Thought I would share this rather interesting information, Soul Mirror is also doing poorly, meanwhile ...surprisingly (?) Nagrand Slam is doing really well.
Maybe this expansion is gonna cost me less than expected afterall, haven't crafted anything yet since I'am always waiting until new Legendarys are established in the new Meta.
If you find any other hyped up cards from this Set that don't quite measure up to the Standart, post them here !
To be honest, I play a bunch of the Prime cards and so far I've been very rarely playing them as they only arrive pretty late in the game and it's usually over by then.
I think in my 30+ games as mage so far I've played Solarian Prime once or maybe twice.
If you want to assess the overall performance of a card, it's better to look at Drawn WR rather than Played WR, because finisher cards have an "artificially" higher played winrate (because you normally play them to finish the game).
The Paladin Prime is prob the one that's done the best for me so far. That's just a good solid card. Warlock one is decent as well. Quite versatile.
High rolling with Priest one in Res Priest is nuts but I have found to to generally underperform in most games.
And Kanrethad Ebonlocke, but rarely ever the prime (I don't think I even played that one ONCE to be honest), but that's mostly because Kanrethad catches a silence a lot.
Okay first of all, it's correct that the cards appears to be doing poorly but we have to establish how to properly look at the stats.
I can see you look at "played winrate" which pretty much doesn't say anything about a cards quality. You need to at least sort it by "drawn winrate" instead, because the stats then tells you how your deck performs once the chosen card enters the game.
There are other ways that indicate it's still to early to say how cards are performing in archetypes that excisted before launch of the phoenix, but that requires a longer explanation.
I do however think that Zixors low winrate is a question of which decks he's played in and how he's being tutored.
Soul Mirror is the absolute best card in Resurrect Priest atm. So it's def not doing poorly.
Nagrand Slam is of course "when played" doing pretty good. Because if you actually have the room and many to play it, you'll probably win. But you rarely reach 10 mana if you draw Nagrand Slam early on which makes it one of the worst cards in Highlander Hunter atm.
So I'm sorry to tell you that you're take is wrong.
Okay first of all, it's correct that the cards appears to be doing poorly but we have to establish how to properly look at the stats.
I can see you look at "played winrate" which pretty much doesn't say anything about a cards quality. You need to at least sort it by "drawn winrate" instead, because the stats then tells you how your deck performs once the chosen card enters the game.
There are other ways that indicate it's still to early to say how cards are performing in archetypes that excisted before launch of the phoenix, but that requires a longer explanation.
I do however think that Zixors low winrate is a question of which decks he's played in and how he's being tutored.
Soul Mirror is the absolute best card in Resurrect Priest atm. So it's def not doing poorly.
Nagrand Slam is of course "when played" doing pretty good. Because if you actually have the room and many to play it, you'll probably win. But you rarely reach 10 mana if you draw Nagrand Slam early on which makes it one of the worst cards in Highlander Hunter atm.
So I'm sorry to tell you that you're take is wrong.
I want to apoligize in advance btw, I wasn't intentionally trying to be mean or BM. I can see how it may how sounded though.
Stats are evil little liars when you don't read them properly. I don't wanna start a big debate about stats. It would be quite boring. YukazoHS already made some very good points.
I thought Zixxor was gonna be the nuts, and was hoping to open it, but the meta is way too fast right now for it to work, specially if you want to buff it.
I was a little disappointed getting Ebonlocke, but right now he sees to be pulling a ridiculous amount of work in Zoo.
If you want to assess the overall performance of a card, it's better to look at Drawn WR rather than Played WR, because finisher cards have an "artificially" higher played winrate (because you normally play them to finish the game).
And the other way around, board clearers like Soul Mirror will usually be used in situations where you're pretty fucked.
Losing to Sire Denathrius makes me not want to play this game anymore. The Sire Denathrius nerf makes me want to play this game again. Losing to Deathrattle Rogue makes me not want to play this game anymore. The Prince Renathal nerf makes me not want to play this game anymore.
I think the only two viable Primes are Warlock and Warrior to be honest. Running a control warlock with a way to get out big demons late and or bait out removal is very good and Warrior's is just pure value because 9 times out of 10 you can remove a minion and trigger death rattle without worrying about silence. That being said, I have run a Shaman deck that abuses the fact that Reliquary is the only 1 cost legendary so 1 cost spells + The Fist of Ra-den is great for generating LOADS of them, but that deck is barely viable and barley breaks even to be honest.
Paladin Prime is also good but I feel like most time's it's a Hat on a Hat of just a good 2 drop. I can't tell you how many games i've played with a Pure Paladin deck where I've never seen it drawn or its Prime death rattle. Feels good to get it off of 7 mana 7/7 generate 5 cards though.
Rogue Prime is a great 3 and 6 drop and can really threaten a board; I play him in my Highlander deck, but I feel like he's a little gimmicky and 9 times out of 10 I only ever play his initial form and never see the prime. Good body on 3 though.
Other than those; I have NEVER seen any of the other primes in game once. Even with Druid Prime benefiting a big minion, I feel like Big Druid is becoming so refined it doesn't really need that anymore and benefits more on ramp and Marsh Hydra's
Reliquary of Souls isn't particularly good without Activate the Obelisk - and most of res and highlander Priests don't play it. It's far from the strongest card in the deck, but it's a decent addition. On top of that you need to remember that playing Reliquary of Souls does not equal to playing Reliquary Prime.
Losing to Sire Denathrius makes me not want to play this game anymore. The Sire Denathrius nerf makes me want to play this game again. Losing to Deathrattle Rogue makes me not want to play this game anymore. The Prince Renathal nerf makes me not want to play this game anymore.
- As people said, drawn w/r is a better stat, but it is still imperfect. - Demon Hunter suppressed everything - Some Primes are bad because they're in a struggling class or don't quite fit something that isn't there yet (Priest, Mage, Shaman) - Or they're being played in decks that are otherwise bad but will probably be good when the class settles on the good decks, (Deathrattle Hunter isn't good, but Zixor is played a lot in that, Warrior Prime is good, but the best way to play Warrior is still up in the air.)
Hmmm... I got the priest and mage primes in a pack and I crafted the warrior and hunter prime.
I played the hunter prime in quest hunter and it performed well synergising with every aspect of the deck (beast, rush, summoning multiple minions). At that time demon hunter was still unnerfed so it dit not amazing against that (though it could beat it) but it crushed most other things.
Then I made a highlander version of quest and it performed even better. Zixxor is going to make it, I'm pretty certain of that.
The mage prime felt insane too. It's simply better yogg if you get the prime. And the warrior one is just super solid on both parts of the card.
The priest one? Yes. Disappointing. Mostly because priest lacks actual good buffst at the moment. Especially attack buffs which this card needs most.
By the way random thought. Do you know which card suddenly became better in highlander? Body Wrapper. With the low cost high value prime cards, you have more options to shuffle something great in your deck early on. I shuffled either zeph or a prime in my deck on turn 4 a couple of times and got them back that same game to great effect. I can tell you, using zeph to clear a demon on turn 2 feels a lot less bad if you shuffle it back in on turn 4.
Yep, Prime's are almost like White Eyes that already never saw play, they're just too slow except the Warlock one that instantly reduces costs of Demons in Zoolock. Streamers like Regis are already promoting hyper fast decks like Teron-Lepergnome-Deathrattle-Hunter, Evolve Aggro Shaman and the mentioned Handbuff Zoolock, there is no way in hell any of these other Prime's EXCEPT maybe the Warrior one in Triple-Bulwark-Tank-Warrior will see play in this up-pacing Meta.
Thought I would share this rather interesting information, Soul Mirror is also doing poorly, meanwhile ...surprisingly (?) Nagrand Slam is doing really well.
Maybe this expansion is gonna cost me less than expected afterall, haven't crafted anything yet since I'am always waiting until new Legendarys are established in the new Meta.
If you find any other hyped up cards from this Set that don't quite measure up to the Standart, post them here !
To be honest, I play a bunch of the Prime cards and so far I've been very rarely playing them as they only arrive pretty late in the game and it's usually over by then.
I think in my 30+ games as mage so far I've played Solarian Prime once or maybe twice.
Primes seldom are of any use. Games over by then. Not much need of puting them in the deck . Instead use a tech card.
The Paladin Prime is prob the one that's done the best for me so far. That's just a good solid card. Warlock one is decent as well. Quite versatile.
High rolling with Priest one in Res Priest is nuts but I have found to to generally underperform in most games.
Missing lethal since June 2015.
If you want to assess the overall performance of a card, it's better to look at Drawn WR rather than Played WR, because finisher cards have an "artificially" higher played winrate (because you normally play them to finish the game).
playing Priest all day since dlc release and i draw reliquary prime exactly 1 time...in a priest mirror when he was useless.
except Maieb, this expansion has the worst neutral legendaries ever btw
And Kanrethad Ebonlocke, but rarely ever the prime (I don't think I even played that one ONCE to be honest), but that's mostly because Kanrethad catches a silence a lot.
Okay first of all, it's correct that the cards appears to be doing poorly but we have to establish how to properly look at the stats.
I can see you look at "played winrate" which pretty much doesn't say anything about a cards quality. You need to at least sort it by "drawn winrate" instead, because the stats then tells you how your deck performs once the chosen card enters the game.
There are other ways that indicate it's still to early to say how cards are performing in archetypes that excisted before launch of the phoenix, but that requires a longer explanation.
I do however think that Zixors low winrate is a question of which decks he's played in and how he's being tutored.
Soul Mirror is the absolute best card in Resurrect Priest atm. So it's def not doing poorly.
Nagrand Slam is of course "when played" doing pretty good. Because if you actually have the room and many to play it, you'll probably win. But you rarely reach 10 mana if you draw Nagrand Slam early on which makes it one of the worst cards in Highlander Hunter atm.
So I'm sorry to tell you that you're take is wrong.
I want to apoligize in advance btw, I wasn't intentionally trying to be mean or BM. I can see how it may how sounded though.
With an agressive meta, Prime cards wont ever be good. And with all the Demon Hunters we have an agressive meta.
The priest prime is not at good card at all, because of the lack of draw in priest.
Zixor is not good unless you play control, and that deck is not great right now
Silver Hand Recruit
As I main warrior and priest, I craft all of their new cards every xpac and hope that someone smarter than me will come up with an idea.
Stats are evil little liars when you don't read them properly. I don't wanna start a big debate about stats. It would be quite boring. YukazoHS already made some very good points.
I thought Zixxor was gonna be the nuts, and was hoping to open it, but the meta is way too fast right now for it to work, specially if you want to buff it.
I was a little disappointed getting Ebonlocke, but right now he sees to be pulling a ridiculous amount of work in Zoo.
I predicted reliquary to be sub-par and so far, it's performing as expected.... Sub-par.
And the other way around, board clearers like Soul Mirror will usually be used in situations where you're pretty fucked.
Standard, Wild, and Classic player.Losing to Sire Denathrius makes me not want to play this game anymore.The Sire Denathrius nerf makes me want to play this game again.
Losing to Deathrattle Rogue makes me not want to play this game anymore.
The Prince Renathal nerf makes me not want to play this game anymore.
I think the only two viable Primes are Warlock and Warrior to be honest. Running a control warlock with a way to get out big demons late and or bait out removal is very good and Warrior's is just pure value because 9 times out of 10 you can remove a minion and trigger death rattle without worrying about silence. That being said, I have run a Shaman deck that abuses the fact that Reliquary is the only 1 cost legendary so 1 cost spells + The Fist of Ra-den is great for generating LOADS of them, but that deck is barely viable and barley breaks even to be honest.
Paladin Prime is also good but I feel like most time's it's a Hat on a Hat of just a good 2 drop. I can't tell you how many games i've played with a Pure Paladin deck where I've never seen it drawn or its Prime death rattle. Feels good to get it off of 7 mana 7/7 generate 5 cards though.
Rogue Prime is a great 3 and 6 drop and can really threaten a board; I play him in my Highlander deck, but I feel like he's a little gimmicky and 9 times out of 10 I only ever play his initial form and never see the prime. Good body on 3 though.
Other than those; I have NEVER seen any of the other primes in game once. Even with Druid Prime benefiting a big minion, I feel like Big Druid is becoming so refined it doesn't really need that anymore and benefits more on ramp and Marsh Hydra's
Weekly Card Design Competition 10.15
Reliquary of Souls isn't particularly good without Activate the Obelisk - and most of res and highlander Priests don't play it. It's far from the strongest card in the deck, but it's a decent addition. On top of that you need to remember that playing Reliquary of Souls does not equal to playing Reliquary Prime.
Standard, Wild, and Classic player.Losing to Sire Denathrius makes me not want to play this game anymore.The Sire Denathrius nerf makes me want to play this game again.
Losing to Deathrattle Rogue makes me not want to play this game anymore.
The Prince Renathal nerf makes me not want to play this game anymore.
There are a number of reasons.
- As people said, drawn w/r is a better stat, but it is still imperfect.
- Demon Hunter suppressed everything
- Some Primes are bad because they're in a struggling class or don't quite fit something that isn't there yet (Priest, Mage, Shaman)
- Or they're being played in decks that are otherwise bad but will probably be good when the class settles on the good decks, (Deathrattle Hunter isn't good, but Zixor is played a lot in that, Warrior Prime is good, but the best way to play Warrior is still up in the air.)
Hmmm... I got the priest and mage primes in a pack and I crafted the warrior and hunter prime.
I played the hunter prime in quest hunter and it performed well synergising with every aspect of the deck (beast, rush, summoning multiple minions). At that time demon hunter was still unnerfed so it dit not amazing against that (though it could beat it) but it crushed most other things.
Then I made a highlander version of quest and it performed even better. Zixxor is going to make it, I'm pretty certain of that.
The mage prime felt insane too. It's simply better yogg if you get the prime. And the warrior one is just super solid on both parts of the card.
The priest one? Yes. Disappointing. Mostly because priest lacks actual good buffst at the moment. Especially attack buffs which this card needs most.
By the way random thought. Do you know which card suddenly became better in highlander? Body Wrapper. With the low cost high value prime cards, you have more options to shuffle something great in your deck early on. I shuffled either zeph or a prime in my deck on turn 4 a couple of times and got them back that same game to great effect. I can tell you, using zeph to clear a demon on turn 2 feels a lot less bad if you shuffle it back in on turn 4.
Yep, Prime's are almost like White Eyes that already never saw play, they're just too slow except the Warlock one that instantly reduces costs of Demons in Zoolock. Streamers like Regis are already promoting hyper fast decks like Teron-Lepergnome-Deathrattle-Hunter, Evolve Aggro Shaman and the mentioned Handbuff Zoolock, there is no way in hell any of these other Prime's EXCEPT maybe the Warrior one in Triple-Bulwark-Tank-Warrior will see play in this up-pacing Meta.