Freshca's Fish Freeze
- Last updated Jan 9, 2015 (GvG Launch)
- Edit
- |
Wild
- 14 Minions
- 16 Spells
- Deck Type: None
- Deck Archetype: Unknown
- Crafting Cost: 2680
- Dust Needed: Loading Collection
- Created: 1/8/2015 (GvG Launch)
- Freshca
- Pro Player
-
Country:
-
Tournament Decks:
7
-
Ladder Decks:
13
-
Submitted By:
So since I made my original list this deck has been catching fire. itsotter has been playing it a lot on stream, and even made a nice write up on reddit. Savjz also played the deck and loved it as well. I figured I should make a formal write up on the deck.
I guess lets start with why I made the deck. I was a huge advocate of fatigue rogue, and some of you may of seen my list being played by firebat, backspace, and tidesoftime. The problem however was there was so much aggro being played it was hard to make the deck consistent enough for my liking as well as it just got boring after playing it for hundreds of games. Thus I started thinking what is really good and really bad about the deck against aggro. Well the board clears and the repeating of heals is good (in rogue it was blade flurry and shadow stepping minions to heal) However if I was doing this it was really hard to finish off my opponents afterwards. My original thought was add some more ways to deal with minions and more heal minions. However this lead to a bigger problem in consistency because now my deck was filled with minions making it harder to empty my hand when I was trying to combo. This made me want to try more classes out to see if I'd have better results. I saw some people were having varying success with druid, but I wanted to make my own deck because that is what I love to do (I do love getting feedback, but I don't just like copying decks at face value). So I started messing around with different mage builds. I tested this deck for weeks before getting a list that could win more then two games in a row, but the more I tweaked it the more consistent it got. I honestly think this deck could actually be an archetype. I've played it in some in house events with a lot of high level players such as firebat, kitkatz, and backspace. It preformed a lot better then people originally thought it would. If you are looking for an interesting deck that is different from your normal meta this is deff the deck for you!
I guess you're also wondering about what the good and bad match ups are. The best match ups for this deck are aggro decks believe it or not. You have so many heals, taunts and board clears it is really hard for them to kill you. They have to over extend on the board otherwise you just out heal their damage as well as get good trades with your taunts + hero power, and when they do over extend you get a sick board clear with your aoe. It's also really good against mid-range type decks like most of the current paladin lists (it gets a little harder depending how many silences they have, if they have rag, and if they still run equality, but even then the match up is winnable) Shaman is another match up that is really good now since they mostly don't run doom hammer anymore, and you have so much board clear potential they can never get a board presence you are scared of. There are some draws that can be a little annoying to deal with for example if they get to hex and kill the frog when you have duplicate it's not the greatest feeling, but it's also not the worst because you now have cheap taunts that are easy to add into your echo value. Lastly, for the good match ups you have priest. Priest doesn't normally have a lot of burst potential from hand forcing them to play right into your strategy of controlling the board while maintaining a high life total.
The match ups you don't mind playing, but aren't the most favorable would be the paladin deck if they do have equality/owls/rag, control warrior, and handlock (it is a free win if they don't slam jaraxxus or you burn it) However it is a decently hard match up if they play jaraxxus early in the game.
Lastly, the only match up you need to avoid like the plague is druid. It's almost impossible to beat a druid if they know what they are doing. They have a really easy time bursting from hand as well as emptying their hand.
Now lets talk about the cards in the deck, and what they do for you.
Frostbolt - is really important to allow you to freeze their big threats to allow them to be aoe'd the following turn. You also need it to snipe those pesky under takers before they get out of hand. Additionally, you can use it to freeze their hero to protect from a weapon so you can follow up with a taunt or heal to get out of danger.
Doomsayer - this card is super versatile. You can combo it with your freeze effects, and even if they silence it you have echo to get value later. It can also be used just to gain 7 life for 2 mana. As well as buy you an extra turn because they don't want to drop any minions into your doomsayer.
Explosive Sheep - Who doesn't love explosive sheep. It goes really well with your hero power. Allowing you to have even more options for board clears. You can also just play it into an undertaker preventing them from developing further onto the board before you can deal with it. There is also a lot of cool stuff you can do with it such as duplicating it or getting an additional sheep as well as saving your minions on board with echo. (gives you another flame strike in some cases)
Ironbeak Owl - this is a card I'm still testing, and it was an idea of Savjz. I was originally running two polymorphs because you needed to be able to deal with death rattles as well as big minions. However, if you run owl then you can just run bgh for the bigger minions and just silence the death rattles. It is also good because you are able to answer undertaker with it in addition to your frost bolts. You can also gain more value because it is another cheap minion for your echo.
Duplicate, Echo of Medivh, and Coldlight Oracle these cards serve the same purpose they are your card draw with out making you draw faster then your opponent. This is important because you still need cards to play, but you don't want to fatigue before your opponent.
Frost Nova, Cone of Cold, and Blizzard are your freeze spells obviously, and you need these in order to set up doomsayer, save hp, and set up for really good board clears with your sheep, and flame strikes.
Big Game Hunter, and Polymorph these cards allow you to deal with the minions you otherwise couldn't just aoe down. they are cheap enough to where you should be able to freeze the board afterwards allowing for a huge recovery from an otherwise grim situation.
Deathlord - this is probably the most important card in the deck (yes more important then coldlight oracle) it forces creatures out of their deck which normally would be hard to deal with, but since you are freezing the board a lot anyway it just speeds up their draws as well as takes away battle cry effects that normally would hurt you. It's also just a huge body that loves to be duplicated. Super efficient card for this strategy.
Earthen Ring Farseer - It is a really solid minion against aggro, and can be good for healing your taunts, additionally it's another cheap minion that provides good value after echo of medivh.
Not much more to say about it other then it just has a solid effect and stats.
Antique Healbot, and Sludge Belcher. These are your power houses. They lead you into the late game, and keep you from dieing if you duplicate either of these bad boys you are in great shape to win that match. Belcher is a lot of stats to eat through and if you have to deal with more then 1 especially when your board is being torn apart by aoe you're not going to be happy. Same goes for Antique Healbot 8 health is a lot when you're trying to burst from your hand. For example I keep clearing the board the logical response would to try and burst me down any way you can (kill command, fireballs alex to face ect) If after you burst I just keep gaining life because of healbots you're going to run out of steam.
Lastly, we have flamestrike this is what you use to finish off the board. Your game plan is to keep freezing the board and pinging minions to set up sick flamestrikes.
Twitch.tv/freshca
Twitter.com/freshcanation
------------------------------------
Updated with the changes I made during my stream tonight based on the decks I was playing against.
Unfortunately, after playing 4 matches, the results aren't so hot. I've been playing enough that I have 1,500 wins and 362 levels so I'm not new to the game. This deck is definitely FUN to play as well as challenging. It's fun because it certainly has the ability, if you get a steady stream of lucky draws and a good opening hand, to frustrate and stall opponents long enough that they will die from fatigue. But you aren't going to be killing anyone with minions with this deck. This is a stall and stay alive deck. It you get unlucky with your mulligan and don't draw lucky after that, go ahead and bail the match as you have no hope.
The first round I played I frustrated the hell out of a Priest. The guy was smack talking the entire time as he maintained board presence and figured this would be an easy win. After decimating his board multiple times with flame strikes and explosive sheep he started to get quiet. Once he was 6 cards into fatigue, he quit.
But, that game required a good deal of straight up lucky draws.
I really want to like this deck and I'm going to continue to play with for another week or so and see if I can get a better feel for mulligans and timing as I know that's very important. But my first impression is that it's a great concept which doesn't play out well in the real world.
Played another 20 or so games and was hoping that my first impression was off base but it's spot on. This deck is crazy fun to play _when it works_. You have to get pretty fortunate for it to work, however. A couple of bad draws in a row is enough to end the game for you and I was only able to kill an opponent with minion damage once. Every other win was by forced fatigue. This means the games are LONG.
To sum it up quickly. This deck is inconsistent and prone to catastrophic collapse but it HELLA fun to play when it draws well. Try it out if nothing else just to experience one of those moments when you can feel your opponent about to explode with fury.
Haven't played the deck yet since I don't have echo, but I played the fatigue rouge a lot. From what I've heard the mage version is a bit slower, but it's still probably nowhere near 30 minutes (your standard control warrior match) even though it's based around fatiguing your opponent. The repeated coldlights off echo/duplicate ensure that both players burn through their decks quickly. As for why people enjoy the deck so much, I personally enjoy it because it's a different way to approach winning the game, which is fun and can be a break from the norm. It also tends to make people mad because you can pull off some weird plays that they're not expecting because they've never had to play against a deck of that kind before. Plus they have to alter their playstyle from the norm, and opponents who don't realize this will become frustrated quickly when they try to do the same thing because they can't adapt.
Fatigue anything isn't viable - that's what I said. I'll amend that. It is "viable" insofar as you can play it, but why would I want to? If your win condition is someone else burning their deck, then something is wrong.
Look at the majority of the comments here. They are almost all about gleefully infuriating someone else, not, not in playing differently or skillfully. You have to master the playstyle of this deck, sure. But once you do that it's all about making someone else mad.
When you say it's a different approach to winning the game, you mean the difference is instead of having a strategy, you shift your gameplay style to "milling" their deck and winning by default. Frustration, anger and irritation ensue. And yes, the matches can be very long, upwards of 30 minutes... I have had a few and they aren't any fun for me. If my opponent says otherwise, they're enjoying half an hour of trying to make me upset and sitting there "OH GOOD I am awesome! I burned their Boom! COOOOL I burned their healbot!" How is that an indicator of skill?
You should be sitting there saying "Oh good, I made a really clever play" - your "oh cool" moment shouldn't be premised on someone else's discomfort, rather on your own merits.
I get that I'll be disagreed with here, that's a given, this is a forum dedicated to the "OH COOL I burned his Jaraxxas... Oh cool I burned his Ragnaros... Oh cool I burned her Tirion" and not a place where anyone will actually consider the merits.
Look at the next two posts directly below this. One posts a screen shot while gleefully saying "You mad bro?" (the most idiotic formulation) and shames someone by posting their battlenet id - which is against the rules and will be addressed, the next one talks about getting "raped! haha".
Yes, I have issues with the people who play this, their frame of mind and the ill intent. Absolutely strive to win, that's the game, but don't strive to anger and shame others.
Firstly, I've taken care of the offending posts below.
Secondly, Griefer is a perfectly legitimate psychographic profile. Griefers enjoy winning while giving their opponents grief. Everyone has a different idea of fun, and nobody gets to define what other people are allowed to (or should) enjoy.
You're acknowledging that a preponderance of the folks who play this deck type are griefers?
You've made my point for me then.
Griefers ends up posting screenshots with personal info. They gleefully enjoy making others miserable with the "You mad, bro?" (typically misspelled because why be literate if you don't have to be?) and talk about how they are "raping" you in a game. Shaming, griefing, "raping" -- are legitimate?
Yes, it's offensive as all hell.
I don't think it's legitimate. If one tries this deck out of frustration with hunters/aggro - sure, I can see that. But the unholy joy it seems to engender? There are so many posts here - and I've seen it on twitch also, where people rhapsodize about how much fun it is to frustrate and make their opponents miserable.
What sort of win condition is that? I'm sure there are people who enjoy the challenge of playing the deck skillfully, but there seem to be so many of the others, who seek this deck out specifically to make others miserable.
That is not valid. If your psychographic/psychological profile suggests you enjoy the misery of others, there is a name for that. I'd suggest that it is valid to define fun as something enjoyable with the caveat that you can't harm others -- our social compact is based on that.
I can absolutely say that there is something wrong when an individual's joy and fun are based explicitly upon causing a lack of those conditions in others.
To suggest that "causing others grief" is legitimate as a way of life or fun is stunning in its implications. Do you really want to stand by that formulation? Do you want your spouse to be that sort of person? Your employer? Anyone that you know at all? Anyone in authority? (wait, they already are ;)
I won't continue the discussion further, but thought it would be impolite if I didn't respond.
Shaming, no. Raping, absolutely not. Griefing, yes. I'd like to point out that the former two are done/used by all psychographic profiles, not just griefers.
But anyway, you're entitled to your opinion, just as griefers are entitled to enjoy griefing. Each to their own. So we'll have to agree to disagree. :)
Ok. This requires an update. I have continued to play this deck almost exclusively for the last 5 days. After having tremendous success with it in certain matches I felt like I should be able to get a bit more consistency out of it and I have. This deck definitely has a learning curve to it. You need some serious patience to play it correctly but now that I have found my "rhythm" with this deck, my win rate has gone through the roof.
MULLIGAN : You definitely want to see frost nova or frostbolt along with duplicate and either belcher or death lord. Explosive sheep is nice as well but much more situational than the others.
As for the bag of tools crying that this form of deck is somehow outside the moral fabric of video gaming, this is one of the most complicated play styles I've seen. It's right there with playing miracle rogue and possibly even a bit more difficult to play correctly. I can understand someone complaining that Zoolock is fairly lame to play against because it requires nearly zero thought or planning. But this deck requires TONS of both so it should be held up as a standard for deck building for people who enjoying the deeper strategies in hearthstone.
I will say this: I get MORE "Well Played" compliments while playing this deck than any other I've played. People respect what this deck does and how you have to manage the board to make it successful. Haters either haven't figured out how to play it correctly, or are tired of being owned by it. The good news is that this community is still predominantly populated by players that respect a well played hand and not by whiners who don't like being milled to death.
Anyone that played MTG knows that mills decks have been around since these kinds of games began. You have two things you need to stay alive in these games; cards and health. Why is attacking one of them ok but the other is off limits?
I agree totally, I don't like mocking other players or taking pleasure in their frustration, but mill decks aren't about that, for me. They are a completely different strategy and very hard, but fun, to play. When I realise I'm being milled it's exciting, I have to quickly change strategy, and if I lose I'll always compliment my opponent. Unlike all the facehunter/mech mage/patron warrior/secret paladin clones, they're the ones that I get frustrated at.
Have a seriously high win rate with this deck... People don't know how to play lmao. This deck is sick! Might just be the modifications I made...
This is the best deck I've ever seen with a few modifications I've made to counter aggro hunters.
If you play this deck incorrectly you will get pwned! haha
I'd love to know your modifications :)
This deck is way too slow to get going. I've played about 10 games and lost every time. There's obviously a certain sequence to follow to get the most out of it. As it stands right now, I can get a doomsayer freeze combo off to clear the board around turn 6, but then I can't medivh anything and if I try to play anything before hand such as duplicate or deathlord, everything gets picked off one piece at a time so the combos won't work and I'm left with no creatures to medivh.
At what point are you supposed to play any card combos effectively? Turn 10 and at 5 health? By then it's too late to cone back.
How about adding a real mulligan guide and explanations that we can't assume for ourselves just by reading the card?
I think i might be playing this deck wrong I think im 2-13 with this deck. Lost to practically every class. Mulligan for removal and try to get duplicates on deathlords and healbots and sludges but still losing. Against aggro I dont even have the opportunity to mill I can barely survive. Against control big monsters overwhelm deathlords or sludges before I can flamestrike.
Really having a lot of fun with this deck Frescha. Even the games I lose end up being pretty close.
I was 2 doomsayer's short and seriously contemplated spending 800 dust to craft them, but instead I bought a classic pack for first time since GvG came out, and sure enough got 1 doomsayer out of it. So for now I run a Dr. Doom instead of a second doomsayer and haven't run into any major issues. Still getting the hang of playing the deck so haven't done much in ranked play, but over time I think this is going to be a very strong deck.
Thanks for building it!
If the idea is to annoy the opponent so that hey rage quits, Duplicate on Annoy-o-Tron would be helpful too.
Is there a replacement for Echo of Mediveh?
Maybe Youthful Brewmaster
It's also a good Undertaker-buster if you have it in your opening hand. (Unlike Echo)
Love this deck :) I'm missing 1 Echo of Medivh and 1 Explosive Sheep, so I put in Hogger and Pyroblast. Working wonders so far
I almost feel guilty using this deck, but it's pretty fun to play and so far everyone I've played it against (priests and warriors) stuck around until the bitter end which can be hilarious.
I won 1 game out of 6 at legend, what am i doing wrong lol