There has been more complaining than ever recently. Druid is OP, everyone knows and Blizzard are working on it. It will be nerfed, it is too strong but people don't seem to understand that there are strong decks and there are weak decks. Every single time there seems to be a deck that is slightly better than average people cry to see it nerfed. The druid hate was justified, but people have already started moaning about highlander priest. What would happen if they nerfed that? Quest mage and Pirate warrior gets targeted. What happens if they nerf that? Something else just happens to be ready to take their place as a tier 1 deck.
It's a never ending cycle. Sometimes there would be strong decks. But it seems like if the deck is tier 2 or above people always complain and want it nerfed. I've never actually heard someone say 'you know what, I lost that game because I was outplayed'. I have witnessed a streamer glyph into Pyroblast and act like they're amazing, and then it happen in reverse the next game and they cry and blame Blizzard.
I made a point recently that if they nerf everything, we'll get to the stage where 4 mana 4/5s are considered good again. What happens if they kept on nerfing things like people want and so people run Yetis again?
Hate to break it to you people, but sometimes there will be strong decks and sometimes there will be weak decks. Un'goro was a super fun meta before Kripp started complaining and everyone jumped on the bandwagon, Quest Rogue wasn't even that common, nor was it really that great since it was classed as a tier 3 deck on ladder, its power level wasn't the reason for the nerf. Even when Un'goro got a bit stale, wild felt like playing a completely new game.
We are in an era at the moment where Druid is very strong and it will be nerfed very soon, I'd rather Blizzard take a few weeks to create the right answer to Druid than rush it and the class is broken entirely like poor poor hunter.
Honestly, to the few that i am addressing on here. Get a grip. Understand that there WILL be strong decks out there like in any card game. Just because you lose the game due to an individual card it doesn't mean it needs a nerf. People cry out for nerfs to Jade idol when in fact Jade Idol is not the reason for the power of Jades. The amount of times I have been Skulking Geist'd before even landing an Idol and still won the game is more times than not.
If you're getting crushed by Pirates, don't come on here and whine about Patches, tech in some Golakkas or Doomsayers. If you lose to Mage a lot, tech in a Spellbreaker, Alchemist or Eater of Secrets. Think before you complain, I don't think this game is half as bad as people (who still pay money to play it) are making out to be. Druid will be nerfed, it'll probably still be playable and that makes 8 out of 9 classes that are easily playable, have varying match ups and archetypes. It's a shame there isn't 9/9, but sadly they seem to be pushing hunter in a control direction and that will probably never work to a decent level.
I'm so tired of the "some decks will be strong" argument.
If a deck won 99% of its games (a practical impossibility since it would face itself a lot, but let's just argue it for the hypothetical), would you think it is okay? No, you would not. All you disagree on is where to draw the line.
Look, I want to tell you something because you're very dear to me. And I hope you understand that it comes from the bottom of my damaged, damaged heart. You are the finest piece of ass I've ever had and I don't care who knows it. I am so glad that I got to roam those hillsides.
I'm so tired of the "some decks will be strong" argument.
If a deck won 99% of its games (a practical impossibility since it would face itself a lot, but let's just argue it for the hypothetical), would you think it is okay? No, you would not. All you disagree on is where to draw the line.
Let's play your game.
A deck has 99 % win rate against all non-mirror match-ups where the game is 50 %.
From here there are two scenarios.
Scenario 1: The deck is just really, really good and there is nothing that can beat it. It loses 1 % of the time to insane bad luck on the card draws.
Who will want to play any other deck than this? No one. Who will want to play this deck? Everyone.
So the new meta will be 100 % of all people playing the same deck and all have 50 % chance of winning so skill and time are the only factors that seperate rank 15 players and rank 5 players. Do we want skills to be what seperates the good players from the bad players or do we want it to be RNG? I choose skills.
Scenario 2: The deck is the best deck but there is one counter-deck that wins against it but only 1 % of all players play that counter-deck.
What happens then? If almost all players want to play the 99 % win rate deck then the counter-deck will quite fast be the best deck on the ladder because it will beat the 99 % deck that everyone is playing and have a 50 % chance against the mirror match-up.
The meta will settle and most likely people will start building a counter-deck to face the counter-deck leaving the meta fluxuating. Suddenly skills be what seperates the good players from the bad players and not RNG.
Scenario 2 is what we have yet Blizzard managed to make the best deck on the ladder a 55 % win rate deck and not a 99 % win rate deck.
I'm so tired of the "some decks will be strong" argument.
If a deck won 99% of its games (a practical impossibility since it would face itself a lot, but let's just argue it for the hypothetical), would you think it is okay? No, you would not. All you disagree on is where to draw the line.
Let's play your game.
A deck has 99 % win rate against all non-mirror match-ups where the game is 50 %.
From here there are two scenarios.
Scenario 1: The deck is just really, really good and there is nothing that can beat it. It loses 1 % of the time to insane bad luck on the card draws.
Who will want to play any other deck than this? No one. Who will want to play this deck? Everyone.
So the new meta will be 100 % of all people playing the same deck and all have 50 % chance of winning so skill and time are the only factors that seperate rank 15 players and rank 5 players. Do we want skills to be what seperates the good players from the bad players or do we want it to be RNG? I choose skills.
Scenario 2: The deck is the best deck but there is one counter-deck that wins against it but only 1 % of all players play that counter-deck.
What happens then? If almost all players want to play the 99 % win rate deck then the counter-deck will quite fast be the best deck on the ladder because it will beat the 99 % deck that everyone is playing and have a 50 % chance against the mirror match-up.
The meta will settle and most likely people will start building a counter-deck to face the counter-deck leaving the meta fluxuating. Suddenly skills be what seperates the good players from the bad players and not RNG.
Scenario 2 is what we have yet Blizzard managed to make the best deck on the ladder a 55 % win rate deck and not a 99 % win rate deck.
I would call that a succes.
But you aren't following your own logic to the inevitable conclusion... for the rock / paper / scissors logic to work, the meta must be able to counter a deck back much closer to 50%. That isn't happening. In fact the opposite is happening, the meta is simply shrinking to only decks that aren't crushed by jade being viable at all... and the small selection of decks that are good versus those are skyrocketing in average win-rates (pirate warrior has increased 3% in average winrate, even though the deck hasn't changed since Un'Goro... that's completely bonkers). And even in that tiny meta so defined by jade druid, it is still able to eke out an average WR of near 55% across all ranks.
Sure, feel free to think it is just people "complaining"... but the truth is that jade druid is completely busted and has shrunk the HS meta down to about 4-5 truly competitive decks.
Awkward moment where Druid has been strong for ages and people disregard that fact. Name a meta for me where Druid wasn't high tier 1 or high tier 2 besides maybe Vanilla? Force of Nature Druids and Fel Reaver Druids, Egg Druids etc were dominant before it's nerf/rotation, when it got nerfed Malygos/Aviana Druids were played, in MSOG Druid got Jades which completely killed Control decks from the meta it was so bad people resorted to just outright aggro decks to counter it, Ungoro they received a whole bunch of ridiculously strong Aggro cards ie, Living Mana, Vicious Fledgling, Bittertide Hydra etc. Blizzard even have to design Neutral Cards around Druids iconic Ramp ability so we basically will never see super awesome Neutral Legendaries because Druid exists. Now in KoTFT Druid received some of the most overtuned cards in the existence of Hearthstone for a class that can literally play them on T3/T4 with 0 downside and Savage Roar is still busted.
The issue this expansion is Druid has no real counterplay besides a shitty 6 mana 4/6 that doesn't do anything if they out tempo you anyway most of the time you can't even play it on turn 6 so they can just use Idols whenever they please. Spreading Plague is an absolute nightmare for Aggro decks to deal with and allows Druids essentially a Time Warp effect to stabilize a little bit too easily. Aggro decks can't afford to give a Druid breathing room or they get out tempoed so they need to overwhelm Druid with minions and this card completely ruins that gameplan. Pirates, Murlocs etc all have counterplay in the form of cards like Golakka Crawler, the 1 mana eat a murloc thing, Silence effects etc. so I would argue that those decks aren't unhealthy for the meta by comparison to Druid.
When a deck is oppressive it ruins the enjoyment of Hearthstone for a serious number of players, honestly the competitive players probably make up maybe 1-2% of Hearthstones overall population. The game is designed for fun and vsing 1 very oppressive deck over and over is... you guessed it... not fun. So that in turn will make people... you guessed it... complain about it.
If something is making the game less fun, then by all means they should be allowed to complain. Just because I'm fine playing against Jades doesn't mean they have to be.
Today in my free brawl pack I got Barongeddon, then I had a cup of fresh green tea. As a result of that, I think Priest is OP because my keyboard is not a mechanical one. I hope Blizzard will address this issue.
We will never stop complaining my little friend, NEVER. Do you want to know why? Because it is FUN, that is all. We enjoy it. We love it. Complaining is love, complaining is life, and you can do nothing to stop us.
One marvelous thing about complaining is that we also help to improve this game while doing so, so it is great. :)
In my experience Blizzard's game communities are never more toxic than when Blizzard actually gives into them. I'm not that familiar with the Diablo 3 launch -- as I understand everyone was mad about being able to buy power (in a largely PvE game???) in an auction house that cost real money -- but when they actually responded with the Reaper of Souls expansion by removing said auction house... everyone was screaming about how sick of Blizzard they were.
Naturally this complaining had no impact and everyone loved Reaper of Souls, but it's what I've noticed and it's going on here with the impending Druid nerfs. xD
Not sure what Blizzard does with their games to cause that kind of behavior, but most other game communities I see might whine constantly but they're usually happy when a change they actually want finally happens. Blizzard fans seem to not.
I'm so tired of the "some decks will be strong" argument.
If a deck won 99% of its games (a practical impossibility since it would face itself a lot, but let's just argue it for the hypothetical), would you think it is okay? No, you would not. All you disagree on is where to draw the line.
Let's play your game.
A deck has 99 % win rate against all non-mirror match-ups where the game is 50 %.
From here there are two scenarios.
Scenario 1: The deck is just really, really good and there is nothing that can beat it. It loses 1 % of the time to insane bad luck on the card draws.
Who will want to play any other deck than this? No one. Who will want to play this deck? Everyone.
So the new meta will be 100 % of all people playing the same deck and all have 50 % chance of winning so skill and time are the only factors that seperate rank 15 players and rank 5 players. Do we want skills to be what seperates the good players from the bad players or do we want it to be RNG? I choose skills.
Scenario 2: The deck is the best deck but there is one counter-deck that wins against it but only 1 % of all players play that counter-deck.
What happens then? If almost all players want to play the 99 % win rate deck then the counter-deck will quite fast be the best deck on the ladder because it will beat the 99 % deck that everyone is playing and have a 50 % chance against the mirror match-up.
The meta will settle and most likely people will start building a counter-deck to face the counter-deck leaving the meta fluxuating. Suddenly skills be what seperates the good players from the bad players and not RNG.
Scenario 2 is what we have yet Blizzard managed to make the best deck on the ladder a 55 % win rate deck and not a 99 % win rate deck.
I would call that a succes.
But you aren't following your own logic to the inevitable conclusion... for the rock / paper / scissors logic to work, the meta must be able to counter a deck back much closer to 50%. That isn't happening. In fact the opposite is happening, the meta is simply shrinking to only decks that aren't crushed by jade being viable at all... and the small selection of decks that are good versus those are skyrocketing in average win-rates (pirate warrior has increased 3% in average winrate, even though the deck hasn't changed since Un'Goro... that's completely bonkers). And even in that tiny meta so defined by jade druid, it is still able to eke out an average WR of near 55% across all ranks.
Sure, feel free to think it is just people "complaining"... but the truth is that jade druid is completely busted and has shrunk the HS meta down to about 4-5 truly competitive decks.
You don't seem to understand. Maybe you should read it again.
If there is one deck that beats almost all others, then people will start playing that until someone discovers a counter-deck. Then the meat will settle and you will end up with a meta that is healthy like the one we have now.
There has been more complaining than ever recently. Druid is OP, everyone knows and Blizzard are working on it. It will be nerfed, it is too strong but people don't seem to understand that there are strong decks and there are weak decks. Every single time there seems to be a deck that is slightly better than average people cry to see it nerfed. The druid hate was justified, but people have already started moaning about highlander priest. What would happen if they nerfed that? Quest mage and Pirate warrior gets targeted. What happens if they nerf that? Something else just happens to be ready to take their place as a tier 1 deck.
It's a never ending cycle. Sometimes there would be strong decks. But it seems like if the deck is tier 2 or above people always complain and want it nerfed. I've never actually heard someone say 'you know what, I lost that game because I was outplayed'. I have witnessed a streamer glyph into Pyroblast and act like they're amazing, and then it happen in reverse the next game and they cry and blame Blizzard.
I made a point recently that if they nerf everything, we'll get to the stage where 4 mana 4/5s are considered good again. What happens if they kept on nerfing things like people want and so people run Yetis again?
Hate to break it to you people, but sometimes there will be strong decks and sometimes there will be weak decks. Un'goro was a super fun meta before Kripp started complaining and everyone jumped on the bandwagon, Quest Rogue wasn't even that common, nor was it really that great since it was classed as a tier 3 deck on ladder, its power level wasn't the reason for the nerf. Even when Un'goro got a bit stale, wild felt like playing a completely new game.
We are in an era at the moment where Druid is very strong and it will be nerfed very soon, I'd rather Blizzard take a few weeks to create the right answer to Druid than rush it and the class is broken entirely like poor poor hunter.
Honestly, to the few that i am addressing on here. Get a grip. Understand that there WILL be strong decks out there like in any card game. Just because you lose the game due to an individual card it doesn't mean it needs a nerf. People cry out for nerfs to Jade idol when in fact Jade Idol is not the reason for the power of Jades. The amount of times I have been Skulking Geist'd before even landing an Idol and still won the game is more times than not.
If you're getting crushed by Pirates, don't come on here and whine about Patches, tech in some Golakkas or Doomsayers. If you lose to Mage a lot, tech in a Spellbreaker, Alchemist or Eater of Secrets. Think before you complain, I don't think this game is half as bad as people (who still pay money to play it) are making out to be. Druid will be nerfed, it'll probably still be playable and that makes 8 out of 9 classes that are easily playable, have varying match ups and archetypes. It's a shame there isn't 9/9, but sadly they seem to be pushing hunter in a control direction and that will probably never work to a decent level.
Well, if you are complaining about those who complains... You're not really making it better !
I'm so tired of the "some decks will be strong" argument.
If a deck won 99% of its games (a practical impossibility since it would face itself a lot, but let's just argue it for the hypothetical), would you think it is okay? No, you would not. All you disagree on is where to draw the line.
Some men just want to see Hearthstone burn. ;)
People will always complain about some decks. For some people, complaining is the best thing about the game. Nothing you can do about it.
plz nerf OP to many words cant read
Look, I want to tell you something because you're very dear to me. And I hope you understand that it comes from the bottom of my damaged, damaged heart. You are the finest piece of ass I've ever had and I don't care who knows it. I am so glad that I got to roam those hillsides.
Awkward moment where Druid has been strong for ages and people disregard that fact. Name a meta for me where Druid wasn't high tier 1 or high tier 2 besides maybe Vanilla? Force of Nature Druids and Fel Reaver Druids, Egg Druids etc were dominant before it's nerf/rotation, when it got nerfed Malygos/Aviana Druids were played, in MSOG Druid got Jades which completely killed Control decks from the meta it was so bad people resorted to just outright aggro decks to counter it, Ungoro they received a whole bunch of ridiculously strong Aggro cards ie, Living Mana, Vicious Fledgling, Bittertide Hydra etc. Blizzard even have to design Neutral Cards around Druids iconic Ramp ability so we basically will never see super awesome Neutral Legendaries because Druid exists. Now in KoTFT Druid received some of the most overtuned cards in the existence of Hearthstone for a class that can literally play them on T3/T4 with 0 downside and Savage Roar is still busted.
The issue this expansion is Druid has no real counterplay besides a shitty 6 mana 4/6 that doesn't do anything if they out tempo you anyway most of the time you can't even play it on turn 6 so they can just use Idols whenever they please. Spreading Plague is an absolute nightmare for Aggro decks to deal with and allows Druids essentially a Time Warp effect to stabilize a little bit too easily. Aggro decks can't afford to give a Druid breathing room or they get out tempoed so they need to overwhelm Druid with minions and this card completely ruins that gameplan. Pirates, Murlocs etc all have counterplay in the form of cards like Golakka Crawler, the 1 mana eat a murloc thing, Silence effects etc. so I would argue that those decks aren't unhealthy for the meta by comparison to Druid.
When a deck is oppressive it ruins the enjoyment of Hearthstone for a serious number of players, honestly the competitive players probably make up maybe 1-2% of Hearthstones overall population. The game is designed for fun and vsing 1 very oppressive deck over and over is... you guessed it... not fun. So that in turn will make people... you guessed it... complain about it.
No.
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Why would people stop complaining?
If something is making the game less fun, then by all means they should be allowed to complain. Just because I'm fine playing against Jades doesn't mean they have to be.
#gNOmeferatu
You already know the answer to that question, so what's the point of asking?
Yeah, people will be whining forever. There must always be a Salt King upon the OP Throne.
We will never stop complaining my little friend, NEVER. Do you want to know why? Because it is FUN, that is all. We enjoy it. We love it. Complaining is love, complaining is life, and you can do nothing to stop us.
One marvelous thing about complaining is that we also help to improve this game while doing so, so it is great. :)
These "leave Britney alooooooone ;__;" - threads aren't any better.
nope ....
I wanna glide down, over Mulholland
I wanna write her, name in the sky
I wanna free fall, out into nothin'
Gonna leave this, world for awhile
In my experience Blizzard's game communities are never more toxic than when Blizzard actually gives into them. I'm not that familiar with the Diablo 3 launch -- as I understand everyone was mad about being able to buy power (in a largely PvE game???) in an auction house that cost real money -- but when they actually responded with the Reaper of Souls expansion by removing said auction house... everyone was screaming about how sick of Blizzard they were.
Naturally this complaining had no impact and everyone loved Reaper of Souls, but it's what I've noticed and it's going on here with the impending Druid nerfs. xD
Not sure what Blizzard does with their games to cause that kind of behavior, but most other game communities I see might whine constantly but they're usually happy when a change they actually want finally happens. Blizzard fans seem to not.
Baah...
Just a simple solution to overtly complex questions"QUIT PLAYING"
OP is a joker...
Lets create topic complaining about complaining AND THEN EXPECT US TO READ THAT MISERABLE PILE OF WORDS, Like any of us could give a sht
Just go away
Wild Paladin fun