• 0

    posted a message on Hearthstone's MM is *NOT* rigged and is *NOT* keeping everyone at 50% win rate

    The very fact that Blizzard persistently doesn't open up about the actual inner working/goal of MMR and RNG - just stating the obvious - telltale available data can't conclusively decide on the subject. On the idiot side of the matter, I love telling flatlanders there's a third dimension, eventhough I realize they think me crazy. Speaking doubt to certainly makes people come out of their echo chamber....eventually. For every fellow traveller comes a time of reckoning...sooner or later.

    Posted in: General Discussion
  • 0

    posted a message on Hearthstone's MM is *NOT* rigged and is *NOT* keeping everyone at 50% win rate
    Quote from ScarfaceRo >>
    Quote from Hooghout >>

     Working hard to celebrate Blizzards excellent A.I. ability to make it all ook like non-rigging. Reminding me of the flatlanders 'proving'  that flat is all there is. Anyways the only credible way is an independent investigation into Blizzard MMR/RNG mechanics. And with independent I mean independent.

     When you have 24 months worth of data of both ranked and arena games all converging to about the same (+/-3%) win rate, which is quite different than the average 50%, I think it's quite obvious that the system is not rigged to keep us at 50% win rate (because otherwise, it would do a terrible job letting me constantly score over 57% win rate.

     Rigging can't be proved or disproved by collecting data from the outside.

    Posted in: General Discussion
  • 0

    posted a message on Hearthstone's MM is *NOT* rigged and is *NOT* keeping everyone at 50% win rate
    Quote from ScarfaceRo >>

    Hey everyone!

    I decided to make this thread because I recently saw a lot of posts of people claiming that Hearthstone's MM is rigged and if you go over 50% win rate it "cheats" you by queueing you against your counters, give you bad cards in the mulligan or draw, etc.

    Of course, like everyone else, I had my highs and lows (with win/lose streaks going on two digits range at times), but I never felt that the system is rigged or that I'm cheated in any way, and by tracking my win rates at the end of each month I was able to notice two things: that each and every month I got over 50% win rate and that the win rate was pretty consistent at the end of each month.

    But enough with the "feeling"; I should better get to the facts and give you the cold numbers. But, before that, I should probably give some details about my play style to better get the context: I play at most six games per day, which take an hour at most (so I usually average less than 180 games per month), with the best possible deck that matches my daily quest (so that means that I don't play a deck enough to really master it and that I don't always play tier 1 decks because not all classes have them). I'm also a decent player (reaching legend in most months and having a couple of top legend rankings), but I'm definitely nowhere close to calling myself an expert, a hardcore, or a pro player.

    And now the numbers (print screens to prove them will be provided at the end of the post):

    December 2017: 61% win rate (83-52)
    January 2018: 68% win rate (57-27)
    February 2018: 68% win rate (61-29)
    March 2018: 62% win rate (92-56)
    April 2018: 58% win rate (104-76)
    May 2018: 57% win rate (79-59)
    June 2018: 67% win rate (85-41)

    --- that was my best month ever, ending the month in top 5 legend and holding for a while even the #1 legend, at which point I had a hard time finding new challenges in the game so took a half-year break ---

    January 2019: 66% win rate (129-65)
    February 2019: 57% win rate (112-85)
    March 2019: 61% win rate (114-72)
    April 2019: 61% win rate (81-51)
    May 2019: 57% win rate (79-59)
    June 2019: 74% win rate (34-12)
    July 2019: 67% (8-4)
    August 2019: 57% (134-100)
    September 2019: 61% (17-11)
    October 2019: 57% (79-59)
    November 2019: 57% (75-57)
    December 2019: 57% (75-57)
    January 2020: 57% (35-26)
    February 2020: 58% (50-36)
    March 2020: 61% (35-22)
    April 2020: 57% (103-77)

    The average (excluding the two months with less than 50 games) was 60.1%; out of the 21 tracked months only four months (two which were during the old system where we were all resetted back to rank 18, so first few games were almost auto wins and two during which I had a lot of luck and managed to end the month in top 10 legend) had a variation of more than 3% from my average 60% win rate, while during the rest of 17 out of 21 I consistently had between 57% and 63% win rate. And, btw, this month I'm also at 58% win rate far now.

    I think that, while it can still somehow be seen as anecdotical evidence since they're just my personal games, there is enough evidence to see that there is a pattern that says that no, the game is not forcing everyone at 50% win rate, but it just aims too point everyone toward that value via MMR, but, ultimately, everyone's win rate is a personal constant dependent of their skill compared with the skill of the average player - a better player will have higher than 50% win rate (the better the player, the better the win rate) and a bad player will have lower than 50% win rate (the worse the player, the lower the win rate) - the MMR is simply trying to limit those variations so we don't end up having people with 80% and people with 20% win rates.

    So, seriously, if you think Blizzard is artificially capping your win rate at 50% win rate and it simply doesn't let you break over it, how you explain the fact that in 23 tracked months, spawning over three years and a lot of various expansions and metas my win rate never fall bellow 57% (and that while still being a rather regular/casual player playing at most one hour a day and switching decks/classes depending on whatever daily quest I get)?

    And, as I promised, here are all the referenced screenshots: https://imgur.com/a/xNIoA1u

    I further detailed my playstyle and win rates depending on deck variation in this answer: https://www.hearthpwn.com/forums/hearthstone-general/general-discussion/242896-hearthstones-mm-is-not-rigged-and-is-not-keeping?comment=16

     Working hard to celebrate Blizzards excellent A.I. ability to make it all ook like non-rigging. Reminding me of the flatlanders 'proving'  that flat is all there is. Anyways the only credible way is an independent investigation into Blizzard MMR/RNG mechanics. And with independent I mean independent.

    Posted in: General Discussion
  • 0

    posted a message on Is this a rock paper scissors game now

    The problem is its steepness. Shallow-up RPS and a lot of problems like MMR and RNG will be solved,

    Posted in: General Discussion
  • 2

    posted a message on The new MMR matchmaking system sux!
    Quote from SlydE >>

    The matchmaking does not know which deck you queue up with.

    How do you know that? Been at Blizzards design team and mechanics and have insiders knowledge? You saw with your own eyes the inner workings of the matchmaking?  I seriously doubt that. Blizzard has reasons enough to exactly know which decks ae queued. 

    Posted in: General Discussion
  • 1

    posted a message on The new MMR matchmaking system sux!

    The explanation viable is the existence of a target audience, target decks that Blizzard wants to be played and be dominant in the meta. Not only is Rogue  a counter to priest, it is just the way it happens and I can confirm the OP.  I even observed an incomplete Soul Mirror which made me lose. 

    The game is rigged.  No question about it. It is just a matter of time. The truth is out there.. It is easy to assume tinfoil, conspiracy and the like. Those who think that are right. They are always right. Until prove wrong.

    Posted in: General Discussion
  • 0

    posted a message on RNG has ruined this game
    Quote from thazud >>
    Quote from Ravza >>
    Quote from thazud >>

    RNG has really taken over Hearthstone. I've played Hearthstone since it was released from beta and enjoyed it a lot. However, in the recent expansions I've lost my motivation but still kept on playing it because there were some fun decks here and there, and BG was a good addition to give some variety. 

    But then I tried to play Legends of Runeterra (LoR), where there are some RNG elements, but not as many and as game-swingy as the ones in Hearthstone. And know I can't play Hearthstone anymore. LoR made me realize how much I hate losing games because someone discovered a Pyroblast of their Mana Cyclone which gave them a discover spell that randomly gave them Pyroblast. Or when you are in a position where you've basically won the match but the enemy got a random puzzlebox which clears your board and gives them a board instead. These situations are just not funny.

    It can be fun a times but when it's a factor in the majority of the games it is too much. LoR is not perfect but it is more satisfying than the RNG-fiesta Hearthstone has become. 

     

     No RNG is really bad too. I don't play chess since it's pointless. I never learned as a child, the game is way too hard, and I can't ever win a game because people who have been playing for years have a near 100% chance to beat me. No one wants to play a hard game where they can never win. If you do want to play that game, play control shaman and enjoy your 75% loss rate to aggro DH. No RNG. You will just lose guaranteed. People like to play mage since at least vs aggro DH they stand some sort of chance since they can discover taunt in power of creation or cheat out a turn 6 box and pray for a win and sometimes get there. Their deck isn't favoured but at least they can win sometimes.

    I think actually a lack of RNG is a big problem right now with the top tier decks. Even face hunter can draw its boar and get unlucky. Aggro DH is so consistent it's unbelievable. If they had some bad RNG so they could lose sometimes it would be great.

     RNG is always a part of card games because you draw cards. You can beat the world best MTG player if he doesn't draw any mana. And I don't care about counter matchups; it happens in LoR as well. RNG should not be such a high factor that it starts to mess with the skill factor. It is fair that it sometimes tips the scale of the match. But the RNG factor is just too consistent in Hearthstone and games are too often decided by what spell, minion or whatever a lackey gave you. It gives great highlights to Youtube but it's not fun to be on the recieving end of it. 

    It's a matter of taste and I found that I really don't like the RNG level of Hearthstone after I tried something else. It's understandable and fair that people like it as it can be really fun too. 

     RNG is a problem because of bad and unbalanced RPS.

    Posted in: General Discussion
  • 0

    posted a message on Serious question on randomness
    Quote from 3nnu1 >>
    Quote from TallStranger >>
    Quote from 3nnu1 >>
    Quote from TallStranger >>
    Quote from 3nnu1 >>

    The thing is, people who have played games that employed actual randomness and have played many of today's games which are overengineered to be more 'fun' know that Hearthstone is not random. No amount of calling people tinfoil hat, or making silly arguments about proving you did not murder someone or being willfully obtuse can change that. The fact that the same debate tactics are deployed again and again to try to shut down conversation  on the topic only highlights how on the money the accusations are. 

     No, people with tinfoil hats think they "know" this because it helps them deal with the fact that they're not as good at HS as they think they are. No matter how many times you repeat your nonsense, it doesn't change the fact that you have yet to offer an ounce of actual evidence.

     What if the person making the accusation gets legend every month? Would that make a difference?

     Actually, no. But you must be the greatest player in history if you're able to make legend DESPITE the evil soulless corporation deliberately stacking the deck against you by reading your cards and matching you with opponents who are highly likely to beat you. You ought to go pro.

     you can keep on with the ridiculous strawmanning and rhetoric and I get it...that is all you got. But your accusation is that I am a frustrated player blaming the system for my failing. When I inform you that i am not failing, I am just observing a biased system, you jump to hyperbole and mockery. 

    So to any actual observers out there, take note that when the person arguing with you resorts to ad hominem attacks, strawman arguments, and rhetorical circles...it means they are are full of it. Hearthstone is rigged. 

     Marvelous - The 'problem' of RNG is not RNG itself but its origin making  RNG a suspect which it isn't. And that origin of all problems with HS is too steep RPS.

    Bear with me. Unfavourable matchups takes skill and luck to win. But it seems like people playing agressieve/tempodecks naturally complain less about RNG.  Lets analyse deeper. 3 things.

    1. Card draw. The more a deck draws cards the lesser RNG becomes as a pointable reason to lose or win.
    2. The steeper RPS, the more the unfavourable party is gong to complain about RNG.
    3. High RNG archetypes (mostely controldecks) suffers more skill, given a constant MMR from RNG than low RNG archetypes.

    The fact that there a high and low RNG decks is often overlooked in the discussion. Skill isn't a decisive factor given a too steep RPS.  The solution is simple: balance RPS better, meaning give everybody a more balance draw ability, shallow-out RPS as everybody has a fair chance to win a game. Only then RNG cease to be a factor of annoyance.

    The result as it is now is that card design favours a certain target audience. If you don't belong, you are apt to complain. Fair enough. That is why it is so stupid  target audience types conclude lack of skill when people point to RNG. For me though it is just an RPS-balance problem.

    Posted in: General Discussion
  • 0

    posted a message on Serious question on randomness
    Quote from TallStranger >>
    Quote from 3nnu1 >>

    The thing is, people who have played games that employed actual randomness and have played many of today's games which are overengineered to be more 'fun' know that Hearthstone is not random. No amount of calling people tinfoil hat, or making silly arguments about proving you did not murder someone or being willfully obtuse can change that. The fact that the same debate tactics are deployed again and again to try to shut down conversation  on the topic only highlights how on the money the accusations are. 

     No, people with tinfoil hats think they "know" this because it helps them deal with the fact that they're not as good at HS as they think they are. No matter how many times you repeat your nonsense, it doesn't change the fact that you have yet to offer an ounce of actual evidence.

     Sigh.....the ever repeated 'argument': asking questions about RNG/MMR/Blizzard is not rigging = proof being bad at the game. So stupid, so childish. Accusing people of tinfoil is a very good coverup/defense tactic. Yes continue to make a fool out of yourself thinking that that argument would stick.

    The American Stock Exchange has a watchdog: the SEC (Securities and Exchange Commission). They investigate independently to ensure fair and level playing field. Dealing with foreknowledge e.g. is strictly forbidden as it manipulates investors. Nobody does that right? Still the SEC is calling the shots. Why should such a commission exist in the financial world and not likewise in the game world?

    Who independent asserts the player base isn't being manipulated big time? No one within right mind will and could argue against an independent inquiry. There is no reason whatsoever NOT to investigate Blizzard. It is simply the right thing to do. And if everything is fine, then it will put to an end a useless discussion.

    Posted in: General Discussion
  • 0

    posted a message on Serious question on randomness
    Quote from EternalHS >>
    Quote from Hooghout >>
    Quote from EternalHS >>
    Quote from Hooghout >>
    Quote from TallStranger >>
    Quote from Hooghout >>
    Quote from TallStranger >>
    Quote from Hooghout >>

     Funny respons. Indeed no Department of Game Investigation.....yet. Look at Google, MS en Apple. Big tech are scrutinized on different levels by state actors and international regulations. The game industry is very big. In the EU pricing loot boxes is forbidden. Need to get accustomed to the idea to scrutinize on the level of MMR and RNG. 

    You seen to be a firm believer that Blizzard is not rigging. Funny. you don't need any proof to believe in holy Blizzard. It's called religious.Maybe Blizzard is a god for the multitudes.

     You want me to prove Blizzard is NOT rigging the system? You know that it's not possible to prove a negative, right? I don't consider Blizzard "holy." I consider it a sensible, risk-adverse corporation that understands there's no meaningful upside to manipulating the MMR or RNG, and a huge downside.

    As for investigations, those are typically launched based on, wait for it, EVIDENCE. You know, the stuff you can't be bothered to collect? "Everybody knows" is not evidence. Hideous streaks of bad luck are not evidence. Deranged ideas of evil corporations trying to scam $20 off you is not evidence. Actual hard numbers are. Do you draw card X more often against one deck than another? Does your opponent draw his card more often than percentages say he should? That's real evidence. And you've got none.

    So you consider them 'a sensible, risk adverse corporation.'  Reason why you not thinking they are rigging the game. I like your gullibility and lack of critical thinking - quod non.  Remember Enron 2001?  A showcase of financial frauds:https://www.cbsnews.com/media/top-14-financial-frauds-of-all-time/  

    Frauds only possible because nobody ask serious questions....till it was too late.

    (showcase only an example among many others based on all thrusting types like you). 

     Again, you draw your knowledge of corporate behavior from stupid Hollywood movies and even stupider politicians. There are hundreds of large corporations out there, and the vast majority of them obey, to the best of their ability, the law. You're focusing on the exceptions. (As an aside, frequently, when these firms do get penalized for something, it's the result of legitimate disagreements over how to interpret an existing regulation, not a result of a company saying "We know this is illegal, but we're doing it anyway." The government's regulations are often quite confusing.) I never said the company was full of saints. It's got nothing to do with trust: it's entirely a matter of the company's own self-interest. The gaming industry is extraordinarily competitive, and there's substantial personnel movement between firms. So people who used to work in senior positions at Blizzard are now likely at all its competitors. Why wouldn't they anonymously leak this fraud to the government or media? It would crush Blizzard and help its competitors. Rigging the RNG is not something that can be done by only a few people: it would be widely known among much of the development team. So why hasn't this come to light? The obvious answer: because it's not happening. The risk/ reward simply doesn't justify it.

    Again, show me evidence, tough guy. Actual data. If it's sooooo obvious, it shouldn't take you long. Truth is, you can't.

     Lots of words, trying to turn things around while you don't have the proof of not rigging. Ever heard of non disclosure agreements? You don't sell out. The competition will not trust you then when you want to work for them. Your sofism won't help you this time.

    Hooghout, even you should know that "guilty until proven innocent" doesn't hold in a debate. That is how our society functioned in the Medieval times. The burden of proof is on the accuser, not the accused and you have presented none. No, "other companies did it" isn't evidence.

    You brought the accusation so you need to present evidence to back it up or else your accusation doesn't have any ground to stand on.

     You're a believer. And one can't argue with believers in the goodness of Blizzard.

     Great job, now you have two things to prove.

     Another sophist being captious, using plausible but fallacious and deceptive reasoning.

    Posted in: General Discussion
  • 0

    posted a message on Serious question on randomness
    Quote from EternalHS >>
    Quote from Hooghout >>
    Quote from TallStranger >>
    Quote from Hooghout >>
    Quote from TallStranger >>
    Quote from Hooghout >>

     Funny respons. Indeed no Department of Game Investigation.....yet. Look at Google, MS en Apple. Big tech are scrutinized on different levels by state actors and international regulations. The game industry is very big. In the EU pricing loot boxes is forbidden. Need to get accustomed to the idea to scrutinize on the level of MMR and RNG. 

    You seen to be a firm believer that Blizzard is not rigging. Funny. you don't need any proof to believe in holy Blizzard. It's called religious.Maybe Blizzard is a god for the multitudes.

     You want me to prove Blizzard is NOT rigging the system? You know that it's not possible to prove a negative, right? I don't consider Blizzard "holy." I consider it a sensible, risk-adverse corporation that understands there's no meaningful upside to manipulating the MMR or RNG, and a huge downside.

    As for investigations, those are typically launched based on, wait for it, EVIDENCE. You know, the stuff you can't be bothered to collect? "Everybody knows" is not evidence. Hideous streaks of bad luck are not evidence. Deranged ideas of evil corporations trying to scam $20 off you is not evidence. Actual hard numbers are. Do you draw card X more often against one deck than another? Does your opponent draw his card more often than percentages say he should? That's real evidence. And you've got none.

    So you consider them 'a sensible, risk adverse corporation.'  Reason why you not thinking they are rigging the game. I like your gullibility and lack of critical thinking - quod non.  Remember Enron 2001?  A showcase of financial frauds:https://www.cbsnews.com/media/top-14-financial-frauds-of-all-time/  

    Frauds only possible because nobody ask serious questions....till it was too late.

    (showcase only an example among many others based on all thrusting types like you). 

     Again, you draw your knowledge of corporate behavior from stupid Hollywood movies and even stupider politicians. There are hundreds of large corporations out there, and the vast majority of them obey, to the best of their ability, the law. You're focusing on the exceptions. (As an aside, frequently, when these firms do get penalized for something, it's the result of legitimate disagreements over how to interpret an existing regulation, not a result of a company saying "We know this is illegal, but we're doing it anyway." The government's regulations are often quite confusing.) I never said the company was full of saints. It's got nothing to do with trust: it's entirely a matter of the company's own self-interest. The gaming industry is extraordinarily competitive, and there's substantial personnel movement between firms. So people who used to work in senior positions at Blizzard are now likely at all its competitors. Why wouldn't they anonymously leak this fraud to the government or media? It would crush Blizzard and help its competitors. Rigging the RNG is not something that can be done by only a few people: it would be widely known among much of the development team. So why hasn't this come to light? The obvious answer: because it's not happening. The risk/ reward simply doesn't justify it.

    Again, show me evidence, tough guy. Actual data. If it's sooooo obvious, it shouldn't take you long. Truth is, you can't.

     Lots of words, trying to turn things around while you don't have the proof of not rigging. Ever heard of non disclosure agreements? You don't sell out. The competition will not trust you then when you want to work for them. Your sofism won't help you this time.

    Hooghout, even you should know that "guilty until proven innocent" doesn't hold in a debate. That is how our society functioned in the Medieval times. The burden of proof is on the accuser, not the accused and you have presented none. No, "other companies did it" isn't evidence.

    You brought the accusation so you need to present evidence to back it up or else your accusation doesn't have any ground to stand on.

     You're a believer. And one can't argue with believers in the goodness of Blizzard.

    Posted in: General Discussion
  • 1

    posted a message on Serious question on randomness
    Quote from TallStranger >>
    Quote from Hooghout >>
    Quote from TallStranger >>
    Quote from Hooghout >>

     Funny respons. Indeed no Department of Game Investigation.....yet. Look at Google, MS en Apple. Big tech are scrutinized on different levels by state actors and international regulations. The game industry is very big. In the EU pricing loot boxes is forbidden. Need to get accustomed to the idea to scrutinize on the level of MMR and RNG. 

    You seen to be a firm believer that Blizzard is not rigging. Funny. you don't need any proof to believe in holy Blizzard. It's called religious.Maybe Blizzard is a god for the multitudes.

     You want me to prove Blizzard is NOT rigging the system? You know that it's not possible to prove a negative, right? I don't consider Blizzard "holy." I consider it a sensible, risk-adverse corporation that understands there's no meaningful upside to manipulating the MMR or RNG, and a huge downside.

    As for investigations, those are typically launched based on, wait for it, EVIDENCE. You know, the stuff you can't be bothered to collect? "Everybody knows" is not evidence. Hideous streaks of bad luck are not evidence. Deranged ideas of evil corporations trying to scam $20 off you is not evidence. Actual hard numbers are. Do you draw card X more often against one deck than another? Does your opponent draw his card more often than percentages say he should? That's real evidence. And you've got none.

    So you consider them 'a sensible, risk adverse corporation.'  Reason why you not thinking they are rigging the game. I like your gullibility and lack of critical thinking - quod non.  Remember Enron 2001?  A showcase of financial frauds:https://www.cbsnews.com/media/top-14-financial-frauds-of-all-time/  

    Frauds only possible because nobody ask serious questions....till it was too late.

    (showcase only an example among many others based on all thrusting types like you). 

     Again, you draw your knowledge of corporate behavior from stupid Hollywood movies and even stupider politicians. There are hundreds of large corporations out there, and the vast majority of them obey, to the best of their ability, the law. You're focusing on the exceptions. (As an aside, frequently, when these firms do get penalized for something, it's the result of legitimate disagreements over how to interpret an existing regulation, not a result of a company saying "We know this is illegal, but we're doing it anyway." The government's regulations are often quite confusing.) I never said the company was full of saints. It's got nothing to do with trust: it's entirely a matter of the company's own self-interest. The gaming industry is extraordinarily competitive, and there's substantial personnel movement between firms. So people who used to work in senior positions at Blizzard are now likely at all its competitors. Why wouldn't they anonymously leak this fraud to the government or media? It would crush Blizzard and help its competitors. Rigging the RNG is not something that can be done by only a few people: it would be widely known among much of the development team. So why hasn't this come to light? The obvious answer: because it's not happening. The risk/ reward simply doesn't justify it.

    Again, show me evidence, tough guy. Actual data. If it's sooooo obvious, it shouldn't take you long. Truth is, you can't.

     Lots of words, trying to turn things around while you don't have the proof of not rigging. Ever heard of non disclosure agreements? You don't sell out. The competition will not trust you then when you want to work for them. Your sofism won't help you this time.

    Posted in: General Discussion
  • 0

    posted a message on Serious question on randomness
    Quote from TheFubar >>
    Quote from Hooghout >>
    Quote from TallStranger >>
    Quote from Hooghout >>

     Funny respons. Indeed no Department of Game Investigation.....yet. Look at Google, MS en Apple. Big tech are scrutinized on different levels by state actors and international regulations. The game industry is very big. In the EU pricing loot boxes is forbidden. Need to get accustomed to the idea to scrutinize on the level of MMR and RNG. 

    You seen to be a firm believer that Blizzard is not rigging. Funny. you don't need any proof to believe in holy Blizzard. It's called religious.Maybe Blizzard is a god for the multitudes.

     You want me to prove Blizzard is NOT rigging the system? You know that it's not possible to prove a negative, right? I don't consider Blizzard "holy." I consider it a sensible, risk-adverse corporation that understands there's no meaningful upside to manipulating the MMR or RNG, and a huge downside.

    As for investigations, those are typically launched based on, wait for it, EVIDENCE. You know, the stuff you can't be bothered to collect? "Everybody knows" is not evidence. Hideous streaks of bad luck are not evidence. Deranged ideas of evil corporations trying to scam $20 off you is not evidence. Actual hard numbers are. Do you draw card X more often against one deck than another? Does your opponent draw his card more often than percentages say he should? That's real evidence. And you've got none.

    So you consider them 'a sensible, risk adeverse corporation.'  Reason why you not thinking they are rigging the game.I like your gullibility and lack of critical thinking - quod non.  Remember Enron 2001?  A showcase of financial frauds:https://www.cbsnews.com/media/top-14-financial-frauds-of-all-time/  

    Frauds only possible because nobody ask serious questions....till it was too late. 

     It sounds like the lack of evidence is the reason he believes Blizzard isn't rigging.  Asking questions is perfectly fine btw, but when the only 'evidence' being presented comes from people complaining they lost to bad rng...why on earth should we suddenly jump to the conclusion that Blizzard is rigging the system?

    I say BAD rng, but honestly what most people here present doesn't even qualify.  Drawing the 'perfect' card from their deck?  Discovering the card they needed to win?  Playing a bad matchup multiple times in a row?  Really?  These are apparently the kind of things that only a rigged system could deliver.

     I'm not talking about bad faith here. And you assume people reaching legend or play high level won't complain about RNG. Maybe they do, you don't know that. It is cynical to assume only bad players complain about RNG. 

    It's more conceptual here. Zephrys e.g is officially rigging the board state. A.I can do that so why not covert. For what reasons? Tell me, to keep the game fast paced, serving a target audience, ensuring a preconceived meta, increase pack selling, stimulating f2p to buy packs......

     

    Posted in: General Discussion
  • 0

    posted a message on Serious question on randomness
    Quote from TallStranger >>
    Quote from Hooghout >>

     Funny respons. Indeed no Department of Game Investigation.....yet. Look at Google, MS en Apple. Big tech are scrutinized on different levels by state actors and international regulations. The game industry is very big. In the EU pricing loot boxes is forbidden. Need to get accustomed to the idea to scrutinize on the level of MMR and RNG. 

    You seen to be a firm believer that Blizzard is not rigging. Funny. you don't need any proof to believe in holy Blizzard. It's called religious.Maybe Blizzard is a god for the multitudes.

     You want me to prove Blizzard is NOT rigging the system? You know that it's not possible to prove a negative, right? I don't consider Blizzard "holy." I consider it a sensible, risk-adverse corporation that understands there's no meaningful upside to manipulating the MMR or RNG, and a huge downside.

    As for investigations, those are typically launched based on, wait for it, EVIDENCE. You know, the stuff you can't be bothered to collect? "Everybody knows" is not evidence. Hideous streaks of bad luck are not evidence. Deranged ideas of evil corporations trying to scam $20 off you is not evidence. Actual hard numbers are. Do you draw card X more often against one deck than another? Does your opponent draw his card more often than percentages say he should? That's real evidence. And you've got none.

    So you consider them 'a sensible, risk adverse corporation.'  Reason why you not thinking they are rigging the game. I like your gullibility and lack of critical thinking - quod non.  Remember Enron 2001?  A showcase of financial frauds:https://www.cbsnews.com/media/top-14-financial-frauds-of-all-time/  

    Frauds only possible because nobody ask serious questions....till it was too late.

    (showcase only an example among many others based on all thrusting types like you).

     

    Posted in: General Discussion
  • 2

    posted a message on Serious question on randomness
    Quote from TallStranger >>
    Quote from Hooghout >>

    Remember Hearthstone is a children's game. If it was a game of adults we would consider the lack of balance, the mindless aggressive stupidity and the lack of (win condition) diversity unacceptable. Adults would demand furthermore an independent investigation to assess RNG and matchup being free of rigging. 

    That's utopia. Based on anecdotical experience of millions  the question is not if the game is rigged, but when it will come to light. It's like the Higgs Boson. An elementary particle. Theorized in 1964, proven by experiment in 2012. Took a long time, but in the end everything comes to light.

    It might surprise you, but there's this silly little thing called intellectual property. See, when someone spends substantial amounts of time and money creating a product (such as the MMR), they tend to not like the idea of other people, you know, reviewing it. Allowing outsiders access to the code is a great way to have it leaked. Once leaked, competitors will emulate/ refine it, and players/ hackers will exploit it.

    And exactly who is going to do this "independent investigation" of the RNG? The government? You know there's no "Department of Game Investigation," right? Who's going to pay for it? You? If Blizzard paid for it, you'd reject the findings instantly.

    If you and the rest of the tinfoil hat crowd want to do an investigation, go for it. Publicize your methodology, record your games so we know you're telling the truth, collect your data, and test your hypothesis. It's funny: every time someone dares you nuts to do this, you always find a reason not to. Or you play a few dozen games and pretend that proves anything. "I got 4 Galakrond rogues IN A ROW! RIGGGGGGGED!"

    I find your signature amusing, since your questions lack courage and your answers lack depth.

     Funny respons. Indeed no Department of Game Investigation.....yet. Look at Google, MS en Apple. Big tech are scrutinized on different levels by state actors and international regulations. The game industry is very big. In the EU pricing loot boxes is forbidden. Need to get accustomed to the idea to scrutinize on the level of MMR and RNG. 

    You seen to be a firm believer that Blizzard is not rigging. Funny. you don't need any proof to believe in holy Blizzard. It's called religious.Maybe Blizzard is a god for the multitudes.

    Posted in: General Discussion
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