The people who are always waiting for the favourable matchups for their greedy decks are always going to be disappointed. Control does not mean that you do nothing on the first 5 turns of the game. You should understand that the game starts at turn 1 and if you skip a few turns, you will lose a lot of games. Warlock rush is not a rush deck, it is a tempo deck. Mech mage also... People complain about face hunter, but I do not remember the last time I saw one. People play midrange hunter now. These decks can kill fast if they face little resistance, but they are not rush decks.
Also I do not understand why people do not want to adapt. I mean this is the main thing in card games, figuring out what is good in the current metagame. If someone sticks to something which is bad in the current meta, it is their problem and should not complain.
you cant adapt when you dont know how the matchmaking system will screw you over. i had a quest for 5 wins with warrior today and i picked my control warrior guess what 5 consecutive druids and 1 thief priest.
Fuck this shit game. It's NEVER going to change. Aggro is cheap, fast, easy and efficient. control requires expensive cards, longer games and more skill. (Yes it does, don't even start. Go fuck yourself.)
YES, you can hard counter it, but it doesn't matter, because it's boring having that turn 1 major stress minion puke in your face every game and even if you're building a anti aggro deck, you still can't fall behind in the start with the wrong cards.
When this game has 500+ more cards than it has now, then MAYBE there's enough diversity to make it interesting.
I feel like quitting. My friend's list has less and less people playing HS. People are leaving. They're fed up. I've invested a lot of time into this game, so I've been clinging on. But I feel it's time to uninstall and wait for the next expansion and do something else.
i feel the same way as you but for different reasons. Since BRM released i havent played much if not at all. Games supposed to be fun, if HS isnt fun for you anymore take a break for a while.
The people who are always waiting for the favourable matchups for their greedy decks are always going to be disappointed. Control does not mean that you do nothing on the first 5 turns of the game. You should understand that the game starts at turn 1 and if you skip a few turns, you will lose a lot of games. Warlock rush is not a rush deck, it is a tempo deck. Mech mage also... People complain about face hunter, but I do not remember the last time I saw one. People play midrange hunter now. These decks can kill fast if they face little resistance, but they are not rush decks.
Also I do not understand why people do not want to adapt. I mean this is the main thing in card games, figuring out what is good in the current metagame. If someone sticks to something which is bad in the current meta, it is their problem and should not complain.
you cant adapt when you dont know how the matchmaking system will screw you over. i had a quest for 5 wins with warrior today and i picked my control warrior guess what 5 consecutive druids and 1 thief priest.
In this case you know that control warrior is might not be the best choice at the time. If you only play a few games a day, then you have no chance to adapt, but if you can do longer sessions, this is what you do. Play a few games, see what it is out there and then go from there.
I think the meta is actually at one of the slowest points of Hearthstone history.
That being said, I think people's mentality have changed a little bit.
I see more and more people choose to go face when they're presented with choices. Even Priests go face these day when they think they have lethal next turn. People used to get punished really hard if they ignore their opponent's board but with introductions of sticky RNG deathrattle cards like Piloted Shredder and Dr. Boom, it's getting harder and harder to punish players who just go face.
Blizzard probably thought the same thing when they introduced cards like Volcanic Drake and Solemn Vigil, but it's still not enough. I hope to see a card with similar mechanics, but does healing instead. For example, a 4 mana card that heals for 10 and costs (1) less for each minion died this turn, or something like that.
I think the meta is actually at one of the slowest points of Hearthstone history.
That being said, I think people's mentality have changed a little bit.
I see more and more people choose to go face when they're presented with choices. Even Priests go face these day when they think they have lethal next turn. People used to get punished really hard if they ignore their opponent's board but with introductions of sticky RNG deathrattle cards like Piloted Shredder and Dr. Boom, it's getting harder and harder to punish players who just go face.
Blizzard probably thought the same thing when they introduced cards like Volcanic Drake and Solemn Vigil, but it's still not enough. I hope to see a card with similar mechanics, but does healing instead. For example, a 4 mana card that heals for 10 and costs (1) less for each minion died this turn, or something like that.
while such a card would be neat and welcome, cards like healbot already do well to punish such moves. I know I've seen in other players, performed for myself, and even suffered to a healbot after a face slam. The game is basically over then.
When I play my double healbot ramp druid, it does very well against hunters. Same goes for my chinese priest. WHen I play hunter though, I just see people trying to put down 1 taunt at a time and using spells to pick off minions without trying to hold the board. Or else are running greedy control decks because they so want to use 3 dragons and Rag.
Aggro is essential to the balance of game. Without it, the meta would degenerate into mindless legend/giant trading and the game would be predictable and boring for the short time people continued to play it. If your deck can't deal with aggro then it isn't a good deck. If you can't come up with a deck that can endure the aggro in the meta with a positive overall win rate then you aren't a very good player.
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What I'm continually astonished by is the high number of people who think they need to win every single game. You don't. You just need to have a higher than 50% win rate against the set of players who queue up against you on ladder, and you will gain ranks.
Say you're playing Oil Rogue. Ok, you've got no play on board until at least Turn 3. Killing a Leper Gnome with dagger will probably get you low enough to be killed by Face Hunter. You pretty much have to draw Backstab in the first 3 turns and hope Face Hunter is on a less than perfect draw in order to win that game. Where's all the anger coming from when you lose that matchup? Move to the next game and farm Patron Warriors, Midrange Hunters, Paladins and Priests. If you had your pick of any deck and you chose that one, then that's why you chose it. Maybe that's the correct choice. You don't just get to play a deck with no bad matchups because you believe you're skilled and everyone playing aggro must be bad at the game.
The only way I enjoy HS lately is Arena. I stay up (or down) to rank 20-15, get my gold, abuse Arena. Usually I get ~300 gold to keep me running for 6 arenas. Still, it's really filled with mages. When you see a mage with 4 fireballs, or they cast portal into Tirion, or your opponent has 3x legendaries ( out of which one is KT and another DW :P )... but that's a conversation for another time :) .
By far too rush filled game. 60 legendaries in the game, can't make a deck that has more than 3 of them. If you have nothing to play by turn two, you're pretty much out of the game.
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Why bother playing classic control? Blizzard keeps on making strong early drops that are AOE resistant in hopes of slowing things down a bit. In reality, everyone just starts playing aggressive midrange decks like the new Zoo and Flamewaker Mage. Why play late game control when early game control/aggro is more consistent, cheaper, and more powerful? Late game minions are often overcosted, vulnerable to removal, and less mana efficient.
On the flip side, small minions like Flamewaker are decent value, sticky, mana efficient, the list goes on. Nobody would use Hex or Silence on it; it's also immune to BGH. This is why I like Patron Warrior. It's one of the few decks that counters most aggro decks, yet everyone still hates it.
To conclude, I think late game control is dead and gone right now, except for a few reliable decks. Again, why bother playing inefficient vulnerable minions late when you can play efficient, sticky minions early.
Rush does not equal aggro imo. I agree with u a 100%, I love playing control and getting to later stages of the game and winning over board control by making cool and somewhat complicated plays. But every deck that I play and love (Handlock/Midrange or dragon pally/and other control decks) wins in board control, but will then just get 20dmg-otk'ed or faced down by an actual aggro deck. And believe me, I'd rather even face Facehuntard these days than a grim patron warr/combodruid/oilrogue/... At least facehunter doesn't give me the illusion of winning until a certain turn. "Oh you should tech your deck and you will win ez you newb". Well, no, it's not enough. There's a great diversity of these decks. I've tried teching a LOT to make my control decks more prone to the meta by adding MCT, Loatheb to slow down combo, more taunts, more heals, more early/tempo orientated cards to keep up but at the end of the game I'm probably somewhere at 20 health with board but my opponent has some kind of gimmicky combo which otk's me. As soon as I start playing Midrange demonzoo or combodruid and rush them down myself I winstreak to rank 5 again, then I wanna play a control deck and I just losestreak a couple ranks back.
I'm not blaming the people who play these decks. "Don't hate the playa hate the game". I just can't help but to wonder what blizzard thinks about all this? Back when I played LoL competitively and some teams found a tactic that would make the game super boring or not fun at all everyone would play it for a while but then Riot made some significant changes to allow more diverse gameplay. Even though I think that a cardgame might be more hard to balance than a moba, it took blizzard 6 friggin months to nerf UT! If this meta is going to keep on for 6 months you'll just be seeing me in arena, if, at all.
There have been a lot of times I was pissed off because my control decks were getting beaten my facehunters, but at least I had fun games when I didn't get matched up against them. And a Kezan/Healbot tech doesn't even make that matchup so bad.
TL;DR: I don't like the only goal of a match to be getting big number of dmg on your opponent ASAP. And if you do try to play a control deck with just strong minions throughout the game, power plays and removal but no combo, you'll lose. At least arena still seems fun.
im tryharding with my pally cause im 34 wins from golden, and i played about 200 games in the last 9 days. mostly i saw hunters, zoo and mages. so yeah you could say the meta is pretty aggro oriented. why not counter it then? i went 13 wins in a row yesterday afternoon, all of those were hunters, zoos and mages. i didnt have godly rng, i just knew how to play vs them and what to expect. i know what to expect cause im saltier than reynad and my opp always has perfect card in hand, i just make sure i have the answer, or at least stall until i get a counter. i teched my deck from doing better vs control to become better vs aggro and flood with argus, mctech, jugglers, musters, kezan, healbot and stuff, and im doing pretty well, until i get <beaten> by rng at least
I used to agree with ya man. I'm the saltiest person I know and I keep tryhard playing Midrange pally/Handlock. But at a certain point it stops feeling like Godly RNG. Yeah my boombots both hit his face for 1 & 2 dmg while he has a juggler, 3/1, and some other stuff and his do the perfect numbers, yeah he topdecks whirlwind the only card that could've given him lethal, or he steals the only card on a board that could've saved him with 6 minions with mct/sylvanas, or other insane topdecks. But after a while I start to wonder if it's really RNG? I mean these decks still do what they do because of those combos who don't seem to be so rare as they pull them off every game. Maybe these decks have so many ways of cheesing you? Starting to lose my faith man, I got 100 more wins to go but I really want my golden pally ^^
im tryharding with my pally cause im 34 wins from golden, and i played about 200 games in the last 9 days. mostly i saw hunters, zoo and mages. so yeah you could say the meta is pretty aggro oriented. why not counter it then? i went 13 wins in a row yesterday afternoon, all of those were hunters, zoos and mages. i didnt have godly rng, i just knew how to play vs them and what to expect. i know what to expect cause im saltier than reynad and my opp always has perfect card in hand, i just make sure i have the answer, or at least stall until i get a counter. i teched my deck from doing better vs control to become better vs aggro and flood with argus, mctech, jugglers, musters, kezan, healbot and stuff, and im doing pretty well, until i get <beaten> by rng at least
I used to agree with ya man. I'm the saltiest person I know and I keep tryhard playing Midrange pally/Handlock. But at a certain point it stops feeling like Godly RNG. Yeah my boombots both hit his face for 1 & 2 dmg while he has a juggler, 3/1, and some other stuff and his do the perfect numbers, yeah he topdecks whirlwind the only card that could've given him lethal, or he steals the only card on a board that could've saved him with 6 minions with mct/sylvanas, or other insane topdecks. But after a while I start to wonder if it's really RNG? I mean these decks still do what they do because of those combos who don't seem to be so rare as they pull them off every game. Maybe these decks have so many ways of cheesing you? Starting to lose my faith man, I got 100 more wins to go but I really want my golden pally ^^
Sadly, you are rather correct, which is what makes some decks ..well.. powerful.
'Fair matches', that is games where both sides are about equal in power/tools/ext will mostly come down to an RNG match. YES, occasionally, you get those tough decisions, but in a card game, most times it's about the draw. Who gets wild growth in a druid match. Who has to use their removal first in warrior vs warrior. That sort of thing.
It's why you try to avoid fair matches. INSTEAD, what you want is something 'unfair'. That 'nitro fuel' in a car match. That special move in a fighting game. It's the "I can snipe you from 100 miles away" vs the "I can move so fast you can't hit me" fights. You want deck advantages over your opponent.
Tempo, for example, sets up their deck so that they tend to get constant pressure throughout the game. Their cards are good by themselves so every topdeck is a 'good card'. You can't just rush them early or wait them out because they are strong early and late game. That's what makes them unfair.
Combo, meanwhile, is the deck that lets you feel like your winning then BOOM, they win the game. They are setting up via their hand so it's harder to disrupt them. The surprise is also a bonus. That's their unfair trick.
Even control is meant to be 'unfair'. You think a warrior with 70 health is FAIR and BALANCED? #*$(# no! That's broken.
So look at your deck. What part of it is Unfair. What part of it would make a person run to the boards and scream "NERF!!!!!" If you don't have one, get one.
As far as RNG.. honestly, I always consider any point when I need to rely on RNG or lose a "failure state." WHen things are going the way I want my RNG should be a matter of "Do I win now or win later?" I should be able to have an advantage even if Dr. Boom's bots go 1 damage to the face. Sure, I consider a, RNG-or-bust win a win, but I'm not content with it. And if too many of my games end up that way then it's time to tweak my deck or playstyle. Same goes for all those other RNG results. A Great deck should allow me to take a lucky opponent's topdeck and keep going. A great deck can recover from a bad mulligan.
A great deck only seems like I topdecked that perfect whirlwind. however, I could've easily 'topdecked' a sludge 2 turns ago so that I wouldn't be in that situation ,or gotten that axe earlier on, or Unstable, or armorsmith to take the board from the start. you didn't get unlucky that I got my whirlwind. You got lucky for 5 turns by bypassing my good starts over and over and your luck just ran out.
Pally is in an odd spot. Their unfair deck, midrange, is facing counters now. Shockadin isn't stable enough with it's unfair card draw, and healadin is only unfair to control decks. Dragon is a tempo deck in need of an early game and a finisher and Paladin is the class that suffers most from not having much of both. Perhaps it just needs refining, but I can't help there since I don't have Tirion.
As for the other decks, PLAY them. Seriously, TRY them out and not just for one game. You'll see where it's stable and where it's not, and learn how to better stop them. You might also see what's lacking in your own deck.
And remember, EVERYONE has the same RNG issues you do. Everyone gets bad runs at times. Some people are still doing well. "lottery luck" isn't something you can blame after 3-5 months of the same thing.
im tryharding with my pally cause im 34 wins from golden, and i played about 200 games in the last 9 days. mostly i saw hunters, zoo and mages. so yeah you could say the meta is pretty aggro oriented. why not counter it then? i went 13 wins in a row yesterday afternoon, all of those were hunters, zoos and mages. i didnt have godly rng, i just knew how to play vs them and what to expect. i know what to expect cause im saltier than reynad and my opp always has perfect card in hand, i just make sure i have the answer, or at least stall until i get a counter. i teched my deck from doing better vs control to become better vs aggro and flood with argus, mctech, jugglers, musters, kezan, healbot and stuff, and im doing pretty well, until i get <beaten> by rng at least
I used to agree with ya man. I'm the saltiest person I know and I keep tryhard playing Midrange pally/Handlock. But at a certain point it stops feeling like Godly RNG. Yeah my boombots both hit his face for 1 & 2 dmg while he has a juggler, 3/1, and some other stuff and his do the perfect numbers, yeah he topdecks whirlwind the only card that could've given him lethal, or he steals the only card on a board that could've saved him with 6 minions with mct/sylvanas, or other insane topdecks. But after a while I start to wonder if it's really RNG? I mean these decks still do what they do because of those combos who don't seem to be so rare as they pull them off every game. Maybe these decks have so many ways of cheesing you? Starting to lose my faith man, I got 100 more wins to go but I really want my golden pally ^^
Sadly, you are rather correct, which is what makes some decks ..well.. powerful.
'Fair matches', that is games where both sides are about equal in power/tools/ext will mostly come down to an RNG match. YES, occasionally, you get those tough decisions, but in a card game, most times it's about the draw. Who gets wild growth in a druid match. Who has to use their removal first in warrior vs warrior. That sort of thing.
It's why you try to avoid fair matches. INSTEAD, what you want is something 'unfair'. That 'nitro fuel' in a car match. That special move in a fighting game. It's the "I can snipe you from 100 miles away" vs the "I can move so fast you can't hit me" fights. You want deck advantages over your opponent.
Tempo, for example, sets up their deck so that they tend to get constant pressure throughout the game. Their cards are good by themselves so every topdeck is a 'good card'. You can't just rush them early or wait them out because they are strong early and late game. That's what makes them unfair.
Combo, meanwhile, is the deck that lets you feel like your winning then BOOM, they win the game. They are setting up via their hand so it's harder to disrupt them. The surprise is also a bonus. That's their unfair trick.
Even control is meant to be 'unfair'. You think a warrior with 70 health is FAIR and BALANCED? #*$(# no! That's broken.
So look at your deck. What part of it is Unfair. What part of it would make a person run to the boards and scream "NERF!!!!!" If you don't have one, get one.
As far as RNG.. honestly, I always consider any point when I need to rely on RNG or lose a "failure state." WHen things are going the way I want my RNG should be a matter of "Do I win now or win later?" I should be able to have an advantage even if Dr. Boom's bots go 1 damage to the face. Sure, I consider a, RNG-or-bust win a win, but I'm not content with it. And if too many of my games end up that way then it's time to tweak my deck or playstyle. Same goes for all those other RNG results. A Great deck should allow me to take a lucky opponent's topdeck and keep going. A great deck can recover from a bad mulligan.
A great deck only seems like I topdecked that perfect whirlwind. however, I could've easily 'topdecked' a sludge 2 turns ago so that I wouldn't be in that situation ,or gotten that axe earlier on, or Unstable, or armorsmith to take the board from the start. you didn't get unlucky that I got my whirlwind. You got lucky for 5 turns by bypassing my good starts over and over and your luck just ran out.
Pally is in an odd spot. Their unfair deck, midrange, is facing counters now. Shockadin isn't stable enough with it's unfair card draw, and healadin is only unfair to control decks. Dragon is a tempo deck in need of an early game and a finisher and Paladin is the class that suffers most from not having much of both. Perhaps it just needs refining, but I can't help there since I don't have Tirion.
As for the other decks, PLAY them. Seriously, TRY them out and not just for one game. You'll see where it's stable and where it's not, and learn how to better stop them. You might also see what's lacking in your own deck.
And remember, EVERYONE has the same RNG issues you do. Everyone gets bad runs at times. Some people are still doing well. "lottery luck" isn't something you can blame after 3-5 months of the same thing.
I have to agree with you! It's not that paladin decks aren't good, pre BRM they were really popular, it's that the meta is really 'unfair' at the things they are weak at it seems. However I just changed my deck a bit more and I won a game against combodruid from a spot where I was at 2hp and he was at 20. (ended at 13hp or smth) I had some RNG as his Rag didn't snipe me when I was at 8 HP, and he didn't have his combo ready at turn 9 or 10 which would've killed me regardless of what play I would've made BUT I knew these things because I have played combo druid quite a lot and understand the deck. So I made the plays that would save me from every situation except the turn 9 force savage and was able to stabilize, heal twice, and get a taunt up for the rest of the game so he couldn't combo me down. Also, this time my Boombots hit more favorably than his but as you said everyone has the same chances with RNG. Thinking about it now I think I might've lost the game if the druid had a bit more luck but my deck changes and plays are making the chances a bit more even at least.
I've realised the same thing, what you said about the so called "lucky whirlwind topdeck", sometimes you've been playing in a game where you have been lucky all the time he wasn't drawing a certain card because you would've gotten #instashrekt right away. The best thing to do is to realise you're being lucky and take advantage of it instead of desperately trying to defend yourself against that scenario just like I saved my sludge for several turns against the druid because I guessed he probably didn't have the combo yet (which I read according to his playstyle, because I would've done the same plays as him if I didn't have the combo yet)
I loooove dragon paladin and I want to make it work, I've also played quite a lot of midrange demonzoo so I know not to waste an owl on a knife juggler and save it for a voidcaller into Mal'Ganis or 7/9 void terror instead. But if I'm really honest most decks are a bit more unfair than dragon paladin atm ^^ Won't give up on it quite yet though.
I still don't get this control purist mentality. As if playing 6, 7 and 8 drops is an indication of your worth as a player. Planning out just how many turns you've got as a Rogue until flurry combo, timing your secrets correctly as Aggro Mage/Hunter, or figuring out how to squeeze in damage as Zoo when a Freeze Mage has you under constant Nova are all tough. Noticing that a 5/4 trades favorably into a 3/5, not complicated. Recognizing that Turn 7 is a good time to play Boom, not complicated. If Control has some blowout play in a Control versus Aggro match, it's because the Aggro player screwed up and overextended, not because the Control player is a genius and recognized that a full board of X/2's is a good spot for Consecration. The point is, there's two sides to every game, and both the player playing slow and the one playing fast share equal accountability for the result.
Just yesterday, I was playing midrange Zoo against Freeze Mage. Not a favored matchup for Zoo, at all. He was at about 10 health with a secret down, and I had maybe 8 attack of minions on the board, including a Knife Juggler. I test the secret, Barrier doesn't pop, and it seems like I'm looking at at least another turn before I can pop Ice Block. What I am holding is a Doomguard, Implosion and a couple other cards. Implosion is considered mostly a dead card in that matchup. I could have discarded it to put down the Doomguard, broken Ice Block, and prayed for no Freeze next turn. Instead, I Implosion my OWN Imp Gang Boss to trigger 3 knives and break block. Next turn, Nova comes, and I put down Doomguard for lethal. Now from the control purist point of view, Freeze Mage is the one with skill because he is playing Control cards, and the Aggro player is the lucky one because his plays are obvious and he just topdecks exactly what he needs. But the aggro player in that spot is following the exact same principles as the Control player, using the lowest value cards necessary to resolve the situation. Sometimes it's obvious, sometimes it's not. But one type of deck isn't automatically more skill intensive, just because.
I have to agree with you! It's not that paladin decks aren't good, pre BRM they were really popular, it's that the meta is really 'unfair' at the things they are weak at it seems. However I just changed my deck a bit more and I won a game against combodruid from a spot where I was at 2hp and he was at 20. (ended at 13hp or smth) I had some RNG as his Rag didn't snipe me when I was at 8 HP, and he didn't have his combo ready at turn 9 or 10 which would've killed me regardless of what play I would've made BUT I knew these things because I have played combo druid quite a lot and understand the deck. So I made the plays that would save me from every situation except the turn 9 force savage and was able to stabilize, heal twice, and get a taunt up for the rest of the game so he couldn't combo me down. Also, this time my Boombots hit more favorably than his but as you said everyone has the same chances with RNG. Thinking about it now I think I might've lost the game if the druid had a bit more luck but my deck changes and plays are making the chances a bit more even at least.
Good job there. There's always going to be SOME luck in the game, of course. The trick is that most of your 'luck' should put the probability in your favor. For example, You that Rag was missing the face because you were flooding the board then that's a good situation, and even a loss would be 'ok' in my book. You just don't want EVERY win to come down that close. Most wins should be "Oh yeah, I had this unless they got STUPID lucky with that one swipe remaining out of 20 card topdeck."
For example, I had some control decks where I found that Rag was constantly being dropped into bad situations: 3 minions on the board and only one good target. Thus my Rags were all gamble shots that would've lost me if I had missed. Note that I tend to get those shots. Even that, once I noticed it, I dropped Rag. It meant not having those gamble wins from nowhere but I WANTED a card that either would give me a better chance than 1 out of 4 or help prevent that from happening. Rag goes in for decks where I need 8 damage from the hand and a big body and I don't give a #W*$(#* where it lands.
I've realised the same thing, what you said about the so called "lucky whirlwind topdeck", sometimes you've been playing in a game where you have been lucky all the time he wasn't drawing a certain card because you would've gotten #instashrekt right away. The best thing to do is to realise you're being lucky and take advantage of it instead of desperately trying to defend yourself against that scenario just like I saved my sludge for several turns against the druid because I guessed he probably didn't have the combo yet (which I read according to his playstyle, because I would've done the same plays as him if I didn't have the combo yet)
And THAT is the key to the 'in game skill' here. This isn't SC where every move is based on skill. Instead, it's small tweaks that turns a bad situation into a managable one, or turns, as in your case, what looks like a desperate struggle into a turnaround. If you hadn't noticed that, yo uwouldn't went the whole game feeling behind and unlucky since the druid "was always ahead of you with a combo waiting in the wings."
I loooove dragon paladin and I want to make it work, I've also played quite a lot of midrange demonzoo so I know not to waste an owl on a knife juggler and save it for a voidcaller into Mal'Ganis or 7/9 void terror instead. But if I'm really honest most decks are a bit more unfair than dragon paladin atm ^^ Won't give up on it quite yet though.
Thx for the advice!
I'm thinking that the best chance for dragon paladin is to make it a TEmpo deck. Take the non-dragon card slots and put it towards your early game. Make it so that in most games you are either in locki step with an aggro deck for the board or have taken tempo from other decks. Instead of board wipes you don't have time for, focus on being aggressive. That way you don't have to spend a turn Equal/concing and can focus more on getting those dragon cards out. Once you get to around turn 5 and you have the board, the game is yours since those dragons be powerful YO!.
As far as finishers, Tempo decks rely on snowballs. The SECOND the opponent fails to keep up, you now have 2-3 powers threats on the board and the ability to keep pumping more or defend what you have. And EVERY threat is a THREAT that can kill the opponent. It honestly just takes 1 5-attack minion who's free to hit he face to end the game FAST. And if they hold out till late game, the opponent won't have the strength to fight Tirion and 2 dragons (and they aren't control since control wouldn't have survived that long ;)).
I'm thinking that the best chance for dragon paladin is to make it a TEmpo deck. Take the non-dragon card slots and put it towards your early game. Make it so that in most games you are either in locki step with an aggro deck for the board or have taken tempo from other decks. Instead of board wipes you don't have time for, focus on being aggressive. That way you don't have to spend a turn Equal/concing and can focus more on getting those dragon cards out. Once you get to around turn 5 and you have the board, the game is yours since those dragons be powerful YO!.
As far as finishers, Tempo decks rely on snowballs. The SECOND the opponent fails to keep up, you now have 2-3 powers threats on the board and the ability to keep pumping more or defend what you have. And EVERY threat is a THREAT that can kill the opponent. It honestly just takes 1 5-attack minion who's free to hit he face to end the game FAST. And if they hold out till late game, the opponent won't have the strength to fight Tirion and 2 dragons (and they aren't control since control wouldn't have survived that long ;)).
Wow.. I took your advice, made a tempo dragon deck where I removed most things that weren't dragon related and added a lot of dragon cards (I used to swap out dragon cards to make it more like midrange pala, but that just ended up making it a shitty version of midrange) and well, I don't know what to say xD I've been playing and testing dragon pala ever since the season started and this first version of the deck is probably the best deck I've made so far :D I've faced 2 combo druids whom I easily CRUSHED, a priests who was dead by turn 6, 1 control warrior who I was able to beat after some mild struggle, a grim patron warrior who rekt me turn 6 with some crazy hand and I just beat facehunter without even drawing my heal! I wonder how it performs against demonzoo.
I think I've found the loophole that could make dragon pally viable in this meta! People usually do not trade in most games, they just attack your face or only reveal a minion when they feel like it (druid). You can really abuse this by trading in your board and popping up some volcanic drakes + a solemn warning. I didn't expect these cards to do as good as they did but it's actually rather easy to set up these plays!
I'm definitely going to post this deck on hearthpwn if it continues to perform as well as it is ^^
Edit: Just got rekt by a priest who was able to keep healing & buffing his injured blademaster and a zoo was a bit too fast for me :( As expected there's still room for improvement.
It used to be that trades happened all the time - then a ton of new deathrattle minions cropped up (first in Naxx, then in GvG) which made it so that trading was frequently a waste. The discount for kill cards are very much meant to nudge people back towards trading (either to cash in their own discount or to prevent their opponent from getting a discount).
It used to be that trades happened all the time - then a ton of new deathrattle minions cropped up (first in Naxx, then in GvG) which made it so that trading was frequently a waste. The discount for kill cards are very much meant to nudge people back towards trading (either to cash in their own discount or to prevent their opponent from getting a discount).
Deathrattle really isn't what amde trading everything a poor bet. Better play and more refined decks changed a lot as well. Trading isn't something you just simply do whenever you can kill a minion.
A way to think of it is..well.. as others describe: It's a race. I'm trying to kill you faster than you can kill me. When the game starts the race starts and both sides need to evaluate whether they are ahead in said race: that is, if we all just went FACE FACE FACE who dies first. Whoever could make the kill first has Tempo and is the aggressor.
If that person is you, the LAST thing you want to do is trade. You're ahead on the race. You want ot..well.. race.
So what does the defender do? Die.
..kidding...
The real idea is that winning the race depends on Tempo, the ability to threaten your opponent. Tempo is gained by board advantage, and board advantage is gained by card advantage.
Now if you already have Tempo (i.e. aggro decks) you are already set and done. If you don't have Tempo, you're attempting to pull board/card advantage and using it to steal Tempo away from the opponent. You use a Consecration to kill 4 of their minions, while Sludge belcher draws out spell and another minion. Eventually, you end up in a positon where they are topdecking and you are dropping 2-3 cards a turn of MUCh higher worth than what they have. Eventually, you can do 10 damage a turn while they can do 2. Now you have Tempo, and good luck for them getting it back in time.
This is why simple board wipes and taunts don't stop aggro. Sure they give you card advantage, but after you have all of your cards can you put down a board strong enough to outrace your opponent, or will you sit with a weak 3 damager sludge belcher that no one really fears at turn 6? Even if it was pre-Naxx and that was a Tazdingo, why would I want to trade that when any ONE of my remaining minions could do the same damage back at you?
Now make that a Tazdingo combined with a Loatheb. Now I'm seeing 8 damage per turn on the board while I can do 5 at best a turn. If it's a case where you can kill me with that before I can kill you then you have Tempo and I sure a #*$(# am going to trade now.
"So why, back in the day, people would drop 2 drops then trade into them all day?" Two reasons:
1. We feared a spell based counter that would result in losing Tempo. I drop a 3/2, you drop a 3/2, I hit face, you frost bolt me and now I'm losing the race. To avoid that we traded instead. Now if I felt that i had a good enough follow up threat if you frost bolted or if I felt you didn't have one, I had no reaason to trade and could just hit the face. If you felt the same way, you had no reason to trade either. And so both hit the face until either one person could win Tempo with a trick move like a taunt or a spell or someone feared it enough to trade and 'reset' the board.
2. We were foolish and focused too much on board clears than actual Tempo.
Bah, back in the day you saw a lot of "I drop a 3/2, you respond with frost bolt and end turn". THAT was poor play if you had a 2 drop as well since you can't gain Tempo that way or even Advantage. People learned and stopped doing that unless they had a GOOD reason, like no 2 drops or they felt your move was a setup for something nasty (juggler 2 drop from a Paladin).
Sidenote: the issue with advantage use is that there's a 'lag' to it. It takes time for a card advantage to turn into a board advantage, and board advantage to turn into Tempo. During that time, you're going to take damage. That's what taunts and heals are for: to give time for advantage to work through its lag. Consecrate at turn 4 for card advantage, Sludge turn 5, Healbot turn 6, then by turn 7 you should have the board. Drop a Dr. Boom and, assuming the Sludge is alive (and probably silenced) you have 12 damage on the board+ whatever the boom bots can do. You now have Tempo. It also assumes that you will eventually stop looking for trades/advantage and start focusing on fighting back for Tempo. At some point, you need to count your side and theirs, realize you can kill him faster than he kill you, and stop trading. At some point, you need to go for that face.
I think I've found the loophole that could make dragon pally viable in this meta! People usually do not trade in most games, they just attack your face or only reveal a minion when they feel like it (druid). You can really abuse this by trading in your board and popping up some volcanic drakes + a solemn warning. I didn't expect these cards to do as good as they did but it's actually rather easy to set up these plays!
Another example. The drake allowed the card advantage trade up to turn into a board advantage+additional card advantage swing. If both boards are clear, you now have 6 damage in front of them and possibly Tempo. Next turn, they trade down the drake with a spell and drop their minions. You then drop more damage vs them. If they try for the face, you heal, drop more, go face, and show that you can out race him. Now he needs to trade to win.. or not and lose.
The key is NOT trading to win. Trading is just a means to an end. The key is Tempo. Either learn how to get it early and keep it or learn how to steal Advantage then stall into a swing to steal it from them. But either way, stop thinking that the game starts and ends at Equality/Consecreate.
you cant adapt when you dont know how the matchmaking system will screw you over. i had a quest for 5 wins with warrior today and i picked my control warrior guess what 5 consecutive druids and 1 thief priest.
i feel the same way as you but for different reasons. Since BRM released i havent played much if not at all. Games supposed to be fun, if HS isnt fun for you anymore take a break for a while.
In this case you know that control warrior is might not be the best choice at the time. If you only play a few games a day, then you have no chance to adapt, but if you can do longer sessions, this is what you do. Play a few games, see what it is out there and then go from there.
I think the meta is actually at one of the slowest points of Hearthstone history.
That being said, I think people's mentality have changed a little bit.
I see more and more people choose to go face when they're presented with choices. Even Priests go face these day when they think they have lethal next turn. People used to get punished really hard if they ignore their opponent's board but with introductions of sticky RNG deathrattle cards like Piloted Shredder and Dr. Boom, it's getting harder and harder to punish players who just go face.
Blizzard probably thought the same thing when they introduced cards like Volcanic Drake and Solemn Vigil, but it's still not enough. I hope to see a card with similar mechanics, but does healing instead. For example, a 4 mana card that heals for 10 and costs (1) less for each minion died this turn, or something like that.
Meta changes the moment you switch your deck.
while such a card would be neat and welcome, cards like healbot already do well to punish such moves. I know I've seen in other players, performed for myself, and even suffered to a healbot after a face slam. The game is basically over then.
When I play my double healbot ramp druid, it does very well against hunters. Same goes for my chinese priest. WHen I play hunter though, I just see people trying to put down 1 taunt at a time and using spells to pick off minions without trying to hold the board. Or else are running greedy control decks because they so want to use 3 dragons and Rag.
One does not simply walk into Mordor,
unless they want to be the best they can be.
Aggro is essential to the balance of game. Without it, the meta would degenerate into mindless legend/giant trading and the game would be predictable and boring for the short time people continued to play it. If your deck can't deal with aggro then it isn't a good deck. If you can't come up with a deck that can endure the aggro in the meta with a positive overall win rate then you aren't a very good player.
Free to try and find a game, dealing cards for sorrow, cards for pain.
What I'm continually astonished by is the high number of people who think they need to win every single game. You don't. You just need to have a higher than 50% win rate against the set of players who queue up against you on ladder, and you will gain ranks.
Say you're playing Oil Rogue. Ok, you've got no play on board until at least Turn 3. Killing a Leper Gnome with dagger will probably get you low enough to be killed by Face Hunter. You pretty much have to draw Backstab in the first 3 turns and hope Face Hunter is on a less than perfect draw in order to win that game. Where's all the anger coming from when you lose that matchup? Move to the next game and farm Patron Warriors, Midrange Hunters, Paladins and Priests. If you had your pick of any deck and you chose that one, then that's why you chose it. Maybe that's the correct choice. You don't just get to play a deck with no bad matchups because you believe you're skilled and everyone playing aggro must be bad at the game.
The only way I enjoy HS lately is Arena. I stay up (or down) to rank 20-15, get my gold, abuse Arena. Usually I get ~300 gold to keep me running for 6 arenas. Still, it's really filled with mages. When you see a mage with 4 fireballs, or they cast portal into Tirion, or your opponent has 3x legendaries ( out of which one is KT and another DW :P )... but that's a conversation for another time :) .
By far too rush filled game. 60 legendaries in the game, can't make a deck that has more than 3 of them. If you have nothing to play by turn two, you're pretty much out of the game.
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Why bother playing classic control? Blizzard keeps on making strong early drops that are AOE resistant in hopes of slowing things down a bit. In reality, everyone just starts playing aggressive midrange decks like the new Zoo and Flamewaker Mage. Why play late game control when early game control/aggro is more consistent, cheaper, and more powerful? Late game minions are often overcosted, vulnerable to removal, and less mana efficient.
On the flip side, small minions like Flamewaker are decent value, sticky, mana efficient, the list goes on. Nobody would use Hex or Silence on it; it's also immune to BGH. This is why I like Patron Warrior. It's one of the few decks that counters most aggro decks, yet everyone still hates it.
To conclude, I think late game control is dead and gone right now, except for a few reliable decks. Again, why bother playing inefficient vulnerable minions late when you can play efficient, sticky minions early.
Shaku, the Collector gave me the Plague
Rush does not equal aggro imo. I agree with u a 100%, I love playing control and getting to later stages of the game and winning over board control by making cool and somewhat complicated plays. But every deck that I play and love (Handlock/Midrange or dragon pally/and other control decks) wins in board control, but will then just get 20dmg-otk'ed or faced down by an actual aggro deck. And believe me, I'd rather even face Facehuntard these days than a grim patron warr/combodruid/oilrogue/... At least facehunter doesn't give me the illusion of winning until a certain turn. "Oh you should tech your deck and you will win ez you newb". Well, no, it's not enough. There's a great diversity of these decks. I've tried teching a LOT to make my control decks more prone to the meta by adding MCT, Loatheb to slow down combo, more taunts, more heals, more early/tempo orientated cards to keep up but at the end of the game I'm probably somewhere at 20 health with board but my opponent has some kind of gimmicky combo which otk's me. As soon as I start playing Midrange demonzoo or combodruid and rush them down myself I winstreak to rank 5 again, then I wanna play a control deck and I just losestreak a couple ranks back.
I'm not blaming the people who play these decks. "Don't hate the playa hate the game". I just can't help but to wonder what blizzard thinks about all this? Back when I played LoL competitively and some teams found a tactic that would make the game super boring or not fun at all everyone would play it for a while but then Riot made some significant changes to allow more diverse gameplay. Even though I think that a cardgame might be more hard to balance than a moba, it took blizzard 6 friggin months to nerf UT! If this meta is going to keep on for 6 months you'll just be seeing me in arena, if, at all.
There have been a lot of times I was pissed off because my control decks were getting beaten my facehunters, but at least I had fun games when I didn't get matched up against them. And a Kezan/Healbot tech doesn't even make that matchup so bad.
TL;DR: I don't like the only goal of a match to be getting big number of dmg on your opponent ASAP. And if you do try to play a control deck with just strong minions throughout the game, power plays and removal but no combo, you'll lose. At least arena still seems fun.
Dedicated to making Dragon Paladin work
I used to agree with ya man. I'm the saltiest person I know and I keep tryhard playing Midrange pally/Handlock. But at a certain point it stops feeling like Godly RNG. Yeah my boombots both hit his face for 1 & 2 dmg while he has a juggler, 3/1, and some other stuff and his do the perfect numbers, yeah he topdecks whirlwind the only card that could've given him lethal, or he steals the only card on a board that could've saved him with 6 minions with mct/sylvanas, or other insane topdecks. But after a while I start to wonder if it's really RNG? I mean these decks still do what they do because of those combos who don't seem to be so rare as they pull them off every game. Maybe these decks have so many ways of cheesing you? Starting to lose my faith man, I got 100 more wins to go but I really want my golden pally ^^
Dedicated to making Dragon Paladin work
Well, I tried out face hunter, but only in casual
Idk how everyone else is having so much success but face hunting doesnt feel reliable enough to do ladder with
maybe my draws just suck or they have a million healbots and taunts
Sadly, you are rather correct, which is what makes some decks ..well.. powerful.
'Fair matches', that is games where both sides are about equal in power/tools/ext will mostly come down to an RNG match. YES, occasionally, you get those tough decisions, but in a card game, most times it's about the draw. Who gets wild growth in a druid match. Who has to use their removal first in warrior vs warrior. That sort of thing.
It's why you try to avoid fair matches. INSTEAD, what you want is something 'unfair'. That 'nitro fuel' in a car match. That special move in a fighting game. It's the "I can snipe you from 100 miles away" vs the "I can move so fast you can't hit me" fights. You want deck advantages over your opponent.
Tempo, for example, sets up their deck so that they tend to get constant pressure throughout the game. Their cards are good by themselves so every topdeck is a 'good card'. You can't just rush them early or wait them out because they are strong early and late game. That's what makes them unfair.
Combo, meanwhile, is the deck that lets you feel like your winning then BOOM, they win the game. They are setting up via their hand so it's harder to disrupt them. The surprise is also a bonus. That's their unfair trick.
Even control is meant to be 'unfair'. You think a warrior with 70 health is FAIR and BALANCED? #*$(# no! That's broken.
So look at your deck. What part of it is Unfair. What part of it would make a person run to the boards and scream "NERF!!!!!" If you don't have one, get one.
As far as RNG.. honestly, I always consider any point when I need to rely on RNG or lose a "failure state." WHen things are going the way I want my RNG should be a matter of "Do I win now or win later?" I should be able to have an advantage even if Dr. Boom's bots go 1 damage to the face. Sure, I consider a, RNG-or-bust win a win, but I'm not content with it. And if too many of my games end up that way then it's time to tweak my deck or playstyle. Same goes for all those other RNG results. A Great deck should allow me to take a lucky opponent's topdeck and keep going. A great deck can recover from a bad mulligan.
A great deck only seems like I topdecked that perfect whirlwind. however, I could've easily 'topdecked' a sludge 2 turns ago so that I wouldn't be in that situation ,or gotten that axe earlier on, or Unstable, or armorsmith to take the board from the start. you didn't get unlucky that I got my whirlwind. You got lucky for 5 turns by bypassing my good starts over and over and your luck just ran out.
Pally is in an odd spot. Their unfair deck, midrange, is facing counters now. Shockadin isn't stable enough with it's unfair card draw, and healadin is only unfair to control decks. Dragon is a tempo deck in need of an early game and a finisher and Paladin is the class that suffers most from not having much of both. Perhaps it just needs refining, but I can't help there since I don't have Tirion.
As for the other decks, PLAY them. Seriously, TRY them out and not just for one game. You'll see where it's stable and where it's not, and learn how to better stop them. You might also see what's lacking in your own deck.
And remember, EVERYONE has the same RNG issues you do. Everyone gets bad runs at times. Some people are still doing well. "lottery luck" isn't something you can blame after 3-5 months of the same thing.
One does not simply walk into Mordor,
unless they want to be the best they can be.
I have to agree with you! It's not that paladin decks aren't good, pre BRM they were really popular, it's that the meta is really 'unfair' at the things they are weak at it seems. However I just changed my deck a bit more and I won a game against combodruid from a spot where I was at 2hp and he was at 20. (ended at 13hp or smth) I had some RNG as his Rag didn't snipe me when I was at 8 HP, and he didn't have his combo ready at turn 9 or 10 which would've killed me regardless of what play I would've made BUT I knew these things because I have played combo druid quite a lot and understand the deck. So I made the plays that would save me from every situation except the turn 9 force savage and was able to stabilize, heal twice, and get a taunt up for the rest of the game so he couldn't combo me down. Also, this time my Boombots hit more favorably than his but as you said everyone has the same chances with RNG. Thinking about it now I think I might've lost the game if the druid had a bit more luck but my deck changes and plays are making the chances a bit more even at least.
I've realised the same thing, what you said about the so called "lucky whirlwind topdeck", sometimes you've been playing in a game where you have been lucky all the time he wasn't drawing a certain card because you would've gotten #instashrekt right away. The best thing to do is to realise you're being lucky and take advantage of it instead of desperately trying to defend yourself against that scenario just like I saved my sludge for several turns against the druid because I guessed he probably didn't have the combo yet (which I read according to his playstyle, because I would've done the same plays as him if I didn't have the combo yet)
I loooove dragon paladin and I want to make it work, I've also played quite a lot of midrange demonzoo so I know not to waste an owl on a knife juggler and save it for a voidcaller into Mal'Ganis or 7/9 void terror instead. But if I'm really honest most decks are a bit more unfair than dragon paladin atm ^^ Won't give up on it quite yet though.
Thx for the advice!
Dedicated to making Dragon Paladin work
I still don't get this control purist mentality. As if playing 6, 7 and 8 drops is an indication of your worth as a player. Planning out just how many turns you've got as a Rogue until flurry combo, timing your secrets correctly as Aggro Mage/Hunter, or figuring out how to squeeze in damage as Zoo when a Freeze Mage has you under constant Nova are all tough. Noticing that a 5/4 trades favorably into a 3/5, not complicated. Recognizing that Turn 7 is a good time to play Boom, not complicated. If Control has some blowout play in a Control versus Aggro match, it's because the Aggro player screwed up and overextended, not because the Control player is a genius and recognized that a full board of X/2's is a good spot for Consecration. The point is, there's two sides to every game, and both the player playing slow and the one playing fast share equal accountability for the result.
Just yesterday, I was playing midrange Zoo against Freeze Mage. Not a favored matchup for Zoo, at all. He was at about 10 health with a secret down, and I had maybe 8 attack of minions on the board, including a Knife Juggler. I test the secret, Barrier doesn't pop, and it seems like I'm looking at at least another turn before I can pop Ice Block. What I am holding is a Doomguard, Implosion and a couple other cards. Implosion is considered mostly a dead card in that matchup. I could have discarded it to put down the Doomguard, broken Ice Block, and prayed for no Freeze next turn. Instead, I Implosion my OWN Imp Gang Boss to trigger 3 knives and break block. Next turn, Nova comes, and I put down Doomguard for lethal. Now from the control purist point of view, Freeze Mage is the one with skill because he is playing Control cards, and the Aggro player is the lucky one because his plays are obvious and he just topdecks exactly what he needs. But the aggro player in that spot is following the exact same principles as the Control player, using the lowest value cards necessary to resolve the situation. Sometimes it's obvious, sometimes it's not. But one type of deck isn't automatically more skill intensive, just because.
Good job there. There's always going to be SOME luck in the game, of course. The trick is that most of your 'luck' should put the probability in your favor. For example, You that Rag was missing the face because you were flooding the board then that's a good situation, and even a loss would be 'ok' in my book. You just don't want EVERY win to come down that close. Most wins should be "Oh yeah, I had this unless they got STUPID lucky with that one swipe remaining out of 20 card topdeck."
For example, I had some control decks where I found that Rag was constantly being dropped into bad situations: 3 minions on the board and only one good target. Thus my Rags were all gamble shots that would've lost me if I had missed. Note that I tend to get those shots. Even that, once I noticed it, I dropped Rag. It meant not having those gamble wins from nowhere but I WANTED a card that either would give me a better chance than 1 out of 4 or help prevent that from happening. Rag goes in for decks where I need 8 damage from the hand and a big body and I don't give a #W*$(#* where it lands.
And THAT is the key to the 'in game skill' here. This isn't SC where every move is based on skill. Instead, it's small tweaks that turns a bad situation into a managable one, or turns, as in your case, what looks like a desperate struggle into a turnaround. If you hadn't noticed that, yo uwouldn't went the whole game feeling behind and unlucky since the druid "was always ahead of you with a combo waiting in the wings."
I'm thinking that the best chance for dragon paladin is to make it a TEmpo deck. Take the non-dragon card slots and put it towards your early game. Make it so that in most games you are either in locki step with an aggro deck for the board or have taken tempo from other decks. Instead of board wipes you don't have time for, focus on being aggressive. That way you don't have to spend a turn Equal/concing and can focus more on getting those dragon cards out. Once you get to around turn 5 and you have the board, the game is yours since those dragons be powerful YO!.
As far as finishers, Tempo decks rely on snowballs. The SECOND the opponent fails to keep up, you now have 2-3 powers threats on the board and the ability to keep pumping more or defend what you have. And EVERY threat is a THREAT that can kill the opponent. It honestly just takes 1 5-attack minion who's free to hit he face to end the game FAST. And if they hold out till late game, the opponent won't have the strength to fight Tirion and 2 dragons (and they aren't control since control wouldn't have survived that long ;)).
One does not simply walk into Mordor,
unless they want to be the best they can be.
Wow.. I took your advice, made a tempo dragon deck where I removed most things that weren't dragon related and added a lot of dragon cards (I used to swap out dragon cards to make it more like midrange pala, but that just ended up making it a shitty version of midrange) and well, I don't know what to say xD I've been playing and testing dragon pala ever since the season started and this first version of the deck is probably the best deck I've made so far :D I've faced 2 combo druids whom I easily CRUSHED, a priests who was dead by turn 6, 1 control warrior who I was able to beat after some mild struggle, a grim patron warrior who rekt me turn 6 with some crazy hand and I just beat facehunter without even drawing my heal! I wonder how it performs against demonzoo.
I think I've found the loophole that could make dragon pally viable in this meta! People usually do not trade in most games, they just attack your face or only reveal a minion when they feel like it (druid). You can really abuse this by trading in your board and popping up some volcanic drakes + a solemn warning. I didn't expect these cards to do as good as they did but it's actually rather easy to set up these plays!
I'm definitely going to post this deck on hearthpwn if it continues to perform as well as it is ^^
Edit: Just got rekt by a priest who was able to keep healing & buffing his injured blademaster and a zoo was a bit too fast for me :( As expected there's still room for improvement.
Dedicated to making Dragon Paladin work
It used to be that trades happened all the time - then a ton of new deathrattle minions cropped up (first in Naxx, then in GvG) which made it so that trading was frequently a waste. The discount for kill cards are very much meant to nudge people back towards trading (either to cash in their own discount or to prevent their opponent from getting a discount).
Deathrattle really isn't what amde trading everything a poor bet. Better play and more refined decks changed a lot as well. Trading isn't something you just simply do whenever you can kill a minion.
A way to think of it is..well.. as others describe: It's a race. I'm trying to kill you faster than you can kill me. When the game starts the race starts and both sides need to evaluate whether they are ahead in said race: that is, if we all just went FACE FACE FACE who dies first. Whoever could make the kill first has Tempo and is the aggressor.
If that person is you, the LAST thing you want to do is trade. You're ahead on the race. You want ot..well.. race.
So what does the defender do? Die.
..kidding...
The real idea is that winning the race depends on Tempo, the ability to threaten your opponent. Tempo is gained by board advantage, and board advantage is gained by card advantage.
Now if you already have Tempo (i.e. aggro decks) you are already set and done. If you don't have Tempo, you're attempting to pull board/card advantage and using it to steal Tempo away from the opponent. You use a Consecration to kill 4 of their minions, while Sludge belcher draws out spell and another minion. Eventually, you end up in a positon where they are topdecking and you are dropping 2-3 cards a turn of MUCh higher worth than what they have. Eventually, you can do 10 damage a turn while they can do 2. Now you have Tempo, and good luck for them getting it back in time.
This is why simple board wipes and taunts don't stop aggro. Sure they give you card advantage, but after you have all of your cards can you put down a board strong enough to outrace your opponent, or will you sit with a weak 3 damager sludge belcher that no one really fears at turn 6? Even if it was pre-Naxx and that was a Tazdingo, why would I want to trade that when any ONE of my remaining minions could do the same damage back at you?
Now make that a Tazdingo combined with a Loatheb. Now I'm seeing 8 damage per turn on the board while I can do 5 at best a turn. If it's a case where you can kill me with that before I can kill you then you have Tempo and I sure a #*$(# am going to trade now.
"So why, back in the day, people would drop 2 drops then trade into them all day?" Two reasons:
1. We feared a spell based counter that would result in losing Tempo. I drop a 3/2, you drop a 3/2, I hit face, you frost bolt me and now I'm losing the race. To avoid that we traded instead. Now if I felt that i had a good enough follow up threat if you frost bolted or if I felt you didn't have one, I had no reaason to trade and could just hit the face. If you felt the same way, you had no reason to trade either. And so both hit the face until either one person could win Tempo with a trick move like a taunt or a spell or someone feared it enough to trade and 'reset' the board.
2. We were foolish and focused too much on board clears than actual Tempo.
Bah, back in the day you saw a lot of "I drop a 3/2, you respond with frost bolt and end turn". THAT was poor play if you had a 2 drop as well since you can't gain Tempo that way or even Advantage. People learned and stopped doing that unless they had a GOOD reason, like no 2 drops or they felt your move was a setup for something nasty (juggler 2 drop from a Paladin).
Sidenote: the issue with advantage use is that there's a 'lag' to it. It takes time for a card advantage to turn into a board advantage, and board advantage to turn into Tempo. During that time, you're going to take damage. That's what taunts and heals are for: to give time for advantage to work through its lag. Consecrate at turn 4 for card advantage, Sludge turn 5, Healbot turn 6, then by turn 7 you should have the board. Drop a Dr. Boom and, assuming the Sludge is alive (and probably silenced) you have 12 damage on the board+ whatever the boom bots can do. You now have Tempo. It also assumes that you will eventually stop looking for trades/advantage and start focusing on fighting back for Tempo. At some point, you need to count your side and theirs, realize you can kill him faster than he kill you, and stop trading. At some point, you need to go for that face.
Another example. The drake allowed the card advantage trade up to turn into a board advantage+additional card advantage swing. If both boards are clear, you now have 6 damage in front of them and possibly Tempo. Next turn, they trade down the drake with a spell and drop their minions. You then drop more damage vs them. If they try for the face, you heal, drop more, go face, and show that you can out race him. Now he needs to trade to win.. or not and lose.
The key is NOT trading to win. Trading is just a means to an end. The key is Tempo. Either learn how to get it early and keep it or learn how to steal Advantage then stall into a swing to steal it from them. But either way, stop thinking that the game starts and ends at Equality/Consecreate.
One does not simply walk into Mordor,
unless they want to be the best they can be.
infact we better stop using the term meta, it's always rush and never changes, I see no use of the word meta anymore.