year. It is clear that a less crazy standard is the direction that they want to go in but for that to happen the older cards must rotate out first. This set will have its time to shine once the rotation happens.
I.......uh.......have no idea what you're trying to say with this string of words. Can you please elaborate?
You even complained about your opponent playing a Kobold Librarian at turn 1 and didn't even hesitate to upload it here.
You realize I was posting in the salt thread right? You realize that's a thread for illogical emotional complaining? If this thread is just meant to be that, perhaps you should post there instead. If you want a serious discussion, then let's do it, but leave salt thread posts out of it.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Life before death. Strength before weakness. Journey before destination.
Look at that text wall, that thing is beautiful! Donald Trump would be proud!
Our media in EU let us believe that Trump was the inventor of the wall... Thanks to Youtube and it's algorithm showed me an documentation about the wall... It was astounding to see, that this whole wall is already there...
Now I think that he wants to protect specific areas, where's a lot of traffic, am I right? I listened to an interview and he said, he wants the people to come through the door not above the wall... I mean, by all criticism, is that so wrong?
Look at that text wall, that thing is beautiful! Donald Trump would be proud!
Our media in EU let us believe that Trump was the inventor of the wall... Thanks to Youtube and it's algorithm showed me an documentation about the wall... It was astounding to see, that this whole wall is already there...
Now I think that he wants to protect specific areas, where's a lot of traffic, am I right? I listened to an interview and he said, he wants the people to come through the door not above the wall... I mean, by all criticism, is that so wrong?
The sixth expansion of each Standard cycle increases the size of the Standard card pool by about 10%. If Game Balance Yoda designed every card in the game, it would be reasonable to expect that the meta-game after the sixth expansion releases would be about 10% different from the meta-game which preceded it. Yoda doesn't work at Blizzard, but you get the idea . . .
According to HSReplays, Odd Mage, OTK Paladin and Clone Priest have combined play-rates of 10%. They each have win-rates between 52%-53%. Prior to RR, none of them existed. I suspect that counts for the "10% difference" between pre- and post-expansion meta-games.
The HS player base is pretty disengaged from the game they play - if the meta-game doesn't shift dramatically after a release, lots of people feel the need to bitch about it, regardless of whether the bitching is reasonable. It would be nifty if every expansion killed off old decks, and ushered in ten new decks in first and second tier. I suppose that Yoda has a lot of work to do.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
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I had said that I am out till next expansion due to Kingsbane and been back since it's gone, so when I had written that this is the least effective expansion ever, I was almost stoned to death by those who kept writing the same thing over and over again. 'This is the first week, wait 2 or 3 weeks you will see new decks emerging'. Let alone new decks there is nothing but hunters, who would guess that I might even miss Shudderwock Shaman.
So when someone claims something that might appear premature in the first sight, wait to reply to unprove what is stated instead of proposing counter arguments and try to get upvotes by your reply. So where are you now?
Here the main question to ask why this expansion is bad is very simple: What makes an expansion good? I tell you what. For instance, when MSoG released, new archetypes emerged. People tried to play decks that can only use one copy of each cards, the discover mechanic is so far the most successful mechanic since the release and it is good for both reasons: first, it is different in each game, which makes it fun to play, and second it is not 100% RNG since it allows you to choose a card that you can either benefit or get punished by it. People created Jade decks - though jade idol was broken till Geist - it was something novel. Introducing even & odd decks are also successful since we saw some of the cards that we thought would never included in any decks normally. Rush is another good mechanic that is introduced since the immediate effect of a card is usually what we want which is the current problem with overkill unless it is a rush minion, and also doesn't have an additive effect for 'just going face decks'. When it comes to Rasthakan, I was hopeful at first glance, spirit cards, Loas which sound like exciting but turned out to be disappointing. I am F2P and usually I do have only 1 deck type that I can play after I manage to earn through arena rewards. Since I wanted to try pirate rogue, which is no way close to being an brainless aggro deck like in turn 5 pirate warrior era, there are some synergistic cards that worth to give a shot, but the results are absolutely terrible, not only because you can usually have a few pirates on the board - thanks to every class having AoEs - that makes Cannon Barage awful, but also you have almost no way to comeback once you lost the board and can't pressure your opponent fast enough which makes odd rogue inevitably superior. I can write an example of each class like that but I am certain that is sufficient to make the point. Apart from standard, Arena is super boring for nowadays, because it is just playing minions over and over again that you just trade and hit face with the remaining ones, I had never complained about RNG in Arena before as it was on of the most important parameter that made Arena somehow exciting and frustrating, which makes the moves unpredictable and punishable, you could go with many spells in your deck and get rewarded by it or punished, it was your choice.
Lastly, someone will surely claim that the RR will be valuable with the introduction of new cards & mechanics, but what is the point of playing the new expansion then? We can just wait 6 months and they can release 2 expansions at once. I am sure Team 5 is at least capable of doing that. Unless we give the right negative feedback, the game will never develop as we want, because the HS players are the ones who declare whether the meta is balanced or extremely boring, not Blizzard.
Yeah overkill was kind of disappointing, the shrines are pretty boring too. Better luck next time I guess
Look at that text wall, that thing is beautiful! Donald Trump would be proud!
Seriously though, anything reasonably balanced wouldn't change a thing after the insanely op cards we got last year. So yeah every RR card seems like dogshit. They took a design choice to tone things down. A choice which i agree with. Now as long as they won't go back to their word AGAIN, and keep this powerlevel in the future expansions as well, then a new life will be added to the game. Till then patience my padawan.
In any given expansion, a few cards will become meta staples. A bunch of cards will be fun to play around with but not actually competitively viable except in a few cases. And most cards will never see play because they're garbage. This is true for every card game, not just Hearthstone. The closer an expansion is released after a rotation, the more impact it will have. I suspect this is why you rate MSOG so highly - if I recall correctly, wasn't it the second expansion of the set year?
So just to counter your claim that RR was unsuccessful, here are cards that are seeing regular competitive play because they're good cards:
I haven't played ladder in since the beginning of the month, so I'm not entirely sure what's being played in Shaman or Warrior. This is largely based on my experience earlier and in watching recent streams of top players. Based on the numbers, it seems RR was just about as impactful as any other expansion.
Kaladin's RoS Set Review
Join me at Out of Cards!
Reason why me and a lot people i know never read nor give a sh** about those posts
Tl;dr, everything from last year is on an insane power level so rastakhan cards didn't work out that well. the end
I think the team is just struggling with the baggage from old expansions (even odd garbage, deathknights, highrolls) and fending off constant pressure from bean counters who have no clue what makes a good game but have an idea what sells. It mirrors what is going on in the film and music industry.
Free to try and find a game, dealing cards for sorrow, cards for pain.
I am devastated by that.
This entire year has been almost not impactful cause of the insane power level of Frozen Throne and Kobolds.
The only cards that have been really impactful for the last 3 sets are Genn and Baku cause they allow you to cheat the mana curve somehow or you can just plain out make a hyper aggro archetype viable and then there is Zilliax cause he's like a tool-type minion where he's not terribly OP but he does work but offensively and defensively (Usually defensively) and is capable of activating multiple synergies on his own. Other than those no other card is actually impactful enough to make the cut right? Like yes some other cards from this year see play and are core to very succesful decks but none of them are nearly as impactful as Genn, Baku, Zilliax and the entire year of the Mammoth.
So you can also counter claims instead of wishing to 'playing around' cards, you know the expansion brings 135 new cards.
Hall of Flame exists for a reason, if RR cards are extremely poor due to the strength level of old cards, we don't have to suffer for 3 more months to see them quit the game, the algorithm for that is both cheap and easy to make it happen.
I.......uh.......have no idea what you're trying to say with this string of words. Can you please elaborate?
Kaladin's RoS Set Review
Join me at Out of Cards!
Who is that crybaby, salty boy again? Dear god, these salty posts for the UP 2018 expansions are more than the bricks that D. Trump needs to build his wall. I want to propose the hearthpwn admins a single-simple algorithm that queries for salty words the new topics and cuts them down before they come into existence.
You even complained about your opponent playing a Kobold Librarian at turn 1 and didn't even hesitate to upload it here.
The set itself is good. The problem are the older sets which are currently in the format.
Blizzard has been releasing weaker sets for the whole year. It is clear that a less crazy standard is the direction that they want to go in but for that to happen the older cards must rotate out first. This set will have its time to shine once the rotation happens.
You realize I was posting in the salt thread right? You realize that's a thread for illogical emotional complaining? If this thread is just meant to be that, perhaps you should post there instead. If you want a serious discussion, then let's do it, but leave salt thread posts out of it.
Kaladin's RoS Set Review
Join me at Out of Cards!
Our media in EU let us believe that Trump was the inventor of the wall... Thanks to Youtube and it's algorithm showed me an documentation about the wall... It was astounding to see, that this whole wall is already there...
Now I think that he wants to protect specific areas, where's a lot of traffic, am I right? I listened to an interview and he said, he wants the people to come through the door not above the wall... I mean, by all criticism, is that so wrong?
Give this man a troll metal. Best troll of 2018
So your problem with arena is that the RNG in the draft is no longer compensating so heavily for shitty play? Cry me river.
Hmmm . . .
The sixth expansion of each Standard cycle increases the size of the Standard card pool by about 10%. If Game Balance Yoda designed every card in the game, it would be reasonable to expect that the meta-game after the sixth expansion releases would be about 10% different from the meta-game which preceded it. Yoda doesn't work at Blizzard, but you get the idea . . .
According to HSReplays, Odd Mage, OTK Paladin and Clone Priest have combined play-rates of 10%. They each have win-rates between 52%-53%. Prior to RR, none of them existed. I suspect that counts for the "10% difference" between pre- and post-expansion meta-games.
The HS player base is pretty disengaged from the game they play - if the meta-game doesn't shift dramatically after a release, lots of people feel the need to bitch about it, regardless of whether the bitching is reasonable. It would be nifty if every expansion killed off old decks, and ushered in ten new decks in first and second tier. I suppose that Yoda has a lot of work to do.