The issue with mage is they have an answer for everything. You don't have any safe plays. Also their cards don't (much) rely on synergy with each other for combo (so you don't get screwed for not getting your entire combo), while keeping 3 cards that are good synergy with the hero ability.
Priest: minions with 4 attack are safe from common removals. Minions above 3 hp are safe from unbuffed holy nova
Warlock: Hellfire does damage to all minions. Siphon soul is rare. Soulfire causes card loss. Shadow bolt is weak compared to fireball. Corruption takes too long to go into effect. Shadowflame is rare.
Druid: Naturlize causes opponnet to draw 2. Swipe only does 1 damage splash.
Rogue: No good common card for AOE removal
Shaman: Lightning storm is rare, and doesn't do as much as flamestrike.
Hunter: Explosive only does 2 damage. Unleashed only works well when comboed.
Warrior: Brawl is epic. Execute requires damaging. Axes cause warrior to take damage.
Paladin: Concentrate only does 2 (unless comboed). Light's justice only does 4.
I cannot believe Blizzard complete ingnores the unbalance-issue's with Mages in Arena for al those months... really crazy
Dont they understand how much this game will improve when the nerf Arena-Mage (and auto buff other classes) or are they just dont taking Arena-mode serieus?
I cannot believe Blizzard complete ingnores the unbalance-issue's with Mages in Arena for al those months... really crazy
Dont they understand how much this game will improve when the nerf Arena-Mage (and auto buff other classes) or are they just dont taking Arena-mode serieus?
In RNGville, theres no reason to take any thing seriously because of how much RNG is in RNGville. So no, blizzard will likely never make a single balance change solely to effect RNGville.
I'm facing right now the 10th mage today in 3 arenas. I've won only 2 or 3 times ._. Arena is turning really boring to play
Edit: I think they should change some cards on mage to become rares like Fireball or polymorph. In arena, Flamestrike is broken because you're probably getting like 2 or 3 minions that are able to survive, it's almost impossible to play around it.
While it can be frustrating to face a string of mages in arena, it's the string part that bothers me.
I don't especially like facing 3 druids in a row, or 3 rogues, or 3 of whatever it is that beat me in my last game.
It would be nice if part of the matching algorithm was a condition that you not face the same class as you did in your previous match (or at least that you not face the same class if you just lost to it).
While it can be frustrating to face a string of mages in arena, it's the string part that bothers me.
I don't especially like facing 3 druids in a row, or 3 rogues, or 3 of whatever it is that beat me in my last game.
It would be nice if part of the matching algorithm was a condition that you not face the same class as you did in your previous match (or at least that you not face the same class if you just lost to it).
Queue time can maybe become a problem with the large group of Mage players, but beside that fact after tuning Mage down you will see allot more diversity in classes, which resolves the problem.
I have had drafts where I've faced nothing but Druids or nothing but Hunters. I would rather face long waits than homogeneous arena runs.
I don't consider it a problem with strength of cards - I consider it a problem with the matching algorithm. Even when I've done well on a 'single-class' run, I don't like it. It doesn't give me a chance to learn how the cards I've drafted would actually play in constructed.
Also, I don't think a Mage nerf is coming any time soon. From what I've heard they haven't been doing anywhere near well enough in constructed for that to happen.
I have had drafts where I've faced nothing but Druids or nothing but Hunters. I would rather face long waits than homogeneous arena runs.
I don't consider it a problem with strength of cards - I consider it a problem with the matching algorithm. Even when I've done well on a 'single-class' run, I don't like it. It doesn't give me a chance to learn how the cards I've drafted would actually play in constructed.
Also, I don't think a Mage nerf is coming any time soon. From what I've heard they haven't been doing anywhere near well enough in constructed for that to happen.
I'd rather be matched randomly and get to play more games. They can't please all of the people ;)
Agree - there's no way the cards are getting nerfed with Mage where they are in constructed - so the only lever left to pull is rarity. I thinking drafting >3 Flamestrikes doesn't make a great deck, and shaman has Hex which is straight up better than Polymorph, but perhaps they could change rarity of Fireball and Water Elemental - because they're two of the best cards in arena? Maybe?
I have had drafts where I've faced nothing but Druids or nothing but Hunters. I would rather face long waits than homogeneous arena runs.
It woudn't surprise me if over 50% of the players playing Arena are Mages (does anyone have some facts to back this up?) With this the chance of facing a couple of Mages instead of another class in a row is much higher.
Here is the primary issue I have with people that complain about mages and flamestrike... KNOW THE META!
If you understand the meta of the opposing player, it isn't super hard to deal with. If you are playing against a mage, keep enough minions out to maintain your board and NO MORE!. Keep your strongest cards (even the low casters) tucked away for after the flamestrike, or play a rush style deck if you encounter them too frequently. Bait a flamestrike with your 2nd or 3rd best play option, then bring down #1 after they waste a turn on it. Mage matches should be a battle of attrition, and should either be over by round 6 or a long-haul control match.
Here is the primary issue I have with people that complain about mages and flamestrike... KNOW THE META!
If you understand the meta of the opposing player, it isn't super hard to deal with. If you are playing against a mage, keep enough minions out to maintain your board and NO MORE!. Keep your strongest cards (even the low casters) tucked away for after the flamestrike, or play a rush style deck if you encounter them too frequently. Bait a flamestrike with your 2nd or 3rd best play option, then bring down #1 after they waste a turn on it. Mage matches should be a battle of attrition, and should either be over by round 6 or a long-haul control match.
The thing is good mages will just swarm the board at turn 6 and if you don't play sufficient minions, she will just clear the board using her minions and save the flamestrike for later. If you put enough to stall her minions, boom flamestrike say bye bye to your game. Thus it's extremely hard to fight against mage in arena due to the lack of removal spell. Mage can freely play all in on her board while we have to always limit our numbers which means almost no face damage (mostly use for trade with her minions). The problem I see with mage is Flamestrike being common card. Seriously this card is way too good to be common, it should be rare or epic to limit their numbers in arena.
Hearthstats shows how much more Mages are picked than anything else: http://hearthstats.net/reports/jan/index.html - but not the full stats or detailed percentages. As Go4dakill says, though, even after that - more games will be with Mages because they stay alive longer.
And because they win more you're likely to get them as you win more.
Hearthstats shows how much more Mages are picked than anything else: http://hearthstats.net/reports/jan/index.html - but no full percentages. As Go4dakill says, though, even after that - more games will be with Mages because they stay alive longer.
And because they win more you're likely to get them as you win more.
Off-topic: I'm always surprised by Hunter win rate in those arena stats trackers. The latest 5 runs of Hunter for me contain 3 12-x runs, a 10-3 run and a 4-3 run. I just don't see how in the world people are doing so poorly with Hunter when the combo's they can pull off right now are simply down right absurd.
Wow, really? I pick Hunter, Priest and Warlock as my bottom 3. Hunter admittedly being the top of them. You won't get all that many beasts - I think the only reason you can do OK with Hunter is going for a 'wall of 2-s' and rushdown (with the hero power working great in concert with the strategy).
I believe mage could be brought in line with one or two simple changes to hero ability:
1. Make fireblast subject to taunt - just like all other hero attacks in the game.
2. Do not allow fireblast to attack friendly minions.
Option two feels extreme to me and would take some fun out of the class, but option 1 is an easy fix and would keep a bunch of minions on the board that have been AOE'd down by other mage abilities (such as yeti post flamestrike).
I believe mage could be brought in line with one or two simple changes to hero ability:
1. Make fireblast subject to taunt - just like all other hero attacks in the game.
2. Do not allow fireblast to attack friendly minions.
Option two feels extreme to me and would take some fun out of the class, but option 1 is an easy fix and would keep a bunch of minions on the board that have been AOE'd down by other mage abilities (such as yeti post flamestrike).
1. I'll point out that the Hunter's hero ability isn't stopped by Taunt - nor the Priests if it's been changed to a damaging ability.
2. Of all the things that might seem overpowered about the mage, the ability to ping their own rage in arena (where you can't even count on having it) hardly seems to rate.
Hearthstats shows how much more Mages are picked than anything else: http://hearthstats.net/reports/jan/index.html - but no full percentages. As Go4dakill says, though, even after that - more games will be with Mages because they stay alive longer.
And because they win more you're likely to get them as you win more.
Off-topic: I'm always surprised by Hunter win rate in those arena stats trackers. The latest 5 runs of Hunter for me contain 3 12-x runs, a 10-3 run and a 4-3 run. I just don't see how in the world people are doing so poorly with Hunter when the combo's they can pull off right now are simply down right absurd.
5 arena runs is not a meaningful sample.
The reason Hunter performs poorly in large samples is because in arena there is only 1 draft to aim for: aggro combo.
Fail to draft the key aggro & combo cards, and Hunter performs very poorly. UTH in particular is the linchpin of all arena Hunter decks, without it the class is well below average.
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The issue with mage is they have an answer for everything. You don't have any safe plays. Also their cards don't (much) rely on synergy with each other for combo (so you don't get screwed for not getting your entire combo), while keeping 3 cards that are good synergy with the hero ability.
Priest: minions with 4 attack are safe from common removals. Minions above 3 hp are safe from unbuffed holy nova
Warlock: Hellfire does damage to all minions. Siphon soul is rare. Soulfire causes card loss. Shadow bolt is weak compared to fireball. Corruption takes too long to go into effect. Shadowflame is rare.
Druid: Naturlize causes opponnet to draw 2. Swipe only does 1 damage splash.
Rogue: No good common card for AOE removal
Shaman: Lightning storm is rare, and doesn't do as much as flamestrike.
Hunter: Explosive only does 2 damage. Unleashed only works well when comboed.
Warrior: Brawl is epic. Execute requires damaging. Axes cause warrior to take damage.
Paladin: Concentrate only does 2 (unless comboed). Light's justice only does 4.
Just faced a Mage with 3 polymorphs, 4 water elementals and 2 flamestrikes. All basic cards. You just can't beat that. GG Blizzard.
I cannot believe Blizzard complete ingnores the unbalance-issue's with Mages in Arena for al those months... really crazy
Dont they understand how much this game will improve when the nerf Arena-Mage (and auto buff other classes) or are they just dont taking Arena-mode serieus?
In RNGville, theres no reason to take any thing seriously because of how much RNG is in RNGville. So no, blizzard will likely never make a single balance change solely to effect RNGville.
Flamestrike isn't the problem. Sure it can swing games at common status..changing it to rare isn't the answer.
1) Mage has REALLY strong commons. An awesome 4 drop (Water Elemental), 4 really good removal spells (Poly, Fireball, Froststrike, Flamestrike).
2) A Hero Power that not only makes each of your opponents creatures have 1 less HP, plus it can ping off the last few life points.
3) Universal Common Cards like Amani Berserker, Gurubashi Berserker, Acolyte of Pain,Raging Worgen are that much more threatening vs a Mage.
I have gone 10-3 Without a Flamestrike, Poly or Fireball in the deck. I have 6 12 win arenas only. All Mages.
I once was foolish to get 4 Flamestrikes in a deck. Went 2-3.
I'm facing right now the 10th mage today in 3 arenas. I've won only 2 or 3 times ._. Arena is turning really boring to play
Edit: I think they should change some cards on mage to become rares like Fireball or polymorph. In arena, Flamestrike is broken because you're probably getting like 2 or 3 minions that are able to survive, it's almost impossible to play around it.
While it can be frustrating to face a string of mages in arena, it's the string part that bothers me.
I don't especially like facing 3 druids in a row, or 3 rogues, or 3 of whatever it is that beat me in my last game.
It would be nice if part of the matching algorithm was a condition that you not face the same class as you did in your previous match (or at least that you not face the same class if you just lost to it).
Queue time can maybe become a problem with the large group of Mage players, but beside that fact after tuning Mage down you will see allot more diversity in classes, which resolves the problem.
I have had drafts where I've faced nothing but Druids or nothing but Hunters. I would rather face long waits than homogeneous arena runs.
I don't consider it a problem with strength of cards - I consider it a problem with the matching algorithm. Even when I've done well on a 'single-class' run, I don't like it. It doesn't give me a chance to learn how the cards I've drafted would actually play in constructed.
Also, I don't think a Mage nerf is coming any time soon. From what I've heard they haven't been doing anywhere near well enough in constructed for that to happen.
I'd rather be matched randomly and get to play more games. They can't please all of the people ;)
Agree - there's no way the cards are getting nerfed with Mage where they are in constructed - so the only lever left to pull is rarity. I thinking drafting >3 Flamestrikes doesn't make a great deck, and shaman has Hex which is straight up better than Polymorph, but perhaps they could change rarity of Fireball and Water Elemental - because they're two of the best cards in arena? Maybe?
It woudn't surprise me if over 50% of the players playing Arena are Mages (does anyone have some facts to back this up?)
With this the chance of facing a couple of Mages instead of another class in a row is much higher.
Since there's only a 1/3 chance that Mage will be presented as an option, I seriously doubt that half of all players in the Arena are playing a mage.
Here is the primary issue I have with people that complain about mages and flamestrike... KNOW THE META!
If you understand the meta of the opposing player, it isn't super hard to deal with. If you are playing against a mage, keep enough minions out to maintain your board and NO MORE!. Keep your strongest cards (even the low casters) tucked away for after the flamestrike, or play a rush style deck if you encounter them too frequently. Bait a flamestrike with your 2nd or 3rd best play option, then bring down #1 after they waste a turn on it. Mage matches should be a battle of attrition, and should either be over by round 6 or a long-haul control match.
The thing is good mages will just swarm the board at turn 6 and if you don't play sufficient minions, she will just clear the board using her minions and save the flamestrike for later. If you put enough to stall her minions, boom flamestrike say bye bye to your game. Thus it's extremely hard to fight against mage in arena due to the lack of removal spell. Mage can freely play all in on her board while we have to always limit our numbers which means almost no face damage (mostly use for trade with her minions). The problem I see with mage is Flamestrike being common card. Seriously this card is way too good to be common, it should be rare or epic to limit their numbers in arena.
Hearthstats shows how much more Mages are picked than anything else: http://hearthstats.net/reports/jan/index.html - but not the full stats or detailed percentages. As Go4dakill says, though, even after that - more games will be with Mages because they stay alive longer.
And because they win more you're likely to get them as you win more.
Wow, really? I pick Hunter, Priest and Warlock as my bottom 3. Hunter admittedly being the top of them. You won't get all that many beasts - I think the only reason you can do OK with Hunter is going for a 'wall of 2-s' and rushdown (with the hero power working great in concert with the strategy).
I forgot to include:
4) Removes Bubbles with Ease.
5) Any X/1 creature is easily plucked off.
I believe mage could be brought in line with one or two simple changes to hero ability:
1. Make fireblast subject to taunt - just like all other hero attacks in the game.
2. Do not allow fireblast to attack friendly minions.
Option two feels extreme to me and would take some fun out of the class, but option 1 is an easy fix and would keep a bunch of minions on the board that have been AOE'd down by other mage abilities (such as yeti post flamestrike).
1. I'll point out that the Hunter's hero ability isn't stopped by Taunt - nor the Priests if it's been changed to a damaging ability.
2. Of all the things that might seem overpowered about the mage, the ability to ping their own rage in arena (where you can't even count on having it) hardly seems to rate.
5 arena runs is not a meaningful sample.
The reason Hunter performs poorly in large samples is because in arena there is only 1 draft to aim for: aggro combo.
Fail to draft the key aggro & combo cards, and Hunter performs very poorly. UTH in particular is the linchpin of all arena Hunter decks, without it the class is well below average.