I know that this maybe belongs in the salt thread, but what is going on with demon hunter? The recent twin slice "nerf" simply provides DH with 5 more attack to your face in most cases in a class that already has insane damage output. I've been playing Hearthstone since Un'Goro and I have never been so agitated by a class/deck and they are everywhere. What is their weakness supposed to be? Opponent Healing and Taunt? Their damage output beats most heals and Kayn, Altruis can burn through any board. Warglaives spits on Assassin's Blade and they just facetank your board then hit you for 5-8 damage as they draw more cards. Teching Ooze isn't enough.
Perhaps this is because I'm a Rogue main and I haven't been afforded AOE and lifesteal. Rogue has 1 choice- Galakrond - and I find that most of the time this just doesn't provide the answers and you're dead by Turn 6-8. I don't want to play another class just to counter this plague (want to work on 1000 wins) and want to know if people think DH is balanced, what their experiences are like, and advice against them. I've never made a thread like this before but needed to reach out. TIA
I have found their numbers significantly lower than 4 or so weeks ago. My win rate with the small spell mage deck I use has risen because DH was a miserable matchup for my deck. Something like 20% win rate or less. Twin slice means they can't glaivebound on 5 anymore and the extra turn makes a difference. If they have coin they can use it for that but it restricts them doing other things. It doesn't feel busted to play against. That's not to say it isn't strong, it's a strong class and when it draws the nuts it will generally roll through you but so does rogue, druid and warrior. Face hunter as well. Lots of decks do well when they draw the right cards, in the right order, at the right time.
I played a lot of secret rogue for 6 weeks or so after the expansion launched. Mainly due to Hanar just being a very fun card and I found that secrets and blackjack stunners were useful against demon hunter as well as saving flik for the right time. It is a hard matchup for rogue though but that's one of the draw backs of 'maining' a class and just one of the reasons I've never bought into that concept. I have a handful of classes I play more than others, sure but I feel you're kind of asking for these issues when you pretty much just play one class. As soon as a deck becomes popular that counters your class, you're a bit stuffed and don't have much room to move because you haven't invested time or have dusted cards from other classes. I do accept that for f2p players this is a viable strategy, to focus on a couple of classes due to dust limitations but pure f2p will almost always have a more difficult time across the board, it's the nature of the beast.
Just to ask though, you do realise that you're playing a deck that people similarly complain about, right? You are your equivalent to demon hunter, to a lot of other people. The deck you use is problematic and a pain to them (I personally really enjoy rogue at the moment). My point being though that people don't all like the same thing.
Since twin slice has been nerfed/buffed, I did find an increase of DH in wild, and the most of them use the same archetype (Odd Demonhunter) which is annoying, cause there is no variability at all to play against. I hope the next expansion will push to an other archetype for DH.
It's not strong as before, but I find the games against DH boring.
Warglaives are bound to be nerfed. Otherwise I'm sick of seeing it but my winrate against it is very good so I think it's not as big of a problem anymore. Pirate warrior in wild is still better than Odd DH
I don't think it's as much of a problem as before the twin slice nerf. DH's tempo play has taken a big toll because of the nerf, taking them to a more midrange-build. I've seen many DHs even playing a highlander version which is not as eye-rolling as the tempo version. They are now easier to counter using control or heavy aggro decks. They are still very powerful, though, and never to be underestimated even after those nerfs. Dealing with DH now can take up to turn 8 on average, compared to turn 5 or turn 6 before the nerf. This is a huge power difference and so many things can be done to outvalue them. Take highlander mage, for example. Turn 6 can be a winning setup due to the Dragoncaster combo. The deck previously struggled a lot due to not enough early power to fight the satyr + battlefiend + warglaives threats. By turn 6, the mage is already left with 14 health or lower and next turn is most often a lethal. I'd say that scenario was also felt when played with other classes. With the nerf, it is less likely for that scenario to happen and reaching a latter turn against DH helps balancing the meta. As for your case, although DH might be an unfavorable matchup, Rogue is still a tier 1 class in the current meta. By having less frequent matches against DH, it should be easier for you to reach that 1000 wins.
I think this is a question worth asking. I refused to play DH until after the twin slice nerf, but I broke down and started playing the Cobalt/Scorpid deck that was on the Hearthpwn homepage last week. I can safely say, it's nuts. I played 12 games in Diamond and won 11 of them. Every. Single. Game the Twin Slice "nerf" was a help to me (partially because the deck runs blade dance). I cringe before I play almost any DH class card and quietly apologize to my opponent - especially if they are trying to play a tier 3 fun deck.
I think one solution that would be really cool is if the HOF'd the entire class and brought back Ragnaros from the HOF.
After the buffs DH is better than ever. Players will realize it soon, pick the proper list and play-rate of the class will rise once again. Early game is still miles better than in other classes.
Rogue is very capable of dealing with DH, but one can never bet against consistency of DH. It's an aggro, ctrl and combo deck at the same time; shuts down classical HS archetypes forever.
Stealth Rogue is somewhat better vs. DH than Secret. Overall, Rogue is shit, rn, imho. It plays like Priest and can't kill anybody.
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“Let your plans be dark and impenetrable as night, and when you move, fall like a thunderbolt.”
Its almost like they made good cards for a new class and gave those cards for free so that anyone has it. It was same problem with galkadon. If everyone plays it and its good its gonna see a lot of games. I just hope they dont start toning down like in a year of a Raven.
The new expansion should be fairly soon, and it'll be worth reexamining the overall strength of DH once we've gotten those new cards. Until then, I'd just let things slide.
Love playing against DH because the matchup is as straightforward as it gets. I know what they want to do and I either have the cards to counter it or I don't; either way, it's over quickly.
Love playing against DH because the matchup is as straightforward as it gets. I know what they want to do and I either have the cards to counter it or I don't; either way, it's over quickly.
Good point. Half the time I don't even feel bad if I lose to DH because I'm like, "Well...I knew that was coming and I just didn't draw what I needed to stop it."
Love playing against DH because the matchup is as straightforward as it gets. I know what they want to do and I either have the cards to counter it or I don't; either way, it's over quickly.
Good point. Half the time I don't even feel bad if I lose to DH because I'm like, "Well...I knew that was coming and I just didn't draw what I needed to stop it."
The point is, the DH plays fairly, by and large, even if the majority of their cards could be called over-powered.. This can't be said for Mage, Priest or Rogue right now, which accounts for a good proportion of the ladder - where a combination of RNG, huge swing potential and pure value over time lead to a lot of results that just feel unfair, atleast in hearthstone terms.
I know that this maybe belongs in the salt thread, but what is going on with demon hunter? The recent twin slice "nerf" simply provides DH with 5 more attack to your face in most cases in a class that already has insane damage output. I've been playing Hearthstone since Un'Goro and I have never been so agitated by a class/deck and they are everywhere. What is their weakness supposed to be? Opponent Healing and Taunt? Their damage output beats most heals and Kayn, Altruis can burn through any board. Warglaives spits on Assassin's Blade and they just facetank your board then hit you for 5-8 damage as they draw more cards. Teching Ooze isn't enough.
Perhaps this is because I'm a Rogue main and I haven't been afforded AOE and lifesteal. Rogue has 1 choice- Galakrond - and I find that most of the time this just doesn't provide the answers and you're dead by Turn 6-8. I don't want to play another class just to counter this plague (want to work on 1000 wins) and want to know if people think DH is balanced, what their experiences are like, and advice against them. I've never made a thread like this before but needed to reach out. TIA
I have found their numbers significantly lower than 4 or so weeks ago. My win rate with the small spell mage deck I use has risen because DH was a miserable matchup for my deck. Something like 20% win rate or less. Twin slice means they can't glaivebound on 5 anymore and the extra turn makes a difference. If they have coin they can use it for that but it restricts them doing other things. It doesn't feel busted to play against. That's not to say it isn't strong, it's a strong class and when it draws the nuts it will generally roll through you but so does rogue, druid and warrior. Face hunter as well. Lots of decks do well when they draw the right cards, in the right order, at the right time.
I played a lot of secret rogue for 6 weeks or so after the expansion launched. Mainly due to Hanar just being a very fun card and I found that secrets and blackjack stunners were useful against demon hunter as well as saving flik for the right time. It is a hard matchup for rogue though but that's one of the draw backs of 'maining' a class and just one of the reasons I've never bought into that concept. I have a handful of classes I play more than others, sure but I feel you're kind of asking for these issues when you pretty much just play one class. As soon as a deck becomes popular that counters your class, you're a bit stuffed and don't have much room to move because you haven't invested time or have dusted cards from other classes. I do accept that for f2p players this is a viable strategy, to focus on a couple of classes due to dust limitations but pure f2p will almost always have a more difficult time across the board, it's the nature of the beast.
Just to ask though, you do realise that you're playing a deck that people similarly complain about, right? You are your equivalent to demon hunter, to a lot of other people. The deck you use is problematic and a pain to them (I personally really enjoy rogue at the moment). My point being though that people don't all like the same thing.
Since twin slice has been nerfed/buffed, I did find an increase of DH in wild, and the most of them use the same archetype (Odd Demonhunter) which is annoying, cause there is no variability at all to play against. I hope the next expansion will push to an other archetype for DH.
It's not strong as before, but I find the games against DH boring.
:)
Warglaives are bound to be nerfed. Otherwise I'm sick of seeing it but my winrate against it is very good so I think it's not as big of a problem anymore. Pirate warrior in wild is still better than Odd DH
I don't think it's as much of a problem as before the twin slice nerf. DH's tempo play has taken a big toll because of the nerf, taking them to a more midrange-build. I've seen many DHs even playing a highlander version which is not as eye-rolling as the tempo version. They are now easier to counter using control or heavy aggro decks. They are still very powerful, though, and never to be underestimated even after those nerfs. Dealing with DH now can take up to turn 8 on average, compared to turn 5 or turn 6 before the nerf. This is a huge power difference and so many things can be done to outvalue them. Take highlander mage, for example. Turn 6 can be a winning setup due to the Dragoncaster combo. The deck previously struggled a lot due to not enough early power to fight the satyr + battlefiend + warglaives threats. By turn 6, the mage is already left with 14 health or lower and next turn is most often a lethal. I'd say that scenario was also felt when played with other classes. With the nerf, it is less likely for that scenario to happen and reaching a latter turn against DH helps balancing the meta. As for your case, although DH might be an unfavorable matchup, Rogue is still a tier 1 class in the current meta. By having less frequent matches against DH, it should be easier for you to reach that 1000 wins.
I think this is a question worth asking. I refused to play DH until after the twin slice nerf, but I broke down and started playing the Cobalt/Scorpid deck that was on the Hearthpwn homepage last week. I can safely say, it's nuts. I played 12 games in Diamond and won 11 of them. Every. Single. Game the Twin Slice "nerf" was a help to me (partially because the deck runs blade dance). I cringe before I play almost any DH class card and quietly apologize to my opponent - especially if they are trying to play a tier 3 fun deck.
I think one solution that would be really cool is if the HOF'd the entire class and brought back Ragnaros from the HOF.
After the buffs DH is better than ever. Players will realize it soon, pick the proper list and play-rate of the class will rise once again. Early game is still miles better than in other classes.
Rogue is very capable of dealing with DH, but one can never bet against consistency of DH. It's an aggro, ctrl and combo deck at the same time; shuts down classical HS archetypes forever.
Stealth Rogue is somewhat better vs. DH than Secret. Overall, Rogue is shit, rn, imho. It plays like Priest and can't kill anybody.
“Let your plans be dark and impenetrable as night, and when you move, fall like a thunderbolt.”
Its almost like they made good cards for a new class and gave those cards for free so that anyone has it. It was same problem with galkadon. If everyone plays it and its good its gonna see a lot of games. I just hope they dont start toning down like in a year of a Raven.
Maybe, but I don't care.
At least, not yet.
The new expansion should be fairly soon, and it'll be worth reexamining the overall strength of DH once we've gotten those new cards. Until then, I'd just let things slide.
Love playing against DH because the matchup is as straightforward as it gets. I know what they want to do and I either have the cards to counter it or I don't; either way, it's over quickly.
No.
Good point. Half the time I don't even feel bad if I lose to DH because I'm like, "Well...I knew that was coming and I just didn't draw what I needed to stop it."
The point is, the DH plays fairly, by and large, even if the majority of their cards could be called over-powered.. This can't be said for Mage, Priest or Rogue right now, which accounts for a good proportion of the ladder - where a combination of RNG, huge swing potential and pure value over time lead to a lot of results that just feel unfair, atleast in hearthstone terms.
DH is a problem when you play Combo decks, lol. Ii just auto concede and move on. Not worth the time.
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Yes a big one, every mode is infested with Demon Hunter virus, Standard, Wild and Tavern Brawl :(