I have a hatred toward paladin but divine favour is in no way OP or in need of a nerf. If they use it turn 3, their beginning game tempo is killed, if they use it later, you shouldn't have enough cards in your hand to give them more than 2 draws. When both players are in top deck mode, divine favour is dead. Learn to play against it.
You realize this was a mediocre card before rush paladin (secret pally) was a huge thing? No one complained until recently. I'd say suck it up.
And you realize no one complained about Frothing Berserker or Warsong Commander until Grim Patron, right? I'm not saying DF needs a nerf, I'm just saying the argument that "Before new cards were introduced this wasn't a problem, so it can't be a problem" kind of argument is just wrong.
Can guys please stop nerfing all the cards? I mean come on guys if you start nerfing every card, you can also put 30 wisps in your deck DansGame
The only card that can be considered to be nerfed is the mysterious challenger since it is a huge tempo swing since secret paladin is already strong and only hunter has an answer to him.
I mean personally, I still don't like Dr. Boom (ask myself how this card could have been missed since months) since the rng of this card is insane!
Only strong cards: Mysterious Challenger and Dr. Balanced. All the other cards are just fine.
I don't find broken is the right term. Cards, which punish you for simply playing the game should not exist. These include Divine Favor, Unleash the Hounds and Frothing Berserker. The first punishes you for having cards in your hand and the other two for playing minions.What am I supposed to do if I can't empty my hand like my opponent? Or if I need to play minions to kill him next turn in order to win?
Cards like that should not exist in the first place.
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'There is nothing more deceptive than an obvious fact'
I don't find broken is the right term. Cards, which punish you for simply playing the game should not exist. These include Divine Favor, Unleash the Hounds and Frothing Berserker. The first punishes you for having cards in your hand and the other two for playing minions.What am I supposed to do if I can't empty my hand like my opponent? Or if I need to play minions to kill him next turn in order to win?
Cards like that should not exist in the first place.
It's fine it's just another card that you have to play around.
How are the cards you mentioned relevant? I have a chance to do sth about those cards because they don't affect the board/your hand immediately. The only way to cancel Divine Favor and UtH is counterspell and I don't even have control over it. Not to mention that Divine Favor draws you cards which is insane and UtH lets you summon many minions at once.
And again if you can't empty your hand how do you play around divine favor?
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'There is nothing more deceptive than an obvious fact'
No. The card was completely fine before paladin got things like muster,minibot and MC. Depending on how badly implemented the nerf is(and so far blizzard's track record in terms of nerfs hasn't been too great) it could make any sort of aggressive paladin unplayable, which would just suck. The paladin cards that clearly need a nerf ASAP are minibot and MC. Minibot would be a perfectly balanced and good card if it was a 2/1 with divine shield and as for MC, I would actually not be sad if they just deleted the card from the game or changed the battlecry to your hero takes 30 damage.
Also for your information, the optimal/close to optimal secret paladin builds don't run DF.
The card is much,much better against control decks. I remember when I played regular aggro pally before TGT and the card basically turned handlock and CW into an auto win when you drew it.
Yeah batanete summed it up. It only gets you the "dream" 5+ draws vs. control decks. In fact, in aggro meta you don't play the card, because you hardly get anything off it.
The reason they nerfed Starving Buzzard was because Hunter decks that were supposed to be balanced by running out of steam if they didn't get the quick kill were not running out of steam due to the card draw. Is there a similar situation with aggro paladin? No. Paladin has so many ways to draw cards they literally should never not have card draw. This has pretty much always been the case. Blessing of Wisdom and Lay on Hands can also be great forms of card draw. So if you combine the paladin's 3 ways to get card draw with all the neutral card draw available, nothing will change just because they nerf one of them to the ground. The deck will just be supplemented with different card draw that you rage at.
But here's the thing: Every one of the Paladin's card draws are situational. Blessing of Wisdom relies on a minion staying alive to attack for at least 2-3 turns. Lay on Hands is great heal and draw, but it's late game only and you lose all tempo. Divine Favor relies on your opponent's hand. People who don't play it would be surprised how often the card is dead weight. If you don't get at least 2 cards from it (the equivalent of Arcane Intellect) it's essentially lost all value. Really you aim for 3+. There's no guarantee that happens even once in the game, let alone twice. When I play paladin, I don't run a second one because the chances of it happening twice are too small. And if you force it early, you lose out on tempo and board presence which are vital to most paladin decks.
The only way to cancel Divine Favor and UtH is counterspell and I don't even have control over it. Not to mention that Divine Favor draws you cards which is insane and UtH lets you summon many minions at once.
And again if you can't empty your hand how do you play around divine favor?
The only way to control your opponents hand/card draw on any level is by giving them things to take up their hand. This is a strategy used in mill decks where the idea is to get them to overdraw in card burn, and late game, to fatigue. But there has never really been a way to directly prevent someone from drawing cards or to straight up counter their card draw, unless you count silencing minions (like Loot Hoarder) with card draw deathrattle effects or Northshire Cleric. That goes for every form of card draw, not just divine favor. Decks with high card draw are nothing new. And you don't need to be a Paladin to do it.
The thing is you can play around a card like DF or Unleash the Hounds the same way you can play around cards like Flamestrike and BGH.
Don't hoard cards versus paladins, and if your deck just does that like Freeze Mage or CW then maybe the card is designed to counter your deck. People complain about it because it does wreck control, but it's garbage versus any other deck that plays a lot of cards. The same way a card like Mind Control wrecks a control mirror but is probably not going to be played versus an aggressive deck. Or a card like Shield Block is good versus aggro but a liability versus some control matchups.
Just because a card is strong versus your deck doesn't make it broken or doesn't mean it should be nerfed. It's when a card is strong versus EVERY deck that a card should be looked at as requiring a balance.
The thing is you can play around a card like DF or Unleash the Hounds the same way you can play around cards like Flamestrike and BGH.
Don't hoard cards versus paladins, and if your deck just does that like Freeze Mage or CW then maybe the card is designed to counter your deck. People complain about it because it does wreck control, but it's garbage versus any other deck that plays a lot of cards. The same way a card like Mind Control wrecks a control mirror but is probably not going to be played versus an aggressive deck. Or a card like Shield Block is good versus aggro but a liability versus some control matchups.
Just because a card is strong versus your deck doesn't make it broken or doesn't mean it should be nerfed. It's when a card is strong versus EVERY deck that a card should be looked at as requiring a balance.
But it's a card that counters the decks that are supposed to counter your deck, thus leaving it without real counters. Isn't that kind of the same thing?
I think the real problem is people hoarding cards in their hands. Hands should be nerfed so you can only hold 5 cards at one time. This way, divine favour would not be exploited in such a way. Discuss.
I think the real problem is people hoarding cards in their hands. Hands should be nerfed so you can only hold 5 cards at one time. This way, divine favour would not be exploited in such a way. Discuss.
That's a terrible idea! I mean no offense, but do you have any clue what mill decks would do with a 5 card hand? Believe me, divine favor would be the least of your worries. The amount of card burn through overdraw would be insane.
I think the real problem is people hoarding cards in their hands. Hands should be nerfed so you can only hold 5 cards at one time. This way, divine favour would not be exploited in such a way. Discuss.
That's a terrible idea! I mean no offense, but do you have any clue what mill decks would do with a 5 card hand? Believe me, divine favor would be the least of your worries. The amount of card burn through overdraw would be insane.
You are right. Fatigue is op. Instead i think they should just give you 1 free Angry Chicken at the beginning of each turn. That would be much balanced and help you make a comeback.
You are proabably right. If it were played in another pally archetype, it would not draw anywhere near as many cards. Maybe they should ban cards from being used in secret pally.
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You realize this was a mediocre card before rush paladin (secret pally) was a huge thing? No one complained until recently. I'd say suck it up.
I have a hatred toward paladin but divine favour is in no way OP or in need of a nerf. If they use it turn 3, their beginning game tempo is killed, if they use it later, you shouldn't have enough cards in your hand to give them more than 2 draws. When both players are in top deck mode, divine favour is dead. Learn to play against it.
Balancing busted cards version 1.0.
you cant take the board, but you have lots of removal in hand? well fuck you i can also get many get in my hand, and take board ccontrol again...
-paladin 2015
this card is just broken in every rush paladin, punishes control decks too hard..
Can guys please stop nerfing all the cards? I mean come on guys if you start nerfing every card, you can also put 30 wisps in your deck DansGame
The only card that can be considered to be nerfed is the mysterious challenger since it is a huge tempo swing since secret paladin is already strong and only hunter has an answer to him.
I mean personally, I still don't like Dr. Boom (ask myself how this card could have been missed since months) since the rng of this card is insane!
Only strong cards: Mysterious Challenger and Dr. Balanced. All the other cards are just fine.
Just remember the good times!
I don't find broken is the right term. Cards, which punish you for simply playing the game should not exist. These include Divine Favor, Unleash the Hounds and Frothing Berserker. The first punishes you for having cards in your hand and the other two for playing minions.What am I supposed to do if I can't empty my hand like my opponent? Or if I need to play minions to kill him next turn in order to win?
Cards like that should not exist in the first place.
'There is nothing more deceptive than an obvious fact'
Sherlock Holmes
'There is nothing more deceptive than an obvious fact'
Sherlock Holmes
No. The card was completely fine before paladin got things like muster,minibot and MC. Depending on how badly implemented the nerf is(and so far blizzard's track record in terms of nerfs hasn't been too great) it could make any sort of aggressive paladin unplayable, which would just suck. The paladin cards that clearly need a nerf ASAP are minibot and MC. Minibot would be a perfectly balanced and good card if it was a 2/1 with divine shield and as for MC, I would actually not be sad if they just deleted the card from the game or changed the battlecry to your hero takes 30 damage.
Also for your information, the optimal/close to optimal secret paladin builds don't run DF.
its only broken because of the meta.
you wouldnt play this in a control meta.
Yeah batanete summed it up. It only gets you the "dream" 5+ draws vs. control decks. In fact, in aggro meta you don't play the card, because you hardly get anything off it.
I say blood imp needs a nerf. It gets warlocks infinite value over the course of the game if you don't draw into aoe? OP!!
The thing is you can play around a card like DF or Unleash the Hounds the same way you can play around cards like Flamestrike and BGH.
Don't hoard cards versus paladins, and if your deck just does that like Freeze Mage or CW then maybe the card is designed to counter your deck. People complain about it because it does wreck control, but it's garbage versus any other deck that plays a lot of cards. The same way a card like Mind Control wrecks a control mirror but is probably not going to be played versus an aggressive deck. Or a card like Shield Block is good versus aggro but a liability versus some control matchups.
Just because a card is strong versus your deck doesn't make it broken or doesn't mean it should be nerfed. It's when a card is strong versus EVERY deck that a card should be looked at as requiring a balance.
Balancing busted cards version 1.0.
I think the real problem is people hoarding cards in their hands. Hands should be nerfed so you can only hold 5 cards at one time. This way, divine favour would not be exploited in such a way. Discuss.
Only broken cuz the secret pally deck...
You are proabably right. If it were played in another pally archetype, it would not draw anywhere near as many cards. Maybe they should ban cards from being used in secret pally.