Hearthpwn

Quote from Fdp8 >>

Quote from Badabingbadabum >>

Yup I called it. I predicted him to be the worst DK when everyone predicted him to be the best.

*pads himself on back*

Wow, we got ourselves a genius here.

Yup I called it. I predicted him to be the worst DK when everyone predicted him to be the best.

*pads himself on back*

Wow, that escalated fast. Is calling each other "narcissistic pedophiles" on the internet now a thing on Hearthpwn?

I wasn't around during Undertaker Hunter so I voted Rogue Quest. It's not the most oppressive card on the list, but it's definitely the one that's given me the most fits.

At some point it will rotate. People also complained about Piloted Shredder. Neutral cards like these will pop up from time to time. And neither Bonemare og Shredder are over powered imo. Just really solid cards. Bonemare is also kept in check by a turn 8 Anduin. I've generally found Bonemare to be awkward in a lot of situations. 

Hearthstone players have weird opinions on how the card game should be balanced. Players from other card games generally tend to accept that some cards will see a lot more play than others. Try to play MTG Legacy or Vintage over 20,000 cards and only around a couple of hundreds see play. And cards like Brainstorm, Delver of Secrets and Force of Will are in 80% of all decks.

Quote from DiViNE_Priest >>

Quote from Fritters154 >>

Why?

Priest machine gun is similar to Exodia Mage, which still exists, except that it does cost mana to play each card and you have finite cards. 

 Exodia Mage is an OTK and you can't really play around it you just have to hope you kill them before their Quest is finished.

You can play around and bait Priest tools pretty effectively and you could read their hand pretty easily because of its Highlander Nature.

Even if the Priest gets their combo on curve you are at an obvious disadvantage but you haven't lost the game either.

Krul is seriously underrated imo. When you play Krul you force your opponent to spend a lot of his resources dealing with your board which makes him completely unprepared for a follow up DK. I've won so many games on turn 10 by making this play. It's especially powerful if Krul pulls Mal'Ganis, because you now have him in play paired with a board he can buff. You don't need to build up a sticky board to play Mal'Ganis onto and you almost always threaten lethal in that spot. 

Quote from Shanaaro >>

Quote from Badabingbadabum >>

Pretty sweet set and some interesting Priest and Paladin cards. The legends are pretty underwhelming though. Don't think that any of them would see much play except in very specific metas (and only Nyxia and Captain Grayson ) . I miss some legends that are just all around good.
The Enlightened One, Ramules and Lady Justice are the only one I could see making it.

 I think Vanessa could have a very good use as a board clear because apart from Fan of Knives, Rogue has nearly no board clears.

Vultros's effect lasting for the rest of the game makes it really good with N'Zoth decks, an archetype Hunter already gets a lot of support for.

Babagaya, Danuvin, Cookie, Kelf and Ripsnarl do all seem garbage, though. In terms of power level, that is, not concept.

 

Pretty sweet set and some interesting Priest and Paladin cards. The legends are pretty underwhelming though. Don't think that any of them would see much play except in very specific metas (and only Nyxia and Captain Grayson ) . I miss some legends that are just all around good.
The Enlightened One, Ramules and Lady Justice are the only one I could see making it.

I'm just looking forward to Magic Arena so I can return to my favorite card game. 

For people who don't know: Magic Arena is basically a HS clone with Magic cards. F2P, fast and more stylish interface with voice sound clips, animations etc. that release all cards from future expansions, so you can collect full blown Standard decks. It's about time too. MTGO drove me to HS. Now it seems that they have finally maned up.

Quote from Heeljin >>

Blood Razor suffers greatly with the axe nerf because now the cards won't naturally curve one after the other. Decks will now most likely run x2 Fiery War Axe and look to another 4-drop.

To me, the most annoying thing about the axe nerf is Warrior will have to "lose" a card every standard cycle because Blizzard has to print an early game weapon each time.

Quote from Velrun >>

Quote from Badabingbadabum >>

Quote from Velrun >>

Quote from byzants >>

Quote from Velrun >>

Quote from byzants >>

 

I'm so tired of the "some decks will be strong" argument.

If a deck won 99% of its games (a practical impossibility since it would face itself a lot, but let's just argue it for the hypothetical), would you think it is okay? No, you would not. All you disagree on is where to draw the line.

 

Let's play your game.

A deck has 99 % win rate against all non-mirror match-ups where the game is 50 %.

From here there are two scenarios.

Scenario 1: The deck is just really, really good and there is nothing that can beat it. It loses 1 % of the time to insane bad luck on the card draws.

Who will want to play any other deck than this? No one. Who will want to play this deck? Everyone.

So the new meta will be 100 % of all people playing the same deck and all have 50 % chance of winning so skill and time are the only factors that seperate rank 15 players and rank 5 players. Do we want skills to be what seperates the good players from the bad players or do we want it to be RNG? I choose skills.

Scenario 2: The deck is the best deck but there is one counter-deck that wins against it but only 1 % of all players play that counter-deck.

What happens then? If almost all players want to play the 99 % win rate deck then the counter-deck will quite fast be the best deck on the ladder because it will beat the 99 % deck that everyone is playing and have a 50 % chance against the mirror match-up.

The meta will settle and most likely people will start building a counter-deck to face the counter-deck leaving the meta fluxuating. Suddenly skills be what seperates the good players from the bad players and not RNG.

Scenario 2 is what we have yet Blizzard managed to make the best deck on the ladder a 55 % win rate deck and not a 99 % win rate deck.

I would call that a succes.

But you aren't following your own logic to the inevitable conclusion... for the rock / paper / scissors logic to work, the meta must be able to counter a deck back much closer to 50%. That isn't happening. In fact the opposite is happening, the meta is simply shrinking to only decks that aren't crushed by jade being viable at all... and the small selection of decks that are good versus those are skyrocketing in average win-rates (pirate warrior has increased 3% in average winrate, even though the deck hasn't changed since Un'Goro... that's completely bonkers). And even in that tiny meta so defined by jade druid, it is still able to eke out an average WR of near 55% across all ranks.

Sure, feel free to think it is just people "complaining"... but the truth is that jade druid is completely busted and has shrunk the HS meta down to about 4-5 truly competitive decks.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You don't seem to understand. Maybe you should read it again.

If there is one deck that beats almost all others, then people will start playing that until someone discovers a counter-deck. Then the meat will settle and you will end up with a meta that is healthy like the one we have now.

 I mean you can't argue with people that don't think that a thing such as an unhealthy meta can exist and that the game shouldn't get regulated because it regulates itself. You could make the same argument with Starcraft. If one of the races were far better than the others, then everyone would just play that race and hence the game has regulated itself.

That's a non-argument since I like to believe that  the majority of the community want some sort of balance when it comes to the game. The only way to keep some sort of balance is to frequently look at class representation numbers in which case druid is at some alarming numbers. You might not agree with this premise, but you can't dismiss it and reduce it to "people being salty" either. 

Nope. Starcraft is execute-based and skillfull players can win with any class. This is not the case with Hearthstone.

Also when there only exists 3 classes, there can never be the same fluxuating meta as in a 9-class game.

HS regulateds itself even if Blizzard leaves the game un-changed. If 99 % of all people play the best deck, then the 1 % will win a whole lot because they play the counter deck. Soon more people will realise this and they will start building the 1 % deck. And so on. This has always been the case with card games since 1995.

Ps. I don't think I've ever used the word "salty" so I don't know where you get that from.

Quote from Velrun >>

Quote from byzants >>

Quote from Velrun >>

Quote from byzants >>

 

I'm so tired of the "some decks will be strong" argument.

If a deck won 99% of its games (a practical impossibility since it would face itself a lot, but let's just argue it for the hypothetical), would you think it is okay? No, you would not. All you disagree on is where to draw the line.

 

Let's play your game.

A deck has 99 % win rate against all non-mirror match-ups where the game is 50 %.

From here there are two scenarios.

Scenario 1: The deck is just really, really good and there is nothing that can beat it. It loses 1 % of the time to insane bad luck on the card draws.

Who will want to play any other deck than this? No one. Who will want to play this deck? Everyone.

So the new meta will be 100 % of all people playing the same deck and all have 50 % chance of winning so skill and time are the only factors that seperate rank 15 players and rank 5 players. Do we want skills to be what seperates the good players from the bad players or do we want it to be RNG? I choose skills.

Scenario 2: The deck is the best deck but there is one counter-deck that wins against it but only 1 % of all players play that counter-deck.

What happens then? If almost all players want to play the 99 % win rate deck then the counter-deck will quite fast be the best deck on the ladder because it will beat the 99 % deck that everyone is playing and have a 50 % chance against the mirror match-up.

The meta will settle and most likely people will start building a counter-deck to face the counter-deck leaving the meta fluxuating. Suddenly skills be what seperates the good players from the bad players and not RNG.

Scenario 2 is what we have yet Blizzard managed to make the best deck on the ladder a 55 % win rate deck and not a 99 % win rate deck.

I would call that a succes.

But you aren't following your own logic to the inevitable conclusion... for the rock / paper / scissors logic to work, the meta must be able to counter a deck back much closer to 50%. That isn't happening. In fact the opposite is happening, the meta is simply shrinking to only decks that aren't crushed by jade being viable at all... and the small selection of decks that are good versus those are skyrocketing in average win-rates (pirate warrior has increased 3% in average winrate, even though the deck hasn't changed since Un'Goro... that's completely bonkers). And even in that tiny meta so defined by jade druid, it is still able to eke out an average WR of near 55% across all ranks.

Sure, feel free to think it is just people "complaining"... but the truth is that jade druid is completely busted and has shrunk the HS meta down to about 4-5 truly competitive decks.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You don't seem to understand. Maybe you should read it again.

If there is one deck that beats almost all others, then people will start playing that until someone discovers a counter-deck. Then the meat will settle and you will end up with a meta that is healthy like the one we have now.

Not only is it not intuitive that cards like Murloc Warleader and Southsea Captain heals the minions they buff when you kill them (especially when you have a history in MtG) but I also find it a bit too punishing when you try to fight back from a board that has been snowballed. 

The interaction with Finja is especially odd to me. You kamikaze it into something and then after it dies, it for some reason revives and heals back up. 

I'm not saying that either Pirate Warrior or Murloc Paladin is particularly over powered at the moment, but it has taken me several years to get used to the mechanic since it makes little logical sense. It also makes it risky to print future tribal cards, which might be one of the reasons why we've seen so few of them so far, because that interaction alone is pretty OP in a vacuum.

I agree the quests was a miss. Especially when you compare them to the death knights that are all somewhat playable without being broken. It's true that not all legendaries have to be playable but when you introduce something new and unique like the quests or the death knights it's not unreasonable to have different expectations.

The mage quest sees plenty of play though.