Hearthpwn

Quote from Tykaine >>

I for one am looking forward to such cards as this. Other card games have plenty of ways of discarding cards from your opponents hand or deck, thus throwing a kink in the plans of any cheesy OTK combos.

The difference is, in other games the combo decks often require some planning and thought input. In HS, the majority of combo decks are just a game of bingo, keep stalling and stalling until you have all the numbers you need, and then it's good game.

You have 30 cards in your deck, if one of them is literally essential to you winning a game, it is a poorly designed deck and should be easily punished.

Bring on the turn 2 concedes.

All the people complaining about this card having no counterplay and it breaking the game, providing an upside for no downside. This is Blizzards answer to uninteractive decks. If your opponent is playing a combo deck, say Exodia Quest mage. Burning their Antonidas and burning  an ice block or a glyph is huge. No doubt about it. But, if you burn say a frostbolt, or a fireball, not that big a deal. Specifically against combo decks is this card good. Against control, burning 1 removal out of 10 isnt gonna do a whole lot considering that Warlock doesnt run big cards anymore. Burning a shield slam or an SW:D, not that great. Against aggro, its a 2/2/2 that makes your opponents deck have only 29 cards, 28 if they run patches, all this does is advance their game plan, allow them to draw their good cards faster. Against midrange, it can be good it can be bad. At the very least, playing the card gives you an indication of what deck you are playing against. Playing against a Warrior? No turn 1 drop for them? Coin this and you can tell what deck their playing. Burn a control card like shield slam and you know you can play it slow. Not to mention, that by burning a card, your opponent knows that they will not draw that card. Can be valuable information. All in all, against most decks, it will just place the card at the bottom. Sure it may burn a Tirion, or a N'zoth or some other combo piece, but you have roughly a 1/25 chance of doing that, assuming you play it turn 2.

Quote from Coincedence >>

All the people complaining about this card having no counterplay and it breaking the game, providing an upside for no downside. This is Blizzards answer to uninteractive decks. If your opponent is playing a combo deck, say Exodia Quest mage. Burning their Antonidas and burning  an ice block or a glyph is huge. No doubt about it. But, if you burn say a frostbolt, or a fireball, not that big a deal. Specifically against combo decks is this card good. Against control, burning 1 removal out of 10 isnt gonna do a whole lot considering that Warlock doesnt run big cards anymore. Burning a shield slam or an SW:D, not that great. Against aggro, its a 2/2/2 that makes your opponents deck have only 29 cards, 28 if they run patches, all this does is advance their game plan, allow them to draw their good cards faster. Against midrange, it can be good it can be bad. At the very least, playing the card gives you an indication of what deck you are playing against. Playing against a Warrior? No turn 1 drop for them? Coin this and you can tell what deck their playing. Burn a control card like shield slam and you know you can play it slow. Not to mention, that by burning a card, your opponent knows that they will not draw that card. Can be valuable information. All in all, against most decks, it will just place the card at the bottom. Sure it may burn a Tirion, or a N'zoth or some other combo piece, but you have roughly a 1/25 chance of doing that, assuming you play it turn 2.

2 mana 2/3, remove a card from the bottomtop of your opponent's deck. Sounds terrible.

I will stand by this opinion until one day Blizzard prints a card that says something like "put a Tirion Fordring on the top of your deck".

Quote from MageroCore >>

Quote from BrokenCycle >>

Quote from MageroCore >>

Quote from BrokenCycle >>

Quote from MageroCore >>

Imagine thinking people are upset about this card because it's gamebreaking and not because its RNG distilled down to it's least interactive form. That's why I hate it. I know it's not going to ruin every game ever, but the idea of dealing with Warlock having an RNG based card burn that doesn't even require a mill setup for the next two years is really bumming me out because it will be incredibly boring to play against. Half the time it will burn nothing, half the time it will burn N'Zoth or something equally important. That's just shit card design. Having no negative effect just doubles the "might as well" nature of the card. 

 How is that any worse than the RNG already present in the game of not drawing the card you need for the entire game?

 Because you normally at least have some level of control over your own deck? Sure, it's RNG, but you can put in more draw, weight your deck towards certain cards and effects, and even then, it's a card game. Some RNG is always present. This, on the other hand, is your opponent messing with your deck to absolutely no detriment of their own. Just because Poker is about RNG doesn't mean it wouldn't be irritating to play a game against someone who's allowed to tell the dealer to skip a card when they deal to you personally.

 Your opponent is not messing with your deck. Your opponent is revealing to you a card you are not going to draw this game. This is generally useful information for you.

 ...and if that card is N'Zoth in a deathrattle control deck? Or White Eyes in a shaman deck? Or Leeroy in an OTK warlock deck? I understand the argument that relying on one card out of 30 to win is stupid, but some decks just DO rely on having a few cards be important, and this will screw those decks every now and then. Again, Im not saying this is a game breaking card, this isn't the end of the world, I just see it as a really uninteractive way of messing with your opponent and I'm not keen to deal with it. As DisguisedToast put it: "Competitive potential 0. Salt potential 9001"

this is so far my favorite card

Quote from FinalFortune >>

Quote from MageroCore >>

Quote from BrokenCycle >>

Quote from MageroCore >>

Quote from BrokenCycle >>

Quote from MageroCore >>

Imagine thinking people are upset about this card because it's gamebreaking and not because its RNG distilled down to it's least interactive form. That's why I hate it. I know it's not going to ruin every game ever, but the idea of dealing with Warlock having an RNG based card burn that doesn't even require a mill setup for the next two years is really bumming me out because it will be incredibly boring to play against. Half the time it will burn nothing, half the time it will burn N'Zoth or something equally important. That's just shit card design. Having no negative effect just doubles the "might as well" nature of the card. 

 How is that any worse than the RNG already present in the game of not drawing the card you need for the entire game?

 Because you normally at least have some level of control over your own deck? Sure, it's RNG, but you can put in more draw, weight your deck towards certain cards and effects, and even then, it's a card game. Some RNG is always present. This, on the other hand, is your opponent messing with your deck to absolutely no detriment of their own. Just because Poker is about RNG doesn't mean it wouldn't be irritating to play a game against someone who's allowed to tell the dealer to skip a card when they deal to you personally.

 Your opponent is not messing with your deck. Your opponent is revealing to you a card you are not going to draw this game. This is generally useful information for you.

 ...and if that card is N'Zoth in a deathrattle control deck? Or White Eyes in a shaman deck? Or Leeroy in an OTK warlock deck? I understand the argument that relying on one card out of 30 to win is stupid, but some decks just DO rely on having a few cards be important, and this will screw those decks every now and then. Again, Im not saying this is a game breaking card, this isn't the end of the world, I just see it as a really uninteractive way of messing with your opponent and I'm not keen to deal with it. As DisguisedToast put it: "Competitive potential 0. Salt potential 9001"

 Do you even play any of those decks? Renolock doesn't care about losing Leeroy Jenkins at all, the number of games you win with Emperoer Thaurisan, Leeroy Jenkins, Power Overwhelming and Faceless Manipulator are few and far between compared to using Leeroy Jenkins for spot removal or for Shadowflame fodder or Faceless Manipulator to copy their Legendary as a tempo play or a Sludge Belcher to increase the value from an N'zoth etc. Control Shaman doesn't care about White Eyes at all, it's just a redundant Deathrattle and Taunt minion for N'zoth and I don't think GOOD Control Shamans rely on N'zoth as their win condition regardless because Warlock, Mage and Priest already delete it from the game with Brann/Kazakus into a 10 mana mass polymorph.

Not only is the card BAD, but all of the situations you people are crying about already exist from much better cards and synergies. Seriously just calm down and think about what already exists in the game and everything you're getting from this expansion, if the Shaman Deathknight is any good then you probably won't give a shit about losing your N'zoth because your opponent just played a River Crocolisk in a control deck and you have a plan B, C, D ... Renolock has N'zoth, Jaraxus, Leeroy/Faceless combo, Kazakus/Brann combo and just pure card advantage and minion beatdown as win conditions, I should probably thank the other Warlock player for not playing a better card and discarding the most situational minion from my deck. 

This card reminds me of twin gemini elf's effect " whenever this monster attacks your opponent, your opponent randomly discards a card from his hand" I hope they release more cards like this :)

Quote from BrokenCycle >>

Quote from MageroCore >>

Quote from BrokenCycle >>

Quote from MageroCore >>

Imagine thinking people are upset about this card because it's gamebreaking and not because its RNG distilled down to it's least interactive form. That's why I hate it. I know it's not going to ruin every game ever, but the idea of dealing with Warlock having an RNG based card burn that doesn't even require a mill setup for the next two years is really bumming me out because it will be incredibly boring to play against. Half the time it will burn nothing, half the time it will burn N'Zoth or something equally important. That's just shit card design. Having no negative effect just doubles the "might as well" nature of the card. 

 How is that any worse than the RNG already present in the game of not drawing the card you need for the entire game?

 Because you normally at least have some level of control over your own deck? Sure, it's RNG, but you can put in more draw, weight your deck towards certain cards and effects, and even then, it's a card game. Some RNG is always present. This, on the other hand, is your opponent messing with your deck to absolutely no detriment of their own. Just because Poker is about RNG doesn't mean it wouldn't be irritating to play a game against someone who's allowed to tell the dealer to skip a card when they deal to you personally.

 Your opponent is not messing with your deck. Your opponent is revealing to you a card you are not going to draw this game. This is generally useful information for you.

Quote from OtkGrill >>

This card reminds me of twin gemini elf's effect " whenever this monster attacks your opponent, your opponent randomly discards a card from his hand" I hope they release more cards like this :)

 

Quote from CheeseEtc >>

I thought Blizzard had a "don't mess with your opponent's cards" policy ?

why not a demon

Quote from bmt6791 >>

why not a demon

Since every argument in this discussion is already made, here is a little of topic:

After an Expansion launch i do occasionally look through the old threads and l enjoy reading how wrong the perceptions from people are.

This one, i will definitly reread. Its going to be a lot of fun :)

holy didnt even think about that, there are going to be montages about that lol

The that makes or breaks this card is if the person using this card can see which card was discarded. 

Love the name. Interesting effect, though I (like many others) am not sure I like Blizzard experimenting with this direction.

Saying that, the card is trash and people are massively overrating it. 

Quote from asteroidm >> 

 Pretty much every argument I have seen for or against this card is true in the opposite.

 

Personally I like the card. I mean i can see a reverse mechanic to discard a topdeck from you opponent as a really nice way to bring the warlock class back into the meta. 

Quote from DyingAtheist >>

Love the name. Interesting effect, though I (like many others) am not sure I like Blizzard experimenting with this direction.

Saying that, the card is trash and people are massively overrating it.