I do not find it fulfilling to join in the parade of the moaning and bitching about balance issues whether real or imagined. And do not have complaints about any other imbalances or so called 'cancer decks'. But ultimately hearthstone is a game about maintaining an equilbrium of value, and sustaining the necessity to edge out the opponent in obtaining this value.
Doppelganger into evolve is an auto concede for me. To compare, let me lay out other scenarios which basically result in autoloss:
1. time warp + apprentice + antonidas
2. raza + anduin (situational but applies)
3. crystal core
I celebrate the variety of this game and it's 'constantly evolving meta', but none of the situations above make me feel cheated or lessen my enjoyment of the game.
What happens when the evolve spawn some craps that you cant even deal with a standard board clear or a normal 5/6 mana magic?or what happenes when you dont even draw it?some people brain really doesnt work.
I agree that dopple+evolve is broken and really needs a rework. too many times i had to concede even if i had blizzard or firestorm in hand.
What decks are you playing that makes this play auto-concede? Doppel-evolve does have a very strong high-roll potential, but also a very strong low-roll potential as well. Evolving totems for example always has a chance for doomsayer. The average 6-mana card from this evolve combo is approximately 5/5 in stats, which is under-statted to begin with, and there are a lot of low-statted 6 mana cards in standard right now as well. Wild is a different story, but in standard it's relatively balanced.
They also have to go through 5 turns to draw this combo. Shaman does have some of the strongest early game board presence if they have the God draw, not necessarily with strong minions, but cards that can spread out board presence very quickly and easily, taking advantage of an aggro meta that doesn't see tons of AoE from classes other than Priest or Warlock. Their plays have to be meticulous because some of their cards like Jade Claws overload them and can take away a doppel-evolve combo the following turn if they are not careful. They play minions with 0 attack, and if they played Jade Claws on 2 then they play with only 2 mana on turn 3....etc. If you can match their board presence and maintain pressure on turns 1-5, you can force an early evolve or tempo-slowing of playing Jade Claws somewhere in there. Turn 6 doppel-evolve could be all they have left to win the game, and if it's a low-roll, then you win. Contrarily if a shaman doppel-evolves a huge board of minions because you couldn't keep up with their early game, then they win, and that's just how the game works for them.
All in all Shaman just relies on a lot of high-rolls to win the game, like high-rolling spellpower totem to clear with maelstrom portal, or high-rolling a heal totem to perfectly put some of their minions out of clearing range, and because of that, it doesn't really need a nerf considering RNG and the pure existence of cards like Big-Time Racketeer is a hard-counter to their deck. Doppel-evolve is just another roll of the dice.
If you have to build a subpar deck to activate an OP win condition, that's not a problem. The issue is when you can have the broken combo without sacrificing the rest of your deck. None of the four decks you mention are higher than tier 3 at the moment, so it's not much of a problem.
Literally, only one scenario you've listed is autoloss (Time Warp). Anything else is manageable and winnable.
Actually if you know when to play Sacred Trial as Paladin it's not an auto-loss, but an auto-win LOLOLOL. This has happened twice where exodia mage plays Sorc Apprentice and clones it a bunch, has 4 of them, plays Antonidas and then it gets destroyed by Sacred Trial... laughing
Of course this is a very niche case and exodia mage is very annoying haha
Yeah you're right, brawl and twisting nether are very much a part of this meta! ROFL
um most zoolocks and control warriors run brawl and twisting nether. dopple gangster evolve needs no nerfing its very common to get unlucky, and its really a highroll cause most evolve shamans have no cards in their hand after they evolve doppl
I well hearthstone is rng. So you could pay 6 mana for 3 1/1s or get 3 cairnes. Cause this game doesn't reward skill. The fact that community loves to hate on others opinions like proves that they're so deadest with sucking the developers dick instead of understanding why people complain. That's why the devs don't care, the majority love blizzard more than helping and understanding. You guys are what you eat after all ;). You want a better card game with more factors in your control play gwent. Hell even shadowverse has a better balance policy than hearthstone's.
um most zoolocks and control warriors run brawl and twisting nether. dopple gangster evolve needs no nerfing its very common to get unlucky, and its really a highroll cause most evolve shamans have no cards in their hand after they evolve doppl
1. Control warrior doesn't exist. (Only keleseth pirate warrior really)
2. Warlock is less than 15% of the meta just IN GENERAL let alone all varieties of warlocks decks. Zoolock is probably 33% of all warlock decks used.
Therefore, brawl and twisting nether are negligible and are not part of the current meta. Especially twisting nether. Not even basic tempo warlocks run it.
I do not find it fulfilling to join in the parade of the moaning and bitching about balance issues whether real or imagined. And do not have complaints about any other imbalances or so called 'cancer decks'. But ultimately hearthstone is a game about maintaining an equilbrium of value, and sustaining the necessity to edge out the opponent in obtaining this value.
Doppelganger into evolve is an auto concede for me. To compare, let me lay out other scenarios which basically result in autoloss:
1. time warp + apprentice + antonidas
2. raza + anduin (situational but applies)
3. crystal core
I celebrate the variety of this game and it's 'constantly evolving meta', but none of the situations above make me feel cheated or lessen my enjoyment of the game.
I hope blizzard takes another look at this.
you know evolve shaman is only tier 2 and without this combo it would probably be tier 3, besides you just need a board clear to deal whit it.
Literally, only one scenario you've listed is autoloss (Time Warp). Anything else is manageable and winnable.
What happens when the evolve spawn some craps that you cant even deal with a standard board clear or a normal 5/6 mana magic?or what happenes when you dont even draw it?some people brain really doesnt work.
I agree that dopple+evolve is broken and really needs a rework. too many times i had to concede even if i had blizzard or firestorm in hand.
Best quotes:
"Casual is perfectly fine"
"warlock is not overpowered"
"Playing odd paladin just to test it"
First off... Network Engineer here and I, for one, hate seeing that font when i am not working.
Second... The combo is definitely strong but for sure is not a auto-win. Also, I would say this complaint is about 6 months belated.
"If anything is certain, it is that I myself am not a Marxist"? -Karl Marx
the font is more annoying than doppleganger evolve combo
What decks are you playing that makes this play auto-concede? Doppel-evolve does have a very strong high-roll potential, but also a very strong low-roll potential as well. Evolving totems for example always has a chance for doomsayer. The average 6-mana card from this evolve combo is approximately 5/5 in stats, which is under-statted to begin with, and there are a lot of low-statted 6 mana cards in standard right now as well. Wild is a different story, but in standard it's relatively balanced.
They also have to go through 5 turns to draw this combo. Shaman does have some of the strongest early game board presence if they have the God draw, not necessarily with strong minions, but cards that can spread out board presence very quickly and easily, taking advantage of an aggro meta that doesn't see tons of AoE from classes other than Priest or Warlock. Their plays have to be meticulous because some of their cards like Jade Claws overload them and can take away a doppel-evolve combo the following turn if they are not careful. They play minions with 0 attack, and if they played Jade Claws on 2 then they play with only 2 mana on turn 3....etc. If you can match their board presence and maintain pressure on turns 1-5, you can force an early evolve or tempo-slowing of playing Jade Claws somewhere in there. Turn 6 doppel-evolve could be all they have left to win the game, and if it's a low-roll, then you win. Contrarily if a shaman doppel-evolves a huge board of minions because you couldn't keep up with their early game, then they win, and that's just how the game works for them.
All in all Shaman just relies on a lot of high-rolls to win the game, like high-rolling spellpower totem to clear with maelstrom portal, or high-rolling a heal totem to perfectly put some of their minions out of clearing range, and because of that, it doesn't really need a nerf considering RNG and the pure existence of cards like Big-Time Racketeer is a hard-counter to their deck. Doppel-evolve is just another roll of the dice.
hardly. evolve shaman didn't really take off until KFT. so its only a couple months old. enough time for the issue to be resolved.
I know they can be outplayed, its why I dont mind the others. In this case the value generated is disproportionate.
board clear isn't the answer to every minion heavy play. otherwise blizzard should just print 5 mana 10/10s.
They should just make evolve cost 2 Mana like devolve. The DK would also be fine at 6 Mana.
If you have to build a subpar deck to activate an OP win condition, that's not a problem. The issue is when you can have the broken combo without sacrificing the rest of your deck. None of the four decks you mention are higher than tier 3 at the moment, so it's not much of a problem.
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It's a stupid combo. Mostly because of variance rather than power.
High rolls win the game on the spot.
Low rolls turn your 2/2s into 1/1s.
I well hearthstone is rng. So you could pay 6 mana for 3 1/1s or get 3 cairnes. Cause this game doesn't reward skill. The fact that community loves to hate on others opinions like proves that they're so deadest with sucking the developers dick instead of understanding why people complain. That's why the devs don't care, the majority love blizzard more than helping and understanding. You guys are what you eat after all ;). You want a better card game with more factors in your control play gwent. Hell even shadowverse has a better balance policy than hearthstone's.
That combo is the only thing keeping shaman in meta, without this he become hunter or warlock before KFT.
Dead class are the worse thing can happen in HS.