2 subjects I'd like to hear your thoughs on them :
1. Main strengh (problem) about New quests are how easy they are to finish and how strong (/oppressive) the reward are. Main reason is because of the battlecry, of course. But is the 5 mana 7/7 body is well balanced too ? (I would argue 5/5 would be better).
2. Reward track : Any "feel bad" feeling when you complete an achievement from a previous Season Reward track, and Blizzard deny you the 100-200-500 exp reward ? Because giving 1/10 of a card pack is too much for accomplishing a often ininteresting task... ?
I'm on board for making the final quest rewards either cost 7 mana, or bring the stats down... but I don't think they will do that. I feel like during one of Iksar's AMAs on Twitter, he mentioned that he was surprised at how fast the quests are being completed, so they may make broad adjustments eventually. I think it would be good for everyone if they slow down the quests a touch.
As for the reward track - I guess I see where you're coming from, it doesn't seem like it would hurt them to let the exp gain remain beyond the expansion the achievements debuted in. I don't see any reason to remove it. New players that didn't get a chance to earn them at the time can still get some extra exp. Why not?
Furthermore, since basically all of these achievements require you to have the cards from the set to do them... gee, it might actually make people want to spend more money on sets that aren't the most recent. Opportunity wasted?
1) The decks running quests probably don't need the big minion on the end. Sure, it adds even more pressure, but the decks run other things to finish the game.
2) No, because I know that only the current achievements reward experience. Some achievements get easier in the next expansion due to added support, so I can understand why they yield experience when they are more difficult.
It's ok, he made a good point. Btw, I never complained once (publicly at least) at Blizzard in 7 years of playing.
Blizzard often improved the game throught years by reducing these "feeling bad" moments, especially when it is at a low cost for them.
For me, having to clear the notification of a achievement done, which most of the time offer a small reward (which is pleasing), to find that's this one is older and for some debatable reasons doesn't provide any reward, is a feel bad moment.
Maybe only a minority of people are feeling the same, but I am curious of what the community really think about this.
Reward track seasons are quite new, so maybe people haven't be exposed much to this situation yet.
It would probably be easier for them not to remove rewards fron achievements and honestly it is so little that I don't get why they even waste time removing it.
1.) yes the stats are too high in my opinion. The battlecray reward is a wincondition on its own. I had enough moments where i could delay the finish enough to win the game myself but the extra 7 dmg of the minion i couldnt deal with or waste resources on just denied it.
2.) im absolutely on your side. I rarely do them tbh but if i do i would like SOMETHING as a reward. Even if its just a tiny amount of xp.
2. Reward track : Any "feel bad" feeling when you complete an achievement from a previous Season Reward track, and Blizzard deny you the 100-200-500 exp reward ? Because giving 1/10 of a card pack is too much for accomplishing a often ininteresting task... ?
I have some feel bad but I understand why it needs to be this way. Otherwise many players will hoard XP granting quests (complete them but not claim the reward) and open a ton of them on day 1 of the new reward track progressing through early levels with lightning speed
1. Quests are boring as killing gameplay because there is no interaction involved. They are mostly overpowered even without the 5 mana 7/7 and frankly the game would have been better off without them. It is inane the blizzard does not get that they need to print cards that interact with quests to make interesting gameplay (i.e. cards that destroy or obstruct quests).
2. The new reward track system is overall crappy. It is needlessly complex and does not add any value to the game experience. The particular problem is emblematic of the needless stupidity of the whole enormous and overly complex system that makes the whole game look increasingly like candy crush. The gazillion awards and a complishments and crap is frankly more or a nuissance than an improvement, I'd take the old system back any day.
1) Yeah they probably miscalculated how fast we could finish quests and overstatted the minions a bit, but I'd also like how I've generally been able to deal with a 7/7 on board (and viceversa) so I don't mind keeping them as is. If anything is fhe Quests themselves that are a bit too strong
2) I get what you mean and as a Free2Player I would agree but I also understand how it would be a bit unbalanced. They are meant to help you during that pass, if they made it retroactive people could "easily" fill in a new account's pass, especially as new expansions release
I have some feel bad but I understand why it needs to be this way. Otherwise many players will hoard XP granting quests (complete them but not claim the reward) and open a ton of them on day 1 of the new reward track progressing through early levels with lightning speed
2) I get what you mean and as a Free2Player I would agree but I also understand how it would be a bit unbalanced. They are meant to help you during that pass, if they made it retroactive people could "easily" fill in a new account's pass, especially as new expansions release
Is that really so bad though? If a player doesn't get the exp and "hoards" it, they are still gaining the same amount of exp whether it was claimed during this expansion or the next one.
The only thing I see here is just not letting new or returning players get exp that they missed. And honestly, the new player experience could be improved a bit more from what I've heard.
2) No, because I know that only the current achievements reward experience. Some achievements get easier in the next expansion due to added support, so I can understand why they yield experience when they are more difficult.
Do you have an example of this? I thought most of the achievements are related to specific cards, so it's hard to complete them unless you have those exact cards in your deck and use them.
Right now the tempo of the 7/7's plays a fairly relevant part in the games ending a turn or two after quest completion.
If you went all out and made them 5 mana 1/1's instead it would definitely scale back the explosive finishes of those games. But keeping the stats and increasing the mana cost instead is probably a better way of doing it.
I have been playing for 5 years and never felt like that before - what happened to the game is love so much ? Well, someone created these horrible questlines.
Yes I feel that getting a 7/7 for 5 when the quest is complete is too strong, but it's not just that. Even some intermediate rewards are too powerful because they make completing the quests even easier : warlocks should not get some life back, shamans should not get their overloaded cristals back and mages should not be able to pick up additional spells.
In my opinion, some other questlines (warrior, rogue...) are better designed because the rewards don't directly accelerate the questline or compensate the penalties you get from trying to complete the questline.
If they arent going to make sweeping changes to the quest one by one then they need to hit the mana cost. 5 mana 7/7's would be fine if they came down 2 turns after quest completion but the best quest are horribly easy to complete and can be played on the same turn even. If they don't do something about the quest, it's going to get REAL old fast.
They won't hit the quests because they are current expac legendaries and they simply don't want to refund a bunch of dust to people.
Iksar said that rarity does not matter as to what is being nerfed but this is just a big fat fucking lie. Should common/rare card be THIS problematic and meta warping they would have been nerfed already.
We can clearly see that support cards are not the issue. Flesh Giant, Incanter's Flow etc are still everywhere because the quests are so fucking bonkers over the top that they still fit in easily. Nobody cared about the Bristleback whatever fckin wlock discard lifesteal pig but now it basically guarantess Wlock players to start the game with 60 health having more healing that Priest and Paladin ever had combined and win simply by surviving WHILE also dropping 0 and 1 cost huge minions on the board.
The quest reward minions can stay as 5 mana 7/7's but they need to be made unplayable on the turn you complete the quest. They already have the tech for this, the rogue quest reward robot does this to enemy minions and they have animation for it.
Also also, they need to make it so when you complete a step in your questline you basically get the next step IN YOUR HAND that you HAVE TO PLAY to start the next step. This would slow down the most oppressive quests while the more late-game oriented ones (pally, priest, war) would be less affected.
Furthermore, since basically all of these achievements require you to have the cards from the set to do them... gee, it might actually make people want to spend more money on sets that aren't the most recent. Opportunity wasted?
The logic is that people spend way more money on the most recent sets. So they are stimulating it even more by making achievements that giving exp exclusive to their expansion. And they gain bigger profit from this, I believe. They do not need to stimulate you to buy packs from the past sets, because there are very few people who would do that. And they will do that anyway, because they want that achievement. The amount of exp is not that high to make you want to buy additional packs from the last expansions.
2 subjects I'd like to hear your thoughs on them :
1. Main strengh (problem) about New quests are how easy they are to finish and how strong (/oppressive) the reward are.
Main reason is because of the battlecry, of course. But is the 5 mana 7/7 body is well balanced too ? (I would argue 5/5 would be better).
2. Reward track : Any "feel bad" feeling when you complete an achievement from a previous Season Reward track, and Blizzard deny you the 100-200-500 exp reward ?
Because giving 1/10 of a card pack is too much for accomplishing a often ininteresting task... ?
I'm on board for making the final quest rewards either cost 7 mana, or bring the stats down... but I don't think they will do that. I feel like during one of Iksar's AMAs on Twitter, he mentioned that he was surprised at how fast the quests are being completed, so they may make broad adjustments eventually. I think it would be good for everyone if they slow down the quests a touch.
As for the reward track - I guess I see where you're coming from, it doesn't seem like it would hurt them to let the exp gain remain beyond the expansion the achievements debuted in. I don't see any reason to remove it. New players that didn't get a chance to earn them at the time can still get some extra exp. Why not?
Furthermore, since basically all of these achievements require you to have the cards from the set to do them... gee, it might actually make people want to spend more money on sets that aren't the most recent. Opportunity wasted?
If 1/10 of a card pack is such a small thing, why do you let it hurt your feelings?
"Why, you never expected justice from a company, did you? They have neither a soul to lose nor a body to kick." -- Lady Saba Holland
look the blizzard defenders are getting salty. Must suck having to defend crap like that all day.
1) The decks running quests probably don't need the big minion on the end. Sure, it adds even more pressure, but the decks run other things to finish the game.
2) No, because I know that only the current achievements reward experience. Some achievements get easier in the next expansion due to added support, so I can understand why they yield experience when they are more difficult.
It's ok, he made a good point. Btw, I never complained once (publicly at least) at Blizzard in 7 years of playing.
Blizzard often improved the game throught years by reducing these "feeling bad" moments, especially when it is at a low cost for them.
For me, having to clear the notification of a achievement done, which most of the time offer a small reward (which is pleasing), to find that's this one is older and for some debatable reasons doesn't provide any reward, is a feel bad moment.
Maybe only a minority of people are feeling the same, but I am curious of what the community really think about this.
Reward track seasons are quite new, so maybe people haven't be exposed much to this situation yet.
It would probably be easier for them not to remove rewards fron achievements and honestly it is so little that I don't get why they even waste time removing it.
1.) yes the stats are too high in my opinion. The battlecray reward is a wincondition on its own. I had enough moments where i could delay the finish enough to win the game myself but the extra 7 dmg of the minion i couldnt deal with or waste resources on just denied it.
2.) im absolutely on your side. I rarely do them tbh but if i do i would like SOMETHING as a reward. Even if its just a tiny amount of xp.
10 7/7
I have some feel bad but I understand why it needs to be this way. Otherwise many players will hoard XP granting quests (complete them but not claim the reward) and open a ton of them on day 1 of the new reward track progressing through early levels with lightning speed
1. Quests are boring as killing gameplay because there is no interaction involved. They are mostly overpowered even without the 5 mana 7/7 and frankly the game would have been better off without them. It is inane the blizzard does not get that they need to print cards that interact with quests to make interesting gameplay (i.e. cards that destroy or obstruct quests).
2. The new reward track system is overall crappy. It is needlessly complex and does not add any value to the game experience. The particular problem is emblematic of the needless stupidity of the whole enormous and overly complex system that makes the whole game look increasingly like candy crush. The gazillion awards and a complishments and crap is frankly more or a nuissance than an improvement, I'd take the old system back any day.
1) Yeah they probably miscalculated how fast we could finish quests and overstatted the minions a bit, but I'd also like how I've generally been able to deal with a 7/7 on board (and viceversa) so I don't mind keeping them as is. If anything is fhe Quests themselves that are a bit too strong
2) I get what you mean and as a Free2Player I would agree but I also understand how it would be a bit unbalanced. They are meant to help you during that pass, if they made it retroactive people could "easily" fill in a new account's pass, especially as new expansions release
And i don’t even play Paladins
Is that really so bad though? If a player doesn't get the exp and "hoards" it, they are still gaining the same amount of exp whether it was claimed during this expansion or the next one.
The only thing I see here is just not letting new or returning players get exp that they missed. And honestly, the new player experience could be improved a bit more from what I've heard.
Do you have an example of this? I thought most of the achievements are related to specific cards, so it's hard to complete them unless you have those exact cards in your deck and use them.
Right now the tempo of the 7/7's plays a fairly relevant part in the games ending a turn or two after quest completion.
If you went all out and made them 5 mana 1/1's instead it would definitely scale back the explosive finishes of those games.
But keeping the stats and increasing the mana cost instead is probably a better way of doing it.
I have been playing for 5 years and never felt like that before - what happened to the game is love so much ? Well, someone created these horrible questlines.
Yes I feel that getting a 7/7 for 5 when the quest is complete is too strong, but it's not just that. Even some intermediate rewards are too powerful because they make completing the quests even easier : warlocks should not get some life back, shamans should not get their overloaded cristals back and mages should not be able to pick up additional spells.
In my opinion, some other questlines (warrior, rogue...) are better designed because the rewards don't directly accelerate the questline or compensate the penalties you get from trying to complete the questline.
i play quest rogue and this 7/7 is one of the win condition.The stats are ok maybe the cost can be 6 mana for all quest reward.
If they arent going to make sweeping changes to the quest one by one then they need to hit the mana cost. 5 mana 7/7's would be fine if they came down 2 turns after quest completion but the best quest are horribly easy to complete and can be played on the same turn even. If they don't do something about the quest, it's going to get REAL old fast.
They won't hit the quests because they are current expac legendaries and they simply don't want to refund a bunch of dust to people.
Iksar said that rarity does not matter as to what is being nerfed but this is just a big fat fucking lie.
Should common/rare card be THIS problematic and meta warping they would have been nerfed already.
We can clearly see that support cards are not the issue. Flesh Giant, Incanter's Flow etc are still everywhere because the quests are so fucking bonkers over the top that they still fit in easily.
Nobody cared about the Bristleback whatever fckin wlock discard lifesteal pig but now it basically guarantess Wlock players to start the game with 60 health having more healing that Priest and Paladin ever had combined and win simply by surviving WHILE also dropping 0 and 1 cost huge minions on the board.
The quest reward minions can stay as 5 mana 7/7's but they need to be made unplayable on the turn you complete the quest.
They already have the tech for this, the rogue quest reward robot does this to enemy minions and they have animation for it.
Also also, they need to make it so when you complete a step in your questline you basically get the next step IN YOUR HAND that you HAVE TO PLAY to start the next step.
This would slow down the most oppressive quests while the more late-game oriented ones (pally, priest, war) would be less affected.
look out the devs here will ban you for trying to break their censorship
The logic is that people spend way more money on the most recent sets. So they are stimulating it even more by making achievements that giving exp exclusive to their expansion. And they gain bigger profit from this, I believe. They do not need to stimulate you to buy packs from the past sets, because there are very few people who would do that. And they will do that anyway, because they want that achievement. The amount of exp is not that high to make you want to buy additional packs from the last expansions.