Hearthpwn

YAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAS!

No idea why its closing, I refuse to believe they don't generate enough revenue from this sites traffic.

Quote from ItEm55 >>

That does not change the fact that you can still magnetize it to that mech rat with stealth the next turn that was played and hit face.

 No, but it does stop the OTK.

Quote from dirbrian >>

Quote from Xarthics >>

Quote from dirbrian >>

Quote from Xarthics >>

Quote from dirbrian >>

Changing it from Echo to Rush might seem like a 'simple fix', but you have to consider what archetypes they were designing this card for.

Changing it from Echo to Rush changes the philosophy of its archetype from of a mid-late game synergy to mostly aggressive decks.

The only card that is problematic was Reckless Experimenter, so why completely change the philosophy of SN1P-SN4P when you can fix the lone problem.

 

 You're missing the point. They're nerfing a card that's been in the game for a while now because they didn't even consider the combo possibility before creating SN1P-SN4P - that to me is just pure laziness. Nerfing SN1P-SN4P nerfs it across the board ruling out all future design space problems, it's a total no brainer.

 I'm aware they're nerfing a card thats already been in game. This has happened since the beginning of Hearthstone.

That should not only be the defining factor. You have to consider every other factor, and prioritize them.

Ask yourself which way opens more flexibility and different type of archetypes.

Right now SN1P-SN4P is very flexible for early, mid, late game decks.  Your idea narrows it down.

 My idea keeps nerfing fair. Reckless Experimenter is still used and likely will be used in future Deathrattle decks, nerfing it because of ONE card they refused to think about before making again - seems really really lazy. This is them basically going "oh, well, we've already thought of this card now, let's nerf the interactions rather than the actual problem"

 Well first off, let me remind you that you said what they're doing is a 'lazy' change, yet you then say you thought of a better idea in 40 seconds by changing Echo to Rush.

So I don't think you can say you're considering every factor. Changing Echo from Rush has more indirect effects than you probably have yet still to consider.

Lets take your way of nerfing something broken and implement it with the Grim Patron & Warsong Commander nerf.

How would that have turned out?

Warsong Commander is completely different though, that's a basic set card, going forward they HAD to nerf that because it would always be there; this, they didn't. I 100% guarantee you to the point where I would bet money that something else comes up in future because they allowed SN1P-SN4P to remain untouched.

It's the ECHO effect that makes this broken, nerfing another card doesn't change that.

Quote from dirbrian >>

Quote from Xarthics >>

Quote from dirbrian >>

Changing it from Echo to Rush might seem like a 'simple fix', but you have to consider what archetypes they were designing this card for.

Changing it from Echo to Rush changes the philosophy of its archetype from of a mid-late game synergy to mostly aggressive decks.

The only card that is problematic was Reckless Experimenter, so why completely change the philosophy of SN1P-SN4P when you can fix the lone problem.

 

 You're missing the point. They're nerfing a card that's been in the game for a while now because they didn't even consider the combo possibility before creating SN1P-SN4P - that to me is just pure laziness. Nerfing SN1P-SN4P nerfs it across the board ruling out all future design space problems, it's a total no brainer.

 I'm aware they're nerfing a card thats already been in game. This has happened since the beginning of Hearthstone.

That should not only be the defining factor. You have to consider every other factor, and prioritize them.

Ask yourself which way opens more flexibility and different type of archetypes.

Right now SN1P-SN4P is very flexible for early, mid, late game decks.  Your idea narrows it down.

 My idea keeps nerfing fair. Reckless Experimenter is still used and likely will be used in future Deathrattle decks, nerfing it because of ONE card they refused to think about before making again - seems really really lazy. This is them basically going "oh, well, we've already thought of this card now, let's nerf the interactions rather than the actual problem"

Quote from dirbrian >>

Changing it from Echo to Rush might seem like a 'simple fix', but you have to consider what archetypes they were designing this card for.

Changing it from Echo to Rush changes the philosophy of its archetype from of a mid-late game synergy to mostly aggressive decks.

The only card that is problematic was Reckless Experimenter, so why completely change the philosophy of SN1P-SN4P when you can fix the lone problem.

 

 You're missing the point. They're nerfing a card that's been in the game for a while now because they didn't even consider the combo possibility before creating SN1P-SN4P - that to me is just pure laziness. Nerfing SN1P-SN4P nerfs it across the board ruling out all future design space problems, it's a total no brainer.

All great nerfs, I'd argue Miscreant isn't enough though... 1 Health makes virtually no difference to its function.

There is no difference, it might seem like that sometimes due to RNG But ultimately they're both the same.

Leeroy Jenkins should die after attacking.

1. It eliminates Leeroy Jenkins bounce scenarios

2. Probably makes design space easier for the Hearthstome team

3. Fits with Leeroys overall theme, he ran into a room during the classic leeroy video and basically died

4. Still allows his core function to work (SMOrc)

72% and you only got to 4800 Legend? calling fakery on that one. With such a ratio you'd easily be instantly thrust into the top 1000 minimum.

Repeating what I said earlier

Raiding Party - will be nerfed, guarantee it.

Leeroy Jenkins - I don't want to see it nerfed but ultimately its becoming a blight on design space. At very minimum I can see it going to the HoF. At very least I can see it being nerfed to a rush with altered stats.

Wins = Time Played, nothing more.

Feel free to criticise the below, I have a thick skin (try and keep it constructive though)

Raiding Party - Is a bigger problem than Edwin VanCleef.

Myra's Unstable Element - Also needs nerfing, being able to draw your entire deck on the spot and still be able to form a board when you have literally 1 card in hand is broken.

EVIL Miscreant - Disagree, the problem isn't EVIL Miscreant it's the Lackey cards costing 1 mana, they should straight up cost 2 mana, not 1 mana.

Magic Carpet - It should have less Health, the only problem players face right now because of Magic Carpet is how tanky it is for the mana cost and effect it grants.

Leeroy Jenkins - a tough one to call, on the one hand, it's not that overpowered but when you introduce Waggle Pick into the equation, suddenly it becomes 20 damage for 12 Mana.



My own recommended nerfs?

Raiding Party increased to 5 mana (yep, it would basically kill the card but being able to target a specific weapon that makes the deck function the way it does for 3 mana while its combo enabled is busted)

Myra's Unstable Element - Hall of Fame - it's going to cause more problems in future expacs, deal with it now, not later.

Lackey Cards - Mana cost increased to 2

Magic Carpet - Health reduced to 3 (or 4, I still think 4 is too high)

Leeroy Jenkins - I have 2 suggestions for this, both are 'out there' in terms of crazy ideas

1. Leeroy Jenkins Dies after attacking - Keeps Leeroy's key function in place but removes the bounce effect without nerfing Waggle Pick or Shadowstep

2. If returned to your hand, attack reduced by 5.