I've noticed the same trend. Decks that kept me hovering in the midst of Rank 5 are just getting washed away by decks that seem equipped to erase every minion before they have a chance to attack. Is there any counter to bad luck? I was successful with Midrange TO ARMS Pally, and the Shockadin style Pally until about a week ago. They're both in the tank lately. I've moved over to Shaman, and I'm getting smoked playing decks that seemed to be "legendary" two weeks ago.
I'm willing to admit I'm not that great at Hearthstone. I've never made it to legend, and I've been playing since its release. But sometimes I wonder if the people at the top are just "luckier" than me, or can somehow see the cards in my hand. It's frustrating to just watch every minion die without the other play suffering any consequence.
I struggled a lot with Paladin this last week before switching to Druid which has been doing very well. I think the problem might have to do with the rise of Rogues and midrange Hunters. Rogues can just kill everything over and over and the new Hunter (which really is a lot like the old hunter), can pressure your with good minions early and then start dropping hay-makers. Paladins aren't really that well equipped to fight either of those strategies, preferring grindier control matchups or aggro where they can kill squishy minions.
I am curious what are Paladin deck are you playing, I cant get past rank 10 now, last week I was hovering around rank 5, dropped to 11 and stabilized at 10. About 20 games later I am still 10. Still the same midrange pally deck, but 1 quartermaster and 2 sludge, to slow down aggro.
Dropping to 11 from 5 is insane, and it doesn't look to me like your deck is the primary reason for it. It's not the Paladin I like right now (I think Harrison is a weak choice for Paladin in this meta and I also like healbot), but it doesn't seem unreasonable and I've been floating between ranks 5 and 4 for a while.
Maybe you could talk about your results against the various decks you encounter? I don't know if you use something like hearthstats.com to keep track of your win / loss ratio vs different classes, but it could be useful to know if you're struggling against any deck in particular (I have a hard time vs Mech Mage and Combo Druid, but > 50% win ratios against almost everything else)
Control Priests beat me every time they outlast my early rush and then start clearing the board mind control usually ends it, Control warrior is close, Druids I win if I can rush them otherwise lose once we get to late game, Oil Rogue mostly loss maybe 1-2 wins against them, Ice Mage I can usually beat but long games, mech mage depends on draw if I get good early 3 turns I can usually win otherwise lose, face hunter or midrange hunter just depends on the first 3 turns, a lot of shamans around 10 these last 2 days and once they get feral spirits out they kill my tempo and then usually take over from there, warlocks haven't seen much and can usually win. Thats my expereience, I feel that aggor decks are beatable but just depends on the draw, while anything that can survive till turn 10 becomes war of attrition.
I feel I cant establish board control and have no effective removals once they do, things like mind control, hexs, big taunts, or rouge burst are killers. And even if I establish control by turn 6-7 they all have 1 card they can play to reset it, while I need 2.
In fact now that I think about it , it seems that mass removals are my problem, followed by ability to get rid of tirion, dr boom, sylvanas easily. I feel that Paladin needs board presence and as long as the opponent can effectively clear it there is little I can do.
I just wanted to pop in and tell you that you are correct. Paladin does have weakness's and if you are playing the more common midrange style anything forcing you into super late game is likely to beat you. The problem is many of the class's you are doing poorly against are class's that were weak or still not considered top tier in the meta.
Basically any deck that was extremely successful and floods the meta is inevitably going to give rise to a whole bunch of decks built around beating it. Paladin got so popular on ladder that people teched to defeat it. Once people give up on paladin and the meta shifts paladin will be good again. If you refuse to play anything but paladin it does not mean you will not be successful but you will almost certainly have to find a less traditional build in order to do so.
Thanks for that, I have tried oil rogue and hunter but dont enjoy the playstyle, priest is too slow and passive for my liking, I like my minions:) I guess druid or shaman are the way to go?
Playing a different deck is always a decent answer when the meta hates your current one. I can pretty much guarantee some variant of druid will always be playable. Its really just about what you like and want to do. I do not want you to think that you should not play your paladin deck at all as necessity is the father of innovation and being forced to change a deck to be successful is what leads to the decks you see everyone copying today. You may just come up with a good new successful paladin deck if that is what you really want to do anyway.
I would say that Tempo Paladin, which is what most of the current Paladins are IMO, is not that strong. First off, I'd say it's Tempo and not Midrange because the minion curve is rather flat, and its really just control Paladin, with a few late game cards switched out for early game minions and spells and because Mustard is a card that is nearly the definition of Tempo in this game. Most of the spells are the same and there is still the common stack of minions at 5 mana of a standard control Paladin. To be a true Midrange it would need more 3 and 4 mana minions.
Second, due to Paladin being rather weak pre-GvG, I think many people had built up an urge to play Paladin. Due to GvG making it better and netdecking it got huge popularity. This has the effect of everyone getting much experience in how to beat it and also decks that beat the current most played will naturally rise to the top.
Same thing a few days ago for me. Although I was playing a control Classic Paladin, it was struggling, so many mech mages. Changed to a self created Divine Shield deck, just messing around trying to find creative ways to beat mech mage. It actually did pretty good for a while, specifically against mech mage. If every minion has Divine Shield, they either have to ping tons of shields or trade into shields. Either one is pretty bad for mech mage. A few pings on Divine Shield isn't usually bad for ping classes, but if they have to ping every single turn it is a huge tempo loss, and if they have to use minions to pop the shields, even better as your getting max value out of the shields. Also I know everyone says Hammer is bad, but only because Mechwarper, I added one. Still not always great and it's not going to stop them when they get the perfect double Mechwarper and all other mechs hand, but noting beats that anyways. And when they don't get that hand, it's almost always good to kill the Mechwarper, because even though using Hammer of Wrath might normally be a tempo loss due to it really needing to be a 3 mana card, the tempo loss is negated by killing mechwarper and essentially giving them an equal tempo loss.
Then I found a few freeze mages. Got destroyed. Almost all decks have a counter.
Netdecking might give effective decks but people will know how to play against them eventually. Gotta stay ahead of the meta. Some Paladin decks will work but right now, I'm thinking the GvG Tempo Paladin that most Paladins are isn't great.
Edit: Also Rogue beats Tempo Paladin, as their Tempo is better, so yeah, not that strong. Before going to Divine Shield deck though, the mostly Classic control Paladin, no GvG cards cept Shielded Minibot and sometimes one Seal of Light or Coghammer, was doing quite well against the Rogues. Seeing a few Handlocks too. I would say its a good time to go to more of a control pre-GvG Paladin, provided the Rogues can keep the mech mages to lower numbers than they were a week or two ago like they have been.
I am curious what are Paladin deck are you playing, I cant get past rank 10 now, last week I was hovering around rank 5, dropped to 11 and stabilized at 10. About 20 games later I am still 10. Still the same midrange pally deck, but 1 quartermaster and 2 sludge, to slow down aggro.
Pretty standard midrange version. I just use Troggzor instead of Boom. I use both 2 quarters and 2 sludges.
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In the last 4-5 days I have gone from rank 5 to rank 11 with this deck http://www.hearthpwn.com/decks/196981-legend-midrange-paladin.
Today I have lost 7 games in a row 1 win against control warrior.
What am I suddenly doing so wrong, is it possible that meta changes so much that I cannot buy a victory now?
End of season, the rush to legend for all the decent players who are hanging around Ranks 8-1 ... you're facing stronger players maybe
Sounds like more of a cold streak/tilt. The rise of rogue has definitely hurt midrange Paladin, but overall it's still a very successful deck.
I've noticed the same trend. Decks that kept me hovering in the midst of Rank 5 are just getting washed away by decks that seem equipped to erase every minion before they have a chance to attack. Is there any counter to bad luck? I was successful with Midrange TO ARMS Pally, and the Shockadin style Pally until about a week ago. They're both in the tank lately. I've moved over to Shaman, and I'm getting smoked playing decks that seemed to be "legendary" two weeks ago.
I'm willing to admit I'm not that great at Hearthstone. I've never made it to legend, and I've been playing since its release. But sometimes I wonder if the people at the top are just "luckier" than me, or can somehow see the cards in my hand. It's frustrating to just watch every minion die without the other play suffering any consequence.
As another posted pointed out - a 7-game losing streak can easily just be a bad run.
Also the deck may just be bad against the type of opponents who are around your rank right now.
Are you sure you're playing the deck correctly? Check out this recent video of Strifecro playing mid range Paladin: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-AXbkHGHx90
I struggled a lot with Paladin this last week before switching to Druid which has been doing very well. I think the problem might have to do with the rise of Rogues and midrange Hunters. Rogues can just kill everything over and over and the new Hunter (which really is a lot like the old hunter), can pressure your with good minions early and then start dropping hay-makers. Paladins aren't really that well equipped to fight either of those strategies, preferring grindier control matchups or aggro where they can kill squishy minions.
Nothing doing, traveler.
Probably the influx of rogues, but I don't think they are 'bad'
If you are able to revisit your decklist to adapt to the meta, you won't struggle. Tech it with key cards.
Used to be a proud Handlock player.
Legend 17 times.
Still flirting with the ladder from times to times with Renolock.
I wouldnt say bad... but not so strong for sure. Lot of rouges + people know how to play against paladin now.
As you play, you should keep tinkering your deck for maximum success
I need YOUR feedback on my ideas for this weeks card contest!
http://www.hearthpwn.com/forums/hearthstone-general/fan-creations/41516-weekly-design-competition-15-discussion-thread?comment=265
Fear me, for i am the Slayer of Stupid, Incompetent, minions!
Yesterday I played 7 games to complete daily quests and won 6 of them with paladin around rank 4-5 on EU. I would not say it is bad at the moment.
I am curious what are Paladin deck are you playing, I cant get past rank 10 now, last week I was hovering around rank 5, dropped to 11 and stabilized at 10. About 20 games later I am still 10. Still the same midrange pally deck, but 1 quartermaster and 2 sludge, to slow down aggro.
Dropping to 11 from 5 is insane, and it doesn't look to me like your deck is the primary reason for it. It's not the Paladin I like right now (I think Harrison is a weak choice for Paladin in this meta and I also like healbot), but it doesn't seem unreasonable and I've been floating between ranks 5 and 4 for a while.
Maybe you could talk about your results against the various decks you encounter? I don't know if you use something like hearthstats.com to keep track of your win / loss ratio vs different classes, but it could be useful to know if you're struggling against any deck in particular (I have a hard time vs Mech Mage and Combo Druid, but > 50% win ratios against almost everything else)
have you been facing more druid? Ive been rolling wall druid and been smashing paladins ever since lol
Control Priests beat me every time they outlast my early rush and then start clearing the board mind control usually ends it, Control warrior is close, Druids I win if I can rush them otherwise lose once we get to late game, Oil Rogue mostly loss maybe 1-2 wins against them, Ice Mage I can usually beat but long games, mech mage depends on draw if I get good early 3 turns I can usually win otherwise lose, face hunter or midrange hunter just depends on the first 3 turns, a lot of shamans around 10 these last 2 days and once they get feral spirits out they kill my tempo and then usually take over from there, warlocks haven't seen much and can usually win. Thats my expereience, I feel that aggor decks are beatable but just depends on the draw, while anything that can survive till turn 10 becomes war of attrition.
I feel I cant establish board control and have no effective removals once they do, things like mind control, hexs, big taunts, or rouge burst are killers. And even if I establish control by turn 6-7 they all have 1 card they can play to reset it, while I need 2.
In fact now that I think about it , it seems that mass removals are my problem, followed by ability to get rid of tirion, dr boom, sylvanas easily. I feel that Paladin needs board presence and as long as the opponent can effectively clear it there is little I can do.
Hello,
I just wanted to pop in and tell you that you are correct. Paladin does have weakness's and if you are playing the more common midrange style anything forcing you into super late game is likely to beat you. The problem is many of the class's you are doing poorly against are class's that were weak or still not considered top tier in the meta.
Basically any deck that was extremely successful and floods the meta is inevitably going to give rise to a whole bunch of decks built around beating it. Paladin got so popular on ladder that people teched to defeat it. Once people give up on paladin and the meta shifts paladin will be good again. If you refuse to play anything but paladin it does not mean you will not be successful but you will almost certainly have to find a less traditional build in order to do so.
Thanks for that, I have tried oil rogue and hunter but dont enjoy the playstyle, priest is too slow and passive for my liking, I like my minions:) I guess druid or shaman are the way to go?
Hello again,
Playing a different deck is always a decent answer when the meta hates your current one. I can pretty much guarantee some variant of druid will always be playable. Its really just about what you like and want to do. I do not want you to think that you should not play your paladin deck at all as necessity is the father of innovation and being forced to change a deck to be successful is what leads to the decks you see everyone copying today. You may just come up with a good new successful paladin deck if that is what you really want to do anyway.
I would say that Tempo Paladin, which is what most of the current Paladins are IMO, is not that strong. First off, I'd say it's Tempo and not Midrange because the minion curve is rather flat, and its really just control Paladin, with a few late game cards switched out for early game minions and spells and because Mustard is a card that is nearly the definition of Tempo in this game. Most of the spells are the same and there is still the common stack of minions at 5 mana of a standard control Paladin. To be a true Midrange it would need more 3 and 4 mana minions.
Second, due to Paladin being rather weak pre-GvG, I think many people had built up an urge to play Paladin. Due to GvG making it better and netdecking it got huge popularity. This has the effect of everyone getting much experience in how to beat it and also decks that beat the current most played will naturally rise to the top.
Same thing a few days ago for me. Although I was playing a control Classic Paladin, it was struggling, so many mech mages. Changed to a self created Divine Shield deck, just messing around trying to find creative ways to beat mech mage. It actually did pretty good for a while, specifically against mech mage. If every minion has Divine Shield, they either have to ping tons of shields or trade into shields. Either one is pretty bad for mech mage. A few pings on Divine Shield isn't usually bad for ping classes, but if they have to ping every single turn it is a huge tempo loss, and if they have to use minions to pop the shields, even better as your getting max value out of the shields. Also I know everyone says Hammer is bad, but only because Mechwarper, I added one. Still not always great and it's not going to stop them when they get the perfect double Mechwarper and all other mechs hand, but noting beats that anyways. And when they don't get that hand, it's almost always good to kill the Mechwarper, because even though using Hammer of Wrath might normally be a tempo loss due to it really needing to be a 3 mana card, the tempo loss is negated by killing mechwarper and essentially giving them an equal tempo loss.
Then I found a few freeze mages. Got destroyed. Almost all decks have a counter.
Netdecking might give effective decks but people will know how to play against them eventually. Gotta stay ahead of the meta. Some Paladin decks will work but right now, I'm thinking the GvG Tempo Paladin that most Paladins are isn't great.
Edit: Also Rogue beats Tempo Paladin, as their Tempo is better, so yeah, not that strong. Before going to Divine Shield deck though, the mostly Classic control Paladin, no GvG cards cept Shielded Minibot and sometimes one Seal of Light or Coghammer, was doing quite well against the Rogues. Seeing a few Handlocks too. I would say its a good time to go to more of a control pre-GvG Paladin, provided the Rogues can keep the mech mages to lower numbers than they were a week or two ago like they have been.
Pretty standard midrange version. I just use Troggzor instead of Boom. I use both 2 quarters and 2 sludges.