Why people get angry while discussing about a card from a game? O_o
Dudes calm down!
Because people like to insist that they are right. There is nothing wrong with discussion. Emotions tend to run high if you have an opinion and someone else disagrees even if it is just an opinion about a card in a digital card game. That said people really shouldn't be getting angry over this.
In my opinion what I do like about the card is that it can be used as a spy. As long as it is in your hand it will give you information on what your opponent is holding which can be very useful. Also it is much better than shifter zerus because it only cares about what your opponent is holding and your opponent is most likely not going to be playing unplayable cards.
I feel this was directed to me, so I apologize. But got kinda annoyed from the cliche posts, which just talked about how insane this card is w/o looking at the whole picture. And the same people just denied, when others tried to bring up the cons. Once again, sorry for the burst.
Super interesting card with mechanics that I love, glad they've printed it. I'd wager that about a month after the expansion you never see it again (outside of maybe tournament play). Knowing one card and giving yourself a potentially dead one just isn't worth cutting your deck for.
I feel this was directed to me, so I apologize. But got kinda annoyed from the cliche posts, which just talked about how insane this card is w/o looking at the whole picture. And the same people just denied, when others tried to bring up the cons. Once again, sorry for the burst.
It's all right, both sides expressed their opinions, if there is no way to come to an agreement you just have to wait a few weeks and we will all have our answers xD
It's not like we should all have the exact same opinion on something that noone can fully understand yet :)
you never want to have it in your hand at all vs aggro
vs control, you should know pretty much every card in their deck and have a reasonable guess at their hand and what to play into/around..he might be better if he changed in to a card left in their deck that WASN'T in their hand
vs combo, does it matter? you beat them before the combo goes off or you don't
In most of the cases: - if you as a priest (control) are in topdeck mode, you have already lost - if your opponent has no handcards, you have already won - if you play vs aggro, you mostly copy an aggressive card, which can be used to drop and trade - you will not replace a low-cost card, because this is a high-cost card tech. Why? Because most of the copied cards will be high mana cards, since these will be held on. So, don't be confused about the 1 mana, in reality it will play as a ~5 mana card.
It's not like we should all have the exact same opinion on something that noone can fully understand yet :)
But bro, you got me all wrong. I don't want people to think exactly like me. I don't force my opinion on others and I never aim to do that. I just wanted to stress on the things, which some people are ignoring for some reason. I wanted all of us to see the both sides on the card. Because - just take a look at the first few pages and don't tell me that you don't stumble upon posts, crediting the card with superlatives like "insane, best priest card" and what not.
I don't want to sound like a self-centered prick, but at least I explain my arguments and I give examples from the most likely scenarios. With the risk of annoying someone or starting a needless flame war, I think, that the points about this card being bad against fast decks reflect the reality of things. Because think about it - how important really is to get a good hand in the mulligan stage against aggro. They are an arch-type, which will keep pressuring you, if you don't react adequately to their plays, if you constantly have a slow hand. Having a consistent one is way more important than knowing specific cards, because this knowledge on its own won't bring you the answers to your hand out of nowhere.
My issue was that some people looked way too much on the positive side, while ignoring vital facts. I don't claim, that I understand the card fully, but I have an opinion, which is accompanied with logical and realistic thinking, and I think, that I'm reaching the truth regarding the usefulness of this card far from those, who are just blindly defending it.
- if you play vs aggro, you mostly copy an aggressive card, which can be used to drop and trade
If you don't mind I would like to reply to your post, although others brought up this argument.
Imagine the following scenario - the little chameleon copies a 2/1 minion from the opponent's hand. You do realize, that 1) they have more synergies with this one (e.g. Deckhand with weapons or murlocs giving health to eachother), 2) a 1-1 trade isn't worth it, because they can just use a weaker token or their weapon to kill your minion, 2.5) if their board is constantly growing, you won't achieve much from this single minion. They can just ignore it and aim the face. Not to mention, that you might copy the wrong cost minions on the wrong turns - e.g. turn 1 this copies a 2 mana minion, on turn 2 this copies another expensive card, turn 3 - you finally get something playable, but the curve is bad. Especially if you falling behind the board.
Dunno, dude, from my experience against aggro - you would never want to have unreliable plays against them. Against slow decks this card does provide you some information, which you can use to make optimal plays. But of the meta is fast, better leave it out of your decks.
Why are priests and warlocks still getting all the amazing cards?!
My question exactly. I thought we’d see warrior and shaman get the love this time since they plan out expansions in advance and they’ve known those two classes have struggled for awhile now.
Tbh against the majority of the ladder, I know exactly which cards they have in their deck once I see their class or their T1-4 plays. Unreliably seeing what’s in their hand and the cost of a card might not end up being worthwhile except against surprising decks. Since I play janky decks, I’m not going to enjoy having this played against me but I don’t think I’d actually use it in one of my own. The assumption that you’ll have this T1 and read your opponent’s gameplan will rarely be the case.
- if you play vs aggro, you mostly copy an aggressive card, which can be used to drop and trade
If you don't mind I would like to reply to your post, although others brought up this argument.
Imagine the following scenario - the little chameleon copies a 2/1 minion from the opponent's hand. You do realize, that 1) they have more synergies with this one (e.g. Deckhand with weapons or murlocs giving health to eachother), 2) a 1-1 trade isn't worth it, because they can just use a weaker token or their weapon to kill your minion, 2.5) if their board is constantly growing, you won't achieve much from this single minion. They can just ignore it and aim the face. Not to mention, that you might copy the wrong cost minions on the wrong turns - e.g. turn 1 this copies a 2 mana minion, on turn 2 this copies another expensive card, turn 3 - you finally get something playable, but the curve is bad. Especially if you falling behind the board.
Dunno, dude, from my experience against aggro - you would never want to have unreliable plays against them. Against slow decks this card does provide you some information, which you can use to make optimal plays. But of the meta is fast, better leave it out of your decks.
This is a rather pooor argument, simply because of what I stated below - you probably will replace something in the middle curve, not an early answer vs aggro.
You make it sound as if Drakonid is a bad card, since it doesn't help you vs aggro. This one at least has the chance to be something you can play for (bad) Tempo instead of nothing at all - after all, you would try to hold on to it for as long as possible due to the higher value it could generate. Sure, it may become some kind of trap, but with enough experience that shouldn't be a problem....
And there can also be some highroll cases, which offset the fact that you draw it too early - for example, it becomes Unleash the Hounds, enabling you to trade the board.... ;)
Same. I'm tired of trying to play other classes when their cards just collect dust from my being able to be used in a viable deck. Lay on Hands has just been staring at me.....menacingly....
If you don't mind I would like to reply to your post, although others brought up this argument.
Imagine the following scenario - the little chameleon copies a 2/1 minion from the opponent's hand. You do realize, that 1) they have more synergies with this one (e.g. Deckhand with weapons or murlocs giving health to eachother), 2) a 1-1 trade isn't worth it, because they can just use a weaker token or their weapon to kill your minion, 2.5) if their board is constantly growing, you won't achieve much from this single minion. They can just ignore it and aim the face. Not to mention, that you might copy the wrong cost minions on the wrong turns - e.g. turn 1 this copies a 2 mana minion, on turn 2 this copies another expensive card, turn 3 - you finally get something playable, but the curve is bad. Especially if you falling behind the board.
Dunno, dude, from my experience against aggro - you would never want to have unreliable plays against them. Against slow decks this card does provide you some information, which you can use to make optimal plays. But of the meta is fast, better leave it out of your decks.
You have valid points. So this gets me thinking, you will not run this card in the removal or mass removal slot. You will not run this card as a win condition. You can only run this card as a tech card. So it's like ooze. You're fine dropping a 3/2 against an inner fire priest, so you should be fine dropping whatever this card can produce against priest similarly. The problem is, you're much better off running a geist in this case. Or maybe an ooze since it helps against warlocks, mages and paladins.
But the card gives intelligence, which can be valuable unto itself. The problem comes in knowing only 1 card among many cards. So you can be sure which card to play around, but not exactly which card not to play around. Unless the hand size is low, you can not reliably punish an opponent for not having drawn a card imo.
I think this card is meta dependant for it to be good. It is very important what decks are played at the meta. If the cards it copies proves to be very good in multiple matchups + if gaining intelligence becomes important against multiple popular decks of the time = then this card will see play. If it will not be relevant that much, it will probably not be played. But it's not correct to write this card as not that good because it is bad against aggro as it becomes a 2/1. This card will be played in the spot of a card like Mind Control, a tech card. Mind control would be even worse in that scenario. (which is more like a tech card against warlocks)
Besides, you make it sound like this card is better against control than aggro. I disagree sir. Spotting a divine favor, whatever mage secret, whatever weapon they have, whatever useful card, whatever deck archetype the opponent is running (which lock, which pala, which priest or whichever class has dual archetypes) is actually very very useful. You are underestimating the value of information.
Or maybe you'll get into a weapon/removal you are not supposed to be getting your hands into and then just play it right there. Since I lacked second glyph, I decided to play a shifting scroll in my secret mage deck as a budget option, and more often than not it was even better than glyph. With glyph, you have to invest 2 mana beforehand and you might get crap so you don't go for it if you already have a tight play. But sometimes scroll can give you an even better alternative without you spending any mana. So it is guarenteed advantage. And it's not like you don't have other cards to play if scroll doesn't turn into something useful for that turn, even as an aggressive mage. So just imagine how it can be for priest. Seriosly play secret mage with 1 glyph and 1 scroll instead of double glyph, and you will see that having a card that transforms itself isn't that bad. Random legendaries are usually crap so that 1 mana legendary is crap, but scroll and chameleos will most of the time give you good cards.
have this card when your opponent has only one or two cards in hand (specially at the end of the game) is extremely valuable and can turn the game in your favour.
best revealed card so far. this should slot in every priest deck that isn't big priest. for those saying it's bad against aggro - lots of aggro decks run cheap taunts and removal, you know? just copying a tar creeper, call to arms, explosive runes, or cheap weapon could easily win you the game. and obviously it's insane against control or combo. copying a DK, rin, lich king, etc.... this strikes me as a card that everyone is going to need to learn to play around.
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I feel this was directed to me, so I apologize. But got kinda annoyed from the cliche posts, which just talked about how insane this card is w/o looking at the whole picture. And the same people just denied, when others tried to bring up the cons. Once again, sorry for the burst.
Super interesting card with mechanics that I love, glad they've printed it. I'd wager that about a month after the expansion you never see it again (outside of maybe tournament play). Knowing one card and giving yourself a potentially dead one just isn't worth cutting your deck for.
Top deck is cheat
cute but useless.
you never want to top deck it
you never want to have it in your hand at all vs aggro
vs control, you should know pretty much every card in their deck and have a reasonable guess at their hand and what to play into/around..he might be better if he changed in to a card left in their deck that WASN'T in their hand
vs combo, does it matter? you beat them before the combo goes off or you don't
some points I would like you to consider:
In most of the cases:
- if you as a priest (control) are in topdeck mode, you have already lost
- if your opponent has no handcards, you have already won
- if you play vs aggro, you mostly copy an aggressive card, which can be used to drop and trade
- you will not replace a low-cost card, because this is a high-cost card tech. Why? Because most of the copied cards will be high mana cards, since these will be held on. So, don't be confused about the 1 mana, in reality it will play as a ~5 mana card.
But bro, you got me all wrong. I don't want people to think exactly like me. I don't force my opinion on others and I never aim to do that. I just wanted to stress on the things, which some people are ignoring for some reason. I wanted all of us to see the both sides on the card. Because - just take a look at the first few pages and don't tell me that you don't stumble upon posts, crediting the card with superlatives like "insane, best priest card" and what not.
I don't want to sound like a self-centered prick, but at least I explain my arguments and I give examples from the most likely scenarios. With the risk of annoying someone or starting a needless flame war, I think, that the points about this card being bad against fast decks reflect the reality of things. Because think about it - how important really is to get a good hand in the mulligan stage against aggro. They are an arch-type, which will keep pressuring you, if you don't react adequately to their plays, if you constantly have a slow hand. Having a consistent one is way more important than knowing specific cards, because this knowledge on its own won't bring you the answers to your hand out of nowhere.
My issue was that some people looked way too much on the positive side, while ignoring vital facts. I don't claim, that I understand the card fully, but I have an opinion, which is accompanied with logical and realistic thinking, and I think, that I'm reaching the truth regarding the usefulness of this card far from those, who are just blindly defending it.
Creative card, but damn I was hoping for Lady in Black
If you don't mind I would like to reply to your post, although others brought up this argument.
Imagine the following scenario - the little chameleon copies a 2/1 minion from the opponent's hand. You do realize, that 1) they have more synergies with this one (e.g. Deckhand with weapons or murlocs giving health to eachother), 2) a 1-1 trade isn't worth it, because they can just use a weaker token or their weapon to kill your minion, 2.5) if their board is constantly growing, you won't achieve much from this single minion. They can just ignore it and aim the face. Not to mention, that you might copy the wrong cost minions on the wrong turns - e.g. turn 1 this copies a 2 mana minion, on turn 2 this copies another expensive card, turn 3 - you finally get something playable, but the curve is bad. Especially if you falling behind the board.
Dunno, dude, from my experience against aggro - you would never want to have unreliable plays against them. Against slow decks this card does provide you some information, which you can use to make optimal plays. But of the meta is fast, better leave it out of your decks.
doesn't clear the board vs aggro, will be immediately dusting this trash card. what a waste of design space.
nah jk
Kaladin's RoS Set Review
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2 questions:
1) If you opponent has no more cards in hand, does it remain whichever card it last transformed into?
2) Will it be obvious to your opponent that you have this in your hand?
Mmm
Tbh against the majority of the ladder, I know exactly which cards they have in their deck once I see their class or their T1-4 plays. Unreliably seeing what’s in their hand and the cost of a card might not end up being worthwhile except against surprising decks. Since I play janky decks, I’m not going to enjoy having this played against me but I don’t think I’d actually use it in one of my own. The assumption that you’ll have this T1 and read your opponent’s gameplan will rarely be the case.
Same. I'm tired of trying to play other classes when their cards just collect dust from my being able to be used in a viable deck. Lay on Hands has just been staring at me.....menacingly....
I eat Kingsbane rogues for breakfast.
Really fun card, great design but not really sure how strong it will be either, seems good in control match ups only.
have this card when your opponent has only one or two cards in hand (specially at the end of the game) is extremely valuable and can turn the game in your favour.
Finally a few good design legends, unfortunately it's more OP stuff for Priest.
best revealed card so far. this should slot in every priest deck that isn't big priest.
for those saying it's bad against aggro - lots of aggro decks run cheap taunts and removal, you know? just copying a tar creeper, call to arms, explosive runes, or cheap weapon could easily win you the game.
and obviously it's insane against control or combo. copying a DK, rin, lich king, etc....
this strikes me as a card that everyone is going to need to learn to play around.