It wasn't that he should "stop disliking decks" just that he should stop doing it in the huge quantities he was doing it. There's something seriously wrong when you spend your day tanking legitimate content on the site. Others have been warned for the exact same thing in the past and I have no problems warning others about it in the future.
Okay, If you insist on keeping the button, maybe you should set an influence limit, basically only let someone hit that downvote button 15 times per month or whatever. It sounds like you feel like some people are overcontributing negatively so just put a limit on it, then grey out their button when they max negative.
We could seriously crack down on the "no proof" people whether that is their ranking with the deck or winrate, but we need to get decks reportable first. It's something I've got written down to look into implementing now that I'm actually able to contribute to the code side of the site, so hopefully, its sooner rather than later. It would be great if more users on Windows adopted Innkeeper, it would let us collect data on deck winrates which could be of great use to put these claims to rest.
Once we get things reportable, these are the things I want to target with new types of warnings and/or removals.
Proof of rank required if you're going to state it.
If posting win-rates, proof is required.
Enforcing the "Request for upvotes" more heavily.
I suppose people would be able to report only decks made after this changes (if they end up being implemented in the future), am I right? If not, it would be a chaos, and a huge amount of users would receive several warnings unfairly.
I suppose people would be able to report only decks made after this changes (if they end up being implemented in the future), am I right? If not, it would be a chaos, and a huge amount of users would receive several warnings unfairly.
Technically people could report any deck. Internal policy though dictates we don't warn old content. If it's something that would normally be deleted, like attacks on a user, it would get deleted but no warning applied.
I don't see any old decks getting deleted due to a rule addition and tools to have them reported :D
Okay, If you insist on keeping the button, maybe you should set an influence limit, basically only let someone hit that downvote button 15 times per month or whatever. It sounds like you feel like some people are overcontributing negatively so just put a limit on it, then grey out their button when they max negative.
Or, hey, people could just not be stupid about it and downvote pages of stuff in a row ;)
We're talking a handful of problematic users here, this is not at all a massive problem. It is something though that is going to be stomped to the curb when it's found to be happening to help it not spread.
We could seriously crack down on the "no proof" people whether that is their ranking with the deck or winrate, but we need to get decks reportable first. It's something I've got written down to look into implementing now that I'm actually able to contribute to the code side of the site, so hopefully, its sooner rather than later. It would be great if more users on Windows adopted Innkeeper, it would let us collect data on deck winrates which could be of great use to put these claims to rest.
Once we get things reportable, these are the things I want to target with new types of warnings and/or removals.
Proof of rank required if you're going to state it.
If posting win-rates, proof is required.
Enforcing the "Request for upvotes" more heavily.
I suppose people would be able to report only decks made after this changes (if they end up being implemented in the future), am I right? If not, it would be a chaos, and a huge amount of users would receive several warnings unfairly.
okay I'm not trying to cause problems here because I might have missed it, but can someone explain to me this whole "report deck" topic? I'm so confused on what it will do for the future and how the system works.
There's definitely a difference. If you come across stuff that straight up sucks, it deserves a downvote.
If you go down a list of decks and downvote them all, that's not right. A while back on HeroesNexus, our now gone Heroes of the Storm site, we actually had this problem where 4 people went around downvoting every single build on the site that didn't include a guide. It's not right to discriminate like that, and it was especially a problem when we didn't have a large userbase interacting with those builds. Due to the low amount of them, we actually had negatively voted stuff show up on the front page once or twice and the entire builds page was a sea of red. If people see that kind of stuff, they aren't going to want to contribute their own stuff to the site because it appears to be a waste of time.
We certainly don't have that much of a problem on HearthPwn because we have such a large userbase, but there are times where we'll post a collection of well-performing decks, and the same 3 or 4 people are caught downvoting all of them. If they get in early, all the decks appear to be "shit-tier" and people will ignore them and possibly contribute negatively as well.
I would much rather not need to have rules against it, but a few people just love to ruin things. Anyone using the site normally shouldn't need to worry about it.
Also, it's better to encourage mass positivity than negativity.
Thanks for the explanation, I think that helps to know someone is just spamming nonsense. It is often difficult to reason with people that spam nonsense.
I suppose people would be able to report only decks made after this changes (if they end up being implemented in the future), am I right? If not, it would be a chaos, and a huge amount of users would receive several warnings unfairly.
Technically people could report any deck. Internal policy though dictates we don't warn old content. If it's something that would normally be deleted, like attacks on a user, it would get deleted but no warning applied.
I don't see any old decks getting deleted due to a rule addition and tools to have them reported :D
Okay, If you insist on keeping the button, maybe you should set an influence limit, basically only let someone hit that downvote button 15 times per month or whatever. It sounds like you feel like some people are overcontributing negatively so just put a limit on it, then grey out their button when they max negative.
Or, hey, people could just not be stupid about it and downvote pages of stuff in a row ;)
We're talking a handful of problematic users here, this is not at all a massive problem. It is something though that is going to be stomped to the curb when it's found to be happening to help it not spread.
Things have been pretty good lately.
I'm happy things are going the way they should. Not all decks need a guide either, so flat out discrimination on decks that are self explanatory is dumb
I'm happy things are going the way they should. Not all decks need a guide either, so flat out discrimination on decks that are self explanatory is dumb
You're not wrong, but it's also a very narrow way of looking at it.
Quoting myself:
Including something, even basic is always a good idea. There are legitimately people who don't play every class in the game and may not know a detail that is more obvious to a veteran of the class or game. We've got people from all walks of life on the site thanks to being the largest Hearthstone netdecking site on this site of the world, guides can help!
okay I'm not trying to cause problems here because I might have missed it, but can someone explain to me this whole "report deck" topic? I'm so confused on what it will do for the future and how the system works.
When changes end up being made, due to the importance of decks on our site, they'll be addressed in a news post.
The only thing people will really need to worry about is including proof if they want to claim specific win-rates or legend status since that will be a new rule. If they're currently asking for upvotes and not providing any form of a guide alongside that, that's already against the rules and will be much easier to penalize these people with a report button available on decks.
I'm happy things are going the way they should. Not all decks need a guide either, so flat out discrimination on decks that are self explanatory is dumb
You're not wrong, but it's also a very narrow way of looking at it.
Quoting myself:
Including something, even basic is always a good idea. There are legitimately people who don't play every class in the game and may not know a detail that is more obvious to a veteran of the class or game. We've got people from all walks of life on the site thanks to being the largest Hearthstone netdecking site on this site of the world, guides can help!
Absolutely. I've been playing the game since May 2016 and I still can't do well as a Mage xD. I had to netdeck my way to get better at Mage.
The fact that the dislike spam of guideless decks is so scummy and hopefully gets fixed soon.
It may end up requiring more humans moderating stuff. If that's the case, we'll open up another wave of recruitment, likely specifically targeting people who like to sift through decks. We don't have anyone dedicated to that and I know we have people on the site already that go through lots of them. We could leverage that power in more ways than just the negative - they'd also be great at finding stuff we could highlight.
F..k yeah, another wave of recrutiment!!! Maybe by then, I will finally become an official mod of this site once and for all, but being a self-proclaimed one feels good too. ;)
okay I'm not trying to cause problems here because I might have missed it, but can someone explain to me this whole "report deck" topic? I'm so confused on what it will do for the future and how the system works.
When changes end up being made, due to the importance of decks on our site, they'll be addressed in a news post.
The only thing people will really need to worry about is including proof if they want to claim specific win-rates or legend status since that will be a new rule. If they're currently asking for upvotes and not providing any form of a guide alongside that, that's already against the rules and will be much easier to penalize these people with a report button available on decks.
by proof, you mean like from HSReplay and all that? I don't play this game competitively so...
by proof, you mean like from HSReplay and all that? I don't play this game competitively so...
If someone wants to state they're Legend with a deck, there best be a screenshot proving that!
Win-rates though, you'll need a proper tracker and a screenshot of it if people are going to boast about their numbers.
None of this is currently mandatory though and as I said before, when changes are decided on there will be a front page post talking about them and why the changes are being made. Before any of this goes into play though I want to see the new system we've worked on come out and see how that changes the way people interact with decks. I hope we can get that out real soon for everyone because it should be incredibly helpful with the new expansion coming out.
by proof, you mean like from HSReplay and all that? I don't play this game competitively so...
If someone wants to state they're Legend with a deck, there best be a screenshot proving that!
Win-rates though, you'll need a proper tracker and a screenshot of it if people are going to boast about their numbers.
None of this is currently mandatory though and as I said before, when changes are decided on there will be a front page post talking about them and why the changes are being made. Before any of this goes into play though I want to see the new system we've worked on come out and see how that changes the way people interact with decks. I hope we can get that out real soon for everyone because it should be incredibly helpful with the new expansion coming out.
alrighty! Are you considering making some test link for the new format when this comes into play?
To be completely honest I always found Toymachine to be an absolute douchebag. But I do strongly agree that a lot of his points he made were absolutely true and usually (I'm saying usually as he sometimes really took stuff to serious and strayed to being a legit douchebag) were on very much on point.
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Add me up if you're looking for someone to play friendly matches with! I play on EU. LuckyScrub#2745
Nope!Not and NO! Good decks with good guides should get the attention and attention should never be given to guide in order to become decent. This is just a sad excuse. I always make a full guide since the begining and i perfect it as much as i can.If i can't make good guide, i don't even bother posting the deck. And guess what all my decks have become popular with 3 of them being at the front page. I am by no means a pro, nor my decks are the god's gift to this game. So if i can do it, everyone can.
You're an example of what we really like to see and I wish more people would do it. Thank you.
Jainaishot deck guides are great. I suppose I should learn from him. :)
Nope!Not and NO! Good decks with good guides should get the attention and attention should never be given to guide in order to become decent. This is just a sad excuse. I always make a full guide since the begining and i perfect it as much as i can.If i can't make good guide, i don't even bother posting the deck. And guess what all my decks have become popular with 3 of them being at the front page. I am by no means a pro, nor my decks are the god's gift to this game. So if i can do it, everyone can.
You're an example of what we really like to see and I wish more people would do it. Thank you.
Jainaishot deck guides are great. I suppose I should learn from him. :)
I actually have no idea who Toymachine is and I've been following the site fairly regularly for a few years, even when I took a two year break haha (I know, no one probably knows who I am, but that's probably a good thing haha).
Saying you'll give an in-depth guide for likes isn't necessarily a bad thing. I've put up a couple decks with decent guides (not as thorough as some guides on this site) and gotten no likes or comments out of it. As far as I can tell it was basically a huge waste of time on my part haha. There was one deck I built that got over 3000 view I think that had a few upvotes, and it made me feel good.
I should also mention that I don't specifically say "+20 for mulligans, +30 for in-depth guide, etc". I kinda put up a basic guide (maybe some reasons for some weird inclusions, some tech choices, or whatever else) then I'll conclude by saying "If this deck seems popular, I'll update more regularly". Which, of course, gets me nowhere lol.
Also I haven't tried putting up a really serious deck here in a long time, so don't go into my profile and criticize me for not being a full on deck-builder or whatever haha =P. Again, I haven't really thought about putting decks up here because it mostly seems like a waste of time. But maybe it's a waste of time because I don't have a click-baity enough title, and I don't beg for likes like other decks, so I guess it goes both ways.
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Twitch name: Anatak15 NA Legend Season 48, 49, 52, 53, 54, 74
Nope!Not and NO! Good decks with good guides should get the attention and attention should never be given to guide in order to become decent. This is just a sad excuse. I always make a full guide since the begining and i perfect it as much as i can.If i can't make good guide, i don't even bother posting the deck. And guess what all my decks have become popular with 3 of them being at the front page. I am by no means a pro, nor my decks are the god's gift to this game. So if i can do it, everyone can.
You're an example of what we really like to see and I wish more people would do it. Thank you.
Jainaishot deck guides are great. I suppose I should learn from him. :)
Nope!Not and NO! Good decks with good guides should get the attention and attention should never be given to guide in order to become decent. This is just a sad excuse. I always make a full guide since the begining and i perfect it as much as i can.If i can't make good guide, i don't even bother posting the deck. And guess what all my decks have become popular with 3 of them being at the front page. I am by no means a pro, nor my decks are the god's gift to this game. So if i can do it, everyone can.
You're an example of what we really like to see and I wish more people would do it. Thank you.
Jainaishot deck guides are great. I suppose I should learn from him. :)
I feel ya on making guides and then the deck going nowhere. It took a really long time for any of my decks to take off with upvotes and even then, none of mine (aside from frozen throne warlock one) have ever made front page. I personally don’t agree with the whole “10 upvotes for ...” idea but will update my decks more if I see further interest. To me, tossing down a few paragraphs to start seems common sense and I don’t find it too time consuming (I actually enjoy it!) so I find it hard to understand why others can’t write a little about their decks.
i find that tagging my decks with “rank 5” (never had the patience for legend) or making something fairly unique with a fun combo (my Maly OTK shaman was the first deck of that type to use new Hemet on this site) tends to go a long way while making a variation on something popular isn’t as good. People want to have fun but they also want to know they can snag some wins. Sometimes you’ll make a breakthrough on something unexpected but until the new rules get put out on providing proof, it’s hard to compete with all of the supposedly legend or 70% wr or decks promising content. I personally have no patience for people like that but I understand mods have to make tough choices about these things and am glad they’re updating their policies.
Thanks for the explanation, I think that helps to know someone is just spamming nonsense. It is often difficult to reason with people that spam nonsense.
To be completely honest I always found Toymachine to be an absolute douchebag. But I do strongly agree that a lot of his points he made were absolutely true and usually (I'm saying usually as he sometimes really took stuff to serious and strayed to being a legit douchebag) were on very much on point.
Add me up if you're looking for someone to play friendly matches with! I play on EU. LuckyScrub#2745
I actually have no idea who Toymachine is and I've been following the site fairly regularly for a few years, even when I took a two year break haha (I know, no one probably knows who I am, but that's probably a good thing haha).
Saying you'll give an in-depth guide for likes isn't necessarily a bad thing. I've put up a couple decks with decent guides (not as thorough as some guides on this site) and gotten no likes or comments out of it. As far as I can tell it was basically a huge waste of time on my part haha. There was one deck I built that got over 3000 view I think that had a few upvotes, and it made me feel good.
I should also mention that I don't specifically say "+20 for mulligans, +30 for in-depth guide, etc". I kinda put up a basic guide (maybe some reasons for some weird inclusions, some tech choices, or whatever else) then I'll conclude by saying "If this deck seems popular, I'll update more regularly". Which, of course, gets me nowhere lol.
Also I haven't tried putting up a really serious deck here in a long time, so don't go into my profile and criticize me for not being a full on deck-builder or whatever haha =P. Again, I haven't really thought about putting decks up here because it mostly seems like a waste of time. But maybe it's a waste of time because I don't have a click-baity enough title, and I don't beg for likes like other decks, so I guess it goes both ways.
Twitch name: Anatak15
NA Legend Season 48, 49, 52, 53, 54, 74
I feel ya on making guides and then the deck going nowhere. It took a really long time for any of my decks to take off with upvotes and even then, none of mine (aside from frozen throne warlock one) have ever made front page. I personally don’t agree with the whole “10 upvotes for ...” idea but will update my decks more if I see further interest. To me, tossing down a few paragraphs to start seems common sense and I don’t find it too time consuming (I actually enjoy it!) so I find it hard to understand why others can’t write a little about their decks.
i find that tagging my decks with “rank 5” (never had the patience for legend) or making something fairly unique with a fun combo (my Maly OTK shaman was the first deck of that type to use new Hemet on this site) tends to go a long way while making a variation on something popular isn’t as good. People want to have fun but they also want to know they can snag some wins. Sometimes you’ll make a breakthrough on something unexpected but until the new rules get put out on providing proof, it’s hard to compete with all of the supposedly legend or 70% wr or decks promising content. I personally have no patience for people like that but I understand mods have to make tough choices about these things and am glad they’re updating their policies.