Well the expansion isn't quite out yet and we've only had limited testing of Inspire in the Brawl so far. But I was wondering what people's opinions on Maiden of the Lake were. So-far I like her, she has enough life to generally stick around a bit if played on curve, and can equal a good amount of value if she can survive a few turns.
Compared with Fencing coach. 1 mana cheaper (3 instead of 4), garbage stats, but a battlecry that gives an immediate 2 mana discount to the next hero power used. While some people may try to run both in inspire decks, I'm wondering if one will end up being favoured over the other. There are pros and cons of each, so I wonder what everyone's thoughts are on this.
Fencing Coach is much, much more versatile can be played early and always generates advantage. That card alone can make some inspire cards worthwile. Playing this on 3, and then inspire card on 4 + hero power.
Fencing coach is obviously more appropriate as a "combo" card, that you use one or a few turns early, expecting to use your hero power for (0) the turn you summon "the" big inspire minion in your deck. Two cards seem to benefit from this the most : Wilfred & Confessor Paletress. The reason Fencing Coach is almost essential in order to maximize the value you get from these cards, is because without it, they're basically trash. Wilfred is slower than dirt, and Paletress won't probably live more than a turn, so might as well hero power the turn you summon her. And double legendary on turn for 7 mana can potentially be mega-value. I wouldn't say Fencing Coach makes these cards great, because they are obviously too gimmicky and not solid enough to be worth building a deck around, but it makes them playable. Still, I have no clue where to put either of them in one of the current decks - we may have to build other ones, more appropriate to they play-style.
Maiden of the lake... is good in a slow meta. I think tavern brawn - aside from exposing us to terrible decks filled with lotsa terrible things - was meant to give us a vision of what games would look like (pace-wise) in the slower meta TGT is meant to bring. And Maiden of the lake seems to thrive in this "habitat", if you will. 4 mana 2/6 is quite bad offensive wise, but it's solid, and since what you mainly want from this card, is for it to stay alive, it's okay. Obviously, in a slow meta, this card could be a central piece to inspire decks. What's left to see is, "will the meta slow down enough" for it to be competitive ?
Overall, I'd say both have their use, but Fencing coach might fit in better in decks such as priest deck, that have a naturally slower pace to them, all the while Maiden of the Lake really needs the meta to slow down to be a competitive drop on the 4th turn.
I can see coach being useful on occasion, like part of a 2 turn combo. The best example would be using it in a priest deck with the new priest legendary. Play it turn 6 then drop the legendary turn 7 and get the proc off it. Whereas maiden imo is just great all around lol. There been many a time where a 1 mana hero power would have helped turn things.
I pretty much agree on all points. While Fencing Coach is strongest when setting up a BIG inspire combo, I still think he holds good value in a deck that uses inspire a lot, but probably not as good as Maiden in this regard. My guess is 2 maidens and 1 fencing coach may be the standard in inspire based decks.
Definitely maiden over coach. Maiden has on-par stats for her cost, whole coach doesn't. That will end up being the deciding factor.
I am not so certain about this. Coach I think will generate more temp for a moderate tempo loss. Maiden on the other hand has sticky stats, not "good" ones. Coach is also more of a guarantee in value as you can always take advantage of his ability when you need too, maiden is just as likely to die before you can really utilize her unless played on turn 5.
This isn't to say maiden isn't good. She is very good. Her stats are sticky enough that she represents a an annoyance to kill that some players may not see worth their time. If you can keep her out more than a few turns she is better than fencing coach, but if you can't and because she doesn't trade up she could just die for free.
Inspire in general will have a hard time against deck that can effectively control the board for cheap. For instance I think zoo will give inspire decks a very hard time. Actual control decks should be a interesting match up. On one hand I see them not wanting to waste precious combo and removal options on things like Maiden of the Lake, on the other they will soon realize that they have too. Which may allow you to have enough inspire minions and end up tempoing them out with ghost minions from inspire mechanics.
Coach is more versatile—you can use him in non-inspire decks, for example as part of an OTK combo in shadowpriest (i.e. Prophet Velen, Mind Blast x2, then hero power, for a total of 24-26 damage depending on how many times you've used Shadowform) or to ensure turn-6 value from Wilfred Fizzlebang. I see Coach being a staple in shadowpriest, actually, as he really reduces the tempo burden of playing Shadowform.
I've been really impressed by Maiden in this week's brawl, though. For some classes (mage, paladin, shaman), she's a pretty decent turn 5 play all by herself. Getting 3/7 or 2/8 total stats for 5 mana, or a 2/6 body that deals 1 damage, isn't good, but it's usually acceptable. If she survives to the next turn and you can get an inspire minion or a Garrison Commander or something down, she's suddenly extremely potent—and a 2/6 is not easy to remove on turn 4 or 5, not without trading in multiple small minions or spending serious removal. And you can get pretty solid same-turn value playing her together with other combo pieces in the late game (Fallen Hero + Commander + Maiden for two 2-damage ping and a fairly sturdy board). Looking forward to seeing her teamed up with Emperor Thaurissan.
Fencing Coach is much better when it comes to activating a whole board of minions with Inspire as you play Fencing Coach first then maximize the board next turn and use your free hero power.
Maiden of the Lake is much better for the long run of the game as the safest way is to play Maiden of the Lake followed by your Hero Power to inspire the minions you have on board.
The problem I see with Maiden Of The Lake is that she doesn't really make your hero power become more effective. She just lets you do something else in addition. The inspire mechanic is already a combo piece, and she mainly works as a card that makes *other* combos more efficient or effective. Giving a player a coin, basically, every turn may or may not be useful depending on what options are in your hand. To get her full power, you have to play something that gives you multiple usage of your hero power, and then some things that have a useful inspire benefit in addition.
You need a full board of interlocking inspiration cards to get the most value from her. Her large body helps her live a turn or two to try and establish that board but whether your deck can feed you the cards you need *and* your opponent plays things that let you pursue your combo mostly unhindered is a different question.
Granted that the tavern brawl decks are far from being "tuned", she still had very little impact on the matches where I've put her in play. Maybe a deck with a lot of one-mana spells that take advantage of that "virtual coin" every turn would benefit from her ability.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
Well the expansion isn't quite out yet and we've only had limited testing of Inspire in the Brawl so far. But I was wondering what people's opinions on Maiden of the Lake were. So-far I like her, she has enough life to generally stick around a bit if played on curve, and can equal a good amount of value if she can survive a few turns.
Compared with Fencing coach. 1 mana cheaper (3 instead of 4), garbage stats, but a battlecry that gives an immediate 2 mana discount to the next hero power used. While some people may try to run both in inspire decks, I'm wondering if one will end up being favoured over the other. There are pros and cons of each, so I wonder what everyone's thoughts are on this.
Fencing Coach is much, much more versatile can be played early and always generates advantage. That card alone can make some inspire cards worthwile. Playing this on 3, and then inspire card on 4 + hero power.
Definitely maiden over coach. Maiden has on-par stats for her cost, whole coach doesn't. That will end up being the deciding factor.
But you can play an inspire minion and get the effect on mana curve from that point out
Fencing coach is obviously more appropriate as a "combo" card, that you use one or a few turns early, expecting to use your hero power for (0) the turn you summon "the" big inspire minion in your deck. Two cards seem to benefit from this the most : Wilfred & Confessor Paletress. The reason Fencing Coach is almost essential in order to maximize the value you get from these cards, is because without it, they're basically trash. Wilfred is slower than dirt, and Paletress won't probably live more than a turn, so might as well hero power the turn you summon her. And double legendary on turn for 7 mana can potentially be mega-value. I wouldn't say Fencing Coach makes these cards great, because they are obviously too gimmicky and not solid enough to be worth building a deck around, but it makes them playable. Still, I have no clue where to put either of them in one of the current decks - we may have to build other ones, more appropriate to they play-style.
Maiden of the lake... is good in a slow meta. I think tavern brawn - aside from exposing us to terrible decks filled with lotsa terrible things - was meant to give us a vision of what games would look like (pace-wise) in the slower meta TGT is meant to bring. And Maiden of the lake seems to thrive in this "habitat", if you will. 4 mana 2/6 is quite bad offensive wise, but it's solid, and since what you mainly want from this card, is for it to stay alive, it's okay. Obviously, in a slow meta, this card could be a central piece to inspire decks. What's left to see is, "will the meta slow down enough" for it to be competitive ?
Overall, I'd say both have their use, but Fencing coach might fit in better in decks such as priest deck, that have a naturally slower pace to them, all the while Maiden of the Lake really needs the meta to slow down to be a competitive drop on the 4th turn.
"My life... for Aiùr."
I can see coach being useful on occasion, like part of a 2 turn combo. The best example would be using it in a priest deck with the new priest legendary. Play it turn 6 then drop the legendary turn 7 and get the proc off it. Whereas maiden imo is just great all around lol. There been many a time where a 1 mana hero power would have helped turn things.
I pretty much agree on all points. While Fencing Coach is strongest when setting up a BIG inspire combo, I still think he holds good value in a deck that uses inspire a lot, but probably not as good as Maiden in this regard. My guess is 2 maidens and 1 fencing coach may be the standard in inspire based decks.
I am not so certain about this. Coach I think will generate more temp for a moderate tempo loss. Maiden on the other hand has sticky stats, not "good" ones. Coach is also more of a guarantee in value as you can always take advantage of his ability when you need too, maiden is just as likely to die before you can really utilize her unless played on turn 5.
This isn't to say maiden isn't good. She is very good. Her stats are sticky enough that she represents a an annoyance to kill that some players may not see worth their time. If you can keep her out more than a few turns she is better than fencing coach, but if you can't and because she doesn't trade up she could just die for free.
Inspire in general will have a hard time against deck that can effectively control the board for cheap. For instance I think zoo will give inspire decks a very hard time. Actual control decks should be a interesting match up. On one hand I see them not wanting to waste precious combo and removal options on things like Maiden of the Lake, on the other they will soon realize that they have too. Which may allow you to have enough inspire minions and end up tempoing them out with ghost minions from inspire mechanics.
Coach is more versatile—you can use him in non-inspire decks, for example as part of an OTK combo in shadowpriest (i.e. Prophet Velen, Mind Blast x2, then hero power, for a total of 24-26 damage depending on how many times you've used Shadowform) or to ensure turn-6 value from Wilfred Fizzlebang. I see Coach being a staple in shadowpriest, actually, as he really reduces the tempo burden of playing Shadowform.
I've been really impressed by Maiden in this week's brawl, though. For some classes (mage, paladin, shaman), she's a pretty decent turn 5 play all by herself. Getting 3/7 or 2/8 total stats for 5 mana, or a 2/6 body that deals 1 damage, isn't good, but it's usually acceptable. If she survives to the next turn and you can get an inspire minion or a Garrison Commander or something down, she's suddenly extremely potent—and a 2/6 is not easy to remove on turn 4 or 5, not without trading in multiple small minions or spending serious removal. And you can get pretty solid same-turn value playing her together with other combo pieces in the late game (Fallen Hero + Commander + Maiden for two 2-damage ping and a fairly sturdy board). Looking forward to seeing her teamed up with Emperor Thaurissan.
Fencing Coach is much better when it comes to activating a whole board of minions with Inspire as you play Fencing Coach first then maximize the board next turn and use your free hero power.
Maiden of the Lake is much better for the long run of the game as the safest way is to play Maiden of the Lake followed by your Hero Power to inspire the minions you have on board.
The problem I see with Maiden Of The Lake is that she doesn't really make your hero power become more effective. She just lets you do something else in addition. The inspire mechanic is already a combo piece, and she mainly works as a card that makes *other* combos more efficient or effective. Giving a player a coin, basically, every turn may or may not be useful depending on what options are in your hand. To get her full power, you have to play something that gives you multiple usage of your hero power, and then some things that have a useful inspire benefit in addition.
You need a full board of interlocking inspiration cards to get the most value from her. Her large body helps her live a turn or two to try and establish that board but whether your deck can feed you the cards you need *and* your opponent plays things that let you pursue your combo mostly unhindered is a different question.
Granted that the tavern brawl decks are far from being "tuned", she still had very little impact on the matches where I've put her in play. Maybe a deck with a lot of one-mana spells that take advantage of that "virtual coin" every turn would benefit from her ability.