Hearthpwn

https://hsreplay.net/replay/zAmMQjmZoxMNdPKfzG8Jwf

My turn 9

Against a ragnaros, I'm offered explosive shot, ancient of war, and black knight, without any option to remove the most threatening minion on the board.

I've done stuff at rank floor like make a specific counter deck to the most popular meta deck and concede against everything but that deck. (The opponents' rank doesn't matter).

I remember doing this in wild to counter pirate warrior. Had a deck with 8 weapon removals. Was like 95% win against pirate warrior.

Quote from Scorpyon >>

Quote from scout1515 >>

The rules are as follows:

Player 1: Creates a deck, can use any cards, standard or wild. Once the list complete, it's turned over to Player 2

Player 2: Creates a counter deck for Player 1's deck, but can only use standard cards. Player 1 does not get P2's decklist.

The match is then played best of 7.

I think this would actually be interesting if there was a tournament done around this. That's something I would actually be interested in watching. It's definitely more interesting than control warrior mirror matches. Both players get a pretty big advantage on 1 aspect. Wild has some ridiculously broken cards, but is that enough of an advantage when someone has the ability to specifically counter your deck? I'm sure there's some wild decks that are so ridiculously hard to counter even if you get to tailor a deck to it. Obviously secret mage or most combo decks probably won't be great choices due to the fact they can be hard countered.

 Player 2, hands down.
It doesn't matter what crazy deck Player 1 comes up with, "Knowledge is Power" as the saying goes - and Player 2 will know exactly what the threats are and how to counter them effectively, whereas Player 1 will always be on the back foot having to try and guess whether a play will succeed.

That said, Player 2's deck will need to include an infallible win condition that can't be countered effectively, otherwise after seeing it the first time, Player 1 will be ready for it.

 So for those of you who think P2 will be the clear winner, how many expansions/rotations do you think it'll take before P1 is favored. At some point the power level in wild will be so high that it won't be possible to counter a well built deck with only standard cards.

I don think there's an issue here since there's tons of crappy unplayable legendaries. Jaraxxus has already been crap for a while now (ever since guldan came out), this is just the final nail in the coffin for it.

https://hsreplay.net/replay/GxbM42TGUDC7biXR9ig6Kk

My turn 9.

Vs a 30/30 ancient one, played zeph with 4 mana remaining. I get offered Defender of argus, sap, and SW:death. No transform of any kind. I get that there's no deathrattle on the thing, but jesus, aren't there 3 options for a reason? Resurrection IS a thing in both standard and wild, why is offering a transform such a last option?

Quote from Poghy >>

I dont think any ladder deck would find luck in this challenge, you need to tailor your deck for it. After so much talk about Renolock, I was thinking that the deck might not be able to win against Bomb Warrior. So I had another idea: Jade druid.

Skulking Geist is not available in standard, so its a good starting point. Control decks cant outvalue jades and fatigue is impossible. The deck is already pretty good against aggro thanks to the armor gain. I also have to be able the beat Mecha'thun, so I needed 2x Dirty Rat. Which means I cant play the Oaken Summons package, but its fine.

Another consideration was that I should or shouldnt run the quest, so Ive made 2 decklists. At first, I was thinking that the quest version might be too vulnerable to aggro, but after making the decks, it seems like that the quest version seems better.

So there is the deck:

Challenge Jade Druid 2 Jade Lotus Druid Deck by Poghy - Sep 7, 2019 View Deck String Export to BBCode Export to Cockatrice Export to MarkDown Export to Html Clone this deck
Minion (6) 2x Crystal Merchant 2x Dirty Rat 2x Oasis Surger	Ability (23) 1x Untapped Potential 2x Branching Paths 2x Ultimate Infestation 2x Innervate 2x Jade Idol 2x Lesser Jasper Spellstone 2x Nourish 2x Starfall 1x Naturalize 2x Jade Blossom 1x Poison Seeds 2x Wrath 2x Swipe	Playable Hero (1) 1x Malfurion the Pestilent
Loading Collection

Battletag: Poghy#2365

Im playing on EU.

@Oyabun Im pretty sure your deck is beatable. Not by ladder control warrior, but by a specifical anti aggro deck. If you are undefeated, Im gonna challenge you.

Im gonna be online soon (TM).

 That seems really solid. Without geist, it basically locks out any kind of control deck from having a chance of winning, and I've definitely lost to jade druid even with some super aggro wild decks. I think the best chance at countering you would be some type of Quest Paladin, since I can pump out those eggs and make a bunch of 8/8s before you can ramp up your jades.

If anyone wants to do this on US my tag is Scout#11983. I don't have the best wild collection so I'd probably want to play the standard side of this.

Oh, and the BO7 idea is if blizzard/someone else was doing a tournament of some kind with $$ awarded to the winner. Obviously if you're playing this casually you just do whatever # of games you want, probably with some fine tuning of decks in between just to keep things interesting.

Quote from Bazza74 >>

Player 2 would have a gigantic advantage. Think of the current 5 strongest decks in wild and there are enough tools currently in standard to combat any of them. Would certainly be 70-30 favoured at least. So imho it would not make for entertaining watching.

 Yes, but the strongest decks in wild right now use things that are easily counterable (like secrets). Same goes for something like odd paladin, where it's fairly easy to make a deck that'll just dump on it. There's tools in wild available that are extremely hard to counter, and obviously there'll need to be some creative deckbuilding, not just take the best available wild deck.

The rules are as follows:

Player 1: Creates a deck, can use any cards, standard or wild. Once the list complete, it's turned over to Player 2

Player 2: Creates a counter deck for Player 1's deck, but can only use standard cards. Player 1 does not get P2's decklist.

The match is then played best of 7.

I think this would actually be interesting if there was a tournament done around this. That's something I would actually be interested in watching. It's definitely more interesting than control warrior mirror matches. Both players get a pretty big advantage on 1 aspect. Wild has some ridiculously broken cards, but is that enough of an advantage when someone has the ability to specifically counter your deck? I'm sure there's some wild decks that are so ridiculously hard to counter even if you get to tailor a deck to it. Obviously secret mage or most combo decks probably won't be great choices due to the fact they can be hard countered.

Quote from PsychicSpade >>

Actually, vargoth is disenchantable and obtainable from rise of shadows packs, so I'm betting he'd get a dust refund.

 Yeah, looks like it's craftable now since it's been a while since you could get it for free.

Golden snip-snap probably won't be dustable until it rotates to wild (which is in a few months since it's boomsday)

Quote from Ardrock >>

Well this is rare. I play wall priest a lot and my opponent always gets a silence from Zephrys the Great when I have a Convincing Infiltrator on the board. Perhaps there was something specific in your situation that made this happen?

Quote from scout1515 >>

Quote from acaacovic >>

I guess it has something to do with your hand? Giant = total cards in your hand, bow 3 damage + something else in your hand? And houndmaster for rush beast also that was in your hand? Maybe screenshot, so we can see that specific turn? :)

 First off it doesnt consider your hand cards. Not offering a hex/poly against a deathrattle with 4 mana is inexcusable. I just lost the game because of that. I honestly want a refund for the dust I spent on zephyrs at this point. If they don't give it to me I'm going to ask apple for my money back.

If you really believe this was a calculation mistake, you should open a ticket to Blizzard instead of crying in the forums, as they are constantly releasing new patches to improve the card.

Oh, and spoiler alert: you are not getting any money or dust back. :)

 I have a replay that shows the board state at the time:

https://hsreplay.net/replay/qUdpkyeZAPQEvKfrH9kz8P

Convincing infiltrator isn't a big body but it's deathrattle more than warrants a silence/transform.

And blizzard might not give me dust back, but apple will give me money back.

Quote from acaacovic >>

I guess it has something to do with your hand? Giant = total cards in your hand, bow 3 damage + something else in your hand? And houndmaster for rush beast also that was in your hand? Maybe screenshot, so we can see that specific turn? :)

 First off it doesnt consider your hand cards. Not offering a hex/poly against a deathrattle with 4 mana is inexcusable. I just lost the game because of that. I honestly want a refund for the dust I spent on zephyrs at this point. If they don't give it to me I'm going to ask apple for my money back.

I just played Zephyrs with 4 mana against a convincing infiltrator. I got offered eaglehorn bow, houndmaster, and mountain giant. What kind of trash is that?

Uh, not a single one of these cards are played on ladder.

What bothers me is it'll offer a removal instead of hex against deathrattle minions.. zeph doesn't know big priest will resurrect stuff, but it should at least know how a deathrattle works.

I think it's a bug, the forbidden 1/1 that gains 1/1 for each mana spent doesn't include the 1 cost of the card.

Likewise, you should be paying for the spell first, then spending the remaining mana on the effect.