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there is not a "single" thing wrong with hunters!!!
...now let me explain... lol.. it is multiple things. card draw, cheap cost spells and minions with great value, excellent removal and control with secrets.
the main problem though lies in the fact that hunters have been given the best card draw in the game combined with low cost high value cards... you can't have both. Hunter is so effective and powerful because it has both. I personally think balance lies in the card draw setup. card draw should be nerfed on hunters to make up for its excellent value cards at low cost. Its just my personal opinion but i believe card draw should take a MAJOR nerf making it one of the worst classes for card draw.
the secrets and the hunters control of the game when combined with the 2 dmg a turn from the hero ability.. well that creates a problem also but i believe the draw is the main problem and if they fixed the draw ability of the hunter things would even out.
think about this also though... its hunters low cost high value cards that make the hero ability so useful.. it gives them room to use it more often than the other classes
What are these low cost high value cards that the hunters are getting that others are not?
I do hear you on Freeze Trap, I play trap-less hunter most of the time and it can be annoying when I drop highmane and then a trap gets thrown down. But as someone that also played traps in hunter for a while (before the scientist) it's also a reasonably situational card that is easy to play around. Freezing trap is best when your opponent has 1 big minion on board. It's typically terrible if they have a small minion on board. So for example.. it's quite good against Taunt Druid since Taunt druid typically plays a lot of high cost guys that will be in play alone. It's not good though against Zoo where it will often pick up a 1 cost guy (that may have battle cry). Simply freezing the minion that attacks would not be nearly good enough for 2 mana and a card. Mage gets to do that plus 3 damage and it's targeted. The only reasonable change I could see would be to get rid of the "costs 2 more" clause.
I'd say if Freezing trap is giving you that many problems try adding in some better options to test for it... maybe some kind of battle cry or heck Deathload isnt a terrible option to take some damage and bounce.
UTH really doesn't bother me, Hunter's Mark is probably my least favorite card that always kills my heavy hitters for free, after that I hate Freeze trap and Leeroy Jenkins (not Hunter specific) but sometimes you just KNOW he is about to be played and you are about to die and his horrible goofy intro music and "battle cry" adds insult to injury. The worst is when you play a miracle rogue and are trying to concede but it won't let you and you gotta listen to it 3 times in a row :(
(2)explosive trap for example compared to lets say (4)concecration
(3)Kill Command [5 dmg] is nearly comparable to fireball but for less mana. yes i see the one mana difference and one damage difference but mage is supposed to have lower cost destruction than the other classes because thats the classes ummm perk i guess you would say.
(3)Animal Companion - More times than not you will get a 4/4 taunt or 4/2 charge.. pretty decent value
(2) freezing trap - extreme high value... Id pay 2 mana to take my oponents whole turn.. cost him 2.5 times tha mana to cast the card. and delay the minion for several turns do to sommoning sickness
(2) snake trap - 3 1/1's... high value
(3) unleash the hounds - 4-5 1/1's with charge.. high value
(6)Savanah Highmane - Essentially a 10/9 for 6 mana if you factor in the 2 2/2's
(3) multishot - 3 dmg to 2 minions.. this is twice the value as most other comparable spells for the same mana range
these are all high value and there are others but im just answering your question... point is when you put together the extreme high value combined with the great draw ability you are going to have problems...
hunter has some of the best removal in the game and such great versatility... secrets aside.... say you have one minion, deadly shot. say you have 2, multi shot. say you have 3 or more, uth.. it costs the hunter less to remove your minions or put them in limbo while at the same time allowing them to gain board presence. this and the great draw from unleash the hounds and buzzard
make hunters mark cost 1 mana
Why is everyone whining about hunter? A week ago I use mid-range hunter to get into legendary and sit around 400... I think my win percentage over the last 4 days is 10% or lower. I seriously just can't win a game and all I am trying to do is finish the last 10 wins to get my gold portrait. All I see is priest, miracle and a few other hunters (that I end up losing to in super dumb ways... I'm looking at you Webspinnered King Krush)
It's all in the card draw/cycling capability that a hunter has. a good portion of the removal requires two cards to be set up properly, but hunters have such an increased opportunity to cycle through their deck to obtain such combos. It's much like playing miracle when they don't get that auctioneer draw. So again, people can complain about the hunter's tools all they want, but all classes have such tools. It's the classes that can pull of these "miracle" cycles that make the cards too powerful.
What bothers me most with Hunter applies to any type of deck where if I want to hard counter it, I cannot.
I should be able to pick a popular deck and design a deck to specifically win against it 80-90% of the time. It will very well perform poorly against other decks but against THIS deck it will be supreme.
I can do this for many decks out there but Hunter is a problem (as was Miracle Rogue). One can design a deck to counter a popular hunter deck and it will be bad against most others but the Hunter deck will still win a significant amount of time.
If there is no hard counter to a deck...it is too OP. All decks should have an Achilles heal. Freeze mage used to be very tough before the nerf but control warrior could counter it.
I agree completely. Hunter just has everything and has it better than every other class out there. Removal out the wazoo, minion synergy all over the place, easily one of the two best hero powers (the other being Life Tap), and card draw that's almost as crazy as Miracle Rogue's. They just literally have -everything-. It also doesn't help that one is automatically severely penalized for playing a certain class against them (we all know which class that is). Sure, every class has advantages and disadvantages, but the matchup I'm referring to is ridiculously one-sided.
Ive met only hunters today and yesterday, its annoing and boring
So a hero power that does 2 unavoidable damage to the face every turn for cheap is the worst in the game? Honestly, it can only be countered with healing or armor (neither of which most classes have easy access to). If anything, I'd say Paladin's hero power is by far the worst as it doesn't have any immediate effect compared to the others, though I still love how the class plays.
I've always found this topic about "best and worst hero power" a bit silly. Of course, if you get hero powers out of their context, you "could" do some kind of tier-list, but if you consider them the way hero power's actually work (in interaction with all that class cards) imo it's quite stupid to say "Hunter has the worst hero power in game" (or best one, either way). Hunter's hero power works WONDERS with their mega-pressure game style, and has great synergy with all his typical decks, and that's the problem... his class cards, neutral cards they tend to use, and his hero power, all together work with insane synergy, and I think that's the problem with the class, they are a motherfucking 4x4 with good/decent answers against anything, while every other class has at least one or two BAD match-ups.
Well, at least that's the way I see it.
Have a nice day.
It does, but nowhere close to the level Hunter counters, say, any Shaman deck. You need what could best be described as a miracle to win against them as a Shaman because you're forced into a damage race with very limited methods of healing if any. The entire class is invalidated when Hunters swarm the meta, and that isn't right. Every deck has strengths and weaknesses, but Hunter really takes the cake.
I still don't get why people keep complaining about the tools that hunters have yet keep overlooking their ability to cycle cards. Most of the tools hunters have require multiple cards to get the desired effect or the opponent playing very poorly setting themself up to be countered. The reason hunters tend to have a response for everything (as was similiar with miracle) is their ability to cycle through their deck effectively. As long as people keep finding ways to quickly cycle cards, those decks will provide a remarkably high win-rate.
I love how ignorant some of the people are that say its your own fault if the hunter draws a bunch of cards off buzzard and UTH. Normally a hunter only has to draw 2-3 for it to even matter and on top of that if you dont play minions you wont beat hunter at all so basically you are telling us to play no creatures and let the hunter kill you because with his power thats all he has to do. Easy fix would be make it so buzzard only draws cards when you actually play a beast not when it comes into play and make hunters mark cost 1. For miracle make it so auctioneer has only 3 toughness.
It's stuff like this that makes me glad I play a control warrior. If more people did, this would change the meta to something else people would find OP and then again and again.... there is always going to be a deck people find to be the most powerful. It is generally the deck that counters the previous "most powerful" deck. Until someone builds a counter.
The Warrior deck is very expensive. That's the reason why although it's very strong in the meta, it sees very little play. Starters always jump between Zoo - Hunter - Miracle Rogue because those are the cheapest decks.
Exactly this.
If you aren't playing Paladin, you're doing it wrong.
I have been playing pretty much the same deck since beta. The Warrior control deck has pretty much a good/equal match up vs everything. The down side is, that it is expensive to make, and it doesn't have many "auto win" match ups. Because of this I think it is harder once you get to like rank 5 where you can't rely on a decent streak to advance you as you a lot of times will go 50/50. I honestly hope people DON'T start playing Control Warrior to counter hunters. That would mean people would start building specific counters to MY deck. =P