Just as an idea that came to mind, with regards to the potential buffs that Iksar has been mentioning, should all the caravans be buffed to 4-health? As they are, they're all underperforming and really don't see any play. At least, I've not come across on ladder yet. If their effects were changed to "end-of- turn" mechanics, it'd both be off flavor and risking being too good. So, upping their health could give them the longevity to enable their respective archetypes.
IMO no, most them would then just be RNG versions of the pre-nerf watchposts. I loved the watchposts, they were viable defensive tool for mid-range. But I guess enough peoplen't as they nerfed them to be unplayable like the caravans.
I think so. Regarding watchposts, I think it was a huge mistake from Blizz sending them to trash like that. Just look at the past week GM. Half of the matchups were agro. That's disgusting, it's a competitive game. Games shouldn't be a 7 turn top deck race...
I think so. Regarding watchposts, I think it was a huge mistake from Blizz sending them to trash like that. Just look at the past week GM. Half of the matchups were agro. That's disgusting, it's a competitive game. Games shouldn't be a 7 turn top deck race...
3 mana watch post shouldn't have been nerfed. Now hunters roam fearlessly on the ladder with close to 0 counters.
I think so. Regarding watchposts, I think it was a huge mistake from Blizz sending them to trash like that. Just look at the past week GM. Half of the matchups were agro. That's disgusting, it's a competitive game. Games shouldn't be a 7 turn top deck race...
3 mana watch post shouldn't have been nerfed. Now hunters roam fearlessly on the ladder with close to 0 counters.
Yes, specially that one. But IMO any of the watch posts needed a nerf. People cried unnecesarily, like they use to do when they see something new they don't know how to counter.
I'm amazed that people disliked so much Watch Post but on the other side cards like Tickatus seem ok for most of the playerbase... Watch Post were a useful way of controlling agro. It actually doesn't kill them, just delay their game plan until you can react properly (unlike Tickatus, that crushes any control deck with low value-generation or any combo deck).
I don't know other way of handling the broken agro there is right now other than nerfing it to the bottom if it's not by introducing reliable tech cards like watch posts. I'm really amazed that Blizzard have 0 prediction and meta analysis skills. You didn't needed to be a genius to understand that by nerfing posts agro would overwhelm every other deck.
IMO no, most them would then just be RNG versions of the pre-nerf watchposts. I loved the watchposts, they were viable defensive tool for mid-range. But I guess enough peoplen't as they nerfed them to be unplayable like the caravans.
Not exactly. Soldiers Caravan is very straightforward, but also potentially would be the most problematic given Paladins power level currently. Soothsayer's Caravan would be the only one I'd consider to be RNG oriented, but considering it's got no real board impact without buffs, it's nothing more than a low impact value engine you could easily ignore if you chose to. The rest are pretty much the same amount of RNG as anything that affects cards you've chosen to put in your deck. So, pretty controlled rng then.
I think so. Regarding watchposts, I think it was a huge mistake from Blizz sending them to trash like that. Just look at the past week GM. Half of the matchups were agro. That's disgusting, it's a competitive game. Games shouldn't be a 7 turn top deck race...
And why exactly would 20+ min games be any less "disgusting"? I'm not even an avid aggro player, but I might become one given how often I read comments that can be summed up as "control good aggro bad". The same way you hate losing on turn 6 many people hate losing by turn 15....
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I think so. Regarding watchposts, I think it was a huge mistake from Blizz sending them to trash like that. Just look at the past week GM. Half of the matchups were agro. That's disgusting, it's a competitive game. Games shouldn't be a 7 turn top deck race...
And why exactly would 20+ min games be any less "disgusting"? I'm not even an avid aggro player, but I might become one given how often I read comments that can be summed up as "control good aggro bad". The same way you hate losing on turn 6 many people hate losing by turn 15....
I'm not saying games should always be 20+ minutes long, don't get me wrong. What I disagree is that half of the lineups in the GM were agro. There should be a fair amount of every type of deck (agro, midrange, control, combo)
Don't get me wrong, control isn't good, agro isn't bad, any play style is good depending of what you like. But a competitive game shouldn't have half of the decks being agro and matches defined by top decks as we saw past weekend dude. That's a consequence of putting an unnecessary nerf to all of the watch posts. They should had left alive AT LEAST the 3 mana watch post. Even control decks sometimes have no chance against these agro matchups.
I think so. Regarding watchposts, I think it was a huge mistake from Blizz sending them to trash like that. Just look at the past week GM. Half of the matchups were agro. That's disgusting, it's a competitive game. Games shouldn't be a 7 turn top deck race...
And why exactly would 20+ min games be any less "disgusting"? I'm not even an avid aggro player, but I might become one given how often I read comments that can be summed up as "control good aggro bad". The same way you hate losing on turn 6 many people hate losing by turn 15....
I'm not saying games should always be 20+ minutes long, don't get me wrong. What I disagree is that half of the lineups in the GM were agro. There should be a fair amount of every type of deck (agro, midrange, control, combo)
Don't get me wrong, control isn't good, agro isn't bad, any play style is good depending of what you like. But a competitive game shouldn't have half of the decks being agro and matches defined by top decks as we saw past weekend dude. That's a consequence of putting an unnecessary nerf to all of the watch posts. They should had left alive AT LEAST the 3 mana watch post. Even control decks sometimes have no chance against these agro matchups.
That I can agree, Watch Posts were a really good idea for keeping the hyper aggression in check, maybe a little bit overtuned (especially Far Watch Post), but they actually managed to provide some kind of counterplay to the game. Maybe that's why people hated it, they don't like being countered. That's when both sides become actually dumb, some aggro players were spoiled to think that they should be free to do whatever they want without the opponent reacting properly.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I love you Dreadsteed, I will never disenchant you!
I'm not sure what you mean by setting Soldier's Caravan to a 0/3 to match primalfin. The murloc totem summons 1 murloc, while the caravan summons 2 recruits.
Summoning 2 recruits at the end of the turn is strong. If that change is made, it should either be 3 mana or nerfed to 1/1, possibly 0/1
I'm pretty sure we're getting the rest of the class Caravans next expansion. I'd like to see them buffed. Sure - why not? No seriously, there's no reason NOT to buff them. They aren't doing anything and honestly there's like, 1 Caravan with a decent effect anyways. I support this.
Having a must kill unit with 4 health on turn 2 is not fun. There are so few 2 mana cards that can deal with 4 health. If multiple 2 mana removals got the Holy Smite treatment and dealt 4 damage to a minion, then i'd be ok with it. But as it stands, having 4 health unit that snowballs on turn 2 sounds like a recipe for frustration
I think so. Regarding watchposts, I think it was a huge mistake from Blizz sending them to trash like that. Just look at the past week GM. Half of the matchups were agro. That's disgusting, it's a competitive game. Games shouldn't be a 7 turn top deck race...
And why exactly would 20+ min games be any less "disgusting"? I'm not even an avid aggro player, but I might become one given how often I read comments that can be summed up as "control good aggro bad". The same way you hate losing on turn 6 many people hate losing by turn 15....
I'm not saying games should always be 20+ minutes long, don't get me wrong. What I disagree is that half of the lineups in the GM were agro. There should be a fair amount of every type of deck (agro, midrange, control, combo)
Don't get me wrong, control isn't good, agro isn't bad, any play style is good depending of what you like. But a competitive game shouldn't have half of the decks being agro and matches defined by top decks as we saw past weekend dude. That's a consequence of putting an unnecessary nerf to all of the watch posts. They should had left alive AT LEAST the 3 mana watch post. Even control decks sometimes have no chance against these agro matchups.
That I can agree, Watch Posts were a really good idea for keeping the hyper aggression in check, maybe a little bit overtuned (especially Far Watch Post), but they actually managed to provide some kind of counterplay to the game. Maybe that's why people hated it, they don't like being countered. That's when both sides become actually dumb, some aggro players were spoiled to think that they should be free to do whatever they want without the opponent reacting properly.
A proper nerf to Far Watch Post would have been to trigger his ability only on 1 or 2 cards drawn per turn. That way, it would only be a counter against agro, but wouldn't excel that much against other types of decks that are reliant on draw (like Miracle Druid, for example). But Blizz would never EVER admit an error on a mechanic and take a step back. That's one of the things I hate about Blizzard. They almost NEVER rework things when they screwed it up. Balance team sometimes can be such morons... I also play Gwent, and what I like of Gwent is that they take balance REALLY serious. If they have to completely change a card that's broken (or weak), THEY WILL.
Regarding to what you said Python (forgot to quote you)... I mean, isn't a recipe for frustration a turn 1/2 full board as we see with Token Druid, or dying at turn 6 with hunter?
Just as an idea that came to mind, with regards to the potential buffs that Iksar has been mentioning, should all the caravans be buffed to 4-health? As they are, they're all underperforming and really don't see any play. At least, I've not come across on ladder yet. If their effects were changed to "end-of- turn" mechanics, it'd both be off flavor and risking being too good. So, upping their health could give them the longevity to enable their respective archetypes.
I say yea
IMO no, most them would then just be RNG versions of the pre-nerf watchposts. I loved the watchposts, they were viable defensive tool for mid-range. But I guess enough peoplen't as they nerfed them to be unplayable like the caravans.
I think so. Regarding watchposts, I think it was a huge mistake from Blizz sending them to trash like that. Just look at the past week GM. Half of the matchups were agro. That's disgusting, it's a competitive game. Games shouldn't be a 7 turn top deck race...
3 mana watch post shouldn't have been nerfed. Now hunters roam fearlessly on the ladder with close to 0 counters.
I'd like to buff caravans to 4 health, too. Seems like they will never get used in their current state.
Also would have been fun if all classes got one...
Demon hunter: Start of turn, give your hero +1 attack.
Mage: Add a random spell to your hand.
Druid: Gain 10 mana crystals, 10 armor, draw 10 cards, summon 10 minions from your deck and give them +10/+10.
Warrior: Gain 2 armor.
It's the little things. Missed opportunities there, really.
Caravans are nasty when they pop out of a 'summon a minion' effect and I think they work best when they do then.
Yes, specially that one. But IMO any of the watch posts needed a nerf. People cried unnecesarily, like they use to do when they see something new they don't know how to counter.
I'm amazed that people disliked so much Watch Post but on the other side cards like Tickatus seem ok for most of the playerbase... Watch Post were a useful way of controlling agro. It actually doesn't kill them, just delay their game plan until you can react properly (unlike Tickatus, that crushes any control deck with low value-generation or any combo deck).
I don't know other way of handling the broken agro there is right now other than nerfing it to the bottom if it's not by introducing reliable tech cards like watch posts. I'm really amazed that Blizzard have 0 prediction and meta analysis skills. You didn't needed to be a genius to understand that by nerfing posts agro would overwhelm every other deck.
Not exactly. Soldiers Caravan is very straightforward, but also potentially would be the most problematic given Paladins power level currently. Soothsayer's Caravan would be the only one I'd consider to be RNG oriented, but considering it's got no real board impact without buffs, it's nothing more than a low impact value engine you could easily ignore if you chose to. The rest are pretty much the same amount of RNG as anything that affects cards you've chosen to put in your deck. So, pretty controlled rng then.
I think all caravans should trigger at the end of the turn
Also, if necessary Tinyfin's Caravan could be nerfed to 3 mana in order to match Mana Tide Totem, Soldier's Caravan could have -1 attack to match Primalfin Totem, and Apothecary's Caravan could either cost 3 mana or have less 1 attack
other caravans are kinda bad anyway
And why exactly would 20+ min games be any less "disgusting"? I'm not even an avid aggro player, but I might become one given how often I read comments that can be summed up as "control good aggro bad". The same way you hate losing on turn 6 many people hate losing by turn 15....
I love you Dreadsteed, I will never disenchant you!
I'm not saying games should always be 20+ minutes long, don't get me wrong. What I disagree is that half of the lineups in the GM were agro. There should be a fair amount of every type of deck (agro, midrange, control, combo)
Don't get me wrong, control isn't good, agro isn't bad, any play style is good depending of what you like. But a competitive game shouldn't have half of the decks being agro and matches defined by top decks as we saw past weekend dude. That's a consequence of putting an unnecessary nerf to all of the watch posts. They should had left alive AT LEAST the 3 mana watch post. Even control decks sometimes have no chance against these agro matchups.
That I can agree, Watch Posts were a really good idea for keeping the hyper aggression in check, maybe a little bit overtuned (especially Far Watch Post), but they actually managed to provide some kind of counterplay to the game. Maybe that's why people hated it, they don't like being countered. That's when both sides become actually dumb, some aggro players were spoiled to think that they should be free to do whatever they want without the opponent reacting properly.
I love you Dreadsteed, I will never disenchant you!
I'm not sure what you mean by setting Soldier's Caravan to a 0/3 to match primalfin. The murloc totem summons 1 murloc, while the caravan summons 2 recruits.
Summoning 2 recruits at the end of the turn is strong. If that change is made, it should either be 3 mana or nerfed to 1/1, possibly 0/1
I'm pretty sure we're getting the rest of the class Caravans next expansion.
I'd like to see them buffed. Sure - why not? No seriously, there's no reason NOT to buff them. They aren't doing anything and honestly there's like, 1 Caravan with a decent effect anyways. I support this.
please don't bully my son
Having a must kill unit with 4 health on turn 2 is not fun. There are so few 2 mana cards that can deal with 4 health. If multiple 2 mana removals got the Holy Smite treatment and dealt 4 damage to a minion, then i'd be ok with it. But as it stands, having 4 health unit that snowballs on turn 2 sounds like a recipe for frustration
A proper nerf to Far Watch Post would have been to trigger his ability only on 1 or 2 cards drawn per turn. That way, it would only be a counter against agro, but wouldn't excel that much against other types of decks that are reliant on draw (like Miracle Druid, for example). But Blizz would never EVER admit an error on a mechanic and take a step back. That's one of the things I hate about Blizzard. They almost NEVER rework things when they screwed it up. Balance team sometimes can be such morons... I also play Gwent, and what I like of Gwent is that they take balance REALLY serious. If they have to completely change a card that's broken (or weak), THEY WILL.
Regarding to what you said Python (forgot to quote you)... I mean, isn't a recipe for frustration a turn 1/2 full board as we see with Token Druid, or dying at turn 6 with hunter?
Dying at turn 6 as a control class is what I wanted to say but couldn't edit it again, that thing in Hearthpwn is so stupid lol