I feel like they did make priest a lot better with the new expansion, but I also feel like they boosted several other classes way more than they did with priest at the same time, so the end result is that priest is still trailing in ranked.
The main thing priest excels at is control. That's what the majority of their cards are focused on and this is how the core class is designed. But when you add things like the jade mechanic which laughs in the face of control (and in the case of druid even gives them literally infinite cards, with an insane tempo ramp), then I don't know what priest is supposed to do. Are we just playing paper rock scissors here as far as deck archetypes go? Oops, I got druid - time to concede! ? Or do the developers think there is some way for us to counter this mechanic reliably as priest? I have tried and haven't found one. And when I see others streaming hearthstone these days, they are very rarely playing priest.
It's starting to feel like priest is just the red-headed step child of hearthstone.
I hope they continue to improve on priest, expand their competitive card pool, and do special things for priest, like they've done for other classes (jade, buff cards in hand, etc.)
Yeah they are still pretty crippled vs 4 attack minions with more than 3 health (looking at you Azure Drake). Could have made Purify permanently remove 1 attack from a minion and draw a card. Would have maybe made the card playable and complement pain, horror, cabal and madness plays.
OP, Jade Druid is barely played (about 1 in 18 matches according to the latest VS report), Jade Rogue doesn't really exist, and you're highly-favored as Dragon Priest against midrange shaman, including the Jade-heavy variant. I don't like the Jade Mechanic; but it's not keeping Priest down. Dragon Priest is one of the best Tier 2 decks, with its only truly bad match-ups being Renolock, which is waning in popularity since it actually sucks at stopping aggro (ironic for a control deck), and Miracle Rogue.
I certainly hope Priest gets more good cards in the expansion; but the class is 100% competitive now. It's time to stop the complaining. A number of classes can no longer effectively run "classic" strategies (try playing Freeze Mage, Zoo, Tempo Mage, or Control Warrior, not to mention literally any Hunter or Paladin deck) - it's not just Control Priest. It's reasonable to hope and expect that the design team leaves every class at least meta viable; but it's silly to expect that your favorite deck for your favorite class will always be viable.
All that said, given the currently-available tools, an old-school Control Priest (non-reno) would actually probably be fairly effective given the prevalence of Shaman and Aggro Warriors on ladder. You'd have to tech heavily for anti-weapon and would just have to acknowledge that you're going to have a low winrate against combo finishers and the rare Jade Druid; but you could rank up with it.
I don't mind the current state where Priest is standing. If Priest were to receive more strong cards in MSG, I don't think the community could handle the salt on this class.
Overall I'd say there's no reason Control Priest necessarily needs to be the best version, though it is certainly the bulk of my wins with the class and I'm a bit biased towards it; right now we have a competitive deck with Dragon Priest, and I think that's truly all you could ask for in regards to a class. It's very strong all around without being oppressively strong, and it goes deeper than just the "play stuff on curve" sort of mindset while still being proactive.
I do think Priest is kind of awkward to design for, but I honestly think they nailed it this expansion as far as keeping up with Priest being able to do some off the wall stuff (Potion of Madness and Pint-Sized for instance) while producing actual viable cards. I think they only one that's kind of terrible is Mana Geode? I'll take Mana Geode any day over Confuse.
Right now I'm more concerned for Paladin which really hasn't seemed to have anything stick in the last year, but there's still plenty of time for someone to crack viable lists for Paladin and Hunter both (maybe not competitively, but you know... Tier 3ish). I actually really liked the Goon mechanic so I'm sad to see it's not really getting any attention or testing.
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Not good enough? Top tier played constantly and consistently by top pros (savijz, kolento, thijs, p4wnyhof etc.). BS thread.
edit: I forgot that Lifecoach said that Drako OP made Priest very strong so yeah, this thread is BS and all arguments invalid.
Top tier? Not even a single priest deck has made tier 1 since gadgetzan. And only 1 priest deck has made tier 2. Where are you getting your info?? Also, savijz kolento thijs p4wny, frozen, ek0p, hippi, ostkaka and others are primarily playing warlock, shaman, warrior. If any of them even play priest at all it is very very infrequently.
All of the sites: hearthstats, gosugamers, meta snapshot, etc. - back up the fact that priest is still at the bottom of competitive play right now. Dragon priest sees some competitive play, but not even that has ever made it to tier 1. All other priest decks are at the flat bottom of the barrel.
I'm sorry guys, but the stat's just don't back up what some of you are saying about priest being in a "good position" right now.
The problem is people conflate Tier 1 with being viable, when in reality Tier 2 is far from being in a bad spot. vS data backs that up when you see that overall Dragon Priest is third, and while still Tier 2 is slightly less than 1% worse in winrate than the number one deck. We really haven't seen any competitive play so far (invitational stuff is pretty much garbage), but I wouldn't be surprised if we see that deck brought to qualifiers and succeed. All of the sites are agreeing Paladin and Hunter are at the bottom of competitive play, but I'm definitely not seeing that sentiment widely shared in regards to Priest...
I can't speak much to the current deck streamers are playing (except P4wnyhof is a god awful example of a competitive player), but I don't put much faith in that regardless. I know I've personally seen a lot of Reno and Dragon Priest tested and played to high legend by people like Hotform, but a lot of the pros will generally just stream whatever they're currently finding most interesting/entertaining with little regard for how good the list actually is; those that do care about how good the deck is will probably still just take the objectively best deck which is widely regarded as Aggro Shaman. Overall that kind of stuff is too anecdotal to really hold much weight.
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Not good enough? Top tier played constantly and consistently by top pros (savijz, kolento, thijs, p4wnyhof etc.). BS thread.
edit: I forgot that Lifecoach said that Drako OP made Priest very strong so yeah, this thread is BS and all arguments invalid.
Top tier? Not even a single priest deck has made tier 1 since gadgetzan. And only 1 priest deck has made tier 2. Where are you getting your info?? Also, savijz kolento thijs p4wny, frozen, ek0p, hippi, ostkaka and others are primarily playing warlock, shaman, warrior. If any of them even play priest at all it is very very infrequently.
All of the sites: hearthstats, gosugamers, meta snapshot, etc. - back up the fact that priest is still at the bottom of competitive play right now. Dragon priest sees some competitive play, but not even that has ever made it to tier 1. All other priest decks are at the flat bottom of the barrel.
I'm sorry guys, but the stat's just don't back up what some of you are saying about priest being in a "good position" right now.
I suggest you stop looking at stats and play some legend ranks.
I take it you're one of those touchy-feely sjw art student feminazi types who think their feelings and intuitions and opinions matter more than actual numbers, figures and facts.
I mean, it has 2 completely viable tier 2 decks (depending on how Reno Priest matches with the ladder at the time). How much greater does it need to be? If it gets much better, it risks being shaman level oppressive. IMO they did priest right this time, unlike how they did shaman and paladin.
I suggest you stop looking at stats and play some legend ranks.
I take it you're one of those touchy-feely sjw art student feminazi types who think their feelings and intuitions and opinions matter more than actual numbers, figures and facts.
Well I'm not sure you're one to judge people ignoring numbers if you're going to claim the data isn't backing up the stance Priest is in a good spot currently. Seriously, the numbers and the objective success is out there in plain sight.
So stop with the ad hominem and start tossing out something more substantial than vague references to "All of the sites".
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I disagree, Dragon Priest have one of the best curves of mana in game, 1 mana 2/3, 2 manas 2/4 taunt, 3 manas 3/5 or 3/4 give 3 health, 4 manas 3/6 taunt and 5 manas 5/6 better discover ever made.
It's probably one of the things they got right. It's decent but not dominant, and has to make more proactive plays than heal, remove, and steal, which just pissed people off to play against. The issues are elsewhere - that Shaman has been broken all year and they don't know how to design new Rogue archetypes so just continue to boost a three year old archetype that has always plagued Priest.
I played a lot of matches with dragon priest now. And it got me a 70% win rate (rank 16), I think I would lose a lot of more matches when I rank up. The Jade Golem decks just ruins my games with dragon priest. Reno Priest at the other hand is more fun for me to play and gave me the same win rate. I would not say that Priest has gotten better but s def more fun to play with.
If anything, it is unstable, at risk of falling back to the void with next rotation, if they don't take care of it again, in the next expansion. Which means the class itself has some structural problem that should be better addressed, instead of just new cards.
But Priest is good right now. It can fight evenly against pretty much anything, and Reno Priest is actually quite spectacular. Dunno what you can expect more.
I feel like they did make priest a lot better with the new expansion, but I also feel like they boosted several other classes way more than they did with priest at the same time, so the end result is that priest is still trailing in ranked.
The main thing priest excels at is control. That's what the majority of their cards are focused on and this is how the core class is designed. But when you add things like the jade mechanic which laughs in the face of control (and in the case of druid even gives them literally infinite cards, with an insane tempo ramp), then I don't know what priest is supposed to do. Are we just playing paper rock scissors here as far as deck archetypes go? Oops, I got druid - time to concede! ? Or do the developers think there is some way for us to counter this mechanic reliably as priest? I have tried and haven't found one. And when I see others streaming hearthstone these days, they are very rarely playing priest.
It's starting to feel like priest is just the red-headed step child of hearthstone.
I hope they continue to improve on priest, expand their competitive card pool, and do special things for priest, like they've done for other classes (jade, buff cards in hand, etc.)
#makepriestgreatagain
Yes, they need to make a card for priest to make great again, 4 mana 7-7 dragon, battlecry: Discover a card from your opponent's hand, discard others.
Yeah they are still pretty crippled vs 4 attack minions with more than 3 health (looking at you Azure Drake). Could have made Purify permanently remove 1 attack from a minion and draw a card. Would have maybe made the card playable and complement pain, horror, cabal and madness plays.
OP, Jade Druid is barely played (about 1 in 18 matches according to the latest VS report), Jade Rogue doesn't really exist, and you're highly-favored as Dragon Priest against midrange shaman, including the Jade-heavy variant. I don't like the Jade Mechanic; but it's not keeping Priest down. Dragon Priest is one of the best Tier 2 decks, with its only truly bad match-ups being Renolock, which is waning in popularity since it actually sucks at stopping aggro (ironic for a control deck), and Miracle Rogue.
I certainly hope Priest gets more good cards in the expansion; but the class is 100% competitive now. It's time to stop the complaining. A number of classes can no longer effectively run "classic" strategies (try playing Freeze Mage, Zoo, Tempo Mage, or Control Warrior, not to mention literally any Hunter or Paladin deck) - it's not just Control Priest. It's reasonable to hope and expect that the design team leaves every class at least meta viable; but it's silly to expect that your favorite deck for your favorite class will always be viable.
All that said, given the currently-available tools, an old-school Control Priest (non-reno) would actually probably be fairly effective given the prevalence of Shaman and Aggro Warriors on ladder. You'd have to tech heavily for anti-weapon and would just have to acknowledge that you're going to have a low winrate against combo finishers and the rare Jade Druid; but you could rank up with it.
Yes, better but still not good enough. Rouge/Shaman/Druid got the candy last expansion. I want them at the bottom next time.
I don't mind the current state where Priest is standing. If Priest were to receive more strong cards in MSG, I don't think the community could handle the salt on this class.
P/S: check out this thread: http://www.hearthpwn.com/forums/hearthstone-general/card-discussion/180411-drakonid-operative-needs-to-be-nerfed?page=41#c833
Overall I'd say there's no reason Control Priest necessarily needs to be the best version, though it is certainly the bulk of my wins with the class and I'm a bit biased towards it; right now we have a competitive deck with Dragon Priest, and I think that's truly all you could ask for in regards to a class. It's very strong all around without being oppressively strong, and it goes deeper than just the "play stuff on curve" sort of mindset while still being proactive.
I do think Priest is kind of awkward to design for, but I honestly think they nailed it this expansion as far as keeping up with Priest being able to do some off the wall stuff (Potion of Madness and Pint-Sized for instance) while producing actual viable cards. I think they only one that's kind of terrible is Mana Geode? I'll take Mana Geode any day over Confuse.
Right now I'm more concerned for Paladin which really hasn't seemed to have anything stick in the last year, but there's still plenty of time for someone to crack viable lists for Paladin and Hunter both (maybe not competitively, but you know... Tier 3ish). I actually really liked the Goon mechanic so I'm sad to see it's not really getting any attention or testing.
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Who's the Beatdown?
All of the sites: hearthstats, gosugamers, meta snapshot, etc. - back up the fact that priest is still at the bottom of competitive play right now. Dragon priest sees some competitive play, but not even that has ever made it to tier 1. All other priest decks are at the flat bottom of the barrel.
I'm sorry guys, but the stat's just don't back up what some of you are saying about priest being in a "good position" right now.
The problem is people conflate Tier 1 with being viable, when in reality Tier 2 is far from being in a bad spot. vS data backs that up when you see that overall Dragon Priest is third, and while still Tier 2 is slightly less than 1% worse in winrate than the number one deck. We really haven't seen any competitive play so far (invitational stuff is pretty much garbage), but I wouldn't be surprised if we see that deck brought to qualifiers and succeed. All of the sites are agreeing Paladin and Hunter are at the bottom of competitive play, but I'm definitely not seeing that sentiment widely shared in regards to Priest...
I can't speak much to the current deck streamers are playing (except P4wnyhof is a god awful example of a competitive player), but I don't put much faith in that regardless. I know I've personally seen a lot of Reno and Dragon Priest tested and played to high legend by people like Hotform, but a lot of the pros will generally just stream whatever they're currently finding most interesting/entertaining with little regard for how good the list actually is; those that do care about how good the deck is will probably still just take the objectively best deck which is widely regarded as Aggro Shaman. Overall that kind of stuff is too anecdotal to really hold much weight.
Articles I suggest every player reads to improve at the game;
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Reframing negative Hearthstone experiences to improve at the game
Who's the Beatdown?
I mean, it has 2 completely viable tier 2 decks (depending on how Reno Priest matches with the ladder at the time). How much greater does it need to be? If it gets much better, it risks being shaman level oppressive. IMO they did priest right this time, unlike how they did shaman and paladin.
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Priest is in a better spot but still has some problems that should be looked at next expansions :
--Alfi--
dragon priest is total garbage right now.
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It's probably one of the things they got right. It's decent but not dominant, and has to make more proactive plays than heal, remove, and steal, which just pissed people off to play against. The issues are elsewhere - that Shaman has been broken all year and they don't know how to design new Rogue archetypes so just continue to boost a three year old archetype that has always plagued Priest.
CCGing since '98.
I played a lot of matches with dragon priest now. And it got me a 70% win rate (rank 16), I think I would lose a lot of more matches when I rank up. The Jade Golem decks just ruins my games with dragon priest. Reno Priest at the other hand is more fun for me to play and gave me the same win rate. I would not say that Priest has gotten better but s def more fun to play with.
Priest is good.
If anything, it is unstable, at risk of falling back to the void with next rotation, if they don't take care of it again, in the next expansion.
Which means the class itself has some structural problem that should be better addressed, instead of just new cards.
But Priest is good right now. It can fight evenly against pretty much anything, and Reno Priest is actually quite spectacular. Dunno what you can expect more.