Man running this deck currently and it really is pretty easy to play and does well against almost the whole meta except rogue and you can high roll bad matchups maybe a third of the time
What are you talking about? Rogue is it's best mu.
Not even close. Warrior is its best matchup, it has about a 57% winrate against rogue and 70-80 vs warrior.
It's countered by aggro builds. Highlander Rogue does ok against it at around 54% loss rate, but the counters are aggro pally/sham, zoolock, highlander hunter, and rezpriest because it pulls out more big crap than they can deal with.
I was just thinking about this not as much that it’s straight broken but, it almost feels like they didn’t think about some of the interactions. Like a 10/6 Leeroy for 7 mana is insane. Similar thoughts with witching hour and winged guardian. Like I know warrior can drop a 10/6 leeroy but, that requires 5 cards, a lot of mana, and some luck
Blizzard didn't think of some of the interactions? That's impossible! They're always careful about this sort of thing, like with this week's pogo brawl.
I was just thinking about this not as much that it’s straight broken but, it almost feels like they didn’t think about some of the interactions. Like a 10/6 Leeroy for 7 mana is insane. Similar thoughts with witching hour and winged guardian. Like I know warrior can drop a 10/6 leeroy but, that requires 5 cards, a lot of mana, and some luck
It’s far cause you may not get it or certain cards that cost more to play.its a gamble and a fair trade off. Plus it takes up a slot or 2 depending on how many you include.
Extra Arms got nerfed back to 3 mana because 2 mana for +2/+2 was deemed to OP. With Embiggen, you literally pay +1 extra mana per minion for the same buff. And miss me with that "but it messes up the curve" bullcrap. The winrates clearly show what's up.
Embiggen is just fundamentally unfair and anyone defending it is currently climbing hard with it and hoping it doesn't get nerfed.
It’s far cause you may not get it or certain cards that cost more to play.its a gamble and a fair trade off. Plus it takes up a slot or 2 depending on how many you include.
Every card you put in your deck takes up a slot. That’s not a trade off. Same for “you may not get it.” Goes for every card.
Yes indeed. Turn 1 Embiggen doesn't change much on it's own, but it prevents someone from playing it along with Strength in Numbers. Drawing Embiggen at the start of Turn 2 probably would take your whole turn to play it, and that matters.
Even a single mana cost increase means it's a lot harder to Embiggen and do something else, and that would matter.
Druid doesn't has the tempo Keleseth Rogue or Warrior has. The problem with keleseth Rogue was the capability of putting strong minions on board and killing yours at the same time because of backstab, preparation > evicerate and Vilespine Slayer. Warrior still had 1 mana Execute and Shield Slam and Rush Minions.
Druid mostly plays big things that don't do much if you can remove them. It is still strong and it can overwhelm you eventually, but not as fast as Rogue or Warrior. Other Keleseth decks were not as good, at least not fro mthe top of my mind.
It's unfair and gives value much above its cost. And you may ask why it didn't have high winrate before Winged Guardian. The answer is that the whole descent of dragons is busted.
If you take Prince Keleseth for example, you cant run any other 2 drops and it only gave +1/+1 to all minions. Embiggen costs 0 mana so it can be played twice at the start of the turn and gives +2/+2.
Please change the card.
If they play two Embiggens turn 1 and you can't get into a position where you can kill them with spells by the time they play their first minion on turn 4/5 then you're bad.
If you take Prince Keleseth for example, you cant run any other 2 drops and it only gave +1/+1 to all minions. Embiggen costs 0 mana so it can be played twice at the start of the turn and gives +2/+2.
Please change the card.
If they play two Embiggens turn 1 and you can't get into a position where you can kill them with spells by the time they play their first minion on turn 4/5 then you're bad.
/thread
Nice irony but there is no class that is able to kill a druid which plays minions while geting armor. Point is it is not the deck that is op, it is the other classes who doesn’t have the response to a unfairly high valued minion based deck.
I don't get the complains about that card. I can get why the deck feels unfair, especially when your opponent starts his first turn with a double Embiggen, but it is far from being op as people here seem to think. It's an highroll deck, with almost no draw that starts to be dangerous only after turn five.
Embiggen is a fair card, the real culprit in this deck is Breath of Dreams. Wild Growth was nerfed because it was too strong and they make a better version of it ? What is the logic Blizzard ?
Not even close. Warrior is its best matchup, it has about a 57% winrate against rogue and 70-80 vs warrior.
https://hsreplay.net/archetypes/354/embiggen-druid?hl=en#tab=matchups
It's countered by aggro builds. Highlander Rogue does ok against it at around 54% loss rate, but the counters are aggro pally/sham, zoolock, highlander hunter, and rezpriest because it pulls out more big crap than they can deal with.
Blizzard didn't think of some of the interactions? That's impossible! They're always careful about this sort of thing, like with this week's pogo brawl.
These are all intended interactions.
Its fair. The only change that would make sense is to cost 1 which I wouldn't care because odds are I have extra mana waiting for the dang card.
Yes
Embiggen is fair, the quest and ramp cards are not.
It’s far cause you may not get it or certain cards that cost more to play.its a gamble and a fair trade off. Plus it takes up a slot or 2 depending on how many you include.
Extra Arms got nerfed back to 3 mana because 2 mana for +2/+2 was deemed to OP. With Embiggen, you literally pay +1 extra mana per minion for the same buff. And miss me with that "but it messes up the curve" bullcrap. The winrates clearly show what's up.
Embiggen is just fundamentally unfair and anyone defending it is currently climbing hard with it and hoping it doesn't get nerfed.
Every card you put in your deck takes up a slot. That’s not a trade off. Same for “you may not get it.” Goes for every card.
Yes indeed. Turn 1 Embiggen doesn't change much on it's own, but it prevents someone from playing it along with Strength in Numbers. Drawing Embiggen at the start of Turn 2 probably would take your whole turn to play it, and that matters.
Even a single mana cost increase means it's a lot harder to Embiggen and do something else, and that would matter.
Embiggen would see play at 2 mana, that's how OP it is. There's so much aggro because you need to win by turn 6 or lose to embiggen druid.
Is a totally fair card,too bad that blizz cant buff your skills as a player :( ,keep crying
Druid doesn't has the tempo Keleseth Rogue or Warrior has. The problem with keleseth Rogue was the capability of putting strong minions on board and killing yours at the same time because of backstab, preparation > evicerate and Vilespine Slayer. Warrior still had 1 mana Execute and Shield Slam and Rush Minions.
Druid mostly plays big things that don't do much if you can remove them. It is still strong and it can overwhelm you eventually, but not as fast as Rogue or Warrior. Other Keleseth decks were not as good, at least not fro mthe top of my mind.
It's unfair and gives value much above its cost. And you may ask why it didn't have high winrate before Winged Guardian. The answer is that the whole descent of dragons is busted.
fair cards don't see a lot of play
so, probably not
.
Nice irony but there is no class that is able to kill a druid which plays minions while geting armor. Point is it is not the deck that is op, it is the other classes who doesn’t have the response to a unfairly high valued minion based deck.
I don't get the complains about that card. I can get why the deck feels unfair, especially when your opponent starts his first turn with a double Embiggen, but it is far from being op as people here seem to think. It's an highroll deck, with almost no draw that starts to be dangerous only after turn five.
Embiggen is a fair card, the real culprit in this deck is Breath of Dreams. Wild Growth was nerfed because it was too strong and they make a better version of it ? What is the logic Blizzard ?
I don't think it would. It'd be still powerful, the effect is overpowered.
Priest has to pay 3 mana AND destroy 3 mana crystals for the same effect that Druid get's for free.
That pretty much sums it all up.