Yeah, because decks that take advantage of the beast tag are overflowing the ladder. A stegodon is nothing but a 2/6 taunt. This card is a 2/6 taunt also, with the caveat that it will almost always be *at least* a 12/6 taunt when it's played. There is no way a stegodon would ever get to that level. You would NEVER play this card on turn 4 unless it was desperate, and then it functions exactly as a stegodon.
Yeah, because decks that take advantage of the beast tag are overflowing the ladder. A stegodon is nothing but a 2/6 taunt. This card is a 2/6 taunt also, with the caveat that it will almost always be *at least* a 12/6 taunt when it's played. There is no way a stegodon would ever get to that level. You would NEVER play this card on turn 4 unless it was desperate, and then it functions exactly as a stegodon.
Which is why this will never see competitive play. Put it another way - if this were a 10-mana 12/6 Taunt that refreshed 6-mana as a battlecry, would it see play? The answer is no it wouldn't.
You can't really talk about the mana cost if you're not willing to play it on 4 most of the time.
Again, it would almost never be a 6 health minion on turn 10 all by its lonesome. I strongly believe you all are doing what most people who judge early cards do where they consider whether they fit in existing meta decks by themselves instead of thinking how you could adjust a deck to make it work, which is how the true meta decks that last are made.
It all depends on the rest of the cards, but writing it off this early is simply silly.
I can only evaluate cards based on the knowledge available and my experience with past expansions. That's how I'm making my assessment.
My challenge to you then is to come up with a few cards that could possibly be released that would make this card really strong, and then ask yourself how likely such a card is to be created (is it way stronger than anything they've ever released? is it far too specific? etc etc).
It's not on me to offer absolutely no criticism of leaked cards on the basis of "well you don't know all the cards yet! it might be good!"
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My point is that it's already good in certain decks without any more new cards, but you clearly disagree so all we can do is kick back and see who is right. I'll have you know that if I'm wrong you won't get any satisfaction, because I will pretend I never posted on this forum and disappear.
My point is that it's already good in certain decks without any more new cards, but you clearly disagree so all we can do is kick back and see who is right. I'll have you know that if I'm wrong you won't get any satisfaction, because I will pretend I never posted on this forum and disappear.
Oh? Which decks would this go into and what cards would it replace? No one has yet answered that for me.
Yeah, because decks that take advantage of the beast tag are overflowing the ladder. A stegodon is nothing but a 2/6 taunt. This card is a 2/6 taunt also, with the caveat that it will almost always be *at least* a 12/6 taunt when it's played. There is no way a stegodon would ever get to that level. You would NEVER play this card on turn 4 unless it was desperate, and then it functions exactly as a stegodon.
Which is why this will never see competitive play. Put it another way - if this were a 10-mana 12/6 Taunt that refreshed 6-mana as a battlecry, would it see play? The answer is no it wouldn't.
You can't really talk about the mana cost if you're not willing to play it on 4 most of the time.
So basically Kun, the Forgotten King with better stats and a taunt, with the minor caveat of not quite regaining all the mana (which you yourself said didnt matter at turn 10 onwards).
Because Kun never sees play. Like, ever. A card that is even better than him totally wouldnt.... 🧐
Yeah, because decks that take advantage of the beast tag are overflowing the ladder. A stegodon is nothing but a 2/6 taunt. This card is a 2/6 taunt also, with the caveat that it will almost always be *at least* a 12/6 taunt when it's played. There is no way a stegodon would ever get to that level. You would NEVER play this card on turn 4 unless it was desperate, and then it functions exactly as a stegodon.
Which is why this will never see competitive play. Put it another way - if this were a 10-mana 12/6 Taunt that refreshed 6-mana as a battlecry, would it see play? The answer is no it wouldn't.
You can't really talk about the mana cost if you're not willing to play it on 4 most of the time.
So basically Kun, the Forgotten King with better stats and a taunt, with the minor caveat of not quite regaining all the mana (which you yourself said didnt matter at turn 10 onwards).
Because Kun never sees play. Like, ever. A card that is even better than him totally wouldnt.... 🧐
Kun ONLY sees play because it combos with Aviana, and by extension, Aviana ONLY sees play because it combos with Kun.
This combos with nothing. It's a Stegodon most of the time, and a pile of stats on turn 10. Pile of stats usually do not win games and do not see play on ladder in serious decks.
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I’ve seen pleeenty of combo decks that play Aviana without Kun. And at least a few the other way around. As for ‘piles of stats’, Are you really trying to claim that a 0-mana 7/7 isnt any good now? Lets look back at Hooked Reaver and Flamewreathed Faceless for reference on this one
But you seem to think that a card has to be able to combo off something else to be considered good. It doesnt. Ultimate Infestation is a card that doesnt require a combo for example, and few would be naive enough to claim that card isnt good
This card is good both in a vacuum as well as in a deck that synergises well with it. Big Druid has been offered as an excellent alternative deck for example. And in this instance, Shudderwock is another one.
I'm saying this card isn't competitive. I'm saying a Stegodon that is sometimes a dead card isn't competitive. I'm saying a Stegodon that is sometimes a dead card that has no other synergy isn't competitive. I'm saying a Stegodon that is sometimes a dead card that has no other synergy and is a big ol' pile of stats and doesn't interact with the board in any other way isn't competitive.
What CURRENT decks would this go into and what cards would it replace? In Paladin where you could throw a Spikeridged Steed on it, it's sort of just a worse Lynessa (who isn't even that great tbh).
edit: This is absolutely counter to what Big Druid wants to do (what card is this BETTER than in Big Druid????) Shudderwock doesn't care about getting additional attack, have you even played Shudderwock before? The win condition is the combo usually, not a board full of Shudderwocks.
They might as well release it as a druid card since its the only class that will use it properly cause druids 10 mana turn is usually a turn 7 or 8. But i reckon that a silence would automatically be played at it. Considering its an epic card i would say its a very situational crappy overcosted card
Scorpyon, look at a similar card - Midnight Drake. High attack, low health. Did this see competitive play?
Thats the most awful comparison ever. It is nothing like that card at all!
6 health is much harder to remove than 4. And that card doesnt have taunt. AND it’s ability is heavily dependant on a hard-to-meet criteria.
Are you seriously saying that at ten mana you think this would be a better choice than Omega Defender?
To answer your previous comment, this thread was about Shudderwock. I dont feel like goong through every deck to determine what card this would replace.
But the key point you seem to repeatedly be missing is that this is not a card designed for ending the game (although it could easily do that). The key to beat Shudderwock is to hit with tempo and beat down beforr the combo arrives. The key to surviving this for Shudderwock is to throw up as many taunts and board clears as possible this fits that narrative perfectly. The fact that Wock picks up that battlecry on top of this is mere icin on the cake and provides a possible second win condition in the event that the battlecry order goes bad .
Trying to get through a 6-health taunt which will likely kill anything you hit it with is extremely valuable for this deck.
6-health is indeed harder to deal with...............on turn 4. On turn 10 it's laughable. There's a reason you go with 5/10 Taunt and not 10/5 when you play Ancient of War. In the late game, high attack low health minions (THAT ALSO DON'T DO ANYTHING ON THE TURN YOU PLAY THEM) are meaningless in every scenario that isn't two players in topdeck mode. I daresay that Soggoth the Slitherer is a better late game taunt than this. What turn 10 combo are you planning on pulling off with this?
So let's talk about Shudderwock. What card(s) are you taking out to include this in? Why is this card better than some other Taunt that you could run (but currently are not)?
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6-health is indeed harder to deal with...............on turn 4. On turn 10 it's laughable. There's a reason you go with 5/10 Taunt and not 10/5 when you play Ancient of War. In the late game, high attack low health minions (THAT ALSO DON'T DO ANYTHING ON THE TURN YOU PLAY THEM) are meaningless in every scenario that isn't two players in topdeck mode. I daresay that Soggoth the Slitherer is a better late game taunt than this. What turn 10 combo are you planning on pulling off with this?
So let's talk about Shudderwock. What card(s) are you taking out to include this in? Why is this card better than some other Taunt that you could run (but currently are not)?
If you're running this card as a valuable 10 drop, you're doing it wrong. The point of the card is that it's a 4 drop Taunt, and it happens to get a huge upgrade if you don't draw it or end up playing it before you have 10 mana. It's not better than any other big card, even an Ultrasaur on turn 10 if you're topdecking, but it's miles better than any one of them on turn 4 since it's playable, and that's why you would run the card. It naturally helps you stall out the game in slow decks, and then rewards you for slowing down the game, giving you an extra bonus for running a combo deck or ramp druid or whatever you're playing that wants to get to 10 mana anyway. It's a Stegodon, but instead of having its possible impact on the board flatline by turn 10, this spikes back up to a 4 mana 12/6 on turn 10, which means you can play it alongside other cards like board clears and removal. If you happen to play two of these on turn 10 and even just Hero Power, does that in any way sound better than Soggoth the Slitherer? Or would you rather have a 5/9 than two 12/6's?
As for Shudderwock deck techs, it depends on the post-expansion meta. I'd say that there's ~25 must have cards in the deck at the moment and ~5 slots for tech options, so it would simply be a tech card you run if you want more insurance in case the combo fails, without having to run an otherwise useless Murmuring Elemental. If there's a highly midrange meta where both stopping early game aggression and having value in the late game are useful in most of your games, that is where Omega Defender, and probably all of the Omega Projects, will shine.
If you have found all the pieces of the Shudderwock combo unless you are quite unlucky you have won the game. Omega defender will not increase the chances to win
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Yeah, because decks that take advantage of the beast tag are overflowing the ladder. A stegodon is nothing but a 2/6 taunt. This card is a 2/6 taunt also, with the caveat that it will almost always be *at least* a 12/6 taunt when it's played. There is no way a stegodon would ever get to that level. You would NEVER play this card on turn 4 unless it was desperate, and then it functions exactly as a stegodon.
Which is why this will never see competitive play. Put it another way - if this were a 10-mana 12/6 Taunt that refreshed 6-mana as a battlecry, would it see play? The answer is no it wouldn't.
You can't really talk about the mana cost if you're not willing to play it on 4 most of the time.
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I don't think a 6-health minion that comes down turn 10 in anything other than Druid is worth considering in constructed.
Busted in arena tho
I tried having fun once. It was awful.
Again, it would almost never be a 6 health minion on turn 10 all by its lonesome. I strongly believe you all are doing what most people who judge early cards do where they consider whether they fit in existing meta decks by themselves instead of thinking how you could adjust a deck to make it work, which is how the true meta decks that last are made.
It all depends on the rest of the cards, but writing it off this early is simply silly.
I can only evaluate cards based on the knowledge available and my experience with past expansions. That's how I'm making my assessment.
My challenge to you then is to come up with a few cards that could possibly be released that would make this card really strong, and then ask yourself how likely such a card is to be created (is it way stronger than anything they've ever released? is it far too specific? etc etc).
It's not on me to offer absolutely no criticism of leaked cards on the basis of "well you don't know all the cards yet! it might be good!"
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My point is that it's already good in certain decks without any more new cards, but you clearly disagree so all we can do is kick back and see who is right. I'll have you know that if I'm wrong you won't get any satisfaction, because I will pretend I never posted on this forum and disappear.
Oh? Which decks would this go into and what cards would it replace? No one has yet answered that for me.
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At 4 mana, you have better plays, and the same goes at 10 mana.
Not useless, but i can hardly see it as something more than a deck filler.
And tbh, i have seen more spectacular memes.
But maybe other omega cards are versatile enough to win a spot in decks.
Also, it looks good for Arena purposes.
What about Meat Wagon synergy?
“Let your plans be dark and impenetrable as night, and when you move, fall like a thunderbolt.”
So basically Kun, the Forgotten King with better stats and a taunt, with the minor caveat of not quite regaining all the mana (which you yourself said didnt matter at turn 10 onwards).
Because Kun never sees play. Like, ever. A card that is even better than him totally wouldnt.... 🧐
For those who dont think that the Shudderwock combo fails very often, I give you this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ioomH3-qmdU
Shudderwock mirror match. Where both Shudderwock combos get played. And both fail! Haha! :-)
Kun ONLY sees play because it combos with Aviana, and by extension, Aviana ONLY sees play because it combos with Kun.
This combos with nothing. It's a Stegodon most of the time, and a pile of stats on turn 10. Pile of stats usually do not win games and do not see play on ladder in serious decks.
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I’ve seen pleeenty of combo decks that play Aviana without Kun. And at least a few the other way around. As for ‘piles of stats’, Are you really trying to claim that a 0-mana 7/7 isnt any good now? Lets look back at Hooked Reaver and Flamewreathed Faceless for reference on this one
But you seem to think that a card has to be able to combo off something else to be considered good. It doesnt. Ultimate Infestation is a card that doesnt require a combo for example, and few would be naive enough to claim that card isnt good
This card is good both in a vacuum as well as in a deck that synergises well with it. Big Druid has been offered as an excellent alternative deck for example. And in this instance, Shudderwock is another one.
I'm saying this card isn't competitive. I'm saying a Stegodon that is sometimes a dead card isn't competitive. I'm saying a Stegodon that is sometimes a dead card that has no other synergy isn't competitive. I'm saying a Stegodon that is sometimes a dead card that has no other synergy and is a big ol' pile of stats and doesn't interact with the board in any other way isn't competitive.
What CURRENT decks would this go into and what cards would it replace? In Paladin where you could throw a Spikeridged Steed on it, it's sort of just a worse Lynessa (who isn't even that great tbh).
edit: This is absolutely counter to what Big Druid wants to do (what card is this BETTER than in Big Druid????) Shudderwock doesn't care about getting additional attack, have you even played Shudderwock before? The win condition is the combo usually, not a board full of Shudderwocks.
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They might as well release it as a druid card since its the only class that will use it properly cause druids 10 mana turn is usually a turn 7 or 8. But i reckon that a silence would automatically be played at it. Considering its an epic card i would say its a very situational crappy overcosted card
Scorpyon, look at a similar card - Midnight Drake. High attack, low health. Did this see competitive play?
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Thats the most awful comparison ever. It is nothing like that card at all!
6 health is much harder to remove than 4. And that card doesnt have taunt. AND it’s ability is heavily dependant on a hard-to-meet criteria.
Are you seriously saying that at ten mana you think this would be a better choice than Omega Defender?
To answer your previous comment, this thread was about Shudderwock. I dont feel like goong through every deck to determine what card this would replace.
But the key point you seem to repeatedly be missing is that this is not a card designed for ending the game (although it could easily do that). The key to beat Shudderwock is to hit with tempo and beat down beforr the combo arrives. The key to surviving this for Shudderwock is to throw up as many taunts and board clears as possible this fits that narrative perfectly. The fact that Wock picks up that battlecry on top of this is mere icin on the cake and provides a possible second win condition in the event that the battlecry order goes bad .
Trying to get through a 6-health taunt which will likely kill anything you hit it with is extremely valuable for this deck.
6-health is indeed harder to deal with...............on turn 4. On turn 10 it's laughable. There's a reason you go with 5/10 Taunt and not 10/5 when you play Ancient of War. In the late game, high attack low health minions (THAT ALSO DON'T DO ANYTHING ON THE TURN YOU PLAY THEM) are meaningless in every scenario that isn't two players in topdeck mode. I daresay that Soggoth the Slitherer is a better late game taunt than this. What turn 10 combo are you planning on pulling off with this?
So let's talk about Shudderwock. What card(s) are you taking out to include this in? Why is this card better than some other Taunt that you could run (but currently are not)?
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If you're running this card as a valuable 10 drop, you're doing it wrong. The point of the card is that it's a 4 drop Taunt, and it happens to get a huge upgrade if you don't draw it or end up playing it before you have 10 mana. It's not better than any other big card, even an Ultrasaur on turn 10 if you're topdecking, but it's miles better than any one of them on turn 4 since it's playable, and that's why you would run the card. It naturally helps you stall out the game in slow decks, and then rewards you for slowing down the game, giving you an extra bonus for running a combo deck or ramp druid or whatever you're playing that wants to get to 10 mana anyway. It's a Stegodon, but instead of having its possible impact on the board flatline by turn 10, this spikes back up to a 4 mana 12/6 on turn 10, which means you can play it alongside other cards like board clears and removal. If you happen to play two of these on turn 10 and even just Hero Power, does that in any way sound better than Soggoth the Slitherer? Or would you rather have a 5/9 than two 12/6's?
As for Shudderwock deck techs, it depends on the post-expansion meta. I'd say that there's ~25 must have cards in the deck at the moment and ~5 slots for tech options, so it would simply be a tech card you run if you want more insurance in case the combo fails, without having to run an otherwise useless Murmuring Elemental. If there's a highly midrange meta where both stopping early game aggression and having value in the late game are useful in most of your games, that is where Omega Defender, and probably all of the Omega Projects, will shine.
If you have found all the pieces of the Shudderwock combo unless you are quite unlucky you have won the game. Omega defender will not increase the chances to win
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