I like combo decks as much as the next guy, but why does Blade Flurry hit face? spellpower bonus is also awkward based on the wording (although I suppose it's a spell).
Rogue's need AOE and I have no problem that they clear my board it's hard enough to come back from that, but since tinker came out it's a bit much that it also does 14 damage to face and clears your entire board.
I'm glade they are back in the meta, but BF has always been a strange one to me. Any compelling reasons why it should AOE and Face?
The only other AOE I can think of that hit's face is Consecration, Holy Nova, Swipe, *Hellfire and they don't have access to prep/making them do 14 damage to face.
It takes several cards to pull off a really OP blade flurry and since the card draw for Rogues was nerfed it's not the easiest thing to do. Oil Rogue has popped up but it's hardly everywhere so it's not really an issue. If you get blade flurried for a significant amount of face damage (hit face then flurry kind of thing) then your opponent has done a decent job setting it up. Also, just like Force + Savage combo and Flamestrike, you just try your best to play around it as you know it's probably coming. Just my opinion :)
The only other AOE I can think of that hit's face is Consecration, Holy Nova, Swipe, *Hellfire and they don't have access to prep/making them do 14 damage to face.
Giant blade flurries require either a lot of cards, a lot of mana, or both. Other big AOE's don't. Flurry is fine. Rogue doesn't need yet another nerf.
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"I hate Hearthstone. This game is a joke. Let's go play a real game." - Xixo on me beating him with his own face hunter list
The only other AOE I can think of that hit's face is Consecration, Holy Nova, Swipe, *Hellfire and they don't have access to prep/making them do 14 damage to face.
Only? So you mean like all but mage AoE.
Brawl, *Unleash the Hounds, the other hunter one 5 dmg + 2 to each next to it, Starfall, Lightning Storm.....Hellfire hurts you as much as them....Swipe...1 damage come on man, there is lot's of AOE that doesn't hit face.
I hear you all, but Rogue has the exact tools to delay delay and make it...an..inevitability against certain classes..., maybe I'm not playing around it well enough ...it's certainly possibly.
You're right, it might be an inevitability against certain classes, but all that means is that Rogue currently has good match ups against certain classes in the meta. If you're really struggling with it then find a class that does well against it and run over Rogues... It's all about adapting to the meta man :)
I think the reason blade flurry hits face is because you can weapon to the face. Other AoE clear spells are just for the board and not using another card or component. I think it makes perfect sense for blade flurry to go board and face.
Yeah it's pretty ridiculously strong. In general I am of the opinion that AoE should hit both sides of the board. There's no design / gameplay reason why it should be one-sided. It just leads to the cards being extremely swingy, creating total blowout scenarios instead of balancing the game.
Cards that are designed to let you come back shouldn't also have a second mode that lets you get further ahead.
So hellfire, auchenai + circle and twisting nether are examples of how AoE should work and pretty much everything else is made wrong.
For every time you see a successful Blade Flurry with Oil and everything else involved, I guarantee there are 4 or 5 other times that a Rogue has the cards in hand to pull it off, but can't due to other pressures on the board. Not to mention the fact that it requires at least 3 cards to make it work, which is quite a bit.
The ideal Blade Flurry play on a blank board would be Deckhand, Hero Power, Preparation, Oil, Deadly Poison, Deadly Poison, Eviscerate Face, Weapon to Face, Blade Flurry, Preparation, Eviscerate Face Again, Deckhand to Face (1+2+0+1+1+1+2+2+0+0=10) which results in 29 Damage if I did my math correctly. 29 to face and 8 to minions. Keep in mind, though, that this requires 9 CARDS to pull off.
Compared to Flamestrike, Force+Savage, etc., it's a well-balanced effect.
The only other AOE I can think of that hit's face is Consecration, Holy Nova, Swipe, *Hellfire and they don't have access to prep/making them do 14 damage to face.
Only? So you mean like all but mage AoE.
Brawl, *Unleash the Hounds, the other hunter one 5 dmg + 2 to each next to it, Starfall, Lightning Storm.....Hellfire hurts you as much as them....Swipe...1 damage come on man, there is lot's of AOE that doesn't hit face.
Swipe can be four if you target the player. Hounds can be used as a finisher. Brawl isn't aoe, it's board clear.
Besides all the examples given it comes down to this; All your aoe example which vary on if they hit face or not don't require multiple cards and sac'ing your weapon. A big blade flurry involves using up your weapon and multiple cards as well. Since oil rogue is the only viable rogue right now you are also calling for a nerf to their only big finisher. It's fine as is.
You're right, it might be an inevitability against certain classes, but all that means is that Rogue currently has good match ups against certain classes in the meta. If you're really struggling with it then find a class that does well against it and run over Rogues... It's all about adapting to the meta man :)
You're right, it might be an inevitability against certain classes, but all that means is that Rogue currently has good match ups against certain classes in the meta. If you're really struggling with it then find a class that does well against it and run over Rogues... It's all about adapting to the meta man :)
And the answer to that question is priests. Priests tend to wreck my balls since they can deal with my fewer minions easily enough and erase the damage I did to them to keep out of lethal range.
All this crap about Rogues needing tonnes of mana & shit loads of cards to pull off these 15 damage turns followed by another 15 damage is just pure non sense and ignorance. I have never lost to a rogue that did not have or draw ' Prep before turn 7, the real issue here is one card called ' Prep. That card is fucking broken it's not even funny, it has needed a nerf or to be re moved for a year now.
Sure Rogues have cheap ways of dealing with your minions, but so do Shamans, mages & the worse of the pack: WARRIORS, YET NO ONE COMPLAINS ABOUT THEM, WHY? I hate Rogues as much as anyone else but the real issue is that a Rogue out of the blue can draw massive amounts of cards and that was the real issue when miracle was around as well.
Auctioneer was not the problem, Prep was and still is. Somehow the sneaky no good for nothing Rogues have pulled a " Hunter " and sneeked back into the meta by exploiting one card ( PREP ). I can promise you that if a Rogue does not draw a prep into sprint they will not win, and if they do beat you then its your fault.
Card draw is wat Rogue lives by, always has and always will. Get rid of 'Prep and a Rogue is nothing for even a Priest to beat. if you guys pay close attention to a Rogues hand you will notice that by turn 6-7 they have as many cards as a hand lock. Of course if you give a Rogue 8-9 cards to work with they will rape any class.
So basically what I am saying is that i like your idea in general but seen in a vacuum it would be horrible and actually requires the game to have more incentive towards midrange/control decks in order to be a change for the better.
Well it would require rebalancing some cards but it's a good philosophy to have going forward imo. I have a feeling they realized this because the only new aoe that came out is poison seeds and lightbomb.
Hopefully we never see stuff like flamestrike / consecration / blizzard / blade flurry again.
The only other AOE I can think of that hit's face is Consecration, Holy Nova, Swipe, *Hellfire and they don't have access to prep/making them do 14 damage to face.
Only? So you mean like all but mage AoE.
Brawl, *Unleash the Hounds, the other hunter one 5 dmg + 2 to each next to it, Starfall, Lightning Storm.....Hellfire hurts you as much as them....Swipe...1 damage come on man, there is lot's of AOE that doesn't hit face.
Brawl is an AoE ? Last time I played it I lost my whole board. Good AoE. Unleash the Hounds, I surely miss some part about this card I think.
Blade Flurry is correct as a card. Of course, it can do a tremendous amount of damage. But... you probably don't understand the thinking required before doing so and the cards that it costed to the rogue. Most of the rogue decks runs few minions in order to have lot of spells to burst/control the board/set up lethal. That's the strenght of the Rogue... planning some plays from the shadows and leaving you breathless.
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Used to be a proud Handlock player.
Legend 17 times.
Still flirting with the ladder from times to times with Renolock.
i hope this is not a thread calling for blade fury nerf :)
it's a combo deck, so you can already know the consistency...yes it feels overpowered when rogue has the combo, but that's like one out of every 4-5 games you get to do some ridiculous combos, because often time you are using cards to stable the board.
play some oil rogue, you will know blade fury is ok as it is.
Blade Furry has always been strange to me, not just since tinker. brawl achieves the same thing most of the time as an AOE most of the time as does unleash, hence the * ,which could be used in a few different capacities it's equally likely to go to face as it is clear the board in my experience.
Anyway, I like combo, I'm glad it has a place in the game, just thinking forward, how much more room do they have to add weapon damage to Rogues? Blade flurry could get exponentially better in the future
Blade Furry has always been strange to me, not just since tinker. brawl achieves the same thing most of the time as an AOE most of the time as does unleash, hence the * ,which could be used in a few different capacities it's equally likely to go to face as it is clear the board in my experience.
Anyway, I like combo, I'm glad it has a place in the game, just thinking forward, how much more room do they have to add weapon damage to Rogues? Blade flurry could get exponentially better in the future
And then ooze and Harrison would ruin Rogue.
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Used to be a proud Handlock player.
Legend 17 times.
Still flirting with the ladder from times to times with Renolock.
You're right, it might be an inevitability against certain classes, but all that means is that Rogue currently has good match ups against certain classes in the meta. If you're really struggling with it then find a class that does well against it and run over Rogues... It's all about adapting to the meta man :)
And the answer to that question is priests. Priests tend to wreck my balls since they can deal with my fewer minions easily enough and erase the damage I did to them to keep out of lethal range.
If you're losing to priests as a combo rogue, you're doing it wrong. It's always been very one-sided in favor of rogue, and still is.
Control warriors, on the other hand... Hitting that Concede button (after Prep for some extra style points) is the best play, just to save time.
Might be deck variations but I actually don't have that bad of a time against control warriors. About 50/50. I just play hyper aggressively. I mulligan for creatures and not early removal (like backstab). Priests just seem to stay above where I can nail them down.
Blade Flurry is fine. The amount of preparation justifies its strength.
I'm glad to see Rogue becoming a viable deck again. Especially when lots of people joining the parade, think that they picked a fast and strong deck, and fail hard because they have no idea how to play it.
For example...
Turn 3, send Bloodmage Thalnos to Senjin, Blade Flurry,
nothing dies because Thalnos is already dead (LOL),
"I Will Be Your Death!",
coin, prep, dagger up, Blade Flurry again,
concede. ...a play from a 300 rank legend player. I laughed so hard.
I like combo decks as much as the next guy, but why does Blade Flurry hit face? spellpower bonus is also awkward based on the wording (although I suppose it's a spell).
Rogue's need AOE and I have no problem that they clear my board it's hard enough to come back from that, but since tinker came out it's a bit much that it also does 14 damage to face and clears your entire board.
I'm glade they are back in the meta, but BF has always been a strange one to me. Any compelling reasons why it should AOE and Face?
The only other AOE I can think of that hit's face is Consecration, Holy Nova, Swipe, *Hellfire and they don't have access to prep/making them do 14 damage to face.
Here's why I think it's fine:
It takes several cards to pull off a really OP blade flurry and since the card draw for Rogues was nerfed it's not the easiest thing to do. Oil Rogue has popped up but it's hardly everywhere so it's not really an issue. If you get blade flurried for a significant amount of face damage (hit face then flurry kind of thing) then your opponent has done a decent job setting it up. Also, just like Force + Savage combo and Flamestrike, you just try your best to play around it as you know it's probably coming. Just my opinion :)
Unbowed. Unbent. Unbroken.
Only? So you mean like all but mage AoE.
Giant blade flurries require either a lot of cards, a lot of mana, or both. Other big AOE's don't. Flurry is fine. Rogue doesn't need yet another nerf.
"I hate Hearthstone. This game is a joke. Let's go play a real game." - Xixo on me beating him with his own face hunter list
Brawl, *Unleash the Hounds, the other hunter one 5 dmg + 2 to each next to it, Starfall, Lightning Storm.....Hellfire hurts you as much as them....Swipe...1 damage come on man, there is lot's of AOE that doesn't hit face.
I hear you all, but Rogue has the exact tools to delay delay and make it...an..inevitability against certain classes..., maybe I'm not playing around it well enough ...it's certainly possibly.
I've added Swamp ooze to most decks though
You're right, it might be an inevitability against certain classes, but all that means is that Rogue currently has good match ups against certain classes in the meta. If you're really struggling with it then find a class that does well against it and run over Rogues... It's all about adapting to the meta man :)
Unbowed. Unbent. Unbroken.
I think the reason blade flurry hits face is because you can weapon to the face. Other AoE clear spells are just for the board and not using another card or component. I think it makes perfect sense for blade flurry to go board and face.
Yeah it's pretty ridiculously strong.
In general I am of the opinion that AoE should hit both sides of the board. There's no design / gameplay reason why it should be one-sided. It just leads to the cards being extremely swingy, creating total blowout scenarios instead of balancing the game.
Cards that are designed to let you come back shouldn't also have a second mode that lets you get further ahead.
So hellfire, auchenai + circle and twisting nether are examples of how AoE should work and pretty much everything else is made wrong.
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For every time you see a successful Blade Flurry with Oil and everything else involved, I guarantee there are 4 or 5 other times that a Rogue has the cards in hand to pull it off, but can't due to other pressures on the board. Not to mention the fact that it requires at least 3 cards to make it work, which is quite a bit.
The ideal Blade Flurry play on a blank board would be Deckhand, Hero Power, Preparation, Oil, Deadly Poison, Deadly Poison, Eviscerate Face, Weapon to Face, Blade Flurry, Preparation, Eviscerate Face Again, Deckhand to Face (1+2+0+1+1+1+2+2+0+0=10) which results in 29 Damage if I did my math correctly. 29 to face and 8 to minions. Keep in mind, though, that this requires 9 CARDS to pull off.
Compared to Flamestrike, Force+Savage, etc., it's a well-balanced effect.
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Swipe can be four if you target the player. Hounds can be used as a finisher. Brawl isn't aoe, it's board clear.
Besides all the examples given it comes down to this; All your aoe example which vary on if they hit face or not don't require multiple cards and sac'ing your weapon. A big blade flurry involves using up your weapon and multiple cards as well. Since oil rogue is the only viable rogue right now you are also calling for a nerf to their only big finisher. It's fine as is.
And the answer to that question is priests. Priests tend to wreck my balls since they can deal with my fewer minions easily enough and erase the damage I did to them to keep out of lethal range.
All this crap about Rogues needing tonnes of mana & shit loads of cards to pull off these 15 damage turns followed by another 15 damage is just pure non sense and ignorance. I have never lost to a rogue that did not have or draw ' Prep before turn 7, the real issue here is one card called ' Prep. That card is fucking broken it's not even funny, it has needed a nerf or to be re moved for a year now.
Sure Rogues have cheap ways of dealing with your minions, but so do Shamans, mages & the worse of the pack: WARRIORS, YET NO ONE COMPLAINS ABOUT THEM, WHY? I hate Rogues as much as anyone else but the real issue is that a Rogue out of the blue can draw massive amounts of cards and that was the real issue when miracle was around as well.
Auctioneer was not the problem, Prep was and still is. Somehow the sneaky no good for nothing Rogues have pulled a " Hunter " and sneeked back into the meta by exploiting one card ( PREP ). I can promise you that if a Rogue does not draw a prep into sprint they will not win, and if they do beat you then its your fault.
Card draw is wat Rogue lives by, always has and always will. Get rid of 'Prep and a Rogue is nothing for even a Priest to beat. if you guys pay close attention to a Rogues hand you will notice that by turn 6-7 they have as many cards as a hand lock. Of course if you give a Rogue 8-9 cards to work with they will rape any class.
Well it would require rebalancing some cards but it's a good philosophy to have going forward imo.
I have a feeling they realized this because the only new aoe that came out is poison seeds and lightbomb.
Hopefully we never see stuff like flamestrike / consecration / blizzard / blade flurry again.
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Brawl is an AoE ? Last time I played it I lost my whole board. Good AoE. Unleash the Hounds, I surely miss some part about this card I think.
Blade Flurry is correct as a card. Of course, it can do a tremendous amount of damage. But... you probably don't understand the thinking required before doing so and the cards that it costed to the rogue. Most of the rogue decks runs few minions in order to have lot of spells to burst/control the board/set up lethal. That's the strenght of the Rogue... planning some plays from the shadows and leaving you breathless.
Used to be a proud Handlock player.
Legend 17 times.
Still flirting with the ladder from times to times with Renolock.
i hope this is not a thread calling for blade fury nerf :)
it's a combo deck, so you can already know the consistency...yes it feels overpowered when rogue has the combo, but that's like one out of every 4-5 games you get to do some ridiculous combos, because often time you are using cards to stable the board.
play some oil rogue, you will know blade fury is ok as it is.
Blade Furry has always been strange to me, not just since tinker. brawl achieves the same thing most of the time as an AOE most of the time as does unleash, hence the * ,which could be used in a few different capacities it's equally likely to go to face as it is clear the board in my experience.
Anyway, I like combo, I'm glad it has a place in the game, just thinking forward, how much more room do they have to add weapon damage to Rogues? Blade flurry could get exponentially better in the future
And then ooze and Harrison would ruin Rogue.
Used to be a proud Handlock player.
Legend 17 times.
Still flirting with the ladder from times to times with Renolock.
Might be deck variations but I actually don't have that bad of a time against control warriors. About 50/50. I just play hyper aggressively. I mulligan for creatures and not early removal (like backstab). Priests just seem to stay above where I can nail them down.
Blade Flurry is fine. The amount of preparation justifies its strength.
I'm glad to see Rogue becoming a viable deck again. Especially when lots of people joining the parade, think that they picked a fast and strong deck, and fail hard because they have no idea how to play it.
For example...
Turn 3, send Bloodmage Thalnos to Senjin, Blade Flurry,
nothing dies because Thalnos is already dead (LOL),
"I Will Be Your Death!",
coin, prep, dagger up, Blade Flurry again,
concede. ...a play from a 300 rank legend player. I laughed so hard.
Meta changes the moment you switch your deck.