This deck was the result of several losses with an odd paladin swarm deck. As the title suggests, I'm not sure what it would qualify as, but I essentially went the opposite direct.
As a fair warning, I don't have a PC so I have to write it all out. So I'm not sure if card names will link to their appropriate card view.
Cost minion amount
1 Glacial Shard 2
1 Lost in the Jungles 2
1 Righteous Protector 2
3 Aldor Peacekeeper 2
3 Ironbeak Owl 2
3 Stonehill Defender 2
3 Unidentified Maul 2
5 Darkscale Healer 1
5 Fen Creeper 1
5 Ghostly Charger 1
5 Nesting Roc 1
5 skelemancer 1
5 Spiteful Smith 2 (May be removed)
5 Stranglethorn Tiger 1
7 Furious Ettin 1
7 Stormwind Champion 2
7 Vinecleaver 2
7 War Golem 2
9 Baku the moon eater 1
So far, it's managed a 50% win rate. Compared to the alternate version which sees a lot of minion removal and AoE destruction. This allows for some wiggle room but at a sacrifice.
Generally, early game board flooding is the main objective. Without any answer, recruits can become a sort of removal to make way for bigger minions, while the bigger minions protect the recruits as well.
A standard match will go turn; 1. Lost in the jungles/Righteous Protector. 2. Hero power 3. Maul (if no minions have been cleared), Stonehill Defender (if enemy controls a minion or two) or Hero power + Glacial Shard (if an enemy minion has 3 or more attack and isn't easily dealt with)
By turn 5 or 6 it's Nesting Roc or Fen Creeper. Depending upon how many minions are still alive. After turn 6, Stormwind Champion/War Golem/ Furious Ettin. By then, most AoE spells have been played minus flamestrike which cannot destroy any of the 3 alone. Then Vinecleaver and begin withering down any defenses your opponent has built. Generally, after the first 10 turns, the opponent should be struggling to keep cards in hand. Leaving the battlefield yours.
With Stonehill Defender, I like to go for Sunkeeper Tarim or the other legendary, can't recall it's name (6/6 divine shield and taunt. Deathrattle: equip a 5/3 Ashbringer)
I'm going to continue to test the deck but it seems capable of answering a lot of the decks that rely on late game plays.
As a side note, card suggestions are more than welcome, however I most likely won't have them. Especially legendary. But if it seems like a good fit, let me know how it goes!
On Android you can also copy-paste deck codes; I don't know about iOS.
When looking at the cards in the deck, my main question is whether it's worth to keep using Baku. If you'd drop her, you could just include Tarim in the deck itself, plus you could get a much better curve. I think Baku is good either in decks that consist of mostly 1 and 3 mana cards, since then you can combine those to spend all your mana each turn, or in control decks that don't care all that much about mana efficiency. What you're trying to create is a mid-range deck, which should care about mana efficiency, but you have a lot of 5 and 7 mana cards, which would make it difficult to spend all you mana on even turns.
Another thing you could do without Baku's restriction is replace the Golems with Stormwatcher and then use Corpsetaker which would get shield, taunt and windfury, possibly even lifesteal if you could find a spot for a minion such as Chillblade Champion.
You'd also have access to Equality, which allows your 1/1s to kill much larger minions from the opponent.
Silver Sword could be an alternative to Stormwind Champion: unlike the Champion, its buffs stay when the card leaves play and if it doesn't get removed immediately, you can buff again the next turn. Most decks that play weapon removal only play one copy, so you could let Vinecleaver take the hit and then follow up with the Silver Sword.
If you do want to keep Baku, then why drop Fungalmancer? It seems to me that when you're playing a minion-heavy deck with a minion-creating hero power, there will always be a moment in a game that Fungalmancer is a good play.
The very diverse selection of 5-drops suggests that you haven't quite figured out what you want the deck to do. Stranglethorn Tiger is likely to survive until the next turn because of its stealth, but you don't really have a play like Fungalmancer or Spikeridged Steed or Bonemare to take advantage of that. Skelemancer punishes AoE but is bad against silence and taunts, both of which are used a lot in the current meta. So I think you'd be better off using high-health minions instead of those two, or possibly deathrattles that don't care about the turn on which they go off, like Rotten Applebaum or Bone Drake.
I’m sorry, but this is a bad design. It’s not due to not having legendaries either, there are just poor card choices. You should look at what the tuned high win rate deck lists for odd Paladin are and then compare your decklist. Think of why they are using cards like level up and why you chose war golems and then think about what this archetype and deck does and whether it fits what you are trying to do. This will hopefully improve your understanding of the game and what archetypes aim to do and how even just 2 or 3 card choices can have a big impact on the match.
Over half the cards you speak of, I don't have. But I don't have Fungalmancer in the deck. It's spiteful Smith that I'm thinking of dropping. But I'll see what I can do in regards to the cards you suggested
Please bear in mind that not every player is either a long term player, or a pay to winner. These are the cards I have at my disposal. I'm not requesting that you use them yourself. Merely looking for constructive feedback. Not your opinions on the card. And secondly, what's wrong with war golem? I've won a handful of games with it already.
I chose cards like war golem to deal with late game problems mostly. To that extent, it's been fairly successful in comparison to the other odd version I've ran that focused on what you speak of. Level ups, corridor creepers, funglemancers, etc. Etc. Ad nauseam. The problem I faced was more long lasting decks like token druid, quest warrior etc. That the deck design just cannot compete with. So I went my own route. As it stands, the deck is 10/11 which isn't horrible.
I'm not saying the deck is wrong. I'm saying I have tried it, and tried it, and tried it... well over 50 times. Either I'm not running it correctly, or the fact that everyone runs a copy/paste makes it extraordinarily easy to counter and predict. Take your pick, I'm not shy about being incompetent.
War Golem , Fen Creeper and Skelemancer (in particular because you do not have any means to make the opponent kill him) are just not good cards. Also Furious Ettin and Spiteful Smith and Ghostly Charger are questionable. And 1 ironbeak owl should be enough as a tech option since a 2/1 for 3 mana is just bad tempo. I am also not convinced of Darkscale Healer. That are 8-9 cards to replace.
The most important cards are probably two Divine Favor to keep you going. In a budget version I'd replace the rest of the above mentioned cards with some of the following choices: Frostwolf Warlord , Raid Leader, Cobalt Scalebane and/or Tar Creeper. other option could be Fire Fly and Argent Squire. Besides the divine favor, all these cards should be commons.
Shadowpheonix, first of all, welcome to Hearthpwn!
As for the deck and the response to it, I think you need to decide what exactly is it that you are looking for with this post. If you want to present a deck for others to use (which seems to be the case, as you're also explaining to others how to use it), and want feedback on the deck design - then "I don't have the card" is maybe not the best response when people suggest card swaps. We are discussing a deck for everyone to play, right?
Also, if you are looking for feedback, then please be receptive to receiving it. e.g. avoid things like: "Merely looking for constructive feedback. Not your opinions on the card." Opinions on cards are part of the feedback, you can't have feedback without discussing individual cards and whether a better alternative exists for the purpose.
or: "Please bear in mind that not every player is either a long term player, or a pay to winner." If you want to create a budget deck, limited by e.g. dust, that's fine. However, then cards should be chosen based on dust cost, and again not on what you personally have.
Anyway, you'll find that there are plenty of friendly and helpful people here who will discuss decks and card choices, design decks with your collection in mind, and are even willing to watch you play and tell you if you're making mistakes - but you have to decide what exactly it is that you wish for. And if it's feedback, define what kind of feedback and then be open to it.
Just reading the above, I'm getting a mixed message, and the general response might not be what you expect.
My apologies. The main reason I discuss how I run it, is simply because I'm fairly new. I'm not sure how it should run per say. So I'm looking for flaws. Maybe I should make that a bit more clear.
As for feedback, I simply fail to understand how saying one card is joke and how that equates to beneficial criticism. If a card is thought of as "bad" that's fine. Provide an alternative. Beyond that, it becomes a personal ideation of the worth of said card. You may think a card is "bad" while I do not. With no other feedback given, there is no direct line of action to take. I don't mind critism, I only ask for alternatives.
In terms of my own limited card pool and others using the build for themselves, I discuss this in my OT. If someone has a better way to run the deck, then by all means I hope they do. Even though I lack the legendaries to back the deck up, it does have a decent win rate. That being said, I could see taking out Baku for something like Prince Keleseth. Boosting the deck even further.
I do apologize again. I'm not attempting to be hostile or unreceptive. If that's how I come off. Though it is worth noting the deck has some potential. It just needs a player with the right card pool. I've taken down a fair share of taunt druids, spiteful mages and spiteful priests with the deck as it is. I can only imagine how a player with a better card pool could take the deck in an even better direction.
Those are my thoughts. If anything else is unclear, please let me know.
It's right to doubt if people say "card X is bad" just because they say it. I mean, cards like Stormwind Champion or Raid Leader were also considered too weak to be played, but with the right deck they improved. So I will give you an example why I consider these bad cards:
War golem is just stats on turn 7. It does nothing for immediate tempo (impact on the board). And not even prime stats if you compare the 7 cost War Golem with other 7 drops that are played like Spiteful Summoner (who usually adds a 8-10 cost minion to the board) or Blazecaller (just 6/6 but 5 damage immediate impact is huge). Also fen creeper is just below the games power curve. Druid has a 3/6 taunt for 4 mana. Conditional, that is true, but an easy condition. For 5 mana these stats are not enough (compare it with Nesting Roc which is also not played in top tier decks).
If you play odd paladin, you have to ask yourself what the goal of your deck is. You have no draw, so it is reasonable to put in more high cost minions to avoid running out of steam. However, with the exception of Stormwind Champion the minions you chose do not have synergy with your upgraded hero power. Sure, it is a gameplan to replace the early game by the upgraded hero power but Odd Paladin is the most powerful when you can squeeze as much advantage out of the board flooding as possible. What you have now is basically a solid arena deck but even in arena the cards you put in your deck are average. In constructed, average is not enough to compete.
But if the cards you chose are doing their job and you are happy, it is fine. You just got the feedback you asked for.
This deck was the result of several losses with an odd paladin swarm deck. As the title suggests, I'm not sure what it would qualify as, but I essentially went the opposite direct.
As a fair warning, I don't have a PC so I have to write it all out. So I'm not sure if card names will link to their appropriate card view.
Cost minion amount
1 Glacial Shard 2
1 Lost in the Jungles 2
1 Righteous Protector 2
3 Aldor Peacekeeper 2
3 Ironbeak Owl 2
3 Stonehill Defender 2
3 Unidentified Maul 2
5 Darkscale Healer 1
5 Fen Creeper 1
5 Ghostly Charger 1
5 Nesting Roc 1
5 skelemancer 1
5 Spiteful Smith 2 (May be removed)
5 Stranglethorn Tiger 1
7 Furious Ettin 1
7 Stormwind Champion 2
7 Vinecleaver 2
7 War Golem 2
9 Baku the moon eater 1
So far, it's managed a 50% win rate. Compared to the alternate version which sees a lot of minion removal and AoE destruction. This allows for some wiggle room but at a sacrifice.
Generally, early game board flooding is the main objective. Without any answer, recruits can become a sort of removal to make way for bigger minions, while the bigger minions protect the recruits as well.
A standard match will go turn; 1. Lost in the jungles/Righteous Protector. 2. Hero power 3. Maul (if no minions have been cleared), Stonehill Defender (if enemy controls a minion or two) or Hero power + Glacial Shard (if an enemy minion has 3 or more attack and isn't easily dealt with)
By turn 5 or 6 it's Nesting Roc or Fen Creeper. Depending upon how many minions are still alive. After turn 6, Stormwind Champion/War Golem/ Furious Ettin. By then, most AoE spells have been played minus flamestrike which cannot destroy any of the 3 alone. Then Vinecleaver and begin withering down any defenses your opponent has built. Generally, after the first 10 turns, the opponent should be struggling to keep cards in hand. Leaving the battlefield yours.
With Stonehill Defender, I like to go for Sunkeeper Tarim or the other legendary, can't recall it's name (6/6 divine shield and taunt. Deathrattle: equip a 5/3 Ashbringer)
I'm going to continue to test the deck but it seems capable of answering a lot of the decks that rely on late game plays.
As a side note, card suggestions are more than welcome, however I most likely won't have them. Especially legendary. But if it seems like a good fit, let me know how it goes!
On Android you can also copy-paste deck codes; I don't know about iOS.
When looking at the cards in the deck, my main question is whether it's worth to keep using Baku. If you'd drop her, you could just include Tarim in the deck itself, plus you could get a much better curve. I think Baku is good either in decks that consist of mostly 1 and 3 mana cards, since then you can combine those to spend all your mana each turn, or in control decks that don't care all that much about mana efficiency. What you're trying to create is a mid-range deck, which should care about mana efficiency, but you have a lot of 5 and 7 mana cards, which would make it difficult to spend all you mana on even turns.
Another thing you could do without Baku's restriction is replace the Golems with Stormwatcher and then use Corpsetaker which would get shield, taunt and windfury, possibly even lifesteal if you could find a spot for a minion such as Chillblade Champion.
You'd also have access to Equality, which allows your 1/1s to kill much larger minions from the opponent.
Silver Sword could be an alternative to Stormwind Champion: unlike the Champion, its buffs stay when the card leaves play and if it doesn't get removed immediately, you can buff again the next turn. Most decks that play weapon removal only play one copy, so you could let Vinecleaver take the hit and then follow up with the Silver Sword.
If you do want to keep Baku, then why drop Fungalmancer? It seems to me that when you're playing a minion-heavy deck with a minion-creating hero power, there will always be a moment in a game that Fungalmancer is a good play.
The very diverse selection of 5-drops suggests that you haven't quite figured out what you want the deck to do. Stranglethorn Tiger is likely to survive until the next turn because of its stealth, but you don't really have a play like Fungalmancer or Spikeridged Steed or Bonemare to take advantage of that. Skelemancer punishes AoE but is bad against silence and taunts, both of which are used a lot in the current meta. So I think you'd be better off using high-health minions instead of those two, or possibly deathrattles that don't care about the turn on which they go off, like Rotten Applebaum or Bone Drake.
War golem?is that a joke
I’m sorry, but this is a bad design. It’s not due to not having legendaries either, there are just poor card choices. You should look at what the tuned high win rate deck lists for odd Paladin are and then compare your decklist. Think of why they are using cards like level up and why you chose war golems and then think about what this archetype and deck does and whether it fits what you are trying to do. This will hopefully improve your understanding of the game and what archetypes aim to do and how even just 2 or 3 card choices can have a big impact on the match.
Over half the cards you speak of, I don't have. But I don't have Fungalmancer in the deck. It's spiteful Smith that I'm thinking of dropping. But I'll see what I can do in regards to the cards you suggested
Please bear in mind that not every player is either a long term player, or a pay to winner. These are the cards I have at my disposal. I'm not requesting that you use them yourself. Merely looking for constructive feedback. Not your opinions on the card. And secondly, what's wrong with war golem? I've won a handful of games with it already.
I chose cards like war golem to deal with late game problems mostly. To that extent, it's been fairly successful in comparison to the other odd version I've ran that focused on what you speak of. Level ups, corridor creepers, funglemancers, etc. Etc. Ad nauseam. The problem I faced was more long lasting decks like token druid, quest warrior etc. That the deck design just cannot compete with. So I went my own route. As it stands, the deck is 10/11 which isn't horrible.
I'm not saying the deck is wrong. I'm saying I have tried it, and tried it, and tried it... well over 50 times. Either I'm not running it correctly, or the fact that everyone runs a copy/paste makes it extraordinarily easy to counter and predict. Take your pick, I'm not shy about being incompetent.
War Golem , Fen Creeper and Skelemancer (in particular because you do not have any means to make the opponent kill him) are just not good cards. Also Furious Ettin and Spiteful Smith and Ghostly Charger are questionable. And 1 ironbeak owl should be enough as a tech option since a 2/1 for 3 mana is just bad tempo. I am also not convinced of Darkscale Healer. That are 8-9 cards to replace.
The most important cards are probably two Divine Favor to keep you going. In a budget version I'd replace the rest of the above mentioned cards with some of the following choices: Frostwolf Warlord , Raid Leader, Cobalt Scalebane and/or Tar Creeper. other option could be Fire Fly and Argent Squire. Besides the divine favor, all these cards should be commons.
Shadowpheonix, first of all, welcome to Hearthpwn!
As for the deck and the response to it, I think you need to decide what exactly is it that you are looking for with this post.
If you want to present a deck for others to use (which seems to be the case, as you're also explaining to others how to use it), and want feedback on the deck design - then "I don't have the card" is maybe not the best response when people suggest card swaps. We are discussing a deck for everyone to play, right?
Also, if you are looking for feedback, then please be receptive to receiving it.
e.g. avoid things like:
"Merely looking for constructive feedback. Not your opinions on the card."
Opinions on cards are part of the feedback, you can't have feedback without discussing individual cards and whether a better alternative exists for the purpose.
or:
"Please bear in mind that not every player is either a long term player, or a pay to winner."
If you want to create a budget deck, limited by e.g. dust, that's fine. However, then cards should be chosen based on dust cost, and again not on what you personally have.
Anyway, you'll find that there are plenty of friendly and helpful people here who will discuss decks and card choices, design decks with your collection in mind, and are even willing to watch you play and tell you if you're making mistakes - but you have to decide what exactly it is that you wish for. And if it's feedback, define what kind of feedback and then be open to it.
Just reading the above, I'm getting a mixed message, and the general response might not be what you expect.
My apologies. The main reason I discuss how I run it, is simply because I'm fairly new. I'm not sure how it should run per say. So I'm looking for flaws. Maybe I should make that a bit more clear.
As for feedback, I simply fail to understand how saying one card is joke and how that equates to beneficial criticism. If a card is thought of as "bad" that's fine. Provide an alternative. Beyond that, it becomes a personal ideation of the worth of said card. You may think a card is "bad" while I do not. With no other feedback given, there is no direct line of action to take. I don't mind critism, I only ask for alternatives.
In terms of my own limited card pool and others using the build for themselves, I discuss this in my OT. If someone has a better way to run the deck, then by all means I hope they do. Even though I lack the legendaries to back the deck up, it does have a decent win rate. That being said, I could see taking out Baku for something like Prince Keleseth. Boosting the deck even further.
I do apologize again. I'm not attempting to be hostile or unreceptive. If that's how I come off. Though it is worth noting the deck has some potential. It just needs a player with the right card pool. I've taken down a fair share of taunt druids, spiteful mages and spiteful priests with the deck as it is. I can only imagine how a player with a better card pool could take the deck in an even better direction.
Those are my thoughts. If anything else is unclear, please let me know.
It's right to doubt if people say "card X is bad" just because they say it. I mean, cards like Stormwind Champion or Raid Leader were also considered too weak to be played, but with the right deck they improved. So I will give you an example why I consider these bad cards:
War golem is just stats on turn 7. It does nothing for immediate tempo (impact on the board). And not even prime stats if you compare the 7 cost War Golem with other 7 drops that are played like Spiteful Summoner (who usually adds a 8-10 cost minion to the board) or Blazecaller (just 6/6 but 5 damage immediate impact is huge). Also fen creeper is just below the games power curve. Druid has a 3/6 taunt for 4 mana. Conditional, that is true, but an easy condition. For 5 mana these stats are not enough (compare it with Nesting Roc which is also not played in top tier decks).
If you play odd paladin, you have to ask yourself what the goal of your deck is. You have no draw, so it is reasonable to put in more high cost minions to avoid running out of steam. However, with the exception of Stormwind Champion the minions you chose do not have synergy with your upgraded hero power. Sure, it is a gameplan to replace the early game by the upgraded hero power but Odd Paladin is the most powerful when you can squeeze as much advantage out of the board flooding as possible. What you have now is basically a solid arena deck but even in arena the cards you put in your deck are average. In constructed, average is not enough to compete.
But if the cards you chose are doing their job and you are happy, it is fine. You just got the feedback you asked for.