Divine Favor - Punish your opponent for having more cards than u! Spreading Plague - Insta-Win vs. aggro decks, just because they have more minions than u have! Kingsbane, The Caverns Below - Punish your opponent, because he is playing control!
Divine Favor - Punish your opponent for always playing their deck the same way and not playing around one of your best cards!
Spreading Plague - Punish aggro decks with no ways to buff their minions for not playing around one of your best cards!
Quest/Kingsbane - Because control decks should never have bad matchups!
Lol I know right. The only one I kind of get is spreading plague, but that's not a design issue. The 5 health is just a tad too high. The card would be fair at 1/4
Doomguard is becoming more and more troublesome, but I know I'm biased in thinking this haha. I just hate that warlocks have so many ways to avoid the battlecry (zoo decks easily emptying and refilling hands, Possessed Lackey, Skull of the Man'ari). I just hate that card so much.
Also, Preparation forever dooms rogues to only get bad cards lol.
Other than these, I'm sure all the actual worst cards have already been mentioned.
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Twitch name: Anatak15 NA Legend Season 48, 49, 52, 53, 54, 74
I think the perfect example of bad design is Temporus. In current state it's worst legendary dragon in game, but if priest will receive support for him (like Ice Block) he definitely will be OPAF.
Special runner up goes to Dirty Rat, because hey, why WOULDN'T we print a card that fucks over every combo deck ever?
The real question is why aren't they doing more of that. This game needs means of disruptive play so bad.
No it doesn't, when something is problematic enough to need to be disrupted it needs to be changed. Alternatively, the disruptions could be conditional or something to only disrupt what they need to. There's no need to ruin a new F2P player's fun by removing Lord Jaraxxus from their hand.
These threads tend to turn into "I hate losing to" discussions. I do not agree that OP cards / cards that counter certain strategies very well and bad design is the same thing. The strong cards were at least designed well enough to be a part of the game!
IMO the worst designs are the junk ones which are not interresting nor playable, and offer next to nothing to the game. Like this guy:
Yes, it actually gets bumped back to your hand when you use your heropower. Did they know the whole mechanic would suck?
These threads tend to turn into "I hate losing to" discussions. I do not agree that OP cards / cards that counter certain strategies very well and bad design is the same thing. The strong cards were at least designed well enough to be a part of the game!
IMO the worst designs are the junk ones which are not interresting nor playable, and offer next to nothing to the game.
Yeah it does seem like a lot of people went that direction. I still think Shadowreaper Anduin (specifically with pre-nerf Raza the Chained) was poor design haha. They realized this quick enough, thankfully haha. OP cards are allowed to be poorly designed.
Coliseum manager is pure garbage though haha. As people have mentioned, I also think Flame Leviathan is terrible design. Such a mechanic could be cool if there were more cards to help it (something like look at the next 3 cards and reorder them how you want - Scry? from MTG?). I even recall thinking they must have had plans for such an interaction. But then they just never did anything for it at all haha.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Twitch name: Anatak15 NA Legend Season 48, 49, 52, 53, 54, 74
A design flaw regarding quests and death knights, not related to their actual in-game impact:
These cards are too essential for playing a broad variety of decks that they simply shouldn't have come with expansions but rather with old-school adventures (e. g. the Lich King challenges would have been a perfect fit). or something similar. Buy the adventure, master 9 challenges and get the respective class card.
These cards are way too hard to get via acquiring packs.
I think the recruit mechanic itself is an awful design. Cheating out minions from your deck is so powerful it will dominate the meta until it's there. It requires most decks to play silence and cheating out high statted minions with negative battlecries (doomguard, charged devilsaur, deathwing) or expensive minions with good deathrattles is unfair. I think the game shouldn't have insane power turns as it makes some matches unfairly one sided.
I'll go with Posessed Lackey for the worst designed card from standard
Divine Favour. Only card in the game which is designed to maximize it's value by forcing the player to minimize the value of their other cards. Every other card in the game works best when you maximize the value of the other cards you play, but Divine Favour doesn't, it asks the player to minimize the value of the cards they have just to generate more value with Divine Favour.
This goes completely against almost every basic principle of any card game, including Hearthstone.
Divine Favor is awesome because it enables critical mass decks that work better together than individually. It creates interesting gameplay because slower decks have to change the way they play. Cards shouldn't all work the same way anyway, and if your cards are individually more powerful then you should be trading resources aggressively.
And you're totally wrong about HS and other games being about maximizing value. Magic is full of cards that incentivize you to play out your hand quickly. Infernal Tutor, Wheel of Fortune, Balance. Not to mention mana accelerants like Dark Ritual, Mox Diamond, Simian Spirit Guide. These cards are strict card disadvantage, they're played for tempo and immediacy, not value, and they're among the most powerful cards in the game.
Really? First time see the card I sure that will be nerfed, it is just retarded, it is like release a neutral minion 1 mana 3/3 no text, of course everyone will use and be busted.
I hate the design of explosive runes. With kabal lackey in wild mages get it out by turn 1 or 3 with kirin tor mage, and its good no matter when its played, not to mention it's discoverable. If its early, my hero will take a good amount of damage, if its late game, my lich king or other high healthed minion has maybe 3 health left because of explosive runes, a 3 mana card. There is NO mage deck out there that is not running the card, that's how good it is. It's literally the Kobold Librarian of mage class imo, it will always be in every mage deck even after rotation(unless it gets nerfed, of course)Let's not forget that if you put a divine shield minion, your hero still takes damage from the card. It is just honestly a bullshit card and makes face/aggro mage as strong as it is and just a terrible experience to play against for me.
There is NO mage deck out there that is not running Explosive Runes, that's how good it is?
So what you're trying to say is that Big Mage isn't a deck, doesn't even exist at all and is therefore merely a delusion?
Shudder isn't bad design, it just has an annoying voice line. Yogg was absolutely a bad design .I also think Barnes had a bad design. Barnes into y'shaarj was stupid.
These threads tend to turn into "I hate losing to" discussions. I do not agree that OP cards / cards that counter certain strategies very well and bad design is the same thing. The strong cards were at least designed well enough to be a part of the game!
IMO the worst designs are the junk ones which are not interresting nor playable, and offer next to nothing to the game. Like this guy:
Yes, it actually gets bumped back to your hand when you use your heropower. Did they know the whole mechanic would suck?
this card would have been insane if it was "inspire, gain 1 health" or something. even if it was 2/4 starting stats that would have been good.
These threads tend to turn into "I hate losing to" discussions. I do not agree that OP cards / cards that counter certain strategies very well and bad design is the same thing. The strong cards were at least designed well enough to be a part of the game!
IMO the worst designs are the junk ones which are not interresting nor playable, and offer next to nothing to the game. Like this guy:
Yes, it actually gets bumped back to your hand when you use your heropower. Did they know the whole mechanic would suck?
this card would have been insane if it was "inspire, gain 1 health" or something. even if it was 2/4 starting stats that would have been good.
It would have made way more sense if it had the same inspire text but also had Charge. Gives it at least a reason to bounce it back to your hand...
Divine Favor - Punish your opponent for having more cards than u! Spreading Plague - Insta-Win vs. aggro decks, just because they have more minions than u have! Kingsbane, The Caverns Below - Punish your opponent, because he is playing control!
Divine Favor - Punish your opponent for always playing their deck the same way and not playing around one of your best cards!
Spreading Plague - Punish aggro decks with no ways to buff their minions for not playing around one of your best cards!
Quest/Kingsbane - Because control decks should never have bad matchups!
How exactly do you play around divine favor? dump your hand randomly? What if you deck has too high of mana cost cards to just dump, how do you play that deck differently? It's very poor design, encouraging brainless plays on both ends.
Maybe an unpopular opinion, but honestly fuck any deck that turns each turn into a diceroll. It's just no fun losing or winning based on wether your fireball decided to hit the right target or not. Doesn't help that it'S one of the only working warrior decks right now
I agree so hard- while quest rogue got more attention, this one really deserved a nerf. Not really because of the power level, but because interactivity relies on spamming the board and hoping to get lucky and avoid the fireball slamming the wrong target The reward for the quest took Ragnaros- which itself is fairly poorly designed, but at least some trade offs with not being able to attack, and then made it a permanent hero power. So dumb.
I don't like any of the quests. I honestly wish they were never printed. All they do is put you on a timer while your opponent stalls to get the quest done. It's just straight up boring.
Divine Favor is awesome because it enables critical mass decks that work better together than individually. It creates interesting gameplay because slower decks have to change the way they play. Cards shouldn't all work the same way anyway, and if your cards are individually more powerful then you should be trading resources aggressively.
And you're totally wrong about HS and other games being about maximizing value. Magic is full of cards that incentivize you to play out your hand quickly. Infernal Tutor, Wheel of Fortune, Balance. Not to mention mana accelerants like Dark Ritual, Mox Diamond, Simian Spirit Guide. These cards are strict card disadvantage, they're played for tempo and immediacy, not value, and they're among the most powerful cards in the game.
We have very different definitions of "interesting gameplay". Divine Favour asks you to dump your hand as fast as possible if you want to maximize it. That is far from interesting, what that card actually does is make players play cards incorrectly and for low impact just to refill with Divine Favour, rather than incencitivize the player to try to get the best out of their other cards to then get most value from Divine Favour. This is terrible design. It is not interesting, there is nothing interesting about seeing a player waste cards for low value just to empty their hand for another card. What is interesting is seeing a player use their resources as best as possible, that is what is interesting, players playing correctly on a technical level.
It doesn't change the way you play the game in playstyle or anything similar, it simply forces you to play incorrectly on a technical level, which is bad design. Cards that change the way you play the game and do it well are many others which offer different playstyles or strategies that don't ask the player to minimize the value of their cards. That would be nearly every card in the game other than Divine Favour.
I don't play Magic, but how exactly do those cards work? There is a difference between cards that play for Tempo and Divine Favour. Doomguard is a Tempo card, it removes value from your hand but it doesn't actually ask you to waste your other cards in hand by playing them. I do know that if you can play your hand before Doomguard it is best to avoid it's Cost, but that is just a flaw with the Discard Mechanic, a really dumb one, that allows players to skip the cost and keep the Tempo play regardless, which shouldn't be a part of the game.
Either way, do those cards from Magic actually ask you to just dump your hand for you to get the maximum value from them? They ask you not to maximize the value of your other cards in hand for them? If so, that is bad design.
Infernal Tutor : Reveal a card from your hand (chosen), and draw the same card from your deck (does not work if you don't have additionnal copies of said card in your deck). If your hand is empty, draw a card of your choice from your deck instead.
Wheel of Fortune : Both players discard their hands and draw 7 cards. (max hand size in Magic is 7, but you only discard the excess at the hand of your turn, not when drawing them. Also you have 60-cards decks)
Balance : Both players discard cards until they have a number of cards equal to the minimum between players (kinda like a reversed divine favor). They do the same for minions (killed until both players have the same number), mana crystals (kinda).
Dark Ritual : 1 mana, gain 3 crystals for this turn only (kinda like pre-nerf innervate)
Mox Diamond : 0 mana, discard a card (does NOT work if you don't have cards in hand), gain a full mana crystal (nourish-style)
Simian Spirit Guide : Either a coin, or a 3 mana 2/2, you choose.
Lol I know right. The only one I kind of get is spreading plague, but that's not a design issue. The 5 health is just a tad too high. The card would be fair at 1/4
Shadowreaper Anduin was very poorly designed when pre-nerf Raza the Chained existed. Now it's perfectly fine haha.
Doomguard is becoming more and more troublesome, but I know I'm biased in thinking this haha. I just hate that warlocks have so many ways to avoid the battlecry (zoo decks easily emptying and refilling hands, Possessed Lackey, Skull of the Man'ari). I just hate that card so much.
Also, Preparation forever dooms rogues to only get bad cards lol.
Other than these, I'm sure all the actual worst cards have already been mentioned.
Twitch name: Anatak15
NA Legend Season 48, 49, 52, 53, 54, 74
I think the perfect example of bad design is Temporus. In current state it's worst legendary dragon in game, but if priest will receive support for him (like Ice Block) he definitely will be OPAF.
No it doesn't, when something is problematic enough to need to be disrupted it needs to be changed. Alternatively, the disruptions could be conditional or something to only disrupt what they need to. There's no need to ruin a new F2P player's fun by removing Lord Jaraxxus from their hand.
These threads tend to turn into "I hate losing to" discussions. I do not agree that OP cards / cards that counter certain strategies very well and bad design is the same thing. The strong cards were at least designed well enough to be a part of the game!
IMO the worst designs are the junk ones which are not interresting nor playable, and offer next to nothing to the game. Like this guy:
Yes, it actually gets bumped back to your hand when you use your heropower. Did they know the whole mechanic would suck?
Editor of the Heartpwn Legendary Crafting Guide:
https://www.hearthpwn.com/forums/hearthstone-general/card-discussion/205920-legendary-tier-list-crafting-guide
Yeah it does seem like a lot of people went that direction. I still think Shadowreaper Anduin (specifically with pre-nerf Raza the Chained) was poor design haha. They realized this quick enough, thankfully haha. OP cards are allowed to be poorly designed.
Coliseum manager is pure garbage though haha. As people have mentioned, I also think Flame Leviathan is terrible design. Such a mechanic could be cool if there were more cards to help it (something like look at the next 3 cards and reorder them how you want - Scry? from MTG?). I even recall thinking they must have had plans for such an interaction. But then they just never did anything for it at all haha.
Twitch name: Anatak15
NA Legend Season 48, 49, 52, 53, 54, 74
A design flaw regarding quests and death knights, not related to their actual in-game impact:
These cards are too essential for playing a broad variety of decks that they simply shouldn't have come with expansions but rather with old-school adventures (e. g. the Lich King challenges would have been a perfect fit). or something similar. Buy the adventure, master 9 challenges and get the respective class card.
These cards are way too hard to get via acquiring packs.
I think the recruit mechanic itself is an awful design. Cheating out minions from your deck is so powerful it will dominate the meta until it's there. It requires most decks to play silence and cheating out high statted minions with negative battlecries (doomguard, charged devilsaur, deathwing) or expensive minions with good deathrattles is unfair. I think the game shouldn't have insane power turns as it makes some matches unfairly one sided.
I'll go with Posessed Lackey for the worst designed card from standard
Divine Favor is awesome because it enables critical mass decks that work better together than individually. It creates interesting gameplay because slower decks have to change the way they play. Cards shouldn't all work the same way anyway, and if your cards are individually more powerful then you should be trading resources aggressively.
And you're totally wrong about HS and other games being about maximizing value. Magic is full of cards that incentivize you to play out your hand quickly. Infernal Tutor, Wheel of Fortune, Balance. Not to mention mana accelerants like Dark Ritual, Mox Diamond, Simian Spirit Guide. These cards are strict card disadvantage, they're played for tempo and immediacy, not value, and they're among the most powerful cards in the game.
4 manas Call To Arms.
Really? First time see the card I sure that will be nerfed, it is just retarded, it is like release a neutral minion 1 mana 3/3 no text, of course everyone will use and be busted.
This is the case to ask...
WHAT THEY THINKING???
There is NO mage deck out there that is not running Explosive Runes, that's how good it is?
So what you're trying to say is that Big Mage isn't a deck, doesn't even exist at all and is therefore merely a delusion?
Shudder isn't bad design, it just has an annoying voice line. Yogg was absolutely a bad design .I also think Barnes had a bad design. Barnes into y'shaarj was stupid.
this card would have been insane if it was "inspire, gain 1 health" or something. even if it was 2/4 starting stats that would have been good.
It would have made way more sense if it had the same inspire text but also had Charge. Gives it at least a reason to bounce it back to your hand...
How exactly do you play around divine favor? dump your hand randomly? What if you deck has too high of mana cost cards to just dump, how do you play that deck differently? It's very poor design, encouraging brainless plays on both ends.
I agree so hard- while quest rogue got more attention, this one really deserved a nerf. Not really because of the power level, but because interactivity relies on spamming the board and hoping to get lucky and avoid the fireball slamming the wrong target The reward for the quest took Ragnaros- which itself is fairly poorly designed, but at least some trade offs with not being able to attack, and then made it a permanent hero power. So dumb.
I don't like any of the quests. I honestly wish they were never printed. All they do is put you on a timer while your opponent stalls to get the quest done. It's just straight up boring.
Infernal Tutor : Reveal a card from your hand (chosen), and draw the same card from your deck (does not work if you don't have additionnal copies of said card in your deck). If your hand is empty, draw a card of your choice from your deck instead.
Wheel of Fortune : Both players discard their hands and draw 7 cards. (max hand size in Magic is 7, but you only discard the excess at the hand of your turn, not when drawing them. Also you have 60-cards decks)
Balance : Both players discard cards until they have a number of cards equal to the minimum between players (kinda like a reversed divine favor). They do the same for minions (killed until both players have the same number), mana crystals (kinda).
Dark Ritual : 1 mana, gain 3 crystals for this turn only (kinda like pre-nerf innervate)
Mox Diamond : 0 mana, discard a card (does NOT work if you don't have cards in hand), gain a full mana crystal (nourish-style)
Simian Spirit Guide : Either a coin, or a 3 mana 2/2, you choose.
Back to the office!
I gotta disagree.
Actually, Trump played an Arena deck once with Coliseum Manager as MVP.
The Arena run includes 3 videos:
Hearthstone: Trump Cards - 243 - Coliseum Manager 2015 - Part 1 (Priest Arena)
Hearthstone: Trump Cards - 243 - Coliseum Manager 2015 - Part 2 (Priest Arena)
Hearthstone: Trump Cards - 243 - Coliseum Manager 2015 - Part 3 (Priest Arena)