It's a pretty harsh nerf but it's also mitigated a bit by the nerfs to Call to Arms and Spiteful Summoner.
I don't think it's going to see Lackey or Pact removed from the deck because you can't rely solely on Skull to cheat out demons and you need healing, but I think Cubelock will have to start skewing more towards anti-aggro, maybe dipping back into the classic Handlock bag of tricks.
Or maybe it'll just be replaced with Rin Control and Zoolock.
well, except for the fact that Call and Spiteful got VERY minor nerfs while Pact and Lackey got much bigger nerfs while deserving it less. a 5 mana (to say nothing of 6 mana) 2/2 without any demons in your deck is way worse than a 6 or 7 mana 4/4 without any spells in your deck.
to be fair, I'm actually undecided that Spiteful needed a direct nerf, what it really NEEDS is for there to be a LOT more under-statted high drops... not just more than the 0 there are now after the rotation of the Old Gods, but more than there were before their rotation, as well as minions that are even more understatted than a 6/6 or a 7/5 or a 5/7...there needs to be a 10 mana 1/1 (or some other similarly woeful stat line, which could just as well be a 2/4 or something at 10 mana) with some crazy effect, for instance, that makes a real low-roll possibility for spiteful to be balanced. i'm fine with a 1-mana bump, because i loathe spiteful decks as much as any deck that's ever existed, but that's not going to solve the real issue with the card. the deckbuilding restriction for spiteful would make it a fair card if there were low-roll opportunities AND if low drops weren't so over-efficient that an on-curve spiteful just too often ends a game. the fact that blizzard didn't safeguard EITHER of those provisions is frankly mind-blowing
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"Sometimes you eat the bear, and sometimes the bear turns into a cat and eats you." - Anonymous Druid
It's a pretty harsh nerf but it's also mitigated a bit by the nerfs to Call to Arms and Spiteful Summoner.
I don't think it's going to see Lackey or Pact removed from the deck because you can't rely solely on Skull to cheat out demons and you need healing, but I think Cubelock will have to start skewing more towards anti-aggro, maybe dipping back into the classic Handlock bag of tricks.
Or maybe it'll just be replaced with Rin Control and Zoolock.
well, except for the fact that Call and Spiteful got VERY minor nerfs while Pact and Lackey got much bigger nerfs while deserving it less. a 5 mana (to say nothing of 6 mana) 2/2 without any demons in your deck is way worse than a 6 or 7 mana 4/4 without any spells in your deck.
to be fair, I'm actually undecided that Spiteful needed a direct nerf, what it really NEEDS is for there to be a LOT more under-statted high drops... not just more than the 0 there are now after the rotation of the Old Gods, but more than there were before their rotation, as well as minions that are even more understatted than a 6/6 or a 7/5 or a 5/7...there needs to be a 10 mana 1/1 (or some other similarly woeful stat line, which could just as well be a 2/4 or something at 10 mana) with some crazy effect, for instance, that makes a real low-roll possibility for spiteful to be balanced. i'm fine with a 1-mana bump, because i loathe spiteful decks as much as any deck that's ever existed, but that's not going to solve the real issue with the card. the deckbuilding restriction for spiteful would make it a fair card if there were low-roll opportunities AND if low drops weren't so over-efficient that an on-curve spiteful just too often ends a game. the fact that blizzard didn't safeguard EITHER of those provisions is frankly mind-blowing
With Spiteful going to 7 mana, Warlock will have time to Twisting Nether it all away.
These nerfs are deserved. Blizzard created a complete package in Cubelock and overstuffed it with quality cards. One set added 30 healing potential in Dark Pact and Spellstone in a class that's supposed to sacrifice life for power and traditionally couldn't heal without neutral cards.
Voidlords are too polarizing to get cheated out. Just look at the stats on Spellbreakers in the meta.
If they undernerf Cubelock, then that's all we'll see and they know we'll hate them for it.
It will still be all over the ladder until next spring, unless a good tech card comes out next expansion. I don't see this weakening it enough.
My thoughts exactly. I don't think it will affect it hardly at all. The biggest problem in the deck was Doomguard charge, especially from Gul"Dan, and that wasn't touched.
Voidlord's are a pain in the ass, but they rarely beat you. Having 2 or 3 or more 5/7 chargers coming at you at once ... gets ya every time
Either you play only hyper control, or you are sorely mistaken.
While it might be the doomguards that beat your face in, if you were playing any sort of aggro/midrange deck the game was probably over 2-3 turns before when the first voidlord hit the board and you could no longer push damage face.
Voidlord beats me WAY more often than doomguard does.
Warlock still has a crazy amount of healing available. Being able to heal 22 instead of 30 (plus DK heals) isn't a huge deal. We are not going to see a new meta, just the top being shuffled around a bit with murloc paladin probably at the top, then either spiteful druid (the spiteful nerf is barely a nerf, a turn 6/7 12/12 is still insane) or warlock. Nobody is going to try creative things, the warlocks will still play warlock, the spiteful people will still play those, and the even paladins/maybequest rogues will migrate to murloc paladin.
Was honestly expecting Doomguard to gain Charge as part of the Battlecry. Or if not that, Cube to be nerfed to 6 mana to allow more time for people to prepare and try to find and answer.
Skull and Gul'dan were also untouched. The Doomguard burst is still there and untouched. Cubelock is not going anywhere. If anything, this might have affected more Control Warlock since the charge with multiple Doomguards is still there.
Lackey to 6 mana was pretty harsh, but I guess necessary. They should've made it a 3/2 at the very least, maybe even a 4/2 to trade better in case you draw it when it's not needed.
I quite like the nerfs. It is still playable in standard, but in wild it is still going to an absolute nightmare to deal with. It would be nice if the nerfs were more harsh, but then again, I am glad that blizzard is not completely destroying this deck (as much as I hate it).
Warlock has always had cards that are strong, but come with the downside of sacrificing health or by sacrificing cards (discard). Cubelock didn't have any of these downsides, as they got WAY too much healing and too many ways to cheat out mana. It made it extremely tough to deal with, and by the time that Gul'dan came into play, Warlocks would still be with 20+ health.
Well, i think that the nerf to lackey would have been enough to nerf cubelock, but without dark pact now it s more vulnerable to aggro and burn deck such as tempo mage (more like face mage) even paladin, thought it get nerfed hard, murlocadin and odd rogue. This is the end of cubelock doninance, so now i can cut my 295884893 tech cards from the deck
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"The flow of time is always cruel... its speed seems different for each person, but no one can change it... A thing that does not change with time is a memory of younger days..."
I always find it funny when people that netdeck cubelock bitch about it being nerfed. its been the best deck since the Raza nerf and there is literally no bad matchups for cubelock.
0 % win rate against baku hunter,tempo mage and quest rogue, yeah no bad matchups at all :D
I think they nerfed warlock appropriately. It stifles aggressive tapping which slows the deck down against control in the early game and the slower lackey will lead to warlocks getting killed far more often aggro. I wonder if even warlock will be the number 1 warlock deck now. It's already fairly strong, relies the spellstone for heal, damage means 4 mana 7/7 taunts and Guldan is still extremely powerful like he should be.
I think it's appropriate, but I am concerned that they didn't nerf paladin enough. That class is just totally busted right now, and I don't know why we haven't heard more complaints about it.
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You do not truly know someone, until you fight them.....
I have no idea what you mean. This is literally the lightest nerf a deck has ever gotten.
"Sometimes you eat the bear, and sometimes the bear turns into a cat and eats you." - Anonymous Druid
If you are in your first year of playing please read this post.
Dust does not burn a hole in the jar. Be careful what you craft, especially before and right after a rotation.
These nerfs are deserved. Blizzard created a complete package in Cubelock and overstuffed it with quality cards. One set added 30 healing potential in Dark Pact and Spellstone in a class that's supposed to sacrifice life for power and traditionally couldn't heal without neutral cards.
Voidlords are too polarizing to get cheated out. Just look at the stats on Spellbreakers in the meta.
If they undernerf Cubelock, then that's all we'll see and they know we'll hate them for it.
I would say not enough. No nerf to guldan, voidlord or doomguard, cubelock got lucky with soft nerfs this time.
Warlock still has a crazy amount of healing available. Being able to heal 22 instead of 30 (plus DK heals) isn't a huge deal. We are not going to see a new meta, just the top being shuffled around a bit with murloc paladin probably at the top, then either spiteful druid (the spiteful nerf is barely a nerf, a turn 6/7 12/12 is still insane) or warlock. Nobody is going to try creative things, the warlocks will still play warlock, the spiteful people will still play those, and the even paladins/maybequest rogues will migrate to murloc paladin.
Was honestly expecting Doomguard to gain Charge as part of the Battlecry. Or if not that, Cube to be nerfed to 6 mana to allow more time for people to prepare and try to find and answer.
Skull and Gul'dan were also untouched. The Doomguard burst is still there and untouched. Cubelock is not going anywhere. If anything, this might have affected more Control Warlock since the charge with multiple Doomguards is still there.
Lackey to 6 mana was pretty harsh, but I guess necessary. They should've made it a 3/2 at the very least, maybe even a 4/2 to trade better in case you draw it when it's not needed.
I quite like the nerfs. It is still playable in standard, but in wild it is still going to an absolute nightmare to deal with. It would be nice if the nerfs were more harsh, but then again, I am glad that blizzard is not completely destroying this deck (as much as I hate it).
Warlock has always had cards that are strong, but come with the downside of sacrificing health or by sacrificing cards (discard). Cubelock didn't have any of these downsides, as they got WAY too much healing and too many ways to cheat out mana. It made it extremely tough to deal with, and by the time that Gul'dan came into play, Warlocks would still be with 20+ health.
Alyss
You can insta concede now against face mage or baku hunter
OP: Nope, nope, hellz nope.
all these rank25 thoughts OMEGALUL
I've never seen lighter nerfs, and you think this is overkill.
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My mandibles which are capable of pressing down and tearing, my talons which are known to intercept and hold.
What I find the most amazing is how you used the word "nerf" about 4 times in one sentence.
Well, i think that the nerf to lackey would have been enough to nerf cubelock, but without dark pact now it s more vulnerable to aggro and burn deck such as tempo mage (more like face mage) even paladin, thought it get nerfed hard, murlocadin and odd rogue. This is the end of cubelock doninance, so now i can cut my 295884893 tech cards from the deck
"The flow of time is always cruel... its speed seems different for each person, but no one can change it... A thing that does not change with time is a memory of younger days..."
those nerfs change almost nothing, warlocks play so much removal anyways that waiting 1 more turn really isnt a problem.
I think they nerfed warlock appropriately. It stifles aggressive tapping which slows the deck down against control in the early game and the slower lackey will lead to warlocks getting killed far more often aggro. I wonder if even warlock will be the number 1 warlock deck now. It's already fairly strong, relies the spellstone for heal, damage means 4 mana 7/7 taunts and Guldan is still extremely powerful like he should be.
I think it's appropriate, but I am concerned that they didn't nerf paladin enough. That class is just totally busted right now, and I don't know why we haven't heard more complaints about it.