Destroy Minion spells for 3 mana. Problem here is DK AOE damage kills useless minions, then these spells pick off your biggest threats with literally no drawback. Makes it too difficult to get ahead of Blood DK. Siphon Soul for 5 mana is legit interaction for instance
Vampiric Blood NERF/DELETE or BALANCE; 3 Mana, +5 life, spend 5Corpses to +5 and draw
Soul Stealer, NERF/DELETE. 8mana, 3/3, LOSEa corpse for each minion destroyed
Frostwyrm 7 mana; NERF TO 4 DAMAGE 4/4 TOKEN
Discover Rune Cards, NERF to only usable Rune cards
The entire game would be in a better place except for Pure Paladin needs nerf list too. You want a community that expands, that buys products like candy. The problem with DK is the power trade off for mana cost per turn. It's too cheap and easy to negate your opponent and stuff their entire deck's strategy. Instance; turn 5 opponent has managed to get 3-4x cheap minions on battlefield. DK just wipes it and gains health back (+vampiric blood interaction makes this more miserable). Opponent's turn 6 they play a big minion to offset the setback they just had turn 5.. the DK just spends 3 mana and removes that. Now opponent is screwed for most part waiting for 12 turns for game to end.
Enjoyable product= more player base More player base = more $$ More $$ = better product
You can make changes @BlizzardActvision, just use your free-will and get er done.
Destroy Minion spells for 3 mana. Problem here is DK AOE damage kills useless minions, then these spells pick off your biggest threats with literally no drawback. Makes it too difficult to get ahead of Blood DK. Siphon Soul for 5 mana is legit interaction for instance
Vampiric Blood NERF/DELETE or BALANCE; 3 Mana, +5 life, spend 5Corpses to +5 and draw
Soul Stealer, NERF/DELETE. 8mana, 3/3, LOSEa corpse for each minion destroyed
Frostwyrm 7 mana; NERF TO 4 DAMAGE 4/4 TOKEN
Discover Rune Cards, NERF to only usable Rune cards
The entire game would be in a better place except for Pure Paladin needs nerf list too. You want a community that expands, that buys products like candy. The problem with DK is the power trade off for mana cost per turn. It's too cheap and easy to negate your opponent and stuff their entire deck's strategy. Instance; turn 5 opponent has managed to get 3-4x cheap minions on battlefield. DK just wipes it and gains health back (+vampiric blood interaction makes this more miserable). Opponent's turn 6 they play a big minion to offset the setback they just had turn 5.. the DK just spends 3 mana and removes that. Now opponent is screwed for most part waiting for 12 turns for game to end.
Enjoyable product= more player base More player base = more $$ More $$ = better product
You can make changes @BlizzardActvision, just use your free-will and get er done.
Construct quarter: Is completely fine now at 2 charges.
Vampiric blood: is fine as a trip blood rune card.
Gnome muncher: You want to kill the card.
Soul stealer: You want to make the card worse than twisting nether even though it’s 9 years newer and requires trip blood.
Frostwyrm: You want to kill the card.
Discover rune cards: A change I actually support.
There’s tuning something, and then there’s making it unplayable. Your suggestions would kill it. You being happy about that or not does not warrant it, and thank goodness emotion doesn’t dictate balance.
Also, you should know that complaining about the meta, or the decks that arise within the first few weeks means little as it has anything but settled.
Your changes are weird and you sound very salty. The actual cards that need to be changed in DK are Discover effects, especially cards like Hematurge, Frost Strike and maybe like Nerubian Vizier. Frostwyrm's Fury could use a 1 mana increase, I guess. If there's any other outlier card it's probably Gnome Muncher as that shuts down a lot of decks. I think it could lose Taunt, although that might kill the card so idk.
Discover is a problem, DK's have too many good spells so its almost impossible for them to low roll. They could increase the cost of corpses to use them (also for neutrals like Nerubian Viziers now that everyone has a corpse counter) which means DK have to be a lot more careful about when to discover. I don't think any other card needs a nerf if they fix the discover giving them endless value.
8 mana summons 5/5 and kills everything as well as gives corpses. I never said Twisting nether needs taking out the game but that as it is only 8 mana and doesn’t summon a 5/5. You clearly a fan of Deathknight to think this card doesn’t need nerfing 🤡
So your ideology is that you think then twisting nether should be 4 mana?
If you can get 12 mana soul stealer should be 12 mana it’s that BS!
If I were going to nerf DK, I would go after the early game and not the late game. Nerfs to 1 and 2 cost undeads would hurt every DK architype.
Alexandros Mograine and Gnome Muncher could be nerfed if the goal was to only turn down blood dk's power. I'm against nerfing blood dk's aoe because minions are so strong right now. It only seems fair that at least some classes would get cards that can actually handle the insane boards that paladin, shaman, and druid make.
Your nerf ideas are all horrible and also far from the way blizz changes things.
- soulstealer is perfectly fine. Slow aoe plus a Body is Fine nowadays. - your discover nerf would be a buff because it narrows the pool a lot if you only allow your runes.
-quarter should be fine now. It lost around 4 mana of value due too last nerf.
-destroy a minion effects are also fine. Comparisons to one of the worst cards that already got powercrept many years ago (siphon soul) are bad. It’s like saying x is op because it’s better then yeti.
- vampiric blood is fine.
-frostwyrm maybe plus 1 mana. Your idea would also work, but it’s actually a slighter nerf then a mana increase.
I'm not saying that I agree with the proposals in the original post, but I think it's slightly disingenuous to make the comparisons with previous board-clear cards.
Gigafin - a 1 of legendary that has a downside giving you your board back (but also only wipes the opponents board).
Plage of flames - requires a board of equal size to function at all (and this card was oppresive when it was played).
Lord Godfrey - might wipe the board but requies some set up. Also - legendary 1 of.
For me the issue with Soulstealer is that he usualy creates lots of corpses in a rune class which sometimes struggles to generate them. As a resource, corpses becomes fairly meaningless once a soulstealer has been played as you nearly always have more than enough to do what you want.
Personally I think the issue isn't with a single card. All of the cards evaluated on their own are good but, but lots of cards from other classes are (individually) good too.
The issue is that ALL of the DK cards are good, and the synergy with the hero power/class mechanics for the neutral cards that are run is also very powerful. Nerubian Vizier might as well just say "if your hero is a DK it costs 2 less".
It's also frustrating to play against multiple discovered legendary minions or triple rune cards from runes the deck isn't using. The premise behing runes is that those cards with more runes are more powerful cards, with the downside being you lose the flexibility to choose from the other runes. Similarly, the concept of a powerful legendary but you only get, one is a joke. The discover mechanic ruins both these concepts in DK.
I don't think there's an easy fix though. Limiting discovers to the runes you're using just increases consitency on the cards you're offered.
Honestly as someone who enjoys playing Blood DK now (Since I was massive Warrior fan back in the day and playstyle is sorta the same now). I think the only thing that needs to be nerfed on DK is the fact that the discover mechanic is basically too strong for it since, it can discover cards from any Rune archetype giving it such a greater flexibility for all the Death Knight classes. Blood DK not having reliable ways to generate corpses or reliable card draw or hit face? Boom you have Plague Grain and Defrost/Frostwyrm. Unholy unable to Heal and stall? Boom Vampiric Blood and Frostwyrm/Soulstealer. Frost basically being about stalling gets tools like Vampiric Blood and potentially Tomb Guardians to stall out for longer till they can reach turn 7.
So I even though I am classified now as a "Flithy DK" player (Mained Control Priest, Warrior, Warlock and Thief Rogue) before I really think that putting rune restrictions on discover cards is the way to go. The same restrictions might benefit the runes as well yes, but still doesn't allow them to cover some weakness they are missing. The amount of times that games can be won by a DK getting the card it requires from another Rune set is quite high which means that most of the time spamming discover cards into your deck isn't a downside since you get to build 3 in 1 Rune deck instead of just Triple.
I’m guessing some of you lot have not been playing hearthstone from the first day like I have done over the years on and off. I agree the discover cards is too much for DK but to say soulstealer is not OP is ridiculous. You obviously new to the game if you thinking this. There is 10 cards that is OP for DK and I’m just pointing out just one. But DK players here are just alike the hunters over the years with lack of brain cells and just want easy boring games. Anyways we can’t change anything but we know more people will leave and I for one even though I am at legend with just mage with my own deck, DK is ruining the game 100%.
Construct Quarter BALANCE, 3mana, summon 3/3 rush
Destroy Minion spells for 3 mana. Problem here is DK AOE damage kills useless minions, then these spells pick off your biggest threats with literally no drawback. Makes it too difficult to get ahead of Blood DK. Siphon Soul for 5 mana is legit interaction for instance
Vampiric Blood NERF/DELETE or BALANCE; 3 Mana, +5 life, spend 5 Corpses to +5 and draw
Gnome Muncher BALANCE, 5mana, 3/5 Taunt Lifesteal, attack HIGHEST health enemy
Soul Stealer, NERF/DELETE. 8mana, 3/3, LOSE a corpse for each minion destroyed
Frostwyrm 7 mana; NERF TO 4 DAMAGE 4/4 TOKEN
Discover Rune Cards, NERF to only usable Rune cards
The entire game would be in a better place except for Pure Paladin needs nerf list too. You want a community that expands, that buys products like candy. The problem with DK is the power trade off for mana cost per turn. It's too cheap and easy to negate your opponent and stuff their entire deck's strategy.
Instance; turn 5 opponent has managed to get 3-4x cheap minions on battlefield. DK just wipes it and gains health back (+vampiric blood interaction makes this more miserable). Opponent's turn 6 they play a big minion to offset the setback they just had turn 5.. the DK just spends 3 mana and removes that. Now opponent is screwed for most part waiting for 12 turns for game to end.
Enjoyable product= more player base
More player base = more $$
More $$ = better product
You can make changes @BlizzardActvision, just use your free-will and get er done.
Construct quarter: Is completely fine now at 2 charges.
Vampiric blood: is fine as a trip blood rune card.
Gnome muncher: You want to kill the card.
Soul stealer: You want to make the card worse than twisting nether even though it’s 9 years newer and requires trip blood.
Frostwyrm: You want to kill the card.
Discover rune cards: A change I actually support.
There’s tuning something, and then there’s making it unplayable. Your suggestions would kill it. You being happy about that or not does not warrant it, and thank goodness emotion doesn’t dictate balance.
Also, you should know that complaining about the meta, or the decks that arise within the first few weeks means little as it has anything but settled.
Your changes are weird and you sound very salty. The actual cards that need to be changed in DK are Discover effects, especially cards like Hematurge, Frost Strike and maybe like Nerubian Vizier. Frostwyrm's Fury could use a 1 mana increase, I guess. If there's any other outlier card it's probably Gnome Muncher as that shuts down a lot of decks. I think it could lose Taunt, although that might kill the card so idk.
Discover is a problem, DK's have too many good spells so its almost impossible for them to low roll. They could increase the cost of corpses to use them (also for neutrals like Nerubian Viziers now that everyone has a corpse counter) which means DK have to be a lot more careful about when to discover. I don't think any other card needs a nerf if they fix the discover giving them endless value.
Soul stealer needs removing out the game without a doubt.
No it doesn’t, just like twisting nether doesn’t.
A 5/5 in exchange for being locked behind triple blood is fine.
That, and no one complained about it until now, because the deck is viable now.
8 mana summons 5/5 and kills everything as well as gives corpses. I never said Twisting nether needs taking out the game but that as it is only 8 mana and doesn’t summon a 5/5.
You clearly a fan of Deathknight to think this card doesn’t need nerfing 🤡
So your ideology is that you think then twisting nether should be 4 mana?
If you can get 12 mana soul stealer should be 12 mana it’s that BS!
Clear board with board control and corpses to back up you cannot possibly believe this is a fair card right 🤡?
Team 5 is filled with drooling morons. They only consider whether or not their moves will sell more cards to the few addicts Hearthstone has left.
If I were going to nerf DK, I would go after the early game and not the late game. Nerfs to 1 and 2 cost undeads would hurt every DK architype.
Alexandros Mograine and Gnome Muncher could be nerfed if the goal was to only turn down blood dk's power. I'm against nerfing blood dk's aoe because minions are so strong right now. It only seems fair that at least some classes would get cards that can actually handle the insane boards that paladin, shaman, and druid make.
Your nerf ideas are all horrible and also far from the way blizz changes things.
- soulstealer is perfectly fine. Slow aoe plus a Body is Fine nowadays.
- your discover nerf would be a buff because it narrows the pool a lot if you only allow your runes.
-quarter should be fine now. It lost around 4 mana of value due too last nerf.
-destroy a minion effects are also fine. Comparisons to one of the worst cards that already got powercrept many years ago (siphon soul) are bad. It’s like saying x is op because it’s better then yeti.
- vampiric blood is fine.
-frostwyrm maybe plus 1 mana. Your idea would also work, but it’s actually a slighter nerf then a mana increase.
Lord Godfrey was released years ago. He cleared a board and left a 4/4 for 7 mana
I like how people pretend to make a point by comparing Soulstealer to Twisting Nether like Gigafin Lord Godfrey and Plague of Flames never existed.
And yes op this thread is ridiculous indeed, thanks for letting us know in the title.
I'm not saying that I agree with the proposals in the original post, but I think it's slightly disingenuous to make the comparisons with previous board-clear cards.
Gigafin - a 1 of legendary that has a downside giving you your board back (but also only wipes the opponents board).
Plage of flames - requires a board of equal size to function at all (and this card was oppresive when it was played).
Lord Godfrey - might wipe the board but requies some set up. Also - legendary 1 of.
For me the issue with Soulstealer is that he usualy creates lots of corpses in a rune class which sometimes struggles to generate them. As a resource, corpses becomes fairly meaningless once a soulstealer has been played as you nearly always have more than enough to do what you want.
Personally I think the issue isn't with a single card. All of the cards evaluated on their own are good but, but lots of cards from other classes are (individually) good too.
The issue is that ALL of the DK cards are good, and the synergy with the hero power/class mechanics for the neutral cards that are run is also very powerful. Nerubian Vizier might as well just say "if your hero is a DK it costs 2 less".
It's also frustrating to play against multiple discovered legendary minions or triple rune cards from runes the deck isn't using. The premise behing runes is that those cards with more runes are more powerful cards, with the downside being you lose the flexibility to choose from the other runes. Similarly, the concept of a powerful legendary but you only get, one is a joke. The discover mechanic ruins both these concepts in DK.
I don't think there's an easy fix though. Limiting discovers to the runes you're using just increases consitency on the cards you're offered.
Honestly as someone who enjoys playing Blood DK now (Since I was massive Warrior fan back in the day and playstyle is sorta the same now). I think the only thing that needs to be nerfed on DK is the fact that the discover mechanic is basically too strong for it since, it can discover cards from any Rune archetype giving it such a greater flexibility for all the Death Knight classes. Blood DK not having reliable ways to generate corpses or reliable card draw or hit face? Boom you have Plague Grain and Defrost/Frostwyrm. Unholy unable to Heal and stall? Boom Vampiric Blood and Frostwyrm/Soulstealer. Frost basically being about stalling gets tools like Vampiric Blood and potentially Tomb Guardians to stall out for longer till they can reach turn 7.
So I even though I am classified now as a "Flithy DK" player (Mained Control Priest, Warrior, Warlock and Thief Rogue) before I really think that putting rune restrictions on discover cards is the way to go. The same restrictions might benefit the runes as well yes, but still doesn't allow them to cover some weakness they are missing. The amount of times that games can be won by a DK getting the card it requires from another Rune set is quite high which means that most of the time spamming discover cards into your deck isn't a downside since you get to build 3 in 1 Rune deck instead of just Triple.
Why do you guys want to nerf tripple blood? It already sucks enough (literally every class has at least one deck which stomps over it with ease).
Ye discover is a Major issue in Dk now, also I think with the addition of banshee, blood has to much tempo for what it is.
It is a slow control (with heavy sustain) deck. When such a deck outtempos aggressive playstyles something is wrong.
The 6 mana taunt and banshee is insane mid game tempo with sustain on top.
Though I gotta say both cards are fairly hard to adjust, without killing them completely.
I’m guessing some of you lot have not been playing hearthstone from the first day like I have done over the years on and off. I agree the discover cards is too much for DK but to say soulstealer is not OP is ridiculous. You obviously new to the game if you thinking this. There is 10 cards that is OP for DK and I’m just pointing out just one. But DK players here are just alike the hunters over the years with lack of brain cells and just want easy boring games. Anyways we can’t change anything but we know more people will leave and I for one even though I am at legend with just mage with my own deck, DK is ruining the game 100%.
Your deathknight buddy mentioned this. You should add each other and play together. But yes can you see your class is OP?
Name me 3 of those decks please, without mentioning pala or dh