Hearthpwn

Quote from Malks2205 >>

Quote from __l1ght >>

Commending posts about Always a Bigger Jormungar increases the likelyhood it gets nerfed to 2 mana faster. If anything, hunter is currently t0 only because of the Hollow Hound and that new card is an absurd buff to an already strong minion.

Talking about t0, when will we see Identity Theft  nerf finally? Even if the priest's titan was the worst (imo it's actually the other way around), you can always take your opponent's – I can't see a reason why control priest would stop terrorizing ranked in new expansion.

 Pretty sure I saw somewhere that Titans weren't discoverable

 

 I'm not sure this applies to priest and rogue "Discover cards from the opponents hand/deck" mechanics. I think being a card in hand takes priority over being an undiscoverable card from the game's pool. Because it's not from the game's pool, it's from your opponent's.

Quote from RendInFriend >>

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Quote from RendInFriend >>

Nobody mentioned that hunter got the best cards out of the expansion. All of this late game control support that will be wasted because hunter simply kills you. Always a bigger jormungar is insane with hound. Hound hunter has a turn 10 combo: play hodir on turn 9; turn 10 play hollow hound, magnetize parasite; always a bigger jormungar. You have a 18/16 that has cleave and deals excess damage to heroes. You will see this in hound hunter and it can end games out of nowhere by punishing the opponent for playing minions.

 If I'm control warrior/DK/druid and I made it to turn 10 against aggro-combo-midrange-ish hunter who had 4 dead cards in hand for 9 turns and set up turn 10 win condition by doing nothing on turn 9, you can believe me when I say, the size of your hound doesn't matter, you can hit three 1/1s with it, I still win this game.

You say the late game support of the expansion is wasted but then you say hunter is the best and will trigger a win condition on turn 10, thus proving that late game support will be relevant if all goes according to your plan.

 No, you interpreted what I wrote completely wrong and you don’t have a clue how hound hunter works. You will see always a bigger jormungar end games on turn 7 with hollow hound. A 7 mana, 5+ damage rush, cleave, splash lifesteal minion is cracked. This will be dealing 10+ face damage consistently on turn 7 since both cards are able to be tutored or copied. It will also be a full heal and clear out half an opponents board. These are far from dead cards until turn 10. My point with the combo isn’t that it is the main plan, but if you are facing a control deck that has any board presence whatsoever, AABJ punishes playing minions, just like sinful brand did. Having the ability to summon a 18/16 with rush, cleave, splash and lifesteal will end grindy control decks as soon as they play a minion. Hunter got the best set by a mile and the best card of the set with AABJ, it is way stronger than any other 1 mana card.

 Maybe you're right. I just don't see it personally, hunters will have more efficient ways to end games. When I look at Trampling Rhino I think it's reasonable to think its text is worth 1 mana and body is worth 4 mana, I don't think AABJ is undercosted. And I also think hound is fairly costed. 3/6 rush worth 4 mana. Lifesteal cleave worth 2 mana.

In my warrior deck I can summon a lot of extremely huge minions with a lot of good keywords and abilities including rush or charge or full clears, by doubling/quadrupling their stats. Doesn't mean I instantly win the game when that happens even if the opponent gives me a good board state to swing. And when I say extremely huge, I mean a lot bigger than 18/16 and a lot more than 1 minion, and I don't require a turn 8 or 9 do nothing to set up, only a turn 5 or turn 7 do nothing. If you get lethal then great, sure. If you don't, what are your options ? Play hound and AABJ normally on curve and/or building tempo fast not beeing overly greedy like a normal hunter deck ? I'm sure that will happen, and AABJ will definitely see play in that context because face is the place.

Also, IF you are correct, people will then play around it and not play small minions or place taunt strategically. Don't expect everyone to play Muster for Battle into your giga hound.

But yes, of course, I could be absurdly wrong, this is the beauty of the reveal season, we just don't know. Remember how we all thought Troggzor the Earthinator would break the game and Dr. Boom was just a glorified War Golem ? We say some stupid shit sometimes, new stuff is always harder than we think to evaluate on paper within the context and knowledge of the current game because that context and knowledge are gone the moment the expansion drops. Lastly, no I don't have a clue how hound hunter works exactly because I haven't played in weeks and never even faced the deck, but I mean, come on, don't mistake me for a 3 years old, I can tell how this deck plays just by looking at the hound and knowing the hunter's kit, I play this game since 2014, and it's not a hard game to figure out. I could homebrew the deck right now and be like 4 cards away from a perfect copy of meta version.

Maybe I can voice my opinion in a different manner. What do you think about Collateral Damage ? Because I thought this was absolutely insane when it was revealed, you just look at the cards and imagine a favorable board state and you're like "woaw, this almost OTKs by itself how is this not broken". Only to realize later that the perfect board state and the perfect hand/card rarely coincide and that card was barely usable. I'm not going to do the same mistake with a 2 cards 7 mana combo or 3 cards 9 mana combo that essentially does what a 1 card 8 mana combo did, just to gain lifesteal on it (in terms of immediate impact, of course not considering the hound body). And let's not talk about the full 2 turns 5 cards 19 mana combo to get the 18/16 giga hound that then needs good targets to win the game, it's just irrelevant imo, something we will only see in MarkMcKz videos.

In terms of best 1 mana card, I'm not sure if you're referring to this expansion or all time, but for all time I'd argue a lot of 1 mana cards are significantly more crazy than this. For this expansion yeah maybe, it's impossible to tell for me because most 1 mana cards of this expansion look insane to me.

Quote from RendInFriend >>

Nobody mentioned that hunter got the best cards out of the expansion. All of this late game control support that will be wasted because hunter simply kills you. Always a bigger jormungar is insane with hound. Hound hunter has a turn 10 combo: play hodir on turn 9; turn 10 play hollow hound, magnetize parasite; always a bigger jormungar. You have a 18/16 that has cleave and deals excess damage to heroes. You will see this in hound hunter and it can end games out of nowhere by punishing the opponent for playing minions.

 If I'm control warrior/DK/druid and I made it to turn 10 against aggro-combo-midrange-ish hunter who had 4 dead cards in hand for 9 turns and set up turn 10 win condition by doing nothing on turn 9, you can believe me when I say, the size of your hound doesn't matter, you can hit three 1/1s with it, I still win this game.

You say the late game support of the expansion is wasted but then you say hunter is the best and will trigger a win condition on turn 10, thus proving that late game support will be relevant if all goes according to your plan.

I really like the theme of this expansion, this feel like TGT without all the goofiness and with proper balancing.

I also like how this thread immediately turned into "this class got the better cards and I hate it" and of course no one can agree on which class this is, which is a good sign.

Flamestrike exists, deals 5 damage to up to 7 minions, and sees 0 play.

Trial by Fire  deals 1, 2, 3, 4 and 5 damage to up to 5 minions, and people think this play see play as a board clear ?

The only questions that remain are : Are the stats worth it to play proactively for 7 mana, and is it worth playing mediocre fire spells for fire synergy.

Scale of Onyxia benefits a lot from ramp and is in a class with extremely few board clear, the total opposite of warrior, lots of board clear and 0 ramp. This is plain 7 mana at best on turn 7 or 6 with coin. This is so much worse than scales man.

The only reason you would ever play this is if you need another fire spell in your deck for synergy.

And it's okay-ish to play proactively to build a board.

But look at Flamestrike which is not played because it's too slow and weak for turn 7, and tell me again Trial by Fire is a good board clear.

It's not hard at all to not play other spells, it just depends on how you build the deck. Some blackrock variations are totally fine with 29-39 minions and weapons.

No, it's random

Oh cool, plague of flames except 7 times worse

I think this card is good at even 1 overload ? And has insane scaling.

This dude puts a significant body on board, gives free mana and draws cards. That's.. honestly a lot for one shaman card.

Still won't see play in all decks because I lot of shaman decks virtually or effectively use 0 overload cards, but definitely mandatory in all overload based decks, i would even pick this in an all spell quest shaman deck.

Midrange hasn't existed in years, it doesn't work in modern Hearthstone, it's just aggro but worse. You can still climb with midrange of course.. but don't expect it to be meta

I can't even be bothered to go to the website, log in and pick a titan.

I guess this is the end of the line for me if I don't even care about free packs. I think i'm like lvl 87 on the tavern pass. Haven't played in weeks.

No hard feelings though, been playing for almost a decade, put insane amounts of money in it. It's been fun while it lasted.

I still have a nearly complete wild collection except all the truly useless pack fillers and power crept cards, I suppose I can come back whenever I want.

You can't even imagine how many times I wished Stormstrike had overload.

Overload is a clear upside when you play a heavy overload synergy deck. Turn the tides is definitely not worse in the right deck.

I'm genuinely surprise this itself has the nature tag, generally when stupid blizz prints synergy like that they don't include the synergy tag on a core card, on purpose.

Really cool card honestly, especially considering the other nature spells in the expansion, they're all good

Also is this the glorious day where shaman finally gets MULTIPLE decent draw options in a rotation like every other class ? Good blizzard, been waiting for this almost an entire decade.

I've played that card once and it didn't copy the spell it was supposed to copy. I don't remember what spell or what was the board state, but I remember it would have won me the game, and I know for a fact, I will never play that card again.