By playing against shamman all day i realized that when they pull their cancer turn four win it's because they are just dumping flametongue totem when they have 1 or 2 minons and then using chargers to output even more damage
The only cancer, my friend, is you and others like you. There is a mega salt sticky thread for you to spew all your anger and cry as hard and as often as you want. Yet you make a new thread, cause you feel you have something special to say, or cause you can't read. Or perhaps you are raging so much and not thinking straight so you rush to proclaim your pitiful thoughts. Either way you are wasting everyone's time, please post your sub rank 20 musings in the salt thread next time where it belongs.
The only cancer, my friend, is you and others like you. There is a mega salt sticky thread for you to spew all your anger and cry as hard and as often as you want. Yet you make a new thread, cause you feel you have something special to say, or cause you can't read. Or perhaps you are raging so much and not thinking straight so you rush to proclaim your pitiful thoughts. Either way you are wasting everyone's time, please post your sub rank 20 musings in the salt thread next time where it belongs.
Shamans have some of the best cards in the game to utilize board presence. It's simply part of how they are designed. The flip side is that the Shaman class is exceptionally weak without board presence, and a card like Flametongue Totem is totally useless in their hand. It's one of the reasons that the class was so bad for so long: once it started losing it completely and utterly lost for the rest of the game.
The only balance concern in my mind is that their early game is so strong right now that it's difficult for many classes to keep up at all (those that can, like Warrior, are coincidentally top-tier). This nearly guarantees that they'll get use out of Flametongue Totem. However, I have to wonder about the future because Shamans are so weak to losing the board that when their strong early game rotates out next year they'll be in an interesting spot.
OP, while it's interesting you're trying to think outside the normal Trogg/Golem/Flamewreathed set of cards to identify what's causing Shaman to be so strong... I don't think Flametongue is actually the culprit. It's certainly a good card, but as someone who's played a reasonable amount of Shaman it's got enough drawbacks to feel balanced.
The main issue overall with Flametongue (and why it's been in and out of lists over the years) is that you need to be winning board for it to have any pay off, otherwise it's very likely it dies for free since a 0/3 is pretty easy to remove nowadays and very few decks are going to have a very good chance of winning against a Shaman without keeping the board as clean as possible.
I'd wager in any game you lose by turns 4/5/6 to Shaman, Flametongue made minimal impacts since you'd basically have to ignore their board for the early turns; bad hands or greedy plays while your opponent gets the nuts isn't really qualifications to make a card unplayable.
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Flametongue isn't the issue with shaman. I played shaman before they got their insane early game boost and flametongue was in no way overpowered at that point. What makes flametongue so good right now is shaman basically has the best early game now and they seem to always have board control in the early game so it is always live, but if that early game was to come back in line with the other classes then they wouldn't be able to guarantee the double minion buff in the early game like they can now and it becomes much less effective.
Shamans have some of the best cards in the game to utilize board presence. It's simply part of how they are designed. The flip side is that the Shaman class is exceptionally weak without board presence, and a card like Flametongue Totem is totally useless in their hand. It's one of the reasons that the class was so bad for so long: once it started losing it completely and utterly lost for the rest of the game.
The only balance concern in my mind is that their early game is so strong right now that it's difficult for many classes to keep up at all (those that can, like Warrior, are coincidentally top-tier). This nearly guarantees that they'll get use out of Flametongue Totem. However, I have to wonder about the future because Shamans are so weak to losing the board that when their strong early game rotates out next year they'll be in an interesting spot.
Yeah, it's going to be very interesting to see what Blizzard does since Shaman's preferred 1, 2, and 3 drops are all rotating out at the same time. Not to mention Thunder Bluff Valiant, which is the win condition for a lot of midrange Shaman decks. On top of that, one of the tools you would use to make Shaman a more control class (Elemental Destruction) is rotating out as well. It's so much rotating out at once that it seems like too much to keep up with in one expansion. Probably going to be a bit of a break for Shaman in next year's Standard.
Flametongue should have at least 1 overload or 2hp instead of 3 or cost 3 mana. In the current state it is too OP - if shaman hits the curve with flametongue on turn 2 in most cases the game is over by turn 5-6 unless you have the very answer in your hand immediately after they play It.
Yup, flametongue is as good as mana tide, yet mana tide costs 3 and most of the time only draws you a card before dying. Also nerf rockbiter to minion only to break doomhammer combo.
By playing against shamman all day i realized that when they pull their cancer turn four win it's because they are just dumping flametongue totem when they have 1 or 2 minons and then using chargers to output even more damage
My god the stupidity. Read the other posts in the thread please. Mana tide is good on its own, it does something on an empty board with potential in future turns to keep doing something. It is an uber taunt cause you can't let it live or you give the opponent tremendous card advantage.
Flametongue on the other hand, needs a minion to get so so value, and 2 minions to get good value on board. On its own it is absolutely useless.
The only cancer, my friend, is you and others like you. There is a mega salt sticky thread for you to spew all your anger and cry as hard and as often as you want. Yet you make a new thread, cause you feel you have something special to say, or cause you can't read. Or perhaps you are raging so much and not thinking straight so you rush to proclaim your pitiful thoughts. Either way you are wasting everyone's time, please post your sub rank 20 musings in the salt thread next time where it belongs.
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By playing against shamman all day i realized that when they pull their cancer turn four win it's because they are just dumping flametongue totem when they have 1 or 2 minons and then using chargers to output even more damage
Solution: flametongue totem now has 2 overload.
The only cancer, my friend, is you and others like you. There is a mega salt sticky thread for you to spew all your anger and cry as hard and as often as you want. Yet you make a new thread, cause you feel you have something special to say, or cause you can't read. Or perhaps you are raging so much and not thinking straight so you rush to proclaim your pitiful thoughts. Either way you are wasting everyone's time, please post your sub rank 20 musings in the salt thread next time where it belongs.
Savage roar is 3 mana, Bloodlust is 5.
Flametongue is worse than both of those.
hihihihihhi
Shamans have some of the best cards in the game to utilize board presence. It's simply part of how they are designed. The flip side is that the Shaman class is exceptionally weak without board presence, and a card like Flametongue Totem is totally useless in their hand. It's one of the reasons that the class was so bad for so long: once it started losing it completely and utterly lost for the rest of the game.
The only balance concern in my mind is that their early game is so strong right now that it's difficult for many classes to keep up at all (those that can, like Warrior, are coincidentally top-tier). This nearly guarantees that they'll get use out of Flametongue Totem. However, I have to wonder about the future because Shamans are so weak to losing the board that when their strong early game rotates out next year they'll be in an interesting spot.
OP, while it's interesting you're trying to think outside the normal Trogg/Golem/Flamewreathed set of cards to identify what's causing Shaman to be so strong... I don't think Flametongue is actually the culprit. It's certainly a good card, but as someone who's played a reasonable amount of Shaman it's got enough drawbacks to feel balanced.
The main issue overall with Flametongue (and why it's been in and out of lists over the years) is that you need to be winning board for it to have any pay off, otherwise it's very likely it dies for free since a 0/3 is pretty easy to remove nowadays and very few decks are going to have a very good chance of winning against a Shaman without keeping the board as clean as possible.
I'd wager in any game you lose by turns 4/5/6 to Shaman, Flametongue made minimal impacts since you'd basically have to ignore their board for the early turns; bad hands or greedy plays while your opponent gets the nuts isn't really qualifications to make a card unplayable.
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Flametongue isn't the issue with shaman. I played shaman before they got their insane early game boost and flametongue was in no way overpowered at that point. What makes flametongue so good right now is shaman basically has the best early game now and they seem to always have board control in the early game so it is always live, but if that early game was to come back in line with the other classes then they wouldn't be able to guarantee the double minion buff in the early game like they can now and it becomes much less effective.
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I don't mind flametongue totem, except when it drops out of Tuskar Totemic. (Says more about Tuskar)
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HAHAHAHAHAH
No.
All these shaman whiners can't even identify the best card shaman has right now. Hint: it's a 5/5 taunt that can be played for free.....
Shaman and warrior do not need nerfs. These classes actually have decent cards. It's time to bring the rest of the field up to this par.
My god the stupidity. Read the other posts in the thread please. Mana tide is good on its own, it does something on an empty board with potential in future turns to keep doing something. It is an uber taunt cause you can't let it live or you give the opponent tremendous card advantage.
Flametongue on the other hand, needs a minion to get so so value, and 2 minions to get good value on board. On its own it is absolutely useless.
Howdy! [cardimg=gold ]Card Name[ /cardimg] (no space)
Hey, how's it going?
What's poppin,' player?