2 mana is too much for an effect that doesn't even clear the board.
2 mana for a hard counter to n'zoth, one of the strongest deck types in existence. Yup, definitely too much.
You do realize by saying N'Zoth decks are one of the strongest deck types in existence, you are saying N'Zoth decks compare against Secret Paladin, Undertaker Hunter and Midrange Shaman.
Not to mention that with already having Hex, Shaman doesn't really need anymore help being a N'Zoth deck.
If you are going to say that Midrange Shaman is unfavoured against N'Zoth Control Warrior, yes that's true, but this card won't help, if the warrior has enough room to play a 10 drop and then press end turn, you've lost regardless of how many minions N'Zoth summons. Midrange Shaman most likely won't use this card either way.
The only deck I can see this card fit into is Control Shaman, but honestly, when Hex already exists it's necessary to also use an Devolve.
Im looking forward to having my belchers turned to 4 mana 7/7s in wild. Im really glad people think that paying 2 mana and reserving a card slot for an inconsistent board clear is a good idea.
Yogg is an inconsistent board clear that sees wide use.
*saw*
Yogg changed games. This barely even changes board states.
Just like Equality barely even changes board states on its own? I'm sure no one uses that.
This shows a clear misunderstanding of what this card does. Equality has a very clear effect that you can plan around and has combos that work every time you properly use it that make for effective clearing of the board. What this card does is maybe kinda sorta help you make a board worse. It's main function is to silence off a bunch of effects, but you cannot fully plan around what you make your opponent's minions and using it as an anti n'zoth card isn't even all that effective. You are turning a vanilla 5/7 into a 9 drop and the deathrattle minions just become other minions and aren't removed at all. If you play it to prevent deathrattles from firing, then n'zoth decks will simply add in a secondary wincon against control shaman. In terms of an anti goons or anti synergy card, it's ok, but it's impossible to know just how strong the goons decks are going to be. If they aren't everywhere, it probably won't be worth teching specifically for them.
Anyway, in an earlier post, I called this a poor card that might be a tech in a certain meta and I'm sticking to that. There simply aren't enough situations where this card is strong enough to be worth a slot in your deck.
I honestly don't think Blizzard even pays attention to what we say and what is happening. Shaman is already OP, the point is to balance the other classes, not give Shaman even more firepower to just completely fuck up the archetype and strategy's of all other classes, therefore making Shaman even more powerful capable of even stopping the few types that gave them little trouble from the beginning.
Im looking forward to having my belchers turned to 4 mana 7/7s in wild. Im really glad people think that paying 2 mana and reserving a card slot for an inconsistent board clear is a good idea.
Yogg is an inconsistent board clear that sees wide use.
*saw*
Yogg changed games. This barely even changes board states.
Just like Equality barely even changes board states on its own? I'm sure no one uses that.
This shows a clear misunderstanding of what this card does. Equality has a very clear effect that you can plan around and has combos that work every time you properly use it that make for effective clearing of the board. What this card does is maybe kinda sorta help you make a board worse. It's main function is to silence off a bunch of effects, but you cannot fully plan around what you make your opponent's minions and using it as an anti n'zoth card isn't even all that effective. You are turning a vanilla 5/7 into a 9 drop and the deathrattle minions just become other minions and aren't removed at all. If you play it to prevent deathrattles from firing, then n'zoth decks will simply add in a secondary wincon against control shaman. In terms of an anti goons or anti synergy card, it's ok, but it's impossible to know just how strong the goons decks are going to be. If they aren't everywhere, it probably won't be worth teching specifically for them.
Anyway, in an earlier post, I called this a poor card that might be a tech in a certain meta and I'm sticking to that. There simply aren't enough situations where this card is strong enough to be worth a slot in your deck.
And we're back to Yogg, another card no one could "fully plan around" that everyone used and continues to see use. Clearly not being able to always plan everything out is no deterrent to a good card.
2 mana mass polymorph, a card that shouldn't exist, also giving it to the strongest class in the game, a class with 3 existing board clears and hex. Seems legit.
This looks like a really strong effect. I would say 1 of is an auto-include in all shaman decks.
The reason evolve didn't see much play is although it looked strong, in the end, you evolved best minions into average minions, so many times it was more like +0.5 evolution. This is the other way around, you're devolving best minions into average minions, so it's going to be more like -1.5 "devolution". On top of that it seems buff will be a big thing in this expansion, so it's going to be worth even more than this. On top of that, evolution the problem is you couldn't move your minions right away so your opponent was first to deal with the board, with devolve, you can devolve and then deal with the new board first, I think that's a huge advantage. On top of that, where evolve, you needed to be ahead for it to be effective, here this is a comeback mechanism, the bigger your opponent's board, the more value it has. Finally, this can be used like silence for deathrattle or taunt, but at the board level, if you consider the owl, a silence on a single target had to be nerfed, this is silence on steroid for the same price (although you don't get the 2-1).
Sure sometimes it might devolve into something strong, but similarily it can devolve into something even weaker, on average, this is insane value, and dramatically better than evolve which was already decent in arena (not so much in constructed). Much better than just 1 mana more for sure.
I honestly don't think Blizzard even pays attention to what we say and what is happening. Shaman is already OP, the point is to balance the other classes, not give Shaman even more firepower to just completely fuck up the archetype and strategy's of all other classes, therefore making Shaman even more powerful capable of even stopping the few types that gave them little trouble from the beginning.
Blizzard pays attention, but people fail to realize how delayed reactions in set design end up being due to sets being designed so far in advance. I mean I think it was either Kara or this one that were actually designed with Standard rotation in mind (which is one reason I believe Priest didn't get a lot of amazing tools, Lightbomb was still being designed with in mind; Paladin also still had its low drops), and that's a pretty big change to design around itself. If you want to see them paying attention, look at how Purify wasn't even live before they had removed it from being a draft possibility in Arena. I imagine with the next cycle of sets we'll see being able to design with Standard in mind will be a big help to keeping things balanced.
What people are expecting is that the strong classes get weak cards, and the weak classes get strong cards; I think this is an absurd expectation, because all of the classes should be getting strong cards. In this case what we have is Control Shaman or Evolve Shaman support, because honestly this is not a card I see getting slotted into Midrange as anything other than a meta choice. Aggro certainly isn't likely to bother with it.
On top of that, post rotation a lot of these overbuffed cards are rotating out; not releasing strong cards for Shaman might be good in the short term, but for the next year and some change after that weak cards are why we end up with something like Priest or Paladin.
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If you don't have a follow up play your opponent will just buff his Wisps with Defender of Argus, play cheap Sea Giants, or trigger Gormokk - all of this is an easy deal as long as Zoo still keeps its board presence.
If you get to pretend you have all that still in your hand, I get to pretend I have another Devolve, not to mention the taunts I played last turn with all my extra mana. After I blow out your comeback play, you're pretty much out of ammo and I can now beat you with curvestone.
No need to pretend at all. Thats just how Zoo works, not only because any average player won't extend into AoE but also thanks to its Hero Power. Zoo values board presence the most. A pseudo-AoE which actually won't clear the board isn't good enough against it.
If you don't have a follow up play your opponent will just buff his Wisps with Defender of Argus, play cheap Sea Giants, or trigger Gormokk - all of this is an easy deal as long as Zoo still keeps its board presence.
If you get to pretend you have all that still in your hand, I get to pretend I have another Devolve, not to mention the taunts I played last turn with all my extra mana. After I blow out your comeback play, you're pretty much out of ammo and I can now beat you with curvestone.
No need to pretend at all. Thats just how Zoo works, not only because any average player won't extend into AoE but also thanks to its Hero Power. Zoo values board presence the most. A pseudo-AoE which actually won't clear the board isn't good enough against it.
I think if you're looking at this from a Control Shaman perspective, Zoo maintaining board presence is probably going to be unlikely because of the one million board clears it runs (and Wild Pyro would actually pair with this reasonably enough that it quite likely with serve at least as partial removal). Zoo obviously will still be in an okay spot having their minions downgraded, but if you're a Shaman and Zoo is winning that hard on board control you're either holding onto answers because there isn't enough pressure to respond or you've lost because you've been out-Tempo'd as one of the board-centric versions of Shaman.
So while Devolve is less effective against Zoo, I would wager Control Shaman shells would be a different story (with Devolve essentially acting as a way to amplify their already plentiful board clear potential). Being less effective against one archetype is not a reason to dismiss a card, especially when on paper it's actually still effectively turning your board into something softer.
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I'm going to call out everyone, just like Gahzrilla, when this card sees almost no play past the first few weeks. Back when Gahzrilla was released Hunter was greatly hated and fairly strong, every card released for them was the end of the world. People even complained that hunter got 2 legendaries, Acidmaw and dreadclaw, while other classes got one (never mind that the 2 legends suck). Same thing with shaman now which is the 'hated' class, people are so salty that every card coming out for them is broken.
Polymorph Aoe...yeah I forgot does Devolve say turn all enemy minions to 1/1 sheep? Yeah that would be great, combine with portal and what a swing! Oh yeah but that isn't what the card does. You slightly weaken an enemies board and leave those minions able to trade or face you next turn, unless you clear them with another card. In which case you might as well just use a big board clear by itself. Oh wait, deathrattles! Yeah what a specific thing to worry about, in addition most deathrattle minions pay in stats for having a deathrattle, so the lower cost minions that appear may not have deathrattles but may have better stats or the same...hey maybe they may have deathrattles or some other powerful effect.
The only uncontrollable RNG cards that see play (this is one of those), are ones where the effect ranges from so so to incredible. That can't backfire terribly like this one can.
It's hard to rate this card, since it's usefulness is gonna be determined by the meta.
It's mainly gonna be good against: - grimy goons decks - Play this after your opponent drops a buffed Doppelgangster, and make him shed some salty tears. -decks which rely on board synergies
In most other match-ups it's not gonna be all that strong, since there are better and more reliable ways of dealing with opponent's board and/or keeping it in check.
If you don't have a follow up play your opponent will just buff his Wisps with Defender of Argus, play cheap Sea Giants, or trigger Gormokk - all of this is an easy deal as long as Zoo still keeps its board presence.
If you get to pretend you have all that still in your hand, I get to pretend I have another Devolve, not to mention the taunts I played last turn with all my extra mana. After I blow out your comeback play, you're pretty much out of ammo and I can now beat you with curvestone.
No need to pretend at all. Thats just how Zoo works, not only because any average player won't extend into AoE but also thanks to its Hero Power. Zoo values board presence the most. A pseudo-AoE which actually won't clear the board isn't good enough against it.
It's not meant to clear the board. It's meant to soften it. I think you underestimate it because you think "AoE" is supposed to be the same as "clear" in all cases. You keep calling it a "pseudo-clear," but that's not what it is at all.
(And I've played more than enough zoo to know that it's not always that easy to re-flood the board, especially if you need to do it a third or fourth time.)
I also think you want to play Devolve at the wrong time. You don't play it as a comeback card when the zoo has already spiraled out of control. You do it a little sooner, to cheaply turn an even-ish board to your advantage. Yes, you will have to follow up with some trades, or even another spell. But your minions are more likely to survive those trades, and the zoo minions will be less sticky after devolving.
Not all powerful cards are powerful in a vacuum, but that doesn't mean they're not powerful.
2 mana is too much for an effect that doesn't even clear the board.
2 mana for a hard counter to n'zoth, one of the strongest deck types in existence. Yup, definitely too much.
You do realize by saying N'Zoth decks are one of the strongest deck types in existence, you are saying N'Zoth decks compare against Secret Paladin, Undertaker Hunter and Midrange Shaman.
Not to mention that with already having Hex, Shaman doesn't really need anymore help being a N'Zoth deck.
If you are going to say that Midrange Shaman is unfavoured against N'Zoth Control Warrior, yes that's true, but this card won't help, if the warrior has enough room to play a 10 drop and then press end turn, you've lost regardless of how many minions N'Zoth summons. Midrange Shaman most likely won't use this card either way.
The only deck I can see this card fit into is Control Shaman, but honestly, when Hex already exists it's necessary to also use an Devolve.
Some N'Zoth decks actually DO compare to those and Undertaker Hunter doesn't exist anymore. Also Midrange Shaman isn't as strong in Wild, it's still very good though.
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I'm here to kick ass and play cards, and I'm all out of ass.
Strong or not, this card should never exist. But oh well, all HS players must deal with it or leave like I have. I'm happy that I have when I see this card.
I don't understand people like yourself. If you left then what is the point of staying active amongst these forums. I'm willing to bet you actually didn't leave or leaving on your terms may be logging in every day to do a quest or something . ..regardless I guarantee you will be back if you aren't already.....I know you will.
Yeah, I also totally hate this card by two interconnected reasons. First, It single-handedly counters and slaughters any strategy, which depends on specific board presence - be it taunts, Divine Shield + buff strategy, deathrattles or even more specific ones, and all of that just for two mana. Second, it's not predictable and totally RNGsus - you just play this and pray that Random Gods will be on your side today, or their 5-drop 5/5 will become a 4-drop 7/7, and so forth.
Overall it looks like a giant button "totally mess the board (most often to your advantage)", and for 2 mana that's totally ridiculous.
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Not to mention that with already having Hex, Shaman doesn't really need anymore help being a N'Zoth deck.
If you are going to say that Midrange Shaman is unfavoured against N'Zoth Control Warrior, yes that's true, but this card won't help, if the warrior has enough room to play a 10 drop and then press end turn, you've lost regardless of how many minions N'Zoth summons. Midrange Shaman most likely won't use this card either way.
I honestly don't think Blizzard even pays attention to what we say and what is happening. Shaman is already OP, the point is to balance the other classes, not give Shaman even more firepower to just completely fuck up the archetype and strategy's of all other classes, therefore making Shaman even more powerful capable of even stopping the few types that gave them little trouble from the beginning.
This card is legit garbage and I cannot believe they are still buffing stupid as shaman.
ENOUGH IS ENOUGH!
2 mana mass polymorph, a card that shouldn't exist, also giving it to the strongest class in the game, a class with 3 existing board clears and hex. Seems legit.
This looks like a really strong effect. I would say 1 of is an auto-include in all shaman decks.
The reason evolve didn't see much play is although it looked strong, in the end, you evolved best minions into average minions, so many times it was more like +0.5 evolution. This is the other way around, you're devolving best minions into average minions, so it's going to be more like -1.5 "devolution". On top of that it seems buff will be a big thing in this expansion, so it's going to be worth even more than this. On top of that, evolution the problem is you couldn't move your minions right away so your opponent was first to deal with the board, with devolve, you can devolve and then deal with the new board first, I think that's a huge advantage. On top of that, where evolve, you needed to be ahead for it to be effective, here this is a comeback mechanism, the bigger your opponent's board, the more value it has. Finally, this can be used like silence for deathrattle or taunt, but at the board level, if you consider the owl, a silence on a single target had to be nerfed, this is silence on steroid for the same price (although you don't get the 2-1).
Sure sometimes it might devolve into something strong, but similarily it can devolve into something even weaker, on average, this is insane value, and dramatically better than evolve which was already decent in arena (not so much in constructed). Much better than just 1 mana more for sure.
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RIP Grimmy Goons gimmick. bubye your boosted minions.
Did should be renamed to the meme streets o. Gadgetzan
This card is a meme factory, and I'd say, it's worth it just to return to this game to see this card at work. Make control/crusher shaman a thing.
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Reached #1 in NA arena leaderboard in May 2018 with a 9.07 average!
I'm going to call out everyone, just like Gahzrilla, when this card sees almost no play past the first few weeks. Back when Gahzrilla was released Hunter was greatly hated and fairly strong, every card released for them was the end of the world. People even complained that hunter got 2 legendaries, Acidmaw and dreadclaw, while other classes got one (never mind that the 2 legends suck). Same thing with shaman now which is the 'hated' class, people are so salty that every card coming out for them is broken.
Polymorph Aoe...yeah I forgot does Devolve say turn all enemy minions to 1/1 sheep? Yeah that would be great, combine with portal and what a swing! Oh yeah but that isn't what the card does. You slightly weaken an enemies board and leave those minions able to trade or face you next turn, unless you clear them with another card. In which case you might as well just use a big board clear by itself. Oh wait, deathrattles! Yeah what a specific thing to worry about, in addition most deathrattle minions pay in stats for having a deathrattle, so the lower cost minions that appear may not have deathrattles but may have better stats or the same...hey maybe they may have deathrattles or some other powerful effect.
The only uncontrollable RNG cards that see play (this is one of those), are ones where the effect ranges from so so to incredible. That can't backfire terribly like this one can.
It's hard to rate this card, since it's usefulness is gonna be determined by the meta.
It's mainly gonna be good against:
- grimy goons decks - Play this after your opponent drops a buffed Doppelgangster, and make him shed some salty tears.
- decks which rely on board synergies
In most other match-ups it's not gonna be all that strong, since there are better and more reliable ways of dealing with opponent's board and/or keeping it in check.
Could be very useful. Against synergy boards for sure. Worth playing 1 in midrange shaman.
"Why, you never expected justice from a company, did you? They have neither a soul to lose nor a body to kick." -- Lady Saba Holland
I'm here to kick ass and play cards, and I'm all out of ass.
Yeah, I also totally hate this card by two interconnected reasons. First, It single-handedly counters and slaughters any strategy, which depends on specific board presence - be it taunts, Divine Shield + buff strategy, deathrattles or even more specific ones, and all of that just for two mana. Second, it's not predictable and totally RNGsus - you just play this and pray that Random Gods will be on your side today, or their 5-drop 5/5 will become a 4-drop 7/7, and so forth.
Overall it looks like a giant button "totally mess the board (most often to your advantage)", and for 2 mana that's totally ridiculous.