Hearthstone was made to be a fun casual game, you don't need to explain that to anyone. Anyone that plays this game should already know that. There are a lot of things in your post that I disagree with or are outright wrong, but there is one particular statement that I find laughable:
This is not a company thinking out of the box, it's very clear they want to conform to the masses. "Communicate and collaborate constantly, sharing code, algorithms, research, and ideas to move Blizzard forward. As we work with our teammates towards a superior end result, we keep everybody on the same page, and remain professional, humble, civil and direct throughout. Keep it simple. We code every system with a clear purpose in mind, and we aim to keep them as simple as possible (and no simpler). We don’t create new solutions when appropriate ones already exist."
Of course the company wants to share code/algorithms/everything across games. That is the way software development is suppose to work. That's not "in the box thinking", that is doing things the correct way. That is software development 101.
Mods, please don't lock this thread unless it turns into a bunch of people flamming each other, this guy hasn't broken any rules, and I would like to have a civil discussion about this. Pretty please.
There is no civil discussion to be had. Topic has came up enough times and his previous post locked enough that we know that this should also be locked immediately. While I don't know about this forum specifically, but usually reopening locked threads is breaking rules.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
People who refuses to play aggro out of principle are even worse than people who play exclusively aggro.
One should seek to become a complete player and play all archetypes, including ones that he despises for whatever irrational reasons.
i see many people (include me sometimes) say this same shit every day at the salty thread, diference is they dont break the keyboard to build high wall of text. Dude, the rng fuck everyone, sometimes your opponent, sometime you, and this always are more noticiable because you get fucked.
Mods, please don't lock this thread unless it turns into a bunch of people flamming each other, this guy hasn't broken any rules, and I would like to have a civil discussion about this. Pretty please.
There is no civil discussion to be had. Topic has came up enough times and his previous post locked enough that we know that this should also be locked immediately. While I don't know about this forum specifically, but usually reopening locked threads is breaking rules.
I suppose you're right. It's just a shame though, I really do like conversing with these conspiracy theory people just to try and understand how they have reached the conclusion they have gotten to.
It will be locked though, because the keyboard warriors will come in calling him retarded and degenerate and they'll have no choice but to put a foot down.
Author makes a lot of interesting points. Just because we enjoy an activity doesn't mean our minds should be closed to negative or alternative viewpoints.
Hearthstone is a very simple and amusing game. Elevating it to the level of esport and professional online streaming seems a bit of a push, to me at least. But it seems to make people happy so that's fine.
I just play for dopey fun. It can't be more than that because the RNG is so heavy. The simple mechanics mean you can't really do anything really clever nor make multi-turn plans. All you can do is hope the RNG pulls your cards out in the right sequence to allow you to play out your various beneficial combos.
If you think ending your poorly-reasoned diatribe with a reminder that random number generators aren't perfectly random does anything to bolster your argument, I'd like some of whatever you're smoking.
Ok some input from the feedback, I am quite happy that most of you have kept it civil and I will respond to only people who giving me this courtesy.
I am not angry about any of the subject matter, and I can't be since I haven't spent a dime on this game. I actually enjoy playing this game cause it takes very little input by me, I click a card and do basic math, that's it. And this is why I don't play games like SC2 anymore cause my hands can no longer tolerate the high APM nor can I tolerate Diablo 3s constant spell clicking even though I am a level 80 Grift player, not that it matters with the discussion at hand.
Secondly, the definition of skill can be different to many people. For me it means trained ability, I have no training in this game just like in any other card game, I learn the cards and I play by the rules. That itself is not skill, just knowledge.
Third, if you believe RNG is rigged or not, you have to accept that the core fundamental of this game is based on elements that you have no control over.
Fourth, this game was made to make money and to grow profits, Blizzard needs to grow its users and you grow your users by making entry to the game even easier. So have this in mind and understand what I am writing here, read with a mind of a businessman.
My comparisons with casinos and poker is not out of the air.
Blizzard adamantly compares this game with Poker and poker is mostly played in casinos and by wager for an obvious reason.
I just play for dopey fun. It can't be more than that because the RNG is so heavy. The simple mechanics mean you can't really do anything really clever nor make multi-turn plans. All you can do is hope the RNG pulls your cards out in the right sequence to allow you to play out your various beneficial combos.
If RNG is so dominant, how do the same players make Legend every month? How are there infinite Arena players?
I stopped reading after he said that there was RNG In SC2... I'm like wtf? SC2 is pure skill... Either you rock with that insanely high APM or you don't.
What a shit ton of shit. Why waste so much time on writing this...What do you wish to accomplish? Do you want everyone to quit games that have RNG? Get a job dude, and spend your energy there. Its a game, if I wanna spend 1 million of my money no this game, I fckin do it.
I stopped reading after he said that there was RNG In SC2... I'm like wtf? SC2 is pure skill... Either you rock with that insanely high APM or you don't.
I meant the matchmaker and mapping zones not the game itself. I should have been more clear.
I stopped reading after he said that there was RNG In SC2... I'm like wtf? SC2 is pure skill... Either you rock with that insanely high APM or you don't.
Funnily enough, there is RNG in SC2, though it has nothing to deal with anything he says. Metalopolis close spawn is an RNG roll that favours terran, while cross spawn favours zerg.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
People who refuses to play aggro out of principle are even worse than people who play exclusively aggro.
One should seek to become a complete player and play all archetypes, including ones that he despises for whatever irrational reasons.
I mean OK. I took the trouble to read all of this including the Guardian article which is a publication I respect. In terms of spreading the word about this terrible money making scheme of the evil world overlords headed up by Blizzard, I can't help but feel you are barking up the wrong tree with such a detailed post on the forums that you have put it on. You need to look into this a bit further and start contacting video game addiction services if it's something you want to explore for the good of humanity.
Like you I suffer from old man wrists and my terrible 40 apm is now even worse than it was when I was 35 so H/S is less intensive for me to play and still remains a good waste of time. This F2P game has had a few quid out of me for some packs - something I vowed never to do when I first started then promptly retracted when drunk on payday. It has become an e-sport because that is the in-thing at the moment. The kids dig it apparently. It is dull as shit to watch mind you and I still love watching a good game of SC2 over this any day.
The basic premise of any company is to make money. They advertise and publicise their products heavily to increase their sales. This is how it as always been. If you are as old as me you will remember Captain Planet which was the biggest pile of old wank since He-Man and both of these cartoons were used to sell less than robust toys.
Its just the new way to flog people stuff - there really isn't a conspiracy but you make some very interesting and well researched points.
I just play for dopey fun. It can't be more than that because the RNG is so heavy. The simple mechanics mean you can't really do anything really clever nor make multi-turn plans. All you can do is hope the RNG pulls your cards out in the right sequence to allow you to play out your various beneficial combos.
If RNG is so dominant, how do the same players make Legend every month? How are there infinite Arena players?
It is very simple question and an easy answer that you can ask to any tournament player. They have the luxury of having entire collection of cards, hence they can switch to the latest and greatest powerful deck that can mitigate RNG to the best chance of winning.
Also higher rank you go up, less players there are, so the chance of getting surprised with an unknown deck is limited, so now you can guess your way to victory. None of this per say is easy since you have to keep with the trends and know what rank what are the top decks being played.
So hopefully that answers your question.
Also this question in itself is good evidence that pure RNG has been omitted because if the game was truly randomized as they claim, anyone with any deck would be able to reach top ranks simply on luck, but that rarely happens or not at all. When was the last time a tournament player competed with a basic deck? It's just not possible because of controlled RNG and power creep. If the game was purely based on chance, then there would be no need to buy additional expansions or packs, classic players would be just as "competitive" as people with other expansions, but that's not true. And one of the reasons why instead of balancing expansion cards, Blizzard opted to get rid of them altogether in garbage bin mode.
This is all being done to get more casual players.
I mean OK. I took the trouble to read all of this including the Guardian article which is a publication I respect. In terms of spreading the word about this terrible money making scheme of the evil world overlords headed up by Blizzard, I can't help but feel you are barking up the wrong tree with such a detailed post on the forums that you have put it on. You need to look into this a bit further and start contacting video game addiction services if it's something you want to explore for the good of humanity.
I have no idea what you or the OP have been reading in that article, but the fact that researchers are able to create a program that partially solves the game means that it is a game of skill. Ultimately, that's what that counts, not some flimsy research that suffers from methological problems.
Did you just write a 2600 word essay on Hearthpwn about how much Hearthstone sucks? I didn't read it (lets face it - who did), but god damn did you waste far to much time and effort on this.
I mean OK. I took the trouble to read all of this including the Guardian article which is a publication I respect. In terms of spreading the word about this terrible money making scheme of the evil world overlords headed up by Blizzard, I can't help but feel you are barking up the wrong tree with such a detailed post on the forums that you have put it on. You need to look into this a bit further and start contacting video game addiction services if it's something you want to explore for the good of humanity.
I have no idea what you or the OP have been reading in that article, but the fact that researchers are able to create a program that partially solves the game means that it is a game of skill. Ultimately, that's what that counts, not some flimsy research that suffers from methological problems.
Why aren't you a millionaire poker player then? Why waste your time on a casual game. If poker and other casino games can fundamentally shift their chances in winning big, then no casino in the world would remain in existence.
The best people have come with is card counting and that in itself is deemed a cheat and illegal. Not because of the act itself because these games are suppose to remain random enough that majority will always lose vs some who will win.
Hearthstone was made to be a fun casual game, you don't need to explain that to anyone. Anyone that plays this game should already know that. There are a lot of things in your post that I disagree with or are outright wrong, but there is one particular statement that I find laughable:
Of course the company wants to share code/algorithms/everything across games. That is the way software development is suppose to work. That's not "in the box thinking", that is doing things the correct way. That is software development 101.
so much food for thought.
There is no civil discussion to be had. Topic has came up enough times and his previous post locked enough that we know that this should also be locked immediately. While I don't know about this forum specifically, but usually reopening locked threads is breaking rules.
People who refuses to play aggro out of principle are even worse than people who play exclusively aggro.
One should seek to become a complete player and play all archetypes, including ones that he despises for whatever irrational reasons.
i see many people (include me sometimes) say this same shit every day at the salty thread, diference is they dont break the keyboard to build high wall of text. Dude, the rng fuck everyone, sometimes your opponent, sometime you, and this always are more noticiable because you get fucked.
need take time to make new pic and signature using the new cards.
I returned to this game much like how a recovering alcoholic can relapse.
Author makes a lot of interesting points. Just because we enjoy an activity doesn't mean our minds should be closed to negative or alternative viewpoints.
Hearthstone is a very simple and amusing game. Elevating it to the level of esport and professional online streaming seems a bit of a push, to me at least. But it seems to make people happy so that's fine.
I just play for dopey fun. It can't be more than that because the RNG is so heavy. The simple mechanics mean you can't really do anything really clever nor make multi-turn plans. All you can do is hope the RNG pulls your cards out in the right sequence to allow you to play out your various beneficial combos.
If you think ending your poorly-reasoned diatribe with a reminder that random number generators aren't perfectly random does anything to bolster your argument, I'd like some of whatever you're smoking.
Ok some input from the feedback, I am quite happy that most of you have kept it civil and I will respond to only people who giving me this courtesy.
I am not angry about any of the subject matter, and I can't be since I haven't spent a dime on this game. I actually enjoy playing this game cause it takes very little input by me, I click a card and do basic math, that's it. And this is why I don't play games like SC2 anymore cause my hands can no longer tolerate the high APM nor can I tolerate Diablo 3s constant spell clicking even though I am a level 80 Grift player, not that it matters with the discussion at hand.
Secondly, the definition of skill can be different to many people. For me it means trained ability, I have no training in this game just like in any other card game, I learn the cards and I play by the rules. That itself is not skill, just knowledge.
Third, if you believe RNG is rigged or not, you have to accept that the core fundamental of this game is based on elements that you have no control over.
Fourth, this game was made to make money and to grow profits, Blizzard needs to grow its users and you grow your users by making entry to the game even easier. So have this in mind and understand what I am writing here, read with a mind of a businessman.
My comparisons with casinos and poker is not out of the air.
Blizzard adamantly compares this game with Poker and poker is mostly played in casinos and by wager for an obvious reason.
just like most card games also he said that the rng is actully rigged which is an amzing lie
I stopped reading after he said that there was RNG In SC2... I'm like wtf? SC2 is pure skill... Either you rock with that insanely high APM or you don't.
What a shit ton of shit. Why waste so much time on writing this...What do you wish to accomplish? Do you want everyone to quit games that have RNG? Get a job dude, and spend your energy there. Its a game, if I wanna spend 1 million of my money no this game, I fckin do it.
Funnily enough, there is RNG in SC2, though it has nothing to deal with anything he says. Metalopolis close spawn is an RNG roll that favours terran, while cross spawn favours zerg.
People who refuses to play aggro out of principle are even worse than people who play exclusively aggro.
One should seek to become a complete player and play all archetypes, including ones that he despises for whatever irrational reasons.
I mean OK. I took the trouble to read all of this including the Guardian article which is a publication I respect. In terms of spreading the word about this terrible money making scheme of the evil world overlords headed up by Blizzard, I can't help but feel you are barking up the wrong tree with such a detailed post on the forums that you have put it on. You need to look into this a bit further and start contacting video game addiction services if it's something you want to explore for the good of humanity.
Like you I suffer from old man wrists and my terrible 40 apm is now even worse than it was when I was 35 so H/S is less intensive for me to play and still remains a good waste of time. This F2P game has had a few quid out of me for some packs - something I vowed never to do when I first started then promptly retracted when drunk on payday. It has become an e-sport because that is the in-thing at the moment. The kids dig it apparently. It is dull as shit to watch mind you and I still love watching a good game of SC2 over this any day.
The basic premise of any company is to make money. They advertise and publicise their products heavily to increase their sales. This is how it as always been. If you are as old as me you will remember Captain Planet which was the biggest pile of old wank since He-Man and both of these cartoons were used to sell less than robust toys.
Its just the new way to flog people stuff - there really isn't a conspiracy but you make some very interesting and well researched points.
People who refuses to play aggro out of principle are even worse than people who play exclusively aggro.
One should seek to become a complete player and play all archetypes, including ones that he despises for whatever irrational reasons.
Did you just write a 2600 word essay on Hearthpwn about how much Hearthstone sucks? I didn't read it (lets face it - who did), but god damn did you waste far to much time and effort on this.
Been playing Hearthstone since March 2015. Avid theory crafter and card conceptualizer.
We have closed similar threads before. What you are doing is no more than conspiracy theory. Enough is enough.
CLOSED.
If you see a bad post on the forum use the report function under it, so I or someone else of the moderation team can take care of it!