So the Apprentice officially survives the nerfs once again.
I think the nerf to Evocation is fair. The card is still strong, but it is no longer possible to make a miracle turn 3 with Apprentice, a few spells, coin, cylcone, evocation....into a 0-mana giant. More importantly, Mage can no longer get multiple Evocations from Wandmaker or Cobalt Spellkin. Magic Trick and Wand Thief can still generate it, but now it is less likely that we see 4+ Evocations played in a single game. Finally, it hurts Odd Mage in wild a bit, which was anyway not a very competitive deck. The nerf to the prime is a very big deal. Playing the prime was a huge swing turn as well and this can no longer happen on t7 or 8, It's also not possible in the mid-late game to draw it with Arcane Intellect and play it on the same turn. Frankly, although I think Solarian was the strongest of all the AoO primes, I had no problem with the card itself, but rather with the fact that Mage can easily discover multiple copies of it, primarily via Primordial Studies
Overall I think the combined effect of these 2 nerfs will hurt Tempo Mage significantly and probably move it from tier1 to tier3 or so. Also, meme decks like Mozaki Mage are kind of dead now
Cards like Mozaki, Master Duelist and Archmage Antonidas are probably the reason for their hesitation on nerfing Sorcerer's Apprentice. Mozaki can't really function without this kind of support and, although Antonidas is perfectly fine as a card, people simply doesn't care about generating Fireballs if they can't use them immediately. If Apprentice is nerfed, it is going to drag a bunch of other cards with it to limbo.
I am fine with Apprentice not getting nerfed. I always liked OTK combo decks. But it will take quite some effort to keep Mage balanced the more 1- and 2- mana spells are printed, especially those that generate other spells
Nerfing Evocation just means you can't get it as easily from other cards that are pretty prevalent in the meta right now, but not impossible.
Back when this deck first emerged it was hinged on getting giants out fast and spell damage synergy to cycle and clear the board. I feel like this is all still possible. You just won't see Evocation played 4-6 times in any single game now.
Watch all the mage "mains" who rngd into legend for the first time come out and moan about these changes. Mage as a class right now is an absolute clown fiesta. Happy with these nerfs
In my opinion, the whole Mage should be re-worked, mostly because any class that is heavily based on spells (or other off-hand cards), doesn't suit the game mechanics. In Hearthstone the main way to interact with your opponent is through the board and cards that can avoid it, are essentially denying your opponent's chance to react (with a few exceptions, e.g. secrets). This is why playing against Mage is so gross, even if the class itself is not very strong. Tons of randomly generated cheap spells and constant stale can piss off anyone... I'd say we either need more interactions off the board, either force all classes to play through the board.
I think Mage will be fine in Standard. While both changes are pretty big, the core of Mage is still very strong. I've played loads of games without even drawing Solarian. Evocation is more relevant, and maybe it would have been better to just change it to generating 5 spells, or something like that, but the fact it got randomly generated so often make it a reasonable change, and with Apprentice untouched, it can still deliver powerful swings.
In Wild, the Evocation nerf hurts Quest Mage quite a bit, which in return really only helps Highlander Priest... because they needed that... ... ... -_-
In my opinion, the whole Mage should be re-worked, mostly because any class that is heavily based on spells (or other off-hand cards), doesn't suit the game mechanics. In Hearthstone the main place to interact with your opponent is through the board and cards that can avoid it, are essentially denying your opponent's chance to react (with a few exceptions, e.g. secrets). This is why playing against Mage is so gross, even if the class itself is not very strong. Tons of randomly generated cheap spells and constant stale can piss off anyone... I'd say we either need more interactions off the board, either force all classes to play through the board.
Mage is, oh well a MAGE. Being heavily focused on spells actually suits them perfectly, whether one likes it or not. This is one of the very few classes in HS, which has a clearly defined flavour since the very beginning and actually sticks to it for the whole time.
This should literally change nothing... Stop crying.
This makes playing the Prime risky... Like it's supposed to be with RnG... It already gives you a 7/7 body, with Spell Damage with half a puzzle box that affects the enemy if possible...
Now, if you take the gamble of playing it, and it doesn't clear the enemy board, you can't just Frost Nova... Which is a reasonable risk.
Watch all the mage "mains" who rngd into legend for the first time come out and moan about these changes. Mage as a class right now is an absolute clown fiesta. Happy with these nerfs
dont worry they will slowly nerf each class. It happens before Master Tour in order to shake the meta quite bit. Joke aside, Paladin never got nerfed, but buffed, are they finally going to show up popular in the next tournament?
Mage is, oh well a MAGE. Being heavily focused on spells actually suits them perfectly, whether one likes it or not. This is one of the very few classes in HS, which has a clearly defined flavour since the very beginning and actually sticks to it for the whole time.
Yes, suits class theme (Mage, spells, you know...), but not actual game mechanics, which were clearly designed with focus on board interactions. The more cards you play from off-hand, the less interactive the game is for your opponent. And no, simple "deal with it" won't do, because interactivity is the foundation of any multiplayer game. If one player has much more influence on the gameplay than the other player (due to certain gameplay mechanics), then the whole thing is pointless and players will simply lose their desire to play it.
https://twitter.com/PlayHearthstone/status/1316817701201821697
Evocation: from 1 to 2 mana
Solarian Prime: from 7 to mana
So the Apprentice officially survives the nerfs once again.
I think the nerf to Evocation is fair. The card is still strong, but it is no longer possible to make a miracle turn 3 with Apprentice, a few spells, coin, cylcone, evocation....into a 0-mana giant. More importantly, Mage can no longer get multiple Evocations from Wandmaker or Cobalt Spellkin. Magic Trick and Wand Thief can still generate it, but now it is less likely that we see 4+ Evocations played in a single game. Finally, it hurts Odd Mage in wild a bit, which was anyway not a very competitive deck.
The nerf to the prime is a very big deal. Playing the prime was a huge swing turn as well and this can no longer happen on t7 or 8, It's also not possible in the mid-late game to draw it with Arcane Intellect and play it on the same turn. Frankly, although I think Solarian was the strongest of all the AoO primes, I had no problem with the card itself, but rather with the fact that Mage can easily discover multiple copies of it, primarily via Primordial Studies
Overall I think the combined effect of these 2 nerfs will hurt Tempo Mage significantly and probably move it from tier1 to tier3 or so. Also, meme decks like Mozaki Mage are kind of dead now
Yep mage is dead after this nerf
Good job Blizzard, nerf the class ranked 5th by winrate in the current meta. Should've have buffed hunter, paladin and DH while they were at it.
God this bad game and the devs and "brains" behind it.
Cards like Mozaki, Master Duelist and Archmage Antonidas are probably the reason for their hesitation on nerfing Sorcerer's Apprentice. Mozaki can't really function without this kind of support and, although Antonidas is perfectly fine as a card, people simply doesn't care about generating Fireballs if they can't use them immediately. If Apprentice is nerfed, it is going to drag a bunch of other cards with it to limbo.
I am fine with Apprentice not getting nerfed. I always liked OTK combo decks. But it will take quite some effort to keep Mage balanced the more 1- and 2- mana spells are printed, especially those that generate other spells
They could have HOF apprentice and the problem would have been solved. Now we have another dead class. Nice.
Mage will survive this.
Nerfing Evocation just means you can't get it as easily from other cards that are pretty prevalent in the meta right now, but not impossible.
Back when this deck first emerged it was hinged on getting giants out fast and spell damage synergy to cycle and clear the board. I feel like this is all still possible. You just won't see Evocation played 4-6 times in any single game now.
I feel like they kind of already were... this nerf doesn't seem like it will make a difference.
Making Solarian Prime cost 9 is fine, too. At least then when it casts Potion of Illusion on itself you can only loop it once in a turn.
Watch all the mage "mains" who rngd into legend for the first time come out and moan about these changes. Mage as a class right now is an absolute clown fiesta. Happy with these nerfs
100% accurate
Nice shoot bliz
In my opinion, the whole Mage should be re-worked, mostly because any class that is heavily based on spells (or other off-hand cards), doesn't suit the game mechanics. In Hearthstone the main way to interact with your opponent is through the board and cards that can avoid it, are essentially denying your opponent's chance to react (with a few exceptions, e.g. secrets). This is why playing against Mage is so gross, even if the class itself is not very strong. Tons of randomly generated cheap spells and constant stale can piss off anyone... I'd say we either need more interactions off the board, either force all classes to play through the board.
I think Mage will be fine in Standard. While both changes are pretty big, the core of Mage is still very strong. I've played loads of games without even drawing Solarian. Evocation is more relevant, and maybe it would have been better to just change it to generating 5 spells, or something like that, but the fact it got randomly generated so often make it a reasonable change, and with Apprentice untouched, it can still deliver powerful swings.
In Wild, the Evocation nerf hurts Quest Mage quite a bit, which in return really only helps Highlander Priest... because they needed that... ... ... -_-
Mage is, oh well a MAGE. Being heavily focused on spells actually suits them perfectly, whether one likes it or not. This is one of the very few classes in HS, which has a clearly defined flavour since the very beginning and actually sticks to it for the whole time.
Evocation could be generated multiple times via Cobalt or Wand Makers.
Now, I suppose Primordial Studies might appear a bit more, but that in turn will potentially generate Solarians as well.
Magic Trick could still generate Evocation or Primordial Studies but the card pool is a lot larger.
Now, Grandmasters is over, but this could still impact Masters Tour Madrid I suppose, will certainly be interesting to see decks change there.
Overall, I think with the look on possible new 1 cost spells, and spells rotating out, I don't think it's the complete end of Mage.
This should literally change nothing... Stop crying.
This makes playing the Prime risky... Like it's supposed to be with RnG... It already gives you a 7/7 body, with Spell Damage with half a puzzle box that affects the enemy if possible...
Now, if you take the gamble of playing it, and it doesn't clear the enemy board, you can't just Frost Nova... Which is a reasonable risk.
Evocation costing 1 more... Meh.
yeah nerf the mage while there are bunch of other classes with op cards lol.
Totally agree with you
dont worry they will slowly nerf each class. It happens before Master Tour in order to shake the meta quite bit. Joke aside, Paladin never got nerfed, but buffed, are they finally going to show up popular in the next tournament?
Yes, suits class theme (Mage, spells, you know...), but not actual game mechanics, which were clearly designed with focus on board interactions. The more cards you play from off-hand, the less interactive the game is for your opponent. And no, simple "deal with it" won't do, because interactivity is the foundation of any multiplayer game. If one player has much more influence on the gameplay than the other player (due to certain gameplay mechanics), then the whole thing is pointless and players will simply lose their desire to play it.
They want very badly Valeera and Jaina join shaman in trash tier club. :(
That is the only explanation to the classes can barely make a low tier 2 deck being nerfed so hard and so often.