i think AoE freeze is a really unhealthy mechanic.
its kills the motivation to create a board. everybody starts asking why should i create a board when enemy can freeze my 5 turns of thinking and good RNG with 3 mana and he can freeze again for next 7 turns.
yes you start to think of an OTK deck and we know the conclusion and we've seen the meta before, we know how unfun it is,
your ideas about this and solutions are much appreciated
I can get what you're saying, but there's only one AoE freeze card... Mage can generate a few extra copies, but that's the idea of control... Freezing quite literally controls aggro decks... I don't see too many Mages out there (I have a freeze highlander deck that does okay, but don't play it often),
If it's that big of an issue, drop a couple Living Dragonbreaths in your deck... Generally Mage uses half their resources on freezing, and being able to "undo" the freeze will basically unravel their whole game.
I'd argue that AE freeze is like IB - it's fine until you can generate extra copies. 4 turns of full board freeze is all freezemage ever had (talking about proper freeze, with combo, back pre-quest etc.); outside of highly specific matchups (such as zoo - even a novice could win that MU, I'm from memory I was over 95% WR in that matchup), that was a resource to be managed, much like anything else. With limited freeze, you can play aruond it with pressure, same as you play around IB by pressuring, dropping opp to as close to 1 as you can before popping etc. - you force the mage to use it earlier, so that they don't have as long later to draw their combo. With the high spell generation route, it's a case of too many, and I'd argue that that is the crux of the issue; you can't get them to run out as easily. If you don't pressure a freezemage and don't make them use their defensive tools, you lost. Gotta approach the different MUs differently. So, the way to handle it would be to tone down the spell generation, or to lower the rates of these cards from spell generation; something like making basic less likely, for example, would solve it.
And yes, I played freezemage to legend. Certainly a deck that had counterplay in most matchups, despite the novas and blizzards - in part because Loatheb, in part because there was secret hate, and the possibility of that slowed you down a fair chunk sometimes (if you could play around it, which you could sometimes, and other times it wasn't worth it due to low numbers of outs in the MU), in part due to burst healing meaning you needed a backup plan post-alex into Reno (even if that was 'pressure the Renolock early to get burst healing used' a lot of the time). And, worth noting, that it's a deck that's been powercreeped past by Wild over time, replacing with infinite damage etc. using insane spell generation.
ETA: Also, Tyrantum, Nova and Blizzard makes two full freezes. The freeze target and two next to aren't full board freezes, and are notably easier to play around, so wouldn't count those.
Sure, Blizzard is a problem... but the twice nerfed and still overpowered DH, and endless-lackey-Rogue with their 1-mana proactive freezing trap on a 1/2 body, isn't. Perspective.
i think AoE freeze is a really unhealthy mechanic.
its kills the motivation to create a board. everybody starts asking why should i create a board when enemy can freeze my 5 turns of thinking and good RNG with 3 mana and he can freeze again for next 7 turns.
yes you start to think of an OTK deck and we know the conclusion and we've seen the meta before, we know how unfun it is,
your ideas about this and solutions are much appreciated
theoretically 2×frost nova 2×blizzard 2×magic trick 2×tortollan pilgrim 1×Kalecgos. im not even mentioning Ray of Frost or othet freezes
2 tech cards for a not so popular deck is too much,the mechanic is not pleasant you know. thank you for taking time
I'd argue that AE freeze is like IB - it's fine until you can generate extra copies. 4 turns of full board freeze is all freezemage ever had (talking about proper freeze, with combo, back pre-quest etc.); outside of highly specific matchups (such as zoo - even a novice could win that MU, I'm from memory I was over 95% WR in that matchup), that was a resource to be managed, much like anything else. With limited freeze, you can play aruond it with pressure, same as you play around IB by pressuring, dropping opp to as close to 1 as you can before popping etc. - you force the mage to use it earlier, so that they don't have as long later to draw their combo. With the high spell generation route, it's a case of too many, and I'd argue that that is the crux of the issue; you can't get them to run out as easily. If you don't pressure a freezemage and don't make them use their defensive tools, you lost. Gotta approach the different MUs differently. So, the way to handle it would be to tone down the spell generation, or to lower the rates of these cards from spell generation; something like making basic less likely, for example, would solve it.
And yes, I played freezemage to legend. Certainly a deck that had counterplay in most matchups, despite the novas and blizzards - in part because Loatheb, in part because there was secret hate, and the possibility of that slowed you down a fair chunk sometimes (if you could play around it, which you could sometimes, and other times it wasn't worth it due to low numbers of outs in the MU), in part due to burst healing meaning you needed a backup plan post-alex into Reno (even if that was 'pressure the Renolock early to get burst healing used' a lot of the time). And, worth noting, that it's a deck that's been powercreeped past by Wild over time, replacing with infinite damage etc. using insane spell generation.
ETA: Also, Tyrantum, Nova and Blizzard makes two full freezes. The freeze target and two next to aren't full board freezes, and are notably easier to play around, so wouldn't count those.
i usually dont play mage because i dont like the class, so the inside look you provided is really helpful. thank you
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i think AoE freeze is a really unhealthy mechanic.
its kills the motivation to create a board. everybody starts asking why should i create a board when enemy can freeze my 5 turns of thinking and good RNG with 3 mana and he can freeze again for next 7 turns.
yes you start to think of an OTK deck and we know the conclusion and we've seen the meta before, we know how unfun it is,
your ideas about this and solutions are much appreciated
I can get what you're saying, but there's only one AoE freeze card... Mage can generate a few extra copies, but that's the idea of control... Freezing quite literally controls aggro decks... I don't see too many Mages out there (I have a freeze highlander deck that does okay, but don't play it often),
If it's that big of an issue, drop a couple Living Dragonbreaths in your deck... Generally Mage uses half their resources on freezing, and being able to "undo" the freeze will basically unravel their whole game.
I'd argue that AE freeze is like IB - it's fine until you can generate extra copies. 4 turns of full board freeze is all freezemage ever had (talking about proper freeze, with combo, back pre-quest etc.); outside of highly specific matchups (such as zoo - even a novice could win that MU, I'm from memory I was over 95% WR in that matchup), that was a resource to be managed, much like anything else. With limited freeze, you can play aruond it with pressure, same as you play around IB by pressuring, dropping opp to as close to 1 as you can before popping etc. - you force the mage to use it earlier, so that they don't have as long later to draw their combo. With the high spell generation route, it's a case of too many, and I'd argue that that is the crux of the issue; you can't get them to run out as easily. If you don't pressure a freezemage and don't make them use their defensive tools, you lost. Gotta approach the different MUs differently. So, the way to handle it would be to tone down the spell generation, or to lower the rates of these cards from spell generation; something like making basic less likely, for example, would solve it.
And yes, I played freezemage to legend. Certainly a deck that had counterplay in most matchups, despite the novas and blizzards - in part because Loatheb, in part because there was secret hate, and the possibility of that slowed you down a fair chunk sometimes (if you could play around it, which you could sometimes, and other times it wasn't worth it due to low numbers of outs in the MU), in part due to burst healing meaning you needed a backup plan post-alex into Reno (even if that was 'pressure the Renolock early to get burst healing used' a lot of the time). And, worth noting, that it's a deck that's been powercreeped past by Wild over time, replacing with infinite damage etc. using insane spell generation.
ETA: Also, Tyrantum, Nova and Blizzard makes two full freezes. The freeze target and two next to aren't full board freezes, and are notably easier to play around, so wouldn't count those.
Someone lost to RNG mage lol. Only real problem is discovering that freeze twin spell over and over again. But it destroys DH so I’m all for it.
Sure, Blizzard is a problem... but the twice nerfed and still overpowered DH, and endless-lackey-Rogue with their 1-mana proactive freezing trap on a 1/2 body, isn't. Perspective.
theoretically 2×frost nova 2×blizzard 2×magic trick 2×tortollan pilgrim 1×Kalecgos. im not even mentioning Ray of Frost or othet freezes
2 tech cards for a not so popular deck is too much,the mechanic is not pleasant you know. thank you for taking time
i usually dont play mage because i dont like the class, so the inside look you provided is really helpful. thank you