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Developer Update - New Maps & Heroes to be Free, Interface Options, End of Game Cards
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Legion - Treasure Demons, Unholy Artifact Intro, Tweets, Setup of the Month
Ben Brode on Basic Cards Power Creep
The unlisted video returns from the dead! We already recapped what Ben Brode had to say on basic cards and power creep last Friday when the video was accidentally shared. You can find a recap of the video below, or watch the video here.
Quote from Ben Brode
- Power creep over basic cards isn't a big deal. They want basic cards to be bad, upgrading your free cards makes you feel good.
- New players don't just lose games because they're using basic cards which are worse then the better versions of them - they're new players.
- Ice Rager isn't played in the meta, and therefore has no effect on the power level of the game so it's not really power creep.
- Dr. Boom is better than War Golem and is an example of power creep. War Golem was never played though due to it being bad.
Piloted Shredder at 3 attack makes it vulnerable to Shadow Word: Pain and also stops it from trading into various 4-drops... Or 2 health makes it die to stuff like Bluegill Warrior, Holy Nova, Holy Smite etc. yet still being sticky. I think one stat loss would be just enough.
Buffing everything doesn't make for quicker games. If aggro decks get a two mana: spawn 4 2/2s, the control decks get a one mana holy nova, and the combo decks get one mana astral communication (also they keep their hand), the meta shifts to include more board clears, but the game doesn't speed up. In fact, it would probably slow down, as people are realizing control already has the perfect arsenal to deal with that stuff.
People keep using "power creep" when what they really must mean is "over budget," "under-costed," or just plain "overpowered." Brode is talking about a different phenomenon, so it doesn't seem appropriate to complain that his answer to a completely different question isn't satisfying for the question you wish he answered.
Dr. Boom can't possibly be an example of power creep when compared to Troggzor the Earthinator and Chillmaw because those cards came out at the same time or after Dr. Boom did. If Dr. Boom is too powerful (and who am I to say he isn't?), then it's just because he's too powerful. War Golem and Magma Rager are actual victims of power creep, because newer cards came out afterward that had better stats for the same cost, and that's what the concept means (or at least what Brode and the dev team understand it to mean). That's why this discussion always goes in this direction.
Mad Scientist is another bad example of "power creep." That card is terrible in any deck that doesn't run a secret (which is most of them, truthfully). You get more value out of a Bloodfen Raptor if you aren't a hunter, mage, or paladin. Again, it may be too powerful in the decks that can use it (I'm not here to argue either way), but it isn't strictly superior to previous 2-drops. It is demonstrably worse than a whole lot of them. For Mad Scientist to be a power creep card there needs to have been a 2/2 for two mana with no text (there isn't one) or a 1/1, 2/1, 1/2, etc. for two mana with the same text, or a 2/2 with the same text and a higher mana cost, for example.
I sort of feel like GvG and Naxxramas dropped in and completely ruined the careful balance of the base game, and Blizzard has been trying to use followup adventures / expansions to correct course ever since. That's why TGT and Blackrock seemed at once underwhelming, but also upped the overall game power level. If you are allergic to nerfing cards, what other choice do you have?
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Banlists
Alright, I can agree with that. The adventures don't release many spells. However, control decks need minions too. I run seven legendaries with my control priest, and it works completely fine. Control decks use big minions. Any time a big minion comes out, control gets a potential Buff. An aggro-killing minion works too. While there aren't enough spells, the new minions make up for it
Simply put - cards with no text are bad. Cards with same cost with effects - good.
a friend of mine just started the game a week ag. i built him a deck of basic cards and he is slaying all those farmers on rank 20
skill > cards
I remember at least 1 one year ago, Amaz was playing his priest deck and he lost against a mage with a deck made of basic cards.
Much has changed in that year.
Of course there have to be powercreeps since you can't just create every 2-3 month something different. Guess one day, each card wil have a similar effect to whatever was before (other spare part mechanics etc...)
But I guess creating powercreeps still doesn't solve the amount of rng in this game, especially, it can make this game even faster in the early but also in the late game and this is what people do not like. I would rather appreciate to play the old basic cards than all these deathrattle op minions. Even mysterious challenger as an example will be worse than some other card one day if this phylosophy goes on.
I feel the same that there need to be some bad cards within the game. Otherwise some minions like Murloc Knight and Piloted Shredder gets better and better over time. Tinyfin was a good way to nerf the Murloc Knight. Also I share his opinion about power creep. Who cares about unplayed cards to get a better version which again is never played in constructed? That is no power creeping.
I really respect the way the game has been continuing to develop. Cards like Magma Rager and Ice Rager are like hilariously terrible siblings. They each have character, and their spot in the collection and community mindspace is valuable. I'm glad they exist, along with Worthless Imp and Shadow of Nothing. They're all a part of the game, meaning they could eventually be used in a Muster for Battle or Ball of Spiders-like card. For now though, minions like War Golem and Flame Leviathan are great to see as "not so bad..." results from Unstable Portal.
Murloc Tinyfin really is a good example that the devs can improve balance after-the-fact without direct nerfs. It doesn't even impact Neptulon as one might expect, because it synergizes well with Murloc Tidecaller, Siltfin Spiritwalker, Coldlight Seer, and... just so much. When you're overloaded, a 0-mana card is actually interesting to have. It does its job as a murloc by helping to overwhelm the opponent. It's great flavor. But does it shove Wisp out of the top-tier meta? Hell no, it buffs the Target Dummy + Wisp + now Murloc Tinyfin Edwin VanCleef Rank 20-or-bust dream decks.
It is weird that Ice Rager is stronger than Magma Rager. Because fire type attacks were super effective against ice type pokemons.
but ice melt into water and water win XD
Ice is harder; so there's more defense.
Damn give us more deck slot , you ********!
You know i do not think we even need more deck slots if that is too difficult for the Dev Team to implement. All we really need is the ability to save a simple Deck List and a drop down menu to automatically fill a Deck Slot with the cards in those lists. 9 deck slots is probably enough if i can save deck lists to select from and a Deck Slot when I want to change them.