Hearthpwn

Yes, these discussions are always interesting and entertaining:) One argument that I see popping up every now and then (also in this thread) that actually does go against the collective scientific knowledge is the "I know myself, and I don't buy more if I lose more, I buy more if I win more" argument. Decades of research show people on average do actually make more impulsive decisions (buy more, spend more) if the are not content but rather a bit frustrated or "flushed". Researchers call this state "arousal", and whether it is caused by winning a lot or losing a lot is irrelevant. In the context of free-to-play games, the best thing the profit-driven game designer can do is design a game that continuously has the player on the edge of their virtual seat. See e.g. "The Candy Crush Sweet Tooth: How ‘Near-misses’ in Candy Crush Increase Frustration, and the Urge to Continue Gameplay" (https://link.springer.com/content/pdf/10.1007/s10899-016-9633-7.pdf) This is the reason the game is designed to keep most of the players around the 50% win rate.

What is sure is that every single one of the successful free-to-play games utilise mechanics aimed at increasing player arousal, and many exploit the fact that frustration leads to poorer impulse control. Whether you call the mechanics that are used to reach such states "rigged" or not is semantics in my opinion (I must say, though, that I am also not a native English speaker). I do agree with the view that it is not some secretive rocket science, though. It does not need to happen on the micro level of individual card choices or actions. Actually, doing it at that level would indeed make it easier to spot and expose. It can be done much easier on the macro level of general matchmaking and, of course, by designing asymmetries in the power level of the cards themselves (thereby explaining why there will never ever be a "balanced" meta - it would be poor design from a monetisation perspective).

Quote from AOFHE >>

Quote from grokl77 >>

Well, the risk for going off topic was real. To me it is semantics if it takes away resources or if it is resources, that could have been used on the core instead. It could be good business to add content for the loyal players, who kept their collection instead of dusting it.

Back on topic.

A rotating format with cards from non-standard expansion would make it more tempting to keep old cards instead of dusting them, because wild is not that fun anymore in my opinion 

 The risk of going off topic is always real, especially if you introduce an off topic discussion point yourself and cannot back it up with any arguments.

 And if you have other people who just can’t stop beating on a dead horse in their quest to win a silly forum debate. 

On topic, I would absolutely love such a format. At the moment, most of my collection sits there without a purpose other than remind me of past fun. A rotating format would serve deck builders and go against the quick net-decking mentality most card games suffer from. Therefore, it will not be implemented. There isn’t enough of a financial upside for Blizzard to do it.

Fun is always subjective. For me, long (15 turns at least) games with a lot of resource generation and management and a chance to play big, flashy, game-changing cards are the epitome of fun. Therefore, I have stopped playing HS for now. Possibly for good. There are other games out there where you actually have to think during gameplay.

With both mage and warlock being able to completely bypass and even exploit fatigue, a core mechanic integral to the game until so far, there is no future for control unless serious nerfs occur. Resource management, careful planning, comeback turns that make face hunters seeth with rage… this is the control I love, and that is currently unplayable. So yes, I am currently playing arena mostly, and turning to other games. It is heart-breaking to try and play control decks in today’s standard meta.

I fully agree with the OP. Creating my own decks has always been a big part of the allure of this game to me, but it feels hopeless now. Or somehow…tiresome? For me, the two biggest offenders are the Warlock and Mage quests plus Ignite. I think having two decks that complete their ”combo” that fast and reliably, while being completely immune to fatigue, is really devastating to the game. There would need to be some way to interact with the quest progression in the first place, and ofc the rewards are completely bonkers when it comes to their power level. Obligatory disclaimer for context: yes, I have reached Legend, and yes, I have been playing since the launch of the game.

But it is exactly the problem! In an aggro meta, control decks should be able to come in and control the speed of the game. Normally, priest, warrior, shaman and warlock (at least) would have the tools to fight off the likes of face hunter etc. But now, if you build a deck that does exactly that, and has a respectable 55-60% win rate against aggro, the fact that every now and then you absolutely lose to Warlock's Tickatus means that the overall win rate drops below 50%. And this is the fundamental problem that no amount of statistics on HSreplay will show. 

Disruption is fine. Giving one class, and one class only, the ability to burn a third of the opponent's deck is not fine. Bringing Dirty Rat back could help a bit (Vol'jin does not help due to the legendary status -> one copy only, and due to the fact that even if you manage to pull Tickatus from the hand, there is suddenly an 8/8 on the board and you have just spent five mana to pull it out and don't have a taunt in the way...).

I love playing control decks, and have been having the worst time ever with them in current HS. There is simply no chance for "honest" control decks from classes such as Priest, Warrior, and Shaman to exist as long as Tickatus is around. And I for one think that it is not only sad, but also bad for the state of the game.

[edit] I was reading some other comments, and had to add this: To those who view Tickatus as an unproblematic card in current Standard, have you tried playing other control decks against it? I mean really? Seeing all of your win conditions being burned away, not only once, but twice? I have, for example, created a home-brew control Shaman deck with Yshaarji returning four corrupted cards to deal 16 damage from hand that actually has a positive win rate against Paladin and Mage. This means I have been able to climb with it this season almost as nicely as I normally do (for me, the most fun in the this game is in creating my own decks). But against Warlock... I have like 10% win rate, and the only reason for this is Tickatus. A single card. If that is not bad design in a card game aiming for diversity of strategies and a resemblance of balance across its many classes, I don't know what is.

Any updates? Winrates from a larger pool of games, say, 30+ ?

Thanks! The idea of not grinding out appeals to me, and yes, Elysiana is a dead card in too many other matchups. Back to practicing:)

Title says it all. If I don’t have Luna’s early, I feel I don’t stand a chance. Nothing sticks, and the one board of giants is laughable in the face of multiple board clears and Supercollider. Games go to fatigue, where they win due to Elysiana. Anyone have experiences? I have thought of including my own Elysiana or weapon removal just for this matchup, since there are a lot of them on the ladder at least in EU ranks 10-5.

It definitely is good enough to be played on the ladder, and what is more important, it is one of the most fun decks in a loooong time:) It does struggle against some decks, though. Control warrior seems like an auto loss if you don’t get Luna’s out early. Also hyper aggro can steamroll it since there is a lack of early game removal that is not Doomsayer.

This guy (actually several user ids) and the word ’bored’ in titles of posts... 🤣 I wonder how many there are by now?

As for the most boring deck, I don’t think there is one, except the one(s) you choose to push to legend, or the ones you constantly lose to. Of course, grinding with the same deck over and over again makes any deck boring.

Video shows bees staying on board if their target does not kill them. So tempo away!

If you want, Master’s Call and Stitched Tracker will fetch you anything you need, but of course we’re talking about a different deck then.

I actually agree on the point about how anything that costs zero can be abused, especially in wild format in the long run.

Gratz! I for one would be in for viewing a shortened version on Youtube or a similar channel. Even picking some key matches along the climb with an intro would be entertaining, I’m sure, and would not mean a metric tonne of editing, either.