Ever since Beta blizzard nerfed a lot of cards because they felt like they dont feel "fun and interactive":
Undertaker, Warsong Commander (Patron nerf), Force of Nature-Combo, Yogg-Saron, Caverns Below (twice), Leeroy, Charge, Raza, Lackey (Cubelock), Jade Druide (until 6 Mana Minion)
All this Decks were very frustrating to play against because you could not play around them (with some exceptions). Yet they Print a Card like Shudderwock where your only winning option as a control player is a) try to smork them as a control deck (90% impossible), b) try to mill their shudderwock somehow (overdraw, burn/discard with warlock) c) hope that the battlecries go off in the wrong order
So why does Blizzard keep printing cards like that? It's so frustrating to play against - i miss the old days were the outcome of the match wasn't so heavenly favored if you play against a certain deck (except the freeze mage vs. Warrior). Rock Paper Sciccor Meta is not fun and Blizzard should make changes quickly or they will lose more and more players.
I don't like the card mostly because I hate playing against combo decks - Hopefully we will get some combo tech in this expansion - Already one card in Warlock that transform a minion in either players hand into a demon - I hope for more, especially a neutral option (Dirty Rat 2.0). Lucky for me most people is too dumb to play Shudderwock and play it before they have even played a Chain gang - This is people at rank 4 at the moment xD
Shudderwock is a very fun card. Lots of different Battlecry combinations to play around with especially in Wild.
Blame the players who are content with wasting their lives watching him infinitely bounce back into their hand and onto the board again while literally sucking on their opponent like a parasitic fly.
Most of these decks are combo decks and are fine. These decks destroy control deck and it is fine since the aim of control deck is to counter aggro. So:
There's no way of getting around that, it's impossible to avoid printing unfun cards because you never know what the meta will be ahead of time, plus unfun cards are still fun on one side of the spectrum, unfun is also pretty subjective, what you may find "cancerous" others may find perfectly fine, that's just how it is with gaming in general and always will be
I think without shudderwock decks like big spell mage and taunt druid would became tier s and every deck would be a greedy control deck shudderwock keeps greedy control decks from breaking game and i think game needs a card like this
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i play cubelock and lose 5 games in a row then i play odd paladin and get my stars back wash rinse repeat
the problem is not shudderwock nor chain gang, the problem is a card that let's you replay a 9 mana card for only 1 mana - grumble, without grumble you can still get a shudderwock back in your hand with zola but can only play 1 per turn
the problem is not shudderwock nor chain gang, the problem is a card that let's you replay a 9 mana card for only 1 mana - grumble, without grumble you can still get a shudderwock back in your hand with zola but can only play 1 per turn
Without chain gang you cannot zola the wok, and you cannot grumble the wok. What needs to happen is a copy battlecry should always copy the original card that triggered it.
Inb4 a lot more interactive than pre-nerfed quest rogue. Also, shaman has a lot of bad AoEs in comparison to other classes. Also also, they don't have any good stall abilities (plague; ice block, freeze). This TTK combo is perfectly fine.
They print "unfun" decks because different people enjoy different types of deck. If every deck was the same win condition, the game would get very stale very fast. Some people want to strategize, some want to roll the dice, some want to fatigue, and some want to build bigger and bigger mans. It's all about preference. If you don't like a particular deck, find a way to beat it. You find it unfun, but someone else might find it fun. Every deck has a counter.
Shudderwock is a very fun card. Lots of different Battlecry combinations to play around with especially in Wild.
Blame the players who are content with wasting their lives watching him infinitely bounce back into their hand and onto the board again while literally sucking on their opponent like a parasitic fly.
True - especially in Wild.
The most recent VS report put the win-rate of the Wild combo version of the deck at about 42%, while simple mid-range JadeWock Shaman has a win-rate of 49%, in which Shudderwock mostly acts as a Battlecry counterpart of N'Zoth. The format is both wide enough, and deep enough to support many viable, off-meta home-brews. Unfortunately, the Wild ladder mostly features "up-graded" versions of the latest Standard decks - despite the higher win-rate of Jade Shaman, for example, HSReplays suggests that the combo version of the deck is played almost 14 times more often. Indeed, my own deck-tracker tells me I've played against MR Jade Shaman once in the past 200 games . . .
Shudderwock is a great card, and it's very satisfying to use, but it creates a problem where disruption cards are the only counterplay, and without it, You are helpless, but with them the Shudderwock player can just loose on the spot if they loose their Shudderwock. Combo decks with no alternative win condition are bad design really.
Oldschool combo decks usually had a few ways to pull off their combo, even without key cards such as Emperor or Brann You could usually try to execute it. Maybe not as an OTK, but some 15 or 20 damage for sure. With Shudderwock vs. Control, if You loose Your Shudderwock You loose the game 90% of the time, if You have it You win 90% of the time.
Disruption is not a solution to Shudderwock. Blizzard simply shouldn't make cards that allow You to pull of a powerful OTK that require legendaries to work. Combo decks should be slowed down by disruption, not completely shut down by it.
Also, Shudderwocm deals pretty much infinite damage and heals to full, which makes it impossible to prep against it. The ONLY viable plan is to just win before You loose, because eventually You always will, and that's bullshit.
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Ever since Beta blizzard nerfed a lot of cards because they felt like they dont feel "fun and interactive":
Undertaker, Warsong Commander (Patron nerf), Force of Nature-Combo, Yogg-Saron, Caverns Below (twice), Leeroy, Charge, Raza, Lackey (Cubelock), Jade Druide (until 6 Mana Minion)
All this Decks were very frustrating to play against because you could not play around them (with some exceptions). Yet they Print a Card like Shudderwock where your only winning option as a control player is a) try to smork them as a control deck (90% impossible), b) try to mill their shudderwock somehow (overdraw, burn/discard with warlock) c) hope that the battlecries go off in the wrong order
So why does Blizzard keep printing cards like that? It's so frustrating to play against - i miss the old days were the outcome of the match wasn't so heavenly favored if you play against a certain deck (except the freeze mage vs. Warrior). Rock Paper Sciccor Meta is not fun and Blizzard should make changes quickly or they will lose more and more players.
holy fucking shit,can we not create another shuttlecock thread every 10minutes?
I don't like the card mostly because I hate playing against combo decks - Hopefully we will get some combo tech in this expansion - Already one card in Warlock that transform a minion in either players hand into a demon - I hope for more, especially a neutral option (Dirty Rat 2.0). Lucky for me most people is too dumb to play Shudderwock and play it before they have even played a Chain gang - This is people at rank 4 at the moment xD
Shudderwock is a very fun card. Lots of different Battlecry combinations to play around with especially in Wild.
Blame the players who are content with wasting their lives watching him infinitely bounce back into their hand and onto the board again while literally sucking on their opponent like a parasitic fly.
Most of these decks are combo decks and are fine. These decks destroy control deck and it is fine since the aim of control deck is to counter aggro. So:
control kill aggro
aggro kill combo
combo kill control
this is the Hearthstone basic scheme.
There's no way of getting around that, it's impossible to avoid printing unfun cards because you never know what the meta will be ahead of time, plus unfun cards are still fun on one side of the spectrum, unfun is also pretty subjective, what you may find "cancerous" others may find perfectly fine, that's just how it is with gaming in general and always will be
Don't mind me just passing by
Shudderwok is fine and a fun card, the interaction with chain gang is not.
I think without shudderwock decks like big spell mage and taunt druid would became tier s and every deck would be a greedy control deck shudderwock keeps greedy control decks from breaking game and i think game needs a card like this
i play cubelock and lose 5 games in a row then i play odd paladin and get my stars back wash rinse repeat
the problem is not shudderwock nor chain gang, the problem is a card that let's you replay a 9 mana card for only 1 mana - grumble, without grumble you can still get a shudderwock back in your hand with zola but can only play 1 per turn
Without chain gang you cannot zola the wok, and you cannot grumble the wok. What needs to happen is a copy battlecry should always copy the original card that triggered it.
TBH i find those to be unfun cards by themselfs haha
Inb4 a lot more interactive than pre-nerfed quest rogue. Also, shaman has a lot of bad AoEs in comparison to other classes. Also also, they don't have any good stall abilities (plague; ice block, freeze). This TTK combo is perfectly fine.
And again, a duplicate thread.
I would LOVE to see some chart-guru Hearthpwner who breaks down ALL the whining threads about how unfair cards/decks/builds/archetypes are...
They print "unfun" decks because different people enjoy different types of deck. If every deck was the same win condition, the game would get very stale very fast. Some people want to strategize, some want to roll the dice, some want to fatigue, and some want to build bigger and bigger mans. It's all about preference. If you don't like a particular deck, find a way to beat it. You find it unfun, but someone else might find it fun. Every deck has a counter.
I like Shudderwok cause it makes whiney complainers like OP cry.
True - especially in Wild.
The most recent VS report put the win-rate of the Wild combo version of the deck at about 42%, while simple mid-range JadeWock Shaman has a win-rate of 49%, in which Shudderwock mostly acts as a Battlecry counterpart of N'Zoth. The format is both wide enough, and deep enough to support many viable, off-meta home-brews. Unfortunately, the Wild ladder mostly features "up-graded" versions of the latest Standard decks - despite the higher win-rate of Jade Shaman, for example, HSReplays suggests that the combo version of the deck is played almost 14 times more often. Indeed, my own deck-tracker tells me I've played against MR Jade Shaman once in the past 200 games . . .
Shudderwock is a great card, and it's very satisfying to use, but it creates a problem where disruption cards are the only counterplay, and without it, You are helpless, but with them the Shudderwock player can just loose on the spot if they loose their Shudderwock. Combo decks with no alternative win condition are bad design really.
Oldschool combo decks usually had a few ways to pull off their combo, even without key cards such as Emperor or Brann You could usually try to execute it. Maybe not as an OTK, but some 15 or 20 damage for sure. With Shudderwock vs. Control, if You loose Your Shudderwock You loose the game 90% of the time, if You have it You win 90% of the time.
Disruption is not a solution to Shudderwock. Blizzard simply shouldn't make cards that allow You to pull of a powerful OTK that require legendaries to work. Combo decks should be slowed down by disruption, not completely shut down by it.
Also, Shudderwocm deals pretty much infinite damage and heals to full, which makes it impossible to prep against it. The ONLY viable plan is to just win before You loose, because eventually You always will, and that's bullshit.